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Northern Ireland- a failure 99 years on?

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    #1982
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 69,184 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    jh79 wrote: »
    We could do much the same as we did for the counties that went to level 4 early. Garda patrols and fines for those caught moving between the countries for non-essential reasons.

    Monaghan's numbers went through the roof at that time, we were number 2 on the list.

    Our numbers didn't come down until restrictions were similar on both sides.


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    #1983
    Hqrry113
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 273 ✭✭Hqrry113


    Hqrry113 wrote: »
    I answered this already, the slogan "Brits out" has never referred to protestants it is referring to British rule in Ireland, you are spouting absolute nonsense.

    Speaking about you being in denial about the Irish flag being illegal in northern Ireland here it is from the mouths of your Brit masters themselves https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=pxZ2yu1BFzM

    Has downcow really not realised after all these years that when people say "Brits out" they are not referring to protestants in Ireland.


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    #1984
    jh79
    Registered Users Posts: 8,273 ✭✭✭jh79


    ittakestwo wrote: »

    Using C-19 as an excuse for a border

    My reason for suggesting it was to see the reaction of those using C-19 to further calls for a border poll. If the health of the nation is the primary concern they shouldn't have a problem with a temp border of some description.


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    #1985
    blanch152
    Registered Users Posts: 27,971 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    So the government fight tooth and nail for several years to block the imposition of a hard border for many reasons, not least the physical impossibility of stopping movement of goods and people and you now think it is feasible or practical in stopping an invisible virus?

    As I said, happened before, worked, apart from a few smugglers, it could work again.

    Heard a doctor from Donegal on the radio this morning pleading for people not to travel to Northern Ireland as they were bringing the virus back.

    The virus won't fly twenty miles across the border in the air. It needs people travelling across the border as vectors to bring it across.

    Closing the border will save lives.


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    #1986
    ittakestwo
    Registered Users Posts: 1,668 ✭✭✭ittakestwo


    jh79 wrote: »
    My reason for suggesting it was to see the reaction of those using C-19 to further calls for a border poll. If the health of the nation is the primary concern they shouldn't have a problem with a temp border of some description.

    NI and the ROI are not acting as one homogenous region regarding C-19 rates. There is big variances, even when you compare county to county. To say we need border exactly where the invisible border actualy lies is using c-19 to put a hard border at tge border. if lets say one county in NI has the same rate as the 26 in the south why should people be stoped going to or from it.


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    #1987
    blanch152
    Registered Users Posts: 27,971 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Hqrry113 wrote: »
    Has downcow really not realised after all these years that when people say "Brits out" they are not referring to protestants in Ireland.

    It is a racist term and shouldn't be used at all.

    A bit like saying that signs of "Irish not welcome" were referring to the Irish government.


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    #1988
    dvdman1
    Registered Users Posts: 512 ✭✭✭dvdman1


    I love Northern Ireland, aside from having spectacularly beautiful landscape the people were lovely, the weird thing about it..i found unionist areas to be the most friendly.
    The dup are not representative of unionists, there a small minority theresa may needed to keep her boat afloat politically.


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    #1989
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 69,184 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    blanch152 wrote: »
    As I said, happened before, worked, apart from a few smugglers, it could work again.

    Heard a doctor from Donegal on the radio this morning pleading for people not to travel to Northern Ireland as they were bringing the virus back.

    The virus won't fly twenty miles across the border in the air. It needs people travelling across the border as vectors to bring it across.

    Closing the border will save lives.

    No restrictions in the north means people are free to travel and to go to work. What do you propose to do about those working in the south?


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    #1990
    Hqrry113
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 273 ✭✭Hqrry113


    blanch152 wrote: »
    It is a racist term and shouldn't be used at all.

    A bit like saying that signs of "Irish not welcome" were referring to the Irish government.

    Is anyone else hearing the nonsense being spouted by these two posters?

    Is anyone actually taking these two seriously?


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    #1991
    jh79
    Registered Users Posts: 8,273 ✭✭✭jh79


    Looks like Stormont have another day to decide, they got their dates wrong!


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    #1992
    BonnieSituation
    Registered Users Posts: 19,085 ✭✭✭✭BonnieSituation


    blanch152 wrote: »
    Closing the border deals with the threat.

    A ban on people travelling to Northern Ireland is much less divisive than a border poll.

    That "less" is doing a lot of heavy lifting there.


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    #1993
    blanch152
    Registered Users Posts: 27,971 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    No restrictions in the north means people are free to travel and to go to work. What do you propose to do about those working in the south?

    They can hardly wait for a border poll, can they?

    This is a public health issue, we have closed the border before for animal health issues, why can't we do it for public health?

    Sinn Fein collapsed Stormont when the DUP used its veto over an Irish language act. Are they prepared to do it over people's lives or is it just meaningless gestures that they act upon?


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    #1994
    BonnieSituation
    Registered Users Posts: 19,085 ✭✭✭✭BonnieSituation


    Hqrry113 wrote: »
    Is anyone else hearing the nonsense being spouted by these two posters?

    Is anyone actually taking these two seriously?

    Most of the regulars here don't.

    The partitionist mantra is bizarre.

    On one hand you have southern partitionists demanding we close the border and on the other hand you have our resident partitionist from An Dún demanding a complete Britain and Ireland approach.

    If only there was some sort of halfway house that many were asking for earlier in the year that utilises the islands natural topography to help stop the spread of the virus?

    Hmmmm any ideas?


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    #1995
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 69,184 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    blanch152 wrote: »
    They can hardly wait for a border poll, can they?

    This is a public health issue, we have closed the border before for animal health issues, why can't we do it for public health?

    Sinn Fein collapsed Stormont when the DUP used its veto over an Irish language act. Are they prepared to do it over people's lives or is it just meaningless gestures that they act upon?

    There is a single party standing against this. It is just about SF.

    The purpose of a border poll call by the Irish government is to show this party that the government here will not allow the island's health to be threatened by ideological belligerence.

    I.E. It will for once put it's people first, not political concerns and fear of offence or of being seen to support a political party.

    Are they going to let the concerns of the SDLP, The UUP, Alliance and SF wither on the vine by standing idly by, in other words.

    Are partitionists going to insist that all the good work on Brexit be negated by claiming now that the re-imposition of a hard border can fix this.


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    #1996
    blanch152
    Registered Users Posts: 27,971 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    There is a single party standing against this. It is just about SF.

    The purpose of a border poll call by the Irish government is to show this party that the government here will not allow the island's health to be threatened by ideological belligerence.

    I.E. It will for once put it's people first, not political concerns and fear of offence or of being seen to support a political party.

    Are they going to let the concerns of the SDLP, The UUP, Alliance and SF wither on the vine by standing idly by, in other words.

    Are partitionists going to insist that all the good work on Brexit be negated by claiming now that the re-imposition of a hard border can fix this.

    An Irish government calling for a border poll is sanctimonious posturing without anything to back it up. Firstly, they would be immediately rebuked by the Northern Ireland Secretary of State who would tell them it is not up to them, and that he decides. Secondly, they would rightly be told that all of the electoral numbers show that support for the parties in favour of a border poll is falling and has been doing so for most of the last decade. Thirdly, it doesn't offer any practical route forward. Fourthly, shouting at people you need to engage with from a long distance away doesn't ever work.

    Sure, nationalism has been emboldened in the South by some feverish reactions to the increase in the Sinn Fein vote and fears about Brexit, but it hasn't been mirrored in the North. At the moment, discussion in the North is more concerened and worried about potential loss of market access to the rest of the UK than about a border poll.

    All in all, requesting that the government demand a border poll in response to the Covid-19 crisis is up there among the stupidest ideas put forward this year on these boards.


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    #1997
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 69,184 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    blanch152 wrote: »
    An Irish government calling for a border poll is sanctimonious posturing without anything to back it up. Firstly, they would be immediately rebuked by the Northern Ireland Secretary of State who would tell them it is not up to them, and that he decides. Secondly, they would rightly be told that all of the electoral numbers show that support for the parties in favour of a border poll is falling and has been doing so for most of the last decade. Thirdly, it doesn't offer any practical route forward. Fourthly, shouting at people you need to engage with from a long distance away doesn't ever work.

    Sure, nationalism has been emboldened in the South by some feverish reactions to the increase in the Sinn Fein vote and fears about Brexit, but it hasn't been mirrored in the North. At the moment, discussion in the North is more concerened and worried about potential loss of market access to the rest of the UK than about a border poll.

    All in all, requesting that the government demand a border poll in response to the Covid-19 crisis is up there among the stupidest ideas put forward this year on these boards.

    From where I am sitting, doing nothing is not only the stupidest idea ever suggested but tantamount to criminal disregard for people's health and welfare, again.

    .


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    #1998
    Hqrry113
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 273 ✭✭Hqrry113


    Is there a single thread on this site that doesn't end up simply becoming another discussion on Covid-19.


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    #1999
    TheCitizen
    Registered Users Posts: 9,538 ✭✭✭TheCitizen


    blanch152 wrote: »
    An unnecessary border poll in the middle of a pandemic?

    I have said before that republicans see their cause of being more important than people's lives. Suggestions like that only prove it to be so.

    Hate it when blue shirt supporters do this. We are all Republicans, this is the Republic of Ireland. SF looking for a border poll right now does not mean all Republicans are looking for it right now.


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    #2000
    TheCitizen
    Registered Users Posts: 9,538 ✭✭✭TheCitizen


    Hqrry113 wrote: »
    Has downcow really not realised after all these years that when people say "Brits out" they are not referring to protestants in Ireland.

    He seems to be be deliberately misinterpreting it that way. More strawmanning delaying tactics.


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    #2001
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 69,184 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    NI figures on the rise again. If the DUP get their way, it opens back up tomorrow

    https://mobile.twitter.com/SJAMcBride/status/1326890067793743873


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    #2002
    TheCitizen
    Registered Users Posts: 9,538 ✭✭✭TheCitizen


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    NI figures on the rise again. If the DUP get their way, it opens back up tomorrow

    https://mobile.twitter.com/SJAMcBride/status/1326890067793743873

    DUP were Trump like oddballs long time before that arsehole Trump decided to enter politics. DUP are going to be a pain in the hole, it’s all they have left.


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    #2003
    BonnieSituation
    Registered Users Posts: 19,085 ✭✭✭✭BonnieSituation


    Hqrry113 wrote: »
    Is there a single thread on this site that doesn't end up simply becoming another discussion on Covid-19.

    May as well seeing as the question posited by the thread title keeps being ignored by all partitionists.


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    #2004
    BonnieSituation
    Registered Users Posts: 19,085 ✭✭✭✭BonnieSituation


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    NI figures on the rise again. If the DUP get their way, it opens back up tomorrow

    https://mobile.twitter.com/SJAMcBride/status/1326890067793743873

    Can anyone tell me the logic behind the DUP's stance without referring to SF?


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    #2005
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 69,184 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    BonnieSituation wrote: »
    Can anyone tell me the logic behind the DUP's stance without referring to SF?

    Not possible.


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    #2006
    downcow
    Registered Users Posts: 11,626 ✭✭✭✭downcow


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    A demand for a border poll is slightly different to actually having one.

    I clearly said what the purpose of it would be. A very clear statement from the Irish government that they will not tolerate threats to the health of it's people. That they will support those that want an all island approach to health.

    As I said, the threat is imminent, pussyfooting around not offending a branch of belligerent Unionism prepared to abuse Petitions Of Concern is not acceptable.

    Haha. Francie thanks the the gfa the Roi have no part in calling border poll


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    #2007
    downcow
    Registered Users Posts: 11,626 ✭✭✭✭downcow


    Hqrry113 wrote: »
    Has downcow really not realised after all these years that when people say "Brits out" they are not referring to protestants in Ireland.

    So if I said Irish out of Northern Ireland you’d be ok with that because I would not be specifically meaning Catholics.
    What planet are you living on. I am a Brit, so how could brits our not include me?


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    #2008
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users Posts: 69,184 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    downcow wrote: »
    Haha. Francie thanks the the gfa the Roi have no part in calling border poll

    My cat can call for a border poll if it wishes downcow.

    Dublin cannot call a border poll. They can call for one as much and as loudly as they want to.


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    #2009
    downcow
    Registered Users Posts: 11,626 ✭✭✭✭downcow


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    There is a single party standing against this. It is just about SF.

    The purpose of a border poll call by the Irish government is to show this party that the government here will not allow the island's health to be threatened by ideological belligerence.

    I.E. It will for once put it's people first, not political concerns and fear of offence or of being seen to support a political party.

    Are they going to let the concerns of the SDLP, The UUP, Alliance and SF wither on the vine by standing idly by, in other words.

    Are partitionists going to insist that all the good work on Brexit be negated by claiming now that the re-imposition of a hard border can fix this.

    Very strange then that rumour is that all parties have accepted almost exactly the proposal made by Diane Dodds some days ago


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    #2010
    downcow
    Registered Users Posts: 11,626 ✭✭✭✭downcow


    TheCitizen wrote: »
    He seems to be be deliberately misinterpreting it that way. More strawmanning delaying tactics.

    So who do you think brits are?


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    #2011
    downcow
    Registered Users Posts: 11,626 ✭✭✭✭downcow


    BonnieSituation wrote: »
    Can anyone tell me the logic behind the DUP's stance without referring to SF?

    They are trying to balance the needs of the economy, cancer sufferers, heart issues, mental health, etc, With the difficulties of covid 19.
    Some think it is all about covid


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