Covid 19 Part XXI-27,908 in ROI (1,777 deaths) 6,647 in NI (559 deaths)(22/08)Read OP

FintanMcluskey

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

I only know one person who caught the virus. Mid sixties back to work after two weeks and took the time to praise my son for donating a kidney.

Im like a broken record.

84 out of 87 folk healthy enough to work had 0 symptoms.

They were in complete disbelief at the positive results

Plumbthedepths

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

The nicest description I can describe your reply with is delusion, but if clinging onto such makes you happy I won't point out the flaws.

Some people would have thought getting the anglo irish agreement or good Friday agreement was delusional at certain times. It was worth it though and we all reaped those benefits. This is also worth fighting for. Many scientists are arguing for this. They don't care so much about politics. Scientists are doing their job advising government. Its now politicians/diplomacy to do theirs.

caveat emptor

fritzelly wrote: »

Anecdotal is not science but call out another poster

Pot...kettle...black

Here's the peer reviewed study, not anecdotal. MRI, magnetic resonance imagining. Allows you to see inside someone, like really see inside someone.

(not written by someone who works for vintners or can't see a life
without going to a pub that doesn't serve chicken wings)


https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamacardiology/fullarticle/2768916

Micky 32

caveat emptor wrote: »

You are an idiot if you disregard science and use 10 people who are probably lying to you as your sample size.

Lol, i don’t really care if you believe me or not to be honest but your reply is definately another sign of a misery merchant. Who said i was disregarding science? I was giving my real life experience. You just don’t want to believe or hear anything positive. But i can tell you now they ALL made a full recovery. One person was 78 and another 85.

I bet if i had told you the opposite had happened those people you wouldn’t have questioned it in the slightest.

Plumbthedepths

SeaBreezes wrote: »

What offical figure is that?
650,000 for what time frame?
For where?

I don't know maybe this organisation has some credibility?

https://www.who.int/news-room/detail/14-12-2017-up-to-650-000-people-die-of-respiratory-diseases-linked-to-seasonal-flu-each-year

Plumbthedepths

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Some people would have thought getting the anglo irish agreement or good Friday agreement was delusional at certain times. It was worth it though and we all reaped those benefits. This is also worth fighting for. Many scientists are arguing for this. They don't care so much about politics. Scientists are doing their job advising government. Its now politicians/diplomacy to do theirs.

The comment you replied to still applies to this comment from you.

Plumbthedepths

caveat emptor wrote: »

I know a camel who had two wives (one was a cat) and donated a spleen that he didn't need. The horse came over to say "nice virtue signalling, I mean well done"

I have read many of your posts across different threads, they tell me all I need to know about your motives. I won't be engaging

Wolf359f

[Deleted User] wrote: »

No system is perfect. Our level of disease is currently higher than the UK anyhow. I did say earlier we would have to use diplomacy with regards NI/UK. Possibly a covid free UK/Ireland zone is another alternative. Its not going to be easy. Alternative is alot more grim for next 12/18 months and not sustainable. We still seem to be in emergency/reactionary mode rather than an overall plan.

What's puzzling is the UK had a massive outbreak of 300 cases in a sandwich factory and a few days later their cases increases by as much and then dropped back down. We had a substantial outbreak and our numbers have been all over the place. I know it's a different country, but you can't deny we're quite similar to the UK in day to day activities.

The government here are certainly in a reactionary mode and the lack of leadership/goal is quite telling. Michael Martin needs to get out in front of it and not make decisions after the fact. For people saying FF is the same as FG.... I think with covid or a national emergency, they are very differently.

caveat emptor

Micky 32 wrote: »

Lol, i don’t really care if you believe me or not to be honest but your reply is definately another sign of a misery merchant. You just don’t want to believe anything positive. But i can tell you now they ALL made a full recovery. One person was 78 and another 85.

I bet if i had told you the opposite had happened those people you wouldn’t have questioned it in the slightest.

Nah that is great. I'm happy for these people. I know people who are still suffering months later though.

Point is it's not a peer reviewed scientific paper though and it's an anonymous Internet forum where people could have multiple lives depending on the point they are making which they regularly do. If I were lucky enough to own a pub I'd say

• "let's get back to normal"
• "it's only a flu"
• "government over reach"
• "liberties and freedoms"
• "too much debt"
• I know ten people who had it and were fine

What I'm really saying is

• "save my pub by ringing my til"

Which is probably a form of cognitive dissonance at this stage.

Why would someone be a "misery merchant" ??


I'm optimistic though. I'm pretty sure this vaccine will work but only if you are nice to china.

https://twitter.com/CGTNOfficial/status/1295158400469196800?s=20

fritzelly

caveat emptor wrote: »

Here's the peer reviewed study, not anecdotal. MRI, magnetic resonance imagining. Allows you to see inside someone, like really see inside someone.

(not written by someone who works for vintners or can't see a life
without going to a pub that doesn't serve chicken wings)

Did you even bother to read the report or just pluck the first thing off the internet - I could go into the unreliability of the report but its just not even worth the effort

caveat emptor

fritzelly wrote: »

Did you even bother to read the report or just pluck the first thing off the internet - I could go into the unreliability of the report but its just not even worth the effort

I discussed it in depth when it came out a few weeks ago.

Please have a go at disproving a peer reviewed study.

I do find that funny on here.

Sad

Tell me how

boggerman1 wrote: »

Stay indoors for the rest of time if you like.some of us have decided to live life come what may

Probably Covid with that attitude.

FintanMcluskey

Tell me how wrote: »

Probably Covid with that attitude.

Lets hope they don't have a runny nose like the 3 food production facility worker's that had symptoms out of 87 positive cases

fritzelly

caveat emptor wrote: »

I discussed it in depth when it came out a few weeks ago.

Please have a go at disproving a peer reviewed study.

I do find that funny on here.

Sad

Where does it say peer reviewed?
Where does it say this could be the case for everyone that catches it

Our study has limitations

Several patients within our cohort had new or persistent symptoms, thus increasing the likelihood of positive CMR findings

do not represent patients during acute COVID-19 infection or those who are completely asymptomatic with COVID-19

And if I remember correctly 70% of the patients in the study had preexisting conditions

Strumms

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

Actually no, I pointed out how we are not willing to protect people from influenza but we will protect people from Covid under punishment of 6 months in prison yet influenza is a recurring illness.

Influenza doesn’t kill as many people as covid though.

Micky 32

caveat emptor wrote: »

• "let's get back to normal"
• "it's only a flu"
• "government over reach"
• "liberties and freedoms"
• "too much debt"
• I know ten people who had it and were fine

The only one on that list that has any relevance to me or do i care about is the last one.

But it’s actually 12.

caveat emptor

Well that's an attempt.
I'm sorry that you can't see if something is peer reviewed or not.
Keep up the science though.
Actually 67% of them didn't even go to hospital with covid.
Top tip, resist the temptation to say preexisting conditions especially if........

A total of 78 patients who recovered from COVID-19 infection (78%) had cardiovascular involvement as detected by standardized CMR, irrespective of preexisting conditions, the severity and overall course of the COVID-19 presentation, the time from the original diagnosis, or the presence of cardiac symp- toms. The most prevalent abnormality was myocardial inflam- mation (defined as abnormal native T1 and T2 measures), detected in 60 patients recently recovered from COVID-19 (60%), followed by regional scar and pericardial enhance- ment. Findings on classic parameters, such as volumes and ejec- tion fractions, were mildly abnormal. Myocardial measures, na- tive T1 measures, and native T2 measures provided the best discriminatory value against healthy controls and risk factor– matched controls for exclusion of any myocardial disease or con- firmation of COVID-19–related involvement, respectively.

Have a read if you don't believe me.
That's the great thing about a scientific paper.
It's verifiable and should be reproducible.
We should do one here to find out.
I know someone who had 12 friends and family.
Sure that's one tenth of this study, a great start.

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamacardiology/fullarticle/2768916

fritzelly

caveat emptor wrote: »

Well that's an attempt.
I'm sorry that you can't see if something is peer reviewed or not.
Keep up the science though.
Actually 67% of them didn't even go to hospital with covid.
Top tip, resist the temptation to say preexisting conditions especially if........

Myocarditis can be caused by viruses - shocker, hold the presses, coronavirus is screwing us all

Not engaging with you anymore with your twitterati proof of the end of the world - back to ignore

caveat emptor

fritzelly wrote: »

Did you even bother to read the report or just pluck the first thing off the internet - I could go into the unreliability of the report but its just not even worth the effort

caveat emptor wrote: »

I discussed it in depth when it came out a few weeks ago.

Please have a go at disproving a peer reviewed study.

I do find that funny on here.

Sad

fritzelly wrote: »

Where does it say peer reviewed?
Where does it say this could be the case for everyone that catches it




And if I remember correctly 70% of the patients in the study had preexisting conditions

caveat emptor wrote: »

Well that's an attempt.
I'm sorry that you can't see if something is peer reviewed or not.
Keep up the science though.
Actually 67% of them didn't even go to hospital with covid.
Top tip, resist the temptation to say preexisting conditions especially if........



Have a read if you don't believe me.
That's the great thing about a scientific paper.
It's verifiable and should be reproducible.
We should do one here to find out.
I know someone who had 12 friends and family.
Sure that's one tenth of this study, a great start.

https://jamanetwork.com/journals/jamacardiology/fullarticle/2768916

fritzelly wrote: »

Myocarditis can be caused by viruses - shocker, hold the presses, coronavirus is screwing us all

Not engaging with you anymore with your twitterati proof of the end of the world - back to ignore

Thought so.......

s1ippy

Lot of non-engagement going on tonight, it's a good sign really because when you're explaining you're losing. So if you're not even explaining...

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

It's not, but it's distrubing that those advocating this position seem to be getting a lot of air time without a countering position being given equal consideration.

So enlighten us with the counter-argument; I assume the opposite of a Zero-Covid Strategy is some sort of "Loads of Covid" approach.

SeaBreezes

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

I don't know maybe this organisation has some credibility?

https://www.who.int/news-room/detail/14-12-2017-up-to-650-000-people-die-of-respiratory-diseases-linked-to-seasonal-flu-each-year

Thats WORLD WIDE. Per annum.

Covid19 deaths globally have surpassed that already.
And we are not even 6 months in with massive lockdowns and restrictions to limit spread.

Even with dreadful under reporting and not counting excess deaths.
Most heart attacks strokes not tested for covid19 ...

SeaBreezes

Micky 32 wrote: »

The only one on that list that has any relevance to me or do i care about is the last one.

But it’s actually 12.

Well mick you've certainly put my mind at rest.

Phew!! For a min there i thought we had a global pandemic.

Sure, it'll be grand!! Mick said so..

SeaBreezes

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

Lets hope they don't have a runny nose like the 3 food production facility worker's that had symptoms out of 87 positive cases

Are.you making this up for a laugh or have you an actual source for this?
Or is it your cousins sisters friend is the source?

spookwoman

fritzelly wrote: »

Myocarditis can be caused by viruses - shocker, hold the presses, coronavirus is screwing us all

Not engaging with you anymore with your twitterati proof of the end of the world - back to ignore

You are very good at just shooting anything you don't like down but I have yet to see you post something that says otherwise. You posted the other night saying people don't know immunology can I ask are you a qualified immunologist, Virologist, an infectious disease specialist with proper qualifications?

I suggest before you blah blah blah that another virus does that and nothing to prove it's caused by Covid, post something that is peer reviewed proving you right.

Good night.

JJandthebear

SeaBreezes wrote: »

What offical figure is that?
650,000 for what time frame?
For where?

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

I don't know maybe this organisation has some credibility?

Those are estimated figures though and the CDC estimates on flu deaths are very sketchy* and have openly been called into question by the british medical journal in the recent past and many US physicians have requested they change their methodology in coming to these figures. They, for example, bundle pneumonia and flu deaths together, even though the CDC itself stated a fear years back that they had a slim relationship with only 8.5% of pnuemonia and influenze deaths being influenza related.

*the annual flu death estimate for America given by the CDC in the last 6 flu seasons ranged somewhere between 25,000 and 65,000 yet their actual reported flu deaths for that period were between 3,500 and 15,000.

fritzelly

spookwoman wrote: »

You are very good at just shooting anything you don't like down but I have yet to see you post something that says otherwise. You posted the other night saying people don't know immunology can I ask are you a qualified immunologist, Virologist, an infectious disease specialist with proper qualifications?

I suggest before you blah blah blah that another virus does that and nothing to prove it's caused by Covid, post something that is peer reviewed proving you right.

Good night.

Call me out on blah blahing another poster posting anything and everything from twitter and random unsubstantiated theories but you want me to post real proof

Here ye go
https://www.mayoclinic.org/diseases-conditions/myocarditis/symptoms-causes/syc-20352539

Waiting for you to show me proof now that coronavirus is doing something that no other virus does

smurfjed

OscarMIlde wrote: »

There are false negatives all right but not false positives. Not unless the samples are contaminated.

thank you as I dont know how the test works, however we have undergone over 5000 PCR tests as a company, I believe that only 1 person ended up in hospital, but we have had over 30 cases listed as positive resulting in people going into isolation and increased testing.

30 from 5000-ish isnt a great number, but it might show that the whole process has errors as these tests were conducted in different cities and tested by different labs.

CalamariFritti

redarmy wrote: »

https://twitter.com/padraig_reilly/status/1295135077647683584

So a photographer on twitter is a source now? Only saying...

stephenjmcd

Kildare GP on Morning Ireland saying in her area no major increase in paitents presenting with symptoms, numbers are very low and she hasn't had a postive case in weeks.

Says it appears Kildare cases are in the known outbreaks (meat plants etc)

ExMachina1000

GooglePlus wrote: »

Rumours of a jive contest in Castleblaney over the weekend but no mention of that on Twitter. Up to 100 men and women courting eachother.

Sounds like a sexy time

thelad95

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Kildare GP on Morning Ireland saying in her area no major increase in paitents presenting with symptoms, numbers are very low and she hasn't had a postive case in weeks.

Says it appears Kildare cases are in the known outbreaks (meat plants etc)

Fantastic to see that the restrictions which were imposed to stop a wild community outbreak from these enormous clusters seem to be working then.

Boggles

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Kildare GP on Morning Ireland saying in her area no major increase in paitents presenting with symptoms, numbers are very low and she hasn't had a postive case in weeks.

Says it appears Kildare cases are in the known outbreaks (meat plants etc)

So the community transmission is not Kildare like expected?

That's not great news TBF.

Boggles

Boggles wrote: »

So the community transmission is not Kildare like expected?

That's not great news TBF.

Is there ever anything that is great? Can we not just welcome the fact that the massive outbreaks associated with a number of locations in Kildare are not breaking out in to the wider community?

Boggles

Deleted User wrote: »

Is there ever anything that is great? Can we not just welcome the fact that the massive outbreaks associated with a number of locations in Kildare are not breaking out in to the wider community?

No, it would be far better if community transmission would be located in a county that is currently under different restrictions to the rest of the country for quite obvious reasons.

Boggles

Boggles wrote: »

No, it would be far better if community transmission would be located in a county that is currently under different restrictions to the rest of the country for quite obvious reasons.

We have had massive outbreaks in a few locations, and these cases are still coming out of these outbreaks, yet our numbers are flat for a week. Yes it is more concerning than a couple of weeks back, but the fact that massive amounts of symptomatic people are not showing up to their GP's or in the hospitals is positive, and very different to where we were in March

Boggles

Deleted User wrote: »

We have had massive outbreaks in a few locations, and these cases are still coming out of these outbreaks, yet our numbers are flat for a week. Yes it is more concerning than a couple of weeks back, but the fact that massive amounts of symptomatic people are not showing up to their GP's or in the hospitals is positive, and very different to where we were in March

You just jumped the fence and ran up the field. But bringing it back to the actual point I made.

The optimistic thought on the thread was that community transmission was happening in the counties that had the outbreaks, the thinking behind it being that you may not be able to directly link a case back to these outbreaks but if the bulk of them are happening only in areas of higher infection you can reasonable assume they came from them indirectly.

If the bulk of community transmission is happening nationwide, then that means the virus is reseeding undetected which is the big problem, not a manageable cluster in a meat factory or mushroom factory.

JazzyJ

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

Im like a broken record.

84 out of 87 folk healthy enough to work had 0 symptoms.

They were in complete disbelief at the positive results

How many were still asymptomatic after a further 7 days?

Micky 32

SeaBreezes wrote: »

Well mick you've certainly put my mind at rest.

Phew!! For a min there i thought we had a global pandemic.

Sure, it'll be grand!! Mick said so..

What rubbish are you spouting now? Does the fact that i know some people that fully recovered not fit in that misery bubble of yours? Would you like me to research and find some people that haven’t recovered? Would that make you feel all happy snug and warm? It seems to be a problem for some certain posters the fact i posted about those people, strange....

I never once deined or dismissed there is a global pandemic going on.


BTW , the reason i qouted that list saying it wasn’t relevent to me except for the last one was because you won’t see many posts from me complaining about it. So hence it was irrelevent the poster qouting them to me.

Jackman25

caveat emptor wrote: »

I don't agree with this. Young people are part of civil society and have responsibilities like the rest of us. A lot of whom take this seriously.

Think of all the health care workers who fell ill and who may fall ill again this winter. Or Kids who won't be able to attend school safely. Height of selfishness, Saying human nature is a cop out. It's human nature to sh!t, it doesn't mean you are allowed to do it on the street. Fine the sh!t out of them and it'll act as a deterrent.

https://twitter.com/Eastcorkclinsoc/status/1294724407978610690?s=20

What is he so tired from?

AdamD

Arghus wrote: »

Sticking to the guidelines and people taking personal responsibility is the only way this is going to work.

I don't really know what you're advocating here to be honest. "Pragmatism and real solutions" reads to me like code for let's crack on and get back to normal life ASAP. Unfortunately getting back to unfettered normal life only has one outcome: more cases, more potential serious illness and death and eventually more restrictions. I'm all for finding a way out but I'm telling you that is definitely not going to be the way. Covid is still a deadly and infectious disease, right now it's infecting young people, but give it time and give it opportunity it will infect others that are not bulletproof. And a lot of people are not bulletproof.

People need to dispense with the fantasy that normal life is coming back anytime soon and that pretending things are grand is going to make things grand. Things are different now and they will stay different. That is crap for everybody, but it's the truth.

We need to accept that the virus is here to stay for the foreseeable, the best we can do is try to find a way to muddle through and keep a lid on it, hopefully until someone somewhere comes up with a plan B. It can't be wished away because we're tired of living with it.

And that plan B could be a vaccine, better knowledge about what we are dealing with here, better treatment or all of the above. But nothing is guaranteed and there's no set time limit on anything. People are fatigued and they want deadlines, set destination points. But this is another thing people need to forget about. The uncertainty and the unknown will continue until it doesn't. And that's understandably a hard thing for people to get their heads around, but unfortunately, that is what we are dealing with here. There isn't a single leader, commentator or scientist in the entire world right now that can legitimately say they know where we'll all be at in 6 months. We're hardwired to expect things - promises, guarantees - that are actually impossible in this context.

I think letting her rip and just fantasising that normal life will roar back without skipping a beat is pie in the sky stuff - a delusion - and, on the other extreme, I wouldn't like to live in a police state. So I really think what we're being asked to do at the moment in terms of following guidelines, social distancing, being sensible and not irresponsible, wearing masks, washing hands is actually the best of all our shyte options right now and the most sustainable and least disastrous in the short to medium term, even if that seems hard to believe. It's all shyte, it sucks. But it's better than the alternatives and if people stuck to it and actually followed it we'd all have a easier time of it overall.

See this is the thing, you think social distancing is sustainable in the medium term, I do not. Sure you can keep pubs/clubs closed, stop mass gatherings etc. that can last. But the guidelines such as stay 2m apart from your friends if you call to their house? Keep your contacts low etc. not going to happen

Boggles

Boggles wrote: »

You just jumped the fence and ran up the field. But bringing it back to the actual point I made.

The optimistic thought on the thread was that community transmission was happening in the counties that had the outbreaks, the thinking behind it being that you may not be able to directly link a case back to these outbreaks but if the bulk of them are happening only in areas of higher infection you can reasonable assume they came from them indirectly.

If the bulk of community transmission is happening nationwide, then that means the virus is reseeding undetected which is the big problem, not a manageable cluster in a meat factory or mushroom factory.

OP you replied to mentioned nothing about community transmission, just that it was positive that cases in Kildare seemed to be all associated with known outbreak. And given Kildare makes up a disproportionate number of current cases, this is positive, not conclusive, but positive nonetheless

What Username Guidelines

Not sure if posted but last night's report was late

Hospitalised up from 16 to 19
ICU remains at 8, with 5 ventilated

Connolly 3 (+1)
Tallaght 3 (+1)
UHL 3 (+1)
Cavan 2 (no change)
Kilkenny 2 (no change)
Mater 2 (no change)
Naas 2 (no change)
Beaumount 1 (no change)
Mullingar 1 (no change)

https://www.hse.ie/eng/services/news/newsfeatures/covid19-updates/covid-19-daily-operations-update-2000-16-august-2020.pdf

wadacrack

21 now in hospital. Highest number for a number of weeks.

blowitupref

wadacrack wrote: »

21 now in hospital. Highest number for a number of weeks.

No patents are sent home at weekends, be interesting to see what the number is by the HSE report on Tuesday.

wadacrack

wadacrack wrote: »

21 now in hospital. Highest number for a number of weeks.

Increase in 7 from Sunday to Sunday, with over 550 cases in the previous week (Takes 5- 7 days to cases to get to hospital - in general). A manageable level getting ill enough to require hospitalisation. And something we have to get used to.

Boggles

Deleted User wrote: »

OP you replied to mentioned nothing about community transmission, just that it was positive that cases in Kildare seemed to be all associated with known outbreak. And given Kildare makes up a disproportionate number of current cases, this is positive, not conclusive, but positive nonetheless

Yes, that is the point.

Boggles

wadacrack wrote: »

21 now in hospital. Highest number for a number of weeks.

Highest number since the 4th of July.

Snow Garden

caveat emptor wrote: »

Height of selfishness, Saying human nature is a cop out. It's human nature to sh!t, it doesn't mean you are allowed to do it on the street. Fine the sh!t out of them and it'll act as a deterrent.

Classic line

ACitizenErased

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Kildare GP on Morning Ireland saying in her area no major increase in paitents presenting with symptoms, numbers are very low and she hasn't had a postive case in weeks.

Says it appears Kildare cases are in the known outbreaks (meat plants etc)

The latest GP buddy stats show very little uptick anywhere in the country tbh

RandomName2

One lesson I hope that comes with the fiasco of COVID-19 is that time is of the essence when responding to an outbreak. Europe essentially sat on its hands in January and February, until significant clusters had formed. When they did respond, they did so slowly, only ratcheting up the level of the response in tandem with the escalation of the numbers infected.

People took the wrong lesson from SARS. They believed that because it was halted meant you didn't have to react much, whereas the opposite was true. For weeks, no months, you had people here saying not to be hysterical.

Initially the WHO said that people should not wear face masks, only relenting after several months.

The Asiatic countries pretty much universally responded appropriately to the initial outbreak. Despite having less time to react, and being closer to the epicenter of the disease, they managed to stave it off until recently.

The criminally negligent behavior of both Europe and America gave the virus opportunity to infect the rest of the world.

The only hope now is for a vaccine, but not only a vaccine, but one that would provide herd immunity. Without this the virus will be with us forever.

Again, if Europe and America stay true to form, and feel that an uptake of just 10-20% for the vaccine is okay, then that's what we'll get. At least if the most vulnerable can be protected that will be a major plus.

At the moment all we are doing is playing for time for a widespread vaccine to be available. The capacity to eradicate the virus, as was done with SARS 1 and MERS, disappeared back in February. The only silver lining is that SARS and MERS were way, way more deadly than COVID-19