Ireland vs Taiwan

timeToLive

httpete wrote: »

We were 1-2 weeks away from eradication at the end of the lockdown in Ireland, with sustained single figure new cases.

If we had held out for another two weeks and then implemented a two week mandatory quarantine for people entering the country, most likely everything would be open now, and apart from tourism, life would be continuing as normal.

We would be in the same boat as countries/islands who took these measures such as Taiwan and New Zealand. Unfortunately, we didn't have the leadership of those countries.

It's 100% a leadership problem. Pick a plan and stick to it would be a good start :P

TheRef

There is a very interesting article I remember reading (just search for: Irish living in the world's best city: 'I miss the Irish weather') on the Irish Times a couple of years ago.

The main takeaway I took was that it seemed people in Taiwan took a much higher level of personal responsibility than in Western cultures and they seem to have a more collective spirit.

While this site is a caricature of Ireland, a simple scan of the threads shows that there are just too many people in Ireland who look always find a reason as to why rules don't apply to them.

Some people advocate for fines for those flouting the rules and others say no way. Likewise, some people would be outraged if they heard of a large social gathering of politicians, but the same people would be equally outraged if anyone dare to report a neighbor hosting a similar social large gathering.

I'm not trying to suggest right or wrong in any of the above, but just maybe highlighting that unless everyone takes more personal responsibility and expect everyone to follow the rules, then we have to accept this is who we are as a people.
The few always ruin it for the many, and maybe here in Ireland we have a higher proportion of the few than other cultures.

Morathi

httpete wrote: »

If you want to compare in terms of society, then what about New Zealand and Australia? We are certainly not so far removed from the Australians. They got the job done.

Wouldn't want to comment tbh, I've never lived over there i dunno what the country and culture is like.

Also what happened to this? :pac:

httpete wrote: »

I think now is an appropriate time to update this thread since I'm sick to death of hearing how Ireland and New Zealand can't be compared New Zealand when it comes to the implementation of zero covid because New Zealand is so remote.

Why don't we compare Ireland to Taiwan instead? Taiwain handled Covid better than anywhere else, including New Zealand. And this 'remote' argument doesn't wash with Taiwan. Other countries we could also look at include Singapore, Vietnam, and South Korea. But let's stick with Taiwan.

plodder

httpete wrote: »

Truck drivers. Big deal. Taiwan have massive imports and exports, far larger than Ireland. See my post above and the figures here:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_Taiwan
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_the_Republic_of_Ireland

How much of that is from roll-on roll-off car ferries? I'd say it's close to zero.

They got the job done regardless. They didn't just say ah sure we might as well give up because we have so many truck drivers importing/exporting goods like us. Typical of the attitude which has seen us lose an entire year to the virus, and now it looks like we expect to lose 2022 to it too.

That's easy for you to say, but the government has to figure out an actual solution before considering zero covid.

I think a fairer comparison for Europe would be China itself and how they managed to isolate Wuhan from the rest of the country for two months. Maybe someone should look into it, identify all the measures they took and then we could see would that be possible in Europe?

httpete

plodder wrote: »

How much of that is from roll-on roll-off car ferries? I'd say it's close to zero.

I assume your point is that use magic or teleportation to handle their massive amounts of imports/exports? Or how do you think this island nation handles their imports/exports?

httpete

The Port of Kaohsiung is the 12th busiest port in the world, and has many notable features, including:

its status as a hub for other popular ports in Asia
Its rank as the 6th biggest container ports in the world, and the biggest in Taiwan
roll-on/roll-off and container shipping services to southern Taiwan
5 container terminals, enabling Port Kaohsiung to except close to 10 million containers every year

https://www.kinternational.com/international-automobile-shipping-to-port-kaohsiung-taiwan-with-roll-onrroll-off-or-container-shipping/

Thelonious Monk

Thelonious Monk wrote: »

Not only are NZ and Australia isolated compared to us, they already had pretty strict rules when entering the country on bringing foreign objects etc. I got to NZ and had 2 dogs sniff around me and my bags searched etc.
Human traffic flows a lot freer in Europe and shutting it down would be a far greater deal.
Anyway we are where we are, there's not really much point in wishing we did things like NZ, if it was even possible to do in the first place.

Oz was months after nz in vigoursly persueing its zero covid lockdown....melbourne was on track to have one of worst outbreaks in world at one stage


Today it had 5 cases for the entire continent......keeping the entire.country here locked down and under restrictions to keep free movement with europe,(we can travel to anywhere in europe,but not 4 or 5 miles down the road) is non-sensical in the extreme

IRISHSPORTSGUY

This thread strikes me as desperately trying to find an angle to have a go at the government. European comparisons are more apt.

plodder

httpete wrote: »

I assume your point is that use magic or teleportation to handle their massive amounts of imports/exports? Or how do you think this island nation handles their imports/exports?

Containers, bulk carriers etc that don't transport humans along with the goods

Same applies to other islands like Aus and NZ, less so to us or the UK.

And from your own link about Kaohsiung

Ro/Ro shipping of wheeled cargo to Port Kaohsiung, including automobiles and certain types of construction equipment.

Automobiles and construction equipment is not lorries with drivers carrying other goods.

GavMan

The level of gubernatorial reach in Taiwan ensures mass compliance

IAMAMORON

I can't believe or trust any of the figures that come out of Asia.

Japan have definitely been covering up trying to enable the Olympics , I would say Korea are the same.

Taiwan has massive connection to China, they are most likely doing whay they are told.

We have no concept of Asian culture and how they get about doing things. I massively don't believe their figures.

ginoginelli

IAMAMORON wrote: »

I can't believe or trust any of the figures that come out of Asia.

Japan have definitely been covering up trying to enable the Olympics , I would say Korea are the same.

Taiwan has massive connection to China, they are most likely doing whay they are told.

We have no concept of Asian culture and how they get about doing things. I massively don't believe their figures.

Youre Clueless.

The Chinese goverment is anathema to the Taiwanese. They are completely independent.

ginoginelli

I have lived in Taiwan. It is a fantastic country. Tech savvy and an extremely high standard of education, very low crime, and super clean, well run cities.

The people are gorgeous, very welcoming and friendly, and go out of their way to help foreigners.

It is by far the most advanced nation I have visited.

If anybody was going to get this virus under control it was them.

timeToLive

ginoginelli wrote: »

I have lived in Taiwan. It is a fantastic country. Tech savvy and an extremely high standard of education, very low crime, and super clean, well run cities.

The people are gorgeous, very welcoming and friendly, and go out of their way to help foreigners.

It is by far the most advanced nation I have visited.

If anybody was going to get this virus under control it was them.

Now I want to move there.

plodder

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/jan/27/china-starts-using-anal-swabs-test-covid-high-infection-areas

Then you get China doing this. How much choice will people have about it? Would Europeans agree to that?

If I'm not mistaken, part of Taiwan and South Korea's success was confining people who are infected, in enforced quarantine, not just travelers arriving on their shores. Getting to where they are requires very severe curtailment of individual liberties that the population actually signs up for.

IAMAMORON

ginoginelli wrote: »

I have lived in Taiwan. It is a fantastic country. Tech savvy and an extremely high standard of education, very low crime, and super clean, well run cities.

The people are gorgeous, very welcoming and friendly, and go out of their way to help foreigners.

It is by far the most advanced nation I have visited.

If anybody was going to get this virus under control it was them.

What is the food like?

ginoginelli

IAMAMORON wrote: »

What is the food like?

Maaan. Dont get me started. Its AMAZING.

The night market culture is the big thing there. Its where they generally go in evenings and weekends. There are huge sprawling night markets everywhere with all sorts of deliciousness. Taiwanese fried chicken was one of my favourite things to get.

If you have ever been to Thailand, its similar to some of the Bangkok markets, but on a whole other scale.

And unlike a lot of other asian countries with a street food culture, they are super clean and well regulated. The Taiwanese really pride themselves on their hygiene and it shows, everything is spotless and well looked after.

Restaurants are decent too. Dumplings and beef noodle soup are very popular, and alot of places will just specify in one thing and be known for that.

Everything is very reasonably priced too.

biko

Taiwan at only 9 dead.
This is what others could have accomplished with enough foresight and fast responses.

There was a recent outbreak so anything could happen. Cannot relax yet.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n9LLDRVzYOo