Covid 19 Part XXI-27,908 in ROI (1,777 deaths) 6,647 in NI (559 deaths)(22/08)Read OP

Renjit

podgeandrodge wrote: »

One thing that we can all agree on is that since masks became mandatory, cases have gone up. The evidence is clear. Just wait, it won't be long before supermarkets have a load of cases after largely getting away with it when masks weren't worn

Irrefutable logic. 200% truth :pac:

Ficheall

podgeandrodge wrote: »

One thing that we can all agree on is that since masks became mandatory, cases have gone up. The evidence is clear. Just wait, it won't be long before supermarkets have a load of cases after largely getting away with it when masks weren't worn

deisedevil

DebDynamite wrote: »

Well said. Even things like the signs with “Thank you HSE” and all the praise being heaped upon them irked me a bit.

Healthcare workers in private nursing homes, many of whom are on minimum wage, had to cope with awful things during this pandemic, and they weren’t rewarded with free coffees in shops, or free haircuts. I’ve said it before on here they should be held up as heros much more than a hospital consultant sitting in their office on €200k

Nursing home workers were left feeling very much forgotten about and are upset at how people seem to view them as inferior to public hospital workers. The government and HSE are happy to have the perception out there that they are incompetent and money grabbers who dont care properly for their residents and that they alone mismanaged the covid situation within their homes. Its just not true though for the most part. I know of a nurse in a hospital telling her former colleagues that they were swimming in free food and cakes and they had next to nothing to be doing because there were next to no patients in the wards. Meanwhile her former colleagues in a nursing home were under severe pressure and feeling very much under appreciated

Most nurses and healthcare workers had it handier than they ever did during lockdown. Not all of course, it wasn't the same across the board, but i know a lot of nurses and they were saying the same thing, that this frontline hero talk was actually only deserved by a small proportion of the public healthcare system. The public got carried away with what they were seeing in Italy and Spain and just assumed our healthcare workers were under the same pressure. We never actually came close to our hospitals being under much pressure.
Meanwhile we had thousands of healthcare workers doing next to nothing but were refusing to go into nursing homes to help out. I know for a fact about some nursing homes seeking assistance but couldnt get any extra workers. What happened to the HSE advising they would redeploy public staff to assist? They had plenty doing nothing.

My wife likes the Script for example. She was under just incredible stress when they announced their free concert. Then she realised it was HSE only. Her sister works in admin in the HSE. She was redeployed as their was no work in their department. She also had little to nothing to do in her new temporary role. She got free tickets. Nit the Scripts fault or anyones fault really. But just felt like another little kick to private healthcare workers.

Sorry for the rant. Just think its a shame the nursing home situation was so misunderstood in general.

spookwoman

What Username Guidelines wrote: »

It’d be like Martin McGuinness shaking hands with the queen.

Well I know I'm not the queen and I know I am not hiding any bodies.

drunkmonkey

Renjit wrote: »

Irrefutable logic. 200% truth :pac:

The evidence seems to be pointing that way, we'll have some real world evidence from Denmark soon as there doing the worlds first randomized trials. At the moment there is no evidence to say masking the unsick gives any advantage in stopping Covid.

Jim_Hodge

theballz wrote: »

What is our R number after today’s figures?

1.6 down from 1.8

Renjit

drunkmonkey wrote: »

The evidence seems to be pointing that way, we'll have some real world evidence from Denmark soon as there doing the worlds first randomized trials. At the moment there is no evidence to say masking the unsick gives any advantage in stopping Covid.

If someone asks: What's the evidence for mask wearing? Here is a list of *SEVENTY* papers, including reviews/meta-analysis and individual studies, in reverse chronological order. Includes 31 from 2020 alone (!!). META = meta-analysis or systematic review. (Source: https://threader.app/thread/1279144399897866248)

drunkmonkey

Renjit wrote: »

If someone asks: What's the evidence for mask wearing? Here is a list of *SEVENTY* papers, including reviews/meta-analysis and individual studies, in reverse chronological order. Includes 31 from 2020 alone (!!). META = meta-analysis or systematic review. (Source: https://threader.app/thread/1279144399897866248)

What's your point, let me make this clear there is no evidence outside a labatory setting masks are effective. Let's see what the randomised real world trial in Denmark will produce.
We have seen cases go up when masks are introduced, it's happened in the UK and seems to be happening here. I welcome the Denmark study to finally bring some clarity, I'm not sure it's going to produce the result you'll like though.

1641

We had a general election in February. We had no Covid at all before that.

I think I have cracked it.

Renjit

drunkmonkey wrote: »

What's your point, let me make this clear there is no evidence outside a labatory setting masks are effective. Let's see what the randomised real world trial in Denmark will produce.
We have seen cases go up when masks are introduced, it's happened in the UK and seems to be happening here. I welcome the Denmark study to finally bring some clarity, I'm not sure it's going to produce the result you'll like though.

Oh lord, my savior, Denmark. All hail:D

drunkmonkey

Renjit wrote: »

Oh lord, my savior, Denmark. All hail:D

Let's see what happens. There being sensible taking an evidence and fact based scientific approach that's more than I can say for what's going on here.

Micky 32

spookwoman wrote: »

No link to the post and And we need a step back or 2 means a lock down :rolleyes:


Seriously ...

froog wrote: »

not good. we need to go back a step or two and fast.

Did you miss this hysterical post then? :rolleyes:

Gael23

When a vaccine is found, how quickly will the “Old Normal” return, or are these changes to society permanent?

ACitizenErased

The US has cut coronavirus testing by 17% and continues to report 50,000+ cases per day.

At the end of July, America was doing more than 800,000 tests a day. This week, it's hovered around 715,000.

Even as states with particularly bad outbreaks pull back on their testing, the proportion of tests coming back positive is still high — which would normally be an indication that they need to be doing more tests.
In Texas, 19% of tests are coming back positive, according to Nephron Research. In Florida, the rate of positive tests is 18%, and in Nevada, 17%.

https://www.axios.com/were-doing-a-lot-less-coronavirus-testing-df191643-91ed-40a4-83f6-0586a7ef9930.html

Renjit

ACitizenErased wrote: »

The US has cut coronavirus testing by 17% and continues to report 50,000+ cases per day.


https://www.axios.com/were-doing-a-lot-less-coronavirus-testing-df191643-91ed-40a4-83f6-0586a7ef9930.html

This thing is not slowing. Governments have stopped reporting actual numbers. New normal is to live with this virus.

eagle eye

Stevieluvsye wrote:

Sick of the merchants of doom here. Between schools, pubs & travel and some other clown having a meltdown about whether or not to go to the Cinema it would drain you.

We need to be more positive and take a pragmatic approach

We need to be realistic and remain safe. My child's health is paramount to me. I'll protect him as best I can. I'll let all the buffoons send their kids back to school, wait eight weeks and if everything is fine have them back in before Halloween. If things go wrong I'll keep them.out until such time as it is safe.
You probably call me a doom and gloomer but I'm just realistic about things. We don't know enough about this virus yet, there's too many questions still to be answered.
As soon as the schools reopen we are going back into lockdown. Only people we will mix with are families that don't send their kids back and remain safe.

ACitizenErased wrote:

The concept of living with this and getting on with life remains an abstract reality to some.

I'm living with it but I'm not willing to take risks which could end up in any if my family contracting the virus.

Like anybody going into a cinema for two hours with total strangers is what I'd call foolhardy which is the friendliest and nicest word I can use for what they're doing.

spookwoman

https://twitter.com/mairenihuigin/status/1293829971585241089?s=20

drunkmonkey

Gael23 wrote: »

When a vaccine is found, how quickly will the “Old Normal” return, or are these changes to society permanent?

There only permanent for as long as people are willing to accept them. Life is normal for a lot of people besides not being able to do one or two things they enjoyed like going to the pub, theater, clubbing etc.
A vaccine doesn't provide immunity, I'm not sure what your hoping will happen when one does arrive, it could take decades to eradicate, we seem to have accepted the heard immunity strategy here but we're driving the cattle truck very slowly as to not overburden the health services.

eagle eye

drunkmonkey wrote:

There only permanent for as long as people are willing to accept them. Life is normal for a lot of people besides not being able to do one or two things they enjoyed like going to the pub, theater, clubbing etc. A vaccine doesn't provide immunity, I'm not sure what your hoping will happen when one does arrive, it could take decades to eradicate, we seem to have accepted the heard immunity strategy here but we're driving the cattle truck very slowly as to not overburden the health services.

A person has got the virus for a second time so at this point there's no such thing as herd immunity.

ACitizenErased

eagle eye wrote: »

A person has got the virus for a second time so at this point there's no such thing as herd immunity.

Where did you see this?

MOR316

bettyoleary wrote: »

OOOh I bet your kids are doing your head in right now.

I live alone. It's ****ing brilliant

igCorcaigh

ACitizenErased wrote: »

Where did you see this?

https://twitter.com/BNODesk/status/1293746229059477504?s=19

It must be rare though, so will not impact on efforts to achieve herd immunity through vaccination.

Sconsey

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Let's see what happens. There being sensible taking an evidence and fact based scientific approach that's more than I can say for what's going on here.

What would you know about 'fact based scientific approach'? you brush off a huge list of fact based scientific studies because they are lab based. You need to get a grip.

ACitizenErased

igCorcaigh wrote: »

https://twitter.com/BNODesk/status/1293746229059477504?s=19

It must be rare though, so will not impact on efforts to achieve herd immunity through vaccination.

That just means the virus got in but caused no symptoms, meaning disease was avoided, which is a good sign.
New studies suggest that immunity is sustained.

Recent studies have indicated that antibody responses to SARS-CoV-2 drop significantly within 2 months. In this preprint, Wu et al. analysed antibody responses in 349 individuals who were among the first to become infected with SARS-CoV-2. All antiviral antibody titres significantly increased in the first weeks after disease onset, followed by a contraction phase, where IgM became undetectable at around week 10–13. Importantly, although Spike-targeted IgG (IgG-S) declined over time, it remained detectable at relatively high levels until the end of the 6-month study period. IgG-S titres correlated closely with neutralizing capacity, although exact correlates of protection for SARS-CoV-2 are still elusive. These results suggest that antibody responses in symptomatic patients with COVID-19 follow a prototypical progression and result in a sustained memory response, suggesting long-term protective immunity.

https://www.nature.com/articles/s41577-020-00423-9

KrustyUCC

spookwoman wrote: »

No link to the post and And we need a step back or 2 means a lock down :rolleyes: .

froog wrote: »

not good. we need to go back a step or two and fast.

One step back is Phase two

Two steps back is Phase One

That's certainly lockdown

ACitizenErased

HSE Daily Operations Update

13 in hospital, increase of 2.
2 confirmed cases today, one in Mullingar and one in Tullamore.
6 in ICU, no change.
4 on ventilators, increase of 1.

Hospitals:
Kilkenny (+1) - 4
Mater (--) - 2
UHL (--) - 2
Beaumont (--) - 1
Cavan (--) - 1
Mullingar (+1) - 1
Tallaght (--) - 1
Tullamore (+1) - 1
Connolly (-1) - 0

drunkmonkey

Sconsey wrote: »

What would you know about 'fact based scientific approach'? you brush off a huge list of fact based scientific studies because they are lab based. You need to get a grip.

Not sure what your getting at, are you saying there's no need for real world trials?

Sconsey

Sconsey wrote: »

What would you know about 'fact based scientific approach'? you brush off a huge list of fact based scientific studies because they are lab based. You need to get a grip.

I'm still waiting for the collapsed supply chain, rampant starvation, garda and the army on the streets based on their posts in March along with the report of the shoot out they were going to have with the garda or army personnel who tried to stop them doing what ever they wanted.

eagle eye

ACitizenErased wrote:

That just means the virus got in but caused no symptoms, meaning disease was avoided, which is a good sign. New studies suggest that immunity is sustained.

How do you come to that conclusion so early? This only happened very recently, gotta wait two weeks before we know anything.

sideswipe

igCorcaigh wrote: »

https://twitter.com/BNODesk/status/1293746229059477504?s=19

It must be rare though, so will not impact on efforts to achieve herd immunity through vaccination.

Or else C-19 can act like the herpes virus which you can have pretty much forever asymptotically?

ACitizenErased

eagle eye wrote: »

How do you come to that conclusion so early? This only happened very recently, gotta wait two weeks before we know anything.

I don't think we'll hear anything.

Lyle

https://amp.ibtimes.sg/coronavirus-reinfection-elderly-chinese-woman-tests-covid-19-positive-again-6-months-after-recovery-50009

An elderly Chinese woman who was diagnosed with COVID-19 in February but recovered fully has tested positive for the disease again six months after, posing new challenge to the medical fraternity.

Apart from the 68-year-old woman from China's Hubei province, who tested positive again after developing symptoms on August 9, another man, found to have contracted the COVID-19 in April after returning from abroad, tested positive in Shanghai on Monday, August 10 though he did not develop any symptoms. Local Chinese authorities said none of the patients' close contacts has tested positive for the novel Coronavirus but they have been placed under quarantine.

An American physician, Clay Ackerly said that he had seen one of his patients who tested positive again for the virus, three months after recovery. As per the expert, while the first time the patient exhibted minor symptoms like cough and sore throat, the second time the person had severe symptoms, including high fever, shortness of breath, and dangerously low oxygen levels.

As per a report, Ackerly wrote, "Despite scientific hopes for either antibody-mediated or cellular immunity, the severity of my patient's second bout with COVID-19 suggests that such responses may not be as robust as we hope." He also added that "many people could catch COVID-19 more than once and with unpredictable severity."

Like everything else to do with this virus, all seems very random. Best case scenario if reinfection is possible is that people aren't infectious the second time around, hopefully? It'll be worth keeping an eye on whether close contacts of these reinfected people turn up any positive tests.

Gael23

drunkmonkey wrote: »

, I'm not sure what your hoping will happen when one does arrive, it could take decades to eradicate, we seem to have accepted the heard immunity strategy here but we're driving the cattle truck very slowly as to not overburden the health services.

Things like no queuing to get into shops, buses running at full capacity and offices opening as normal with all employees on site.

drunkmonkey

ACitizenErased wrote: »

That just means the virus got in but caused no symptoms, meaning disease was avoided, which is a good sign.
New studies suggest that immunity is sustained.

So they were asymptomatic? Are we sure asymptomatic people actually spread it?
.........................
The Zhongshan Hospital of this city found a case of new coronary pneumonia from Jilin who came to Shanghai for medical treatment. After investigation, the case was diagnosed as an imported confirmed case overseas in April this year, and was discharged after isolation treatment.




The case came to Shanghai in the afternoon of August 9 and went to Zhongshan Hospital for medical treatment in the morning of August 10. The hospital took samples and tested the hospitalized cases according to the relevant requirements of "should be checked." The test results were positive for the new coronavirus nucleic acid and diagnosed as asymptomatic cases of Fuyang. They have been transferred to designated medical institutions for isolation and treatment. His wife came to Shanghai with her, and the nucleic acid test was negative, and quarantine measures have been implemented.



The city immediately carried out prevention and control measures such as follow-up and investigation of close contacts and terminal disinfection. Up to now, a total of 23 people in close contact with the city have been tracked and managed, and isolation measures have been implemented, and nucleic acid tests have all been negative.
...............
https://mp.weixin.qq.com/s/rHlCRo9bhoJ4S1LlZE8-bQ

eagle eye

ACitizenErased wrote:

I don't think we'll hear anything.

So you are guessing now.

ACitizenErased

eagle eye wrote: »

So you are guessing now.

Just like you are guessing re-infection is possible based on 1 story.

Goldengirl

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Not sure what your trying to say, are the pubs the major vectors in those lockdowns or maybe it's a knee jerk reaction to just shut everything down, it's not any kind of strategy to just keep shutting everything down.
The term using a sledgehammer to crack a nut springs to mind.

It was the fact that he was unfortunately giving Melbourne as an example ....when Victoria was just going back into lockdown .
Just reminded me of it and made me chuckle.

Clip is interesting alright ,and if it was policed properly it would be alright ...therein lies the problem though .

ACitizenErased

eagle eye wrote: »

There's more than just be story, there's two in China, one in Durban, SA as well.

We would have heard thousands of stories by now if it was true, in my opinion. There's 20 million+ confirmed cases and very little evidence.

drunkmonkey

Gael23 wrote: »

Things like no queuing to get into shops, buses running at full capacity and offices opening as normal with all employees on site.

Time to move to move to a smaller place if you want that kind of normality quickly. Can't see offices and buses at full capacity for a while.

eagle eye

ACitizenErased wrote:

Just like you are guessing re-infection is possible based on 1 story.

There's more than just one story, there's two in China, one in Durban, SA as well. And these are facts, no guessing on my part.

igCorcaigh

It may be true but rare.
I think reinfection is not a significant story at all.
Hope I'm right!

eagle eye

ACitizenErased wrote:

We would have heard thousands of stories by now if it was true, in my opinion. There's 20 million+ confirmed cases and very little evidence.

Typical dismissive fairweather thinking. You go ahead and be a guinea pig. Don't come back here crying if you get covid-19.

ACitizenErased

eagle eye wrote: »

Typical dismissive fairweather thinking. You go ahead and be a guinea pig. Don't come back here crying if you get covid-19.

Uhm, okay?

mountgomery burns

If you're looking at 7 day averages every day, and you have a particularly high day, invariably the average will rise on that dayy. It's not really hugely different to looking at one day in isolation. Better to assess it at regular intervals, such as Monday-Sunday each week or otherwise.

Testing numbers have increased the last two days, I think that's a comforting thing because they'd taken a fairly sharp dip recently despite a few events you would have thought would have prompted them to rise.

Sconsey

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Not sure what your getting at, are you saying there's no need for real world trials?

I'm saying you choose to ignore a multitude of studies (probably because you don't like the conclusion) but think this one study from Denmark will trump everything else produced on the topic (the topic being how effective masks are). You seem to think if a study is done in a lab it is irrelevant.

DubInMeath wrote: »

I'm still waiting for the collapsed supply chain, rampant starvation, garda and the army on the streets based on their posts in March along with the report of the shoot out they were going to have with the garda or army personnel who tried to stop them doing what ever they wanted.

No Idea what you are on about or why you are quoting me.

Goldengirl

drunkmonkey wrote: »

The evidence seems to be pointing that way, we'll have some real world evidence from Denmark soon as there doing the worlds first randomized trials. At the moment there is no evidence to say masking the unsick gives any advantage in stopping Covid.

True, but how do you know if someone is ' unsick' or an asymptomatic spreader , without regular testing ?

seanb85

ACitizenErased wrote: »

We would have heard thousands of stories by now if it was true, in my opinion. There's 20 million+ confirmed cases and very little evidence.

Other corona viruses only produce immunity lasting 3 - 12 months, we're probably only now getting to the period where we will find out if reinfection is likely or possible, the next 6 months will tell us a lot. If it does occur hopefully B and T cells will mean a milder infection.

MOR316

eagle eye wrote: »

Typical dismissive fairweather thinking. You go ahead and be a guinea pig. Don't come back here crying if you get covid-19.

What the absolute ****? :D:D

drunkmonkey

@ACitizenErased, what's your take on this from Ivor Cummins..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FU3OibcindQ

Micky 32

Gael23 wrote: »

Things like no queuing to get into shops, buses running at full capacity and offices opening as normal with all employees on site.

If a vaccine is approved ( looking more likely there will be than not) and provided you take it you’ll be safe enough to do what you want including travelling again.