FG to still just do nothing for the next 5 years - part 2

Bubbaclaus

McMurphy wrote: »

I think at this point and time Francie, it's:

"Oh sh1t, how do I reverse away from this one"?

It's poor taste using sickness and deaths to try and score points, but FFS - if you insist on doing so, have your facts straight beforehand.

In the interest of defending myself from blatant lies, here are the entirety of my posts on this discussion, which clearly show I have done no such thing as implied above at any point. As everyone will see, none of my posts even mention deaths or make any comparisons.

No idea why such a lie would be posted.

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

I don't get what you are trying to say here. The statements made by both poster 1 and 2 in your scenario can both be correct at the same time.

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

I'm reading all of what McMurphy posted and commenting based on that. If he is poorly explaining and incorrectly quoting how the actual conversation he is referring to went then fair enough.

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

I'm not sure what you are trying to say here. Both poster 1 and poster 2 in McMurphy's example can be correct at the same time. They are not saying opposite things.

Who are the notable posters?

McMurphy

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

In the interest of defending myself from blatant lies, here are the entirety of my posts on this discussion, which clearly show I have done no such thing as implied above at any point. As everyone will see, none of my posts even mention deaths or make any comparisons.

No idea why such a lie would be posted.

Were you the poster that claimed the Norths rate was higher than ours, and even though ours was officially the worst in the world, "even for a brief time" - still standing by that statement?

I didn't say you were. You were however trying to back up the falsehood.

No?

Great, there was no personal abuse regardless, either to you, or "poster1"

BS claims, are BS claims. It's time to stop polishing the turd.

blanch152

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

I was typing up a reply explaining why both statements as you wrote them can absolutely be correct at the same time, but then I noticed this so deleted it as I realised it's pointless. No need for personal abuse, I didn't direct any in your direction.

Here are the facts.


https://www.rte.ie/news/2021/0129/1193927-covid-ireland-latest/

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0129/1193894-coronavirus-northern-ireland/

Death toll in Northern Ireland: 1,814
Death toll in Ireland: 3,214

Both are horrendous numbers.

Per capita (1,000) the figures are

Deaths in Northern Ireland: 0.962
Deaths in Ireland: 0.655

The death toll in Northern Ireland is running nearly 50% higher than in the South. This is despite two factors that should result in the North being lower. Firstly, the North does not count deaths as widely as the South and secondly, the Boris Johnson government's success in securing vaccines should have seen a much lower death rate this year.

Those are the horrendous facts about what is happening. Yes, for one week, we were at the highest rate in the world, but that was one week.

Real people have died as a result of this pandemic. Many of them have died unnecessarily in the North as they should have been able to achieve better results than us for the factors I have mentioned. It is a real scandal.

FrancieBrady

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

I was typing up a reply explaining why both statements as you wrote them can absolutely be correct at the same time, but then I noticed this so deleted it as I realised it's pointless. No need for personal abuse, I didn't direct any in your direction.

The poster he was referring to has engaged in a macabre competition, blaming one party in our government for the tragedy in NI.

Again, try reading the conversation posted with that in mind.

Bubbaclaus

McMurphy wrote: »

Were you the poster that claimed the Norths rate was higher than ours, and even though ours was officially the worst in the world, "even for a brief time" - still standing by that statement?

I didn't say you were. You were however trying to back up the falsehood.

No?

Great, there was no personal abuse regardless, either to you, or "poster1"

BS claims, are BS claims. It's time to stop polishing the turd.

Your quotes were the following. I do not spend most of my time on boards, and have not been privy to all you and others conversations, so I was going by your quotes below. If you poorly outlined the discussion and the points being made in it then it's hardly my fault.

McMurphy wrote: »

Poster1 "Northern Ireland had higher covid rates than us"

Correct and accurate statement based on available data.

McMurphy wrote: »

Poster2""Eh, we literally had the highest infection rates in the entire world, right here in the 26 counties for covid, just this week."

Correct and accurate statement based on available data.

McMurphy wrote: »

Poster1s reply "Aye but that was just for a wee while, northern Ireland had higher"

Correct and accurate statement based on available data.


That's why I asked the question. All the points above by both Poster 1 and Poster 2 were accurate statements to make. If you mistyped them originally and something else was actually said in the original discussion then fair enough, but it's hardly my fault for reading and interpreting your quotes as they were presented.

McMurphy

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

Your quotes were the following. I do not spend most of my time on boards, and have not been privy to all you and others conversations, so I was going by your quotes below. If you poorly outlined the discussion and the points being made in it then it's hardly my fault.



Correct and accurate statement based on available data.



Correct and accurate statement based on available data.



Correct and accurate statement based on available data.


That's why I asked the question. All the points above by both Poster 1 and Poster 2 were accurate statements to make. If you mistyped them originally and something else was actually said in the original discussion then fair enough, but it's hardly my fault for reading and interpreting your quotes as they were presented.

Ok, to sum it up, let's go back to my Keane v Quinn analogy.

Quinn has scored more goals for Ireland than anyone else.

True only if Keane never existed and didn't go on to score more than 3 X more.

We, this jurisdiction has held the position of having the most infections of covid 19 in the world this year.

The only country that had a higher rate during the entire length of the pandemic was Belgium in October 2020.


So claiming "yeah for a wee while" is irrelevant. There's no possible scenario where "both can be correct at the same time"

Deal with it.

Bubbaclaus

McMurphy wrote: »

Ok, to sum it up, let's go back to my Keane v Quinn analogy.

Quinn has scored more goals for Ireland than anyone else.

True only if Keane never existed and didn't go on to score more than 3 X more.

We, this jurisdiction has held the position of having the most infections of covid 19 in the world this year.

The only country that had a higher rate during the entire length of the pandemic was Belgium in October 2020.


So claiming "yeah for a wee while" is irrelevant. There's no possible scenario where "both can be correct at the same time"

Deal with it.

Let's agree to disagree then. Clear as day to me that all statements in your quotes can be and are accurate. Beats me how you see otherwise.

I've no interest in covid comparisons between the North and South, and stupid political point scoring that follows, but for what it's worth I would much prefer to have a higher rate for a few weeks over having a higher rate in the overall 11 months (so far) pandemic.

I agree with your Niall Quinn/Robbie Keane analogy, but think you have mixed up who is Quinn and who is Keane.

"Deal with it" (Is this how the kids sign off on emails these days?)

McMurphy

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

Let's agree to disagree then. Clear as day to me that all statements in your quotes can be and are accurate. Beats me how you see otherwise.

I've no interest in covid comparisons between the North and South, and stupid political point scoring that follows, but for what it's worth I would much prefer to have a higher rate for a few weeks over having a higher rate in the overall 11 months (so far) pandemic.

I agree with your Niall Quinn/Robbie Keane analogy, but think you have mixed up who is Quinn and who is Keane.

"Deal with it" (Is this how the kids sign off on emails these days?)

I'm not surprised.

I was saying Quinn was the record holder as a clear example of bolloxology. I thought I clarified that by immediately posting about Keane not existing afterwards.

But I agree - let's move on, life is too short.

Jinglejangle69

McMurphy wrote: »

I'm not surprised.

I was saying Quinn was the record holder as a clear example of bolloxology. I thought I clarified that by immediately posting about Keane not existing afterwards.

But I agree - let's move on, life is too short.

smurgen

Indo Leo V spin piece again yesterday on his recent walk show with RTE all of your life. He's talking about coming out yet not one acknowledgement of his lengthy and impassioned dail speech to limited adoption rights for same-sex couples. I found the below paragraph a disgusting mindset that shows his out and out emotional immaturity as a person. A person with a mindset like that isn't fit to govern in my opinion. Vindictive and jealous.


"The Tánaiste admitted to being judgemental of other people before coming out, saying he probably held “conservative social views, almost as a reaction to the fact that, if I have to suppress who I am, then why shouldn’t other people - you know?"

https://twitter.com/Independent_ie/status/1355395331186429954?s=19

smurgen

smurgen wrote: »

Indo Leo V spin piece again yesterday on his recent walk show with RTE all of your life. He's talking about coming out yet not one acknowledgement of his lengthy and impassioned dail speech to limited adoption rights for same-sex couples. I found the below paragraph a disgusting mindset that shows his out and out emotional immaturity as a person. A person with a mindset like that isn't fit to govern in my opinion. Vindictive and jealous.


"The Tánaiste admitted to being judgemental of other people before coming out, saying he probably held “conservative social views, almost as a reaction to the fact that, if I have to suppress who I am, then why shouldn’t other people - you know?"

https://twitter.com/Independent_ie/status/1355395331186429954?s=19

Young people tend to be very opinionated and rigid in their views. Then they grow up and learn to see things from both sides. Or maybe he was speaking as one who grew up “different” and I don’t mean his sexuality. Children can be cruel towards another child that is in any way different to them.

McMurphy

Deleted User wrote: »

Young people tend to be very opinionated and rigid in their views. Then they grow up and learn to see things from both sides. Or maybe he was speaking as one who grew up “different” and I don’t mean his sexuality. Children can be cruel towards another child that is in any way different to them.

That might explain how the future Taoiseach of the country, publicly opposed gay marriage, even though he himself was a gay man when he opposed it so?

smurgen

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Young people tend to be very opinionated and rigid in their views. Then they grow up and learn to see things from both sides. Or maybe he was speaking as one who grew up “different” and I don’t mean his sexuality. Children can be cruel towards another child that is in any way different to them.

It's not just children though. Varadkar was 31 when he made that speech. Having an 'i'm not happy so others can't be' approach to public service is extremely dangerous behavior from a person who is also a law maker.This lack of emotional intelligence is alarming.

McMurphy

smurgen wrote: »

It's not just children though. Varadkar was 31 when he made that speech. Having a I'm not happy so others can't be is extremely dangerous behavior from a person who is a law maker.This lack of emotional intelligence is alarming.

That's why many members of the gay community are openly hostile to Leo, he is not a champion for gay rights, he openly opposed them, and then rode in on the coattails of the real campaigners for gay rights successes.

When it was clear which way the wind was blowing obviously.

smurgen

McMurphy wrote: »

That's why many members of the gay community are openly hostile to Leo, he is not a champion for gay rights, he openly opposed them, and then rode in on the coattails of the real campaigners for gay rights successes.

When it was clear which way the wind was blowing obviously.

Yep running with the hare and hunting with the hound when it was politically safe to do so. They deserve better. It's people's civil rights at stake and they need strong representatives.

CrazyFather1

McMurphy wrote: »

That's why many members of the gay community are openly hostile to Leo, he is not a champion for gay rights, he openly opposed them, and then rode in on the coattails of the real campaigners for gay rights successes.

When it was clear which way the wind was blowing obviously.

So you are part of the LGBTQ community?
Personally I am not part of the LGBTQ community so I would never speak for what they do/don't think. It would be very condescending of me to make comments of their behalf.

McMurphy

McMurphy wrote: »

That's why many members of the gay community are openly hostile to Leo, he is not a champion for gay rights, he openly opposed them, and then rode in on the coattails of the real campaigners for gay rights successes.

When it was clear which way the wind was blowing obviously.

Just like some people are hostile to others holding different opinions to them. You’ll find it in all walks of life.

James Brown

blanch152 wrote: »

Here are the facts.


https://www.rte.ie/news/2021/0129/1193927-covid-ireland-latest/

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0129/1193894-coronavirus-northern-ireland/

Death toll in Northern Ireland: 1,814
Death toll in Ireland: 3,214

Both are horrendous numbers.

Per capita (1,000) the figures are

Deaths in Northern Ireland: 0.962
Deaths in Ireland: 0.655

The death toll in Northern Ireland is running nearly 50% higher than in the South. This is despite two factors that should result in the North being lower. Firstly, the North does not count deaths as widely as the South and secondly, the Boris Johnson government's success in securing vaccines should have seen a much lower death rate this year.

Those are the horrendous facts about what is happening. Yes, for one week, we were at the highest rate in the world, but that was one week.

Real people have died as a result of this pandemic. Many of them have died unnecessarily in the North as they should have been able to achieve better results than us for the factors I have mentioned. It is a real scandal.

Yet as with murder victims and their families you are happy to use them to try score points in some game.

James Brown

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

Let's agree to disagree then. Clear as day to me that all statements in your quotes can be and are accurate. Beats me how you see otherwise.

I've no interest in covid comparisons between the North and South, and stupid political point scoring that follows, but for what it's worth I would much prefer to have a higher rate for a few weeks over having a higher rate in the overall 11 months (so far) pandemic.

I agree with your Niall Quinn/Robbie Keane analogy, but think you have mixed up who is Quinn and who is Keane.

"Deal with it" (Is this how the kids sign off on emails these days?)

The south had the highest in the world. That's a quite horrifying and sad fact. Hand waving that fact away to try get a dig at SF is pretty low IMO.

smurgen

Not one Fine Gael minister posting a remembrance for victims of Bloody Sunday. Speaks volumes. They weren't murdered by the right organisations for them so they don't matter. My condolences to Charlie Tanagan on what must be an uncomfortable day.

https://twitter.com/OxfordDiplomat/status/1355518044932616196?s=19

James Brown

Deleted User wrote: »

Young people tend to be very opinionated and rigid in their views. Then they grow up and learn to see things from both sides. Or maybe he was speaking as one who grew up “different” and I don’t mean his sexuality. Children can be cruel towards another child that is in any way different to them.

So maybe he should wait until he grows up before running for public office?

James Brown

CrazyFather1 wrote: »

So you are part of the LGBTQ community?
Personally I am not part of the LGBTQ community so I would never speak for what they do/don't think. It would be very condescending of me to make comments of their behalf.

How is listening to a group speaking for them?

lawrencesummers

Deleted User wrote: »

I make no apologies for thinking varadkar is smary,underhand and best described as the 4chan taoiseach

But this is completly unnecessary

https://mobile.twitter.com/chrisadonnelly/status/1355527832563314693

As dumb as the graffiti ‘artist’ is, they are smart enough to realize that Leo is still the boss, no matter how much MM attempts to make out that he is in charge.

darem93

CrazyFather1 wrote: »

So you are part of the LGBTQ community?
Personally I am not part of the LGBTQ community so I would never speak for what they do/don't think. It would be very condescending of me to make comments of their behalf.

I am gay and I would definitely not consider Leo a champion of LGBT rights in the slightest.

As pointed out above, he claimed quite a lot of the glory with gay rights that genuine activists had spent years fighting tooth and nail for. It was the same with abortion rights back in 2018. Leo always does that, he flip flops and seems to only really support something when it looks like the majority of the public agree with him.

Natterjack from Kerry

McMurphy wrote: »

That's why many members of the gay community are openly hostile to Leo, he is not a champion for gay rights, he openly opposed them, and then rode in on the coattails of the real campaigners for gay rights successes.

When it was clear which way the wind was blowing obviously.

This hypocrisy and discrimination against Varadkar by the gay community is rich indeed. Equality only when it suits them.

McMurphy

CrazyFather1 wrote: »

So you are part of the LGBTQ community?
Personally I am not part of the LGBTQ community so I would never speak for what they do/don't think. It would be very condescending of me to make comments of their behalf.

No I'm not part of the LGBT community, and do not, nor do I pretend to speak for them.

I'm passing comment on what's been reported in the traditional media, and has been on social media since Leo made his infamous speech where he didn't think gay couples should enjoy the same rights as straight couples and be allowed to marry, then came out as a gay man, with very "coincidental timing".

By his own admission he always put his career first, and political progression was more important than being personally open. This might be your prerogative if you're a private citizen, but it's bothersome when you and others are later going to hold yourself out as a figurehead and the icon for a cause. Varadkar was happy to let others do the heavy lifting of bringing gay rights forward before he could sail in at the end, and accept the worldwide plaudits for becoming the first gay Taoiseach

In other news, I don't have a womb nor a vagina, it's as well I wasn't on here posting about repeal the eighth.

Do you think your posts through before submitting them?

McMurphy

Natterjack from Kerry wrote: »

This hypocrisy and discrimination against Varadkar by the gay community is rich indeed. Equality only when it suits them.

WTF are you about


Leo Varadkar was/is literally part of that same "gay community" when he was advocating denying the very community he is a member of "equality" with his SSM objection ffs:


This post is so goddam ridiculous it's hard to know where to start and finish with it tbh.

smurgen

darem93 wrote: »

I am gay and I would definitely not consider Leo a champion of LGBT rights in the slightest.

As pointed out above, he claimed quite a lot of the glory with gay rights that genuine activists had spent years fighting tooth and nail for. It was the same with abortion rights back in 2018. Leo always does that, he flip flops and seems to only really support something when it looks like the majority of the public agree with him.

Funny there was an article in the examiner about this flip flopping by him just today.

https://twitter.com/McConnellDaniel/status/1355480774531801089?s=19

Bubbaclaus

James Brown wrote: »

The south had the highest in the world. That's a quite horrifying and sad fact. Hand waving that fact away to try get a dig at SF is pretty low IMO.

Sorry, is this directed at me?

CrazyFather1

McMurphy wrote: »

No I'm not part of the LGBT community, and do not, nor do I pretend to speak for them.

I'm passing comment on what's been reported in the traditional media, and has been on social media since Leo made his infamous speech where he didn't think gay couples should enjoy the same rights as straight couples and be allowed to marry, then came out as a gay man, with very "coincidental timing".



In other news, I don't have a womb nor a vagina, it's as well I wasn't on here posting about repeal the eighth.

Do you think your posts through before submitting them?

Personally I would never make comments for any of the communities in Ireland I am not a part of, if it is LGBTQ, Polish, English, etc etc. They have their own voices and should never be told what they think. Just my own opinion.

Could you explain what you mean by saying Leo been gay was "coincidental timing"?