Seattle defund police

Foxtrol

Manic Moran wrote: »

Did you read the text of the order, or just the catchy title put onto it by the twitterer?

Yes, did you?

Manic Moran

Yes. I note that chokeholds are not the only thing forbidden. If that were the only restriction, I might perhaps see the point, but it seems to restrict a number of positions not uncommonly used, including by the Gardai after a brief google search. It is not up to Westchester or Yonkers police to put themselves at a disadvantage when they can avoid it.

Foxtrol

Manic Moran wrote: »

Yes. I note that chokeholds are not the only thing forbidden. If that were the only restriction, I might perhaps see the point, but it seems to restrict a number of positions not uncommonly used, including by the Gardai after a brief google search. It is not up to Westchester or Yonkers police to put themselves at a disadvantage when they can avoid it.

A number of other positions that can choke those in custody to death. The reason why the list is expanded is because police have used the excuse of them being allowed to get out of obvious situations where they were improperly used. When a Garda kneels on the back of a suspect for 8+ minutes until they die then we can discuss that comparison.

'Avoid it' is refusing to do their job. It is like a bus driver refusing to drive down a road on their route because they changed the speed limit. It is pathetic and builds no goodwill from the public.

2u2me

The only other alternative to chokeholds is beating a person on the head until they are unconscious.

Any practitioner of Brazilian Jiu Jitsu would tell you a chokehold is a very humane practice when used correctly.

Banning them creates other problems that aren't being addressed.

Just because some things are improperly used doesn't mean we ban them all.
People use glue to get high but we still need it for our envelopes.

Mr. Karate

mynamejeff wrote: »

who will then be murdered by the person with the mental health issue


good plan

Who will believe there's more than 2 genders and vote Democrat then?

Foxtrol

2u2me wrote: »

The only other alternative to chokeholds is beating a person on the head until they are unconscious.

Any practitioner of Brazilian Jiu Jitsu would tell you a chokehold is a very humane practice when used correctly.

Banning them creates other problems that aren't being addressed.

Just because some things are improperly used doesn't mean we ban them all.
People use glue to get high but we still need it for our envelopes.

I agree a lot of this. It is a very blunt/lazy/easy way to deal with the problem, I'd much prefer a complete revamp of how police are dealt with within the law (both criminal and civil). Cops and their Unions would kick up even more of a fuss about that so there is no easy way to resolve it.

Right now it is however far too easy for them to get off from obvious wrongdoing by saying it is allowed or part of their training.

RWCNT

mynamejeff wrote: »

who will then be murdered by the person with the mental health issue


good plan

Why do you and the 9 people that liked this naturally assume that this is the natural conclusion to that situation? Mentally ill people are FAR more likely to be the victims of violence than the perpetrators of it.

suicide_circus

2u2me wrote: »

The only other alternative to chokeholds is beating a person on the head until they are unconscious

From what i've seen of our own Gardai dealing with a non compliant person who has been arrested it seems to involve a pile-on of officers or a beating with a telescopic baton but its hard to know exactly since they dont have vest cams. But at the same time, if the Gardai arrest someone with 50 previous conviction, the person can expect (another) suspended sentence...in the states people are still going down for years for 3 strikes.

suicide_circus

Actually there are a few videos on youtube of gardai issuing 6 of the best to some bold people

Edgware

Carfacemandog wrote: »

It will be interesting to see if Seattle's crime rates plunge as much as Newark and Camden did, experiencing a 41% and 51% drop in crime, respectively.

It will also be interesting to see what develops from this as many appear to think that the real issue is the police union chief, who is apparently very fond of glorifying police violence and militarization which has plagued Seattle from the outset of these protests and played a notable role in their popularity in the US.

Here's his campaign ad (police vote fro their union chiefs), it gets pretty interesting at the 1 minute mark (bizarrely using footage from Kremlin propaganda outlet Ruptly of all places).

Its easy have a drop in crime when there is no one to report it to.

Edgware

stinkypinky wrote: »

The mayor of Seattle has already publicly proposed a plan defunding the department by 76 million by 2021, this is just the first step. Even with the so called "1%" - 100 police officers have lost their jobs out of a total of 1400, not insignificant at all.

https://www.kiro7.com/news/local/mayor-durkan-announces-initial-76-million-reductions-2021-seattle-police-department-budget/3UJ2QEP5JNFTPA3XZRB6ZVSDDE/

SEATTLE — Seattle Mayor Jenny Durkan on Monday announced an initial $76 million in reductions to the 2021 Seattle Police Department budget.

Durkan said the reductions are part of a series of early actions designed to transform the department.

Durkan said $56 million will be transferred out of the department’s 2021 budget by moving the following functions to civilian oversight:

The 911 call center to be removed from the Seattle Police Department.
The parking enforcement division to be removed from the Seattle Police Department and into the Seattle Department of Transportation.
The Office of Emergency Management and office of police accountability to be removed from the Seattle Police Department.
Durkan said an additional $20 million in cuts to the SPD budget have been identified by not expanding the force in 2021 and by making reductions to overtime

Good news. Those guys in the 911 centre and parking enforcement were really causing problems. Lets bring the civilians in ( and we can pay them40% less)
Hell why not bring back Marty Crane and Duke while we are at it.

Carfacemandog

Edgware wrote: »

Its easy have a drop in crime when there is no one to report it to.

Which might make sense if either of these cities had "no one to report it to" like in some of the meth infested areas of the country where you can go weeks without seeing a single cop due to so few covering such vast areas. In Camden, Newark, or just about any other city of notable size in the US, that is far from the case.

Slowyourrole

suicide_circus wrote: »

When police are called and end up dealing with someone who is mentally unstable it is because the person is a serious danger to others or themselves. People don't call the cops when Auntie Nelly is having one of her breakdowns.

Yes they do.