Woman pushed into Royal Canal

BorneTobyWilde

I keep reading title of this thread as
'' woman pushed into royal anal'' thinking its something about Prince Andrew

Tea drinker

^Just another reason to abolish child payments by the state. If you like kids pay for em, no more "free kids" that have no value to parents bar their cheque.

kenmm

Tea drinker wrote: »

^Just another reason to abolish child payments by the state. If you like kids pay for em, no more "free kids" that have no value to parents bar their cheque.

Tax credits for married couples too.
And health rebates.

(Or insert thing I don't want my tax to go to)

Etc

joseywhales

All I ask, please don't complain about mass immigration and people being incentivised to have children simultaneously.

What we really want is professional irish people to have children.

kenmm

But only if they can sign some contracts to make sure they can afford them and guarantee that their circumstances never change

Thelonious Monk

Tea drinker wrote: »

^Just another reason to abolish child payments by the state. If you like kids pay for em, no more "free kids" that have no value to parents bar their cheque.

They'll still have them, only they'll be more impoverished, and it'll regress back to how it was pre Celtic Tiger.
Taking money off poor people is not going to make them get their act together.
It would require lots of social work, community centres, all that stuff. Really full on help to guide these kids and families. Just as the travelling community need. But I can't see it ever happening, we don't have the infrastructure or money for this, nor the history or culture of these kinds of services.

elperello

BorneTobyWilde wrote: »

I keep reading title of this thread as
'' woman pushed into royal anal'' thinking its something about Prince Andrew

Keep taking the tabloids

Tony EH

Strumms wrote: »

Parents need to parent. You can be loyal to your kids, up to a point. When they start assaulting people, throwing them in rivers... you’ve failed at parenting to a point... Garda station next stop,

People keep trying to push this, but the fact is we know absolutely NOTHING about the parents. All there is is biased assumptions thrown into the air.

The phrase "Street devil, house angel" was coined for a reason and in many cases the parents are completely unaware of the behaviour of their little tyke when he's not in their view.

Kids, all the time, are experts at pulling the wool over their parents eyes and when they get involved with the wrong type of ringleader, they can end up running amok like wild dogs.

Children learn very early to misdirect their parents and hide things away from them to avoid punishment.

Strumms

Tony EH wrote: »

People keep trying to push this, but the fact is we know absolutely NOTHING about the parents. All there is is biased assumptions thrown into the air.

The phrase "Street devil, house angel" was coined for a reason and in many cases the parents are completely unaware of the behaviour of their little tyke when he's not in their view.

Kids, all the time, are experts at pulling the wool over their parents eyes and when they get involved with the wrong type of ringleader, they can end up running amok like wild dogs.

Children learn very early to misdirect their parents and hide things away from them to avoid punishment.

How can they be pulling wool ? I said “if the parents see the video they should... “

If they see the video, there can’t be wool pulling.. the unedited and undeniable evidence is there.. parents need to fûcking parent then need to act...

You can pull excuses out of your jumper all day long.

joseywhales

joseywhales wrote: »

All I ask, please don't complain about mass immigration and people being incentivised to have children simultaneously.

Why? Ireland doesn't need a population intake from mass migration. Ireland has a naturally growing population all on it's own, in addition to "normal" EU migration.

What we really want is professional irish people to have children.

Agreed.

Tony EH

Strumms wrote: »

How can they be pulling wool ? I said “if the parents see the video they should... “

If they see the video, there can’t be wool pulling.. the unedited and undeniable evidence is there.. parents need to fûcking parent then need to act...

You can pull excuses out of your jumper all day long.

I'm speaking in general terms about anti social behaviour and all the big man talk about fining parents etc. for the actions of their children.

AllForIt

Tony EH wrote: »

People keep trying to push this, but the fact is we know absolutely NOTHING about the parents. All there is is biased assumptions thrown into the air.

The phrase "Street devil, house angel" was coined for a reason and in many cases the parents are completely unaware of the behaviour of their little tyke when he's not in their view.

Kids, all the time, are experts at pulling the wool over their parents eyes and when they get involved with the wrong type of ringleader, they can end up running amok like wild dogs.

Children learn very early to misdirect their parents and hide things away from them to avoid punishment.

Just because teenagers may be pulling wool that does not mean the family unit as a whole is good. Even these scum are hardly going to go home and tell their parents they pushed someone into the canal, even if the parents are scum as well.

When teenagers behave in this violent way there has to be something wrong in the family unit. Has to be.

Gradius

AllForIt wrote: »

Just because teenagers may be pulling wool that does not mean the family unit as a whole is good. Even these scum are hardly going to go home and tell their parents they pushed someone into the canal, even if the parents are scum as well.

When teenagers behave in this violent way there has to be something wrong in the family unit. Has to be.

While bad parenting is always bad parenting, I think a lot of people should start smelling the coffee about the impact of the internet.

It is a whole world, essentially secret to those below a certain age, where literally anything, and I stress "anything" can be foisted on children as a way of life.

It's not like a television that gets flicked off. It's always there, more than parents, 5am in the morning, during school, holidays, Christmas day...unrelenting exposure to the same space occupied by quite literally the lowest of the low, because everything is on there.

Zero regulation. Zero checks. Zero accountability. Zero responsibility.

When you see them stuck on the phone every second they get, what do you think they're so intently watching? Marty Morrissey?

Gradius

Gradius wrote: »

While bad parenting is always bad parenting, I think a lot of people should start smelling the coffee about the impact of the internet.

Whereas I think there should be more pressure on the government to provide educational services, which require all prospective and current parents to learn effective parenting. It always amazes me that we allow people to have children whenever they want, blame them for their shortcomings as parents, and not step up, to teach adults how to be better parents. Provide them with the tools needed.

I was a teacher in Asia for a few years (TEFL), and then, I went back to university, to get proper training in being a teacher. Light years difference both in my effectiveness as a teacher, but also my ability to manage a classroom.

Rather than complaining about parents, we should be encouraging society to act responsibly about parenting and having children.

It is a whole world, essentially secret to those below a certain age, where literally anything, and I stress "anything" can be foisted on children as a way of life.

<snip>

When you see them stuck on the phone every second they get, what do you think they're so intently watching? Marty Morrissey?

Ahh well, I do think we need to start working in society to make children, actually children again. The age at which children develop into teens seems to decrease each year. My 11 year old niece is essentially a teenager now, with all the associated problems/angst.

We really should be limiting the access that minors have to the internet/social media. I understand the desire to give everyone freedom, but there are real consequences to that freedom, and I'm wondering whether the cost is worth it, especially as society further develops.

Geuze

joseywhales wrote: »

All I ask, please don't complain about mass immigration and people being incentivised to have children simultaneously.

What we really want is professional irish people to have children.

Simple solution:

reduce the cash Child Benefit
reduce the cash Increase for a Qualified Child paid to welfare recipients

Replace with:

tax credit per child



Or else, scale back cash CB, replace with in-kind benefits, like free/cheaper school books/uniforms/meals, etc.

SlowMotion321

Geuze wrote: »

Simple solution:

reduce the cash Child Benefit
reduce the cash Increase for a Qualified Child paid to welfare recipients

Replace with:

tax credit per child



Or else, scale back cash CB, replace with in-kind benefits, like free/cheaper school books/uniforms/meals, etc.

Let me guess, you don't avail of any of the above services!:rolleyes:

If that's the answer to dealing with the problem of problem children we're all fcuked!

Tea drinker

kenmm wrote: »

Tax credits for married couples too.
And health rebates.

(Or insert thing I don't want my tax to go to)

Etc

You should start a thread to abolish those things if you feel strongly about it.
In this thread about problem children the above is hardly helpful.

SlowMotion321

Kids, particularly teenagers these days live in four different worlds, home, school, outside with their peers and virtual with God knows who! If you really want to address the problem you need to look at all the environments to figure out what's going on with them and come up with a rounded approach, yes there are individuals like the ones in the op who you might say give them a short sharp shock and it might work, but as a society we really need to address all of the factors I mentioned! Otherwise you're all just tut tutting on the internet and turning your eyes away when you see it happening in the real world!

Now my arse is sore from sitting on this high horse anyone else want to ride it?

kenmm

Tea drinker wrote: »

You should start a thread to abolish those things if you feel strongly about it.
In this thread about problem children the above is hardly helpful.

Come on, this is not a thread about 'problem children' - it started out about a specific incident and has meandered all over the place.

It should really be taken out the back and shot, it's on its last legs.

Regardless, cutting benefits for those in need is not a solution to anything really, that was my point.

I also believe there is a report post button, but then that's me back seat modding your back seat modding..

Geuze

SlowMotion321 wrote: »

Let me guess, you don't avail of any of the above services!:rolleyes:

If that's the answer to dealing with the problem of problem children we're all fcuked!

I do.

I think the State should support families.

How the State supports families is up for debate.

Cash vs tax reliefs vs in-kind benefits (e.g. childcare)

Ireland has traditionally been big into cash.

I welcome any debate on the level of and form of support.

It seems the trend is away from cash and towards services, e.g the cash Early Childcare Supp was scrapped and replaced with the ECCE service.

Geuze

Geuze wrote: »

I do.

I think the State should support families.

How the State supports families is up for debate.

Cash vs tax reliefs vs in-kind benefits (e.g. childcare)

Ireland has traditionally been big into cash.

I welcome any debate on the level of and form of support.

It seems the trend is away from cash and towards services, e.g the cash Early Childcare Supp was scrapped and replaced with the ECCE service.

How did this discussion go from scumbaggery(may not be a word) to cash and benefits?

Gardai on the beat and a judiciary that supports them will help. It won't solve the matter but would help.

The current situation is:

Individual does something illegal, guard arrests him or her, guard spends 3 hours doing paperwork, then guard spends a day in court, individual gets yet another suspended sentence, guard thinks: why do i bother.

SlowMotion321

Geuze wrote: »

I do.

I think the State should support families.

How the State supports families is up for debate.

Cash vs tax reliefs vs in-kind benefits (e.g. childcare)

Ireland has traditionally been big into cash.

I welcome any debate on the level of and form of support.

It seems the trend is away from cash and towards services, e.g the cash Early Childcare Supp was scrapped and replaced with the ECCE service.

I'll happily and respectfully have that debate with you! But in deference to the op and other posters it would be off topic here, see you in the correct thread;)

Tony EH

AllForIt wrote: »

When teenagers behave in this violent way there has to be something wrong in the family unit. Has to be.

No. It doesn't "have" to be at all.

Children are not merely extensions of their parents.

AllForIt

Tony EH wrote: »

No. It doesn't "have" to be at all.

Children are not merely extensions of their parents.

Yes they are.

Because like their parents they are part of what I call a 'micro social demographic'.

I will open a thread on this soon. It won't be pretty.

Tony EH

Tony EH wrote: »

No. It doesn't "have" to be at all.

Children are not merely extensions of their parents.

AllForIt wrote: »

Yes they are.

So, children are just the extension of their parents. There's nothing else involved.

Right.