Sinn Fein Omerta

blanch152

end of the road wrote: »

sf are not afraid of the truth, that is the british, loyalists and ff/fg.
until they agree to take part in any truth process then sf is entitled to not reveal anything that already isn't know.

FrancieBrady wrote: »

No, the truth about what the IRA would, and the truth about what they all did. Because the violence was wrong from the start.

But blanch only wants the 'truth' from his boogeymen. God if only for once you took those cudgels up on behalf of some of the other victims you might have some honour and credibility.

I want the truth from those who are looking for my vote, is that too much to ask?

You two seem to think it is ok for politicians and others to hide the truth about their past.

IAMAMORON

onh81 wrote: »

I see you’re living up to your name. If you’re going to pretend you know what you’re talking about, please don’t engage in revisionism.

508 civilian fatalities is 508 too many but still only constitutes 29% of those killed by the IRA. Compare that to the British army’s rate of civilian deaths (50%), the RUC (54%) the UDR (63%). The loyalists are even worse, now they *specifically* targeted civilians (almost 900)

Nothing revisionist about facts pal. As i said I would have more respect for IRA supporters if they put their hands up and admitted complicity in civilian murders. Deflecting it with figures and blaming the Brits or Loyalists doesn't wash either. At least take responsibility for the shight that went on, whataboutery won't do it for me, or your victims and their families. Bad shight went down during the troubles, but have the decency to admit it for starters. 508 too many is 508 too many, regardless.

FrancieBrady

blanch152 wrote: »

I want the truth from those who are looking for my vote, is that too much to ask?

You two seem to think it is ok for politicians and others to hide the truth about their past.

The problem you have as I keep telling you is that you have already decided what the truth is.

You said as much on another thread.

I live in the constituency of Cavan Monaghan where British and Loyalist forces are implicated in attacks here, I want the truth of what happened there and I know it will never happen in a one sided process as I am sure the victims of bombs and actions in the rest of south think too.

It isn't ALL about you sadly blanch.

jm08

IAMAMORON wrote: »

Absolute garbage. Why bother? There has never been any evidence of either party involved. Pure rubbish talk.

We know. There was a cover up.

blanch152

FrancieBrady wrote: »

The problem you have as I keep telling you is that you have already decided what the truth is.

You said as much on another thread.

I live in the constituency of Cavan Monaghan where British and Loyalist forces are implicated in attacks here, I want the truth of what happened there and I know it will never happen in a one sided process as I am sure the victims of bombs and actions in the rest of south think too.

It isn't ALL about you sadly blanch.

Which British or loyalist politicians are looking for votes in the South.

Again, I ask, is it too much to expect truth and honesty from the politicians of Sinn Fein?

IAMAMORON

jm08 wrote: »

We know. There was a cover up.

There sure was, but throwing mud at Free State politicians is rubbish. It didn't happen. There was no doubt British collusion and we could talk all night about Robert Nairac etc. But throwing mud at Fianna Fáil or Fine Gael is garbage, please don't go there.

James Brown

blanch152 wrote: »

If you plant a bomb in a place where there are civilians, you target civilians.

You may only be targeting them to terrorise them rather than kill them, but it is a bare face brazen lie to say that the IRA did not target civilians. No amount of rightthink or doublethink will change that.

so if a country carpet bombs another country's town or city its deliberately targeting civilians? When they invade a country they are targeting civilians? You are accusing every army of targeting civilians. We know the BA did it on purpose on a number of occasions but do we know the IRA did? I'd expect it was unintentionally.

blanch152

Bowie wrote: »

so if a country carpet bombs another country's town or city its deliberately targeting civilians? When they invade a country they are targeting civilians? You are accusing every army of targeting civilians. We know the BA did it on purpose on a number of occasions but do we know the IRA did? I'd expect it was unintentionally.

Again, answer me this, who is looking for votes in this country? I don’t give a fu@k about Trump or Johnson looking for votes or what their states have done, that is for their electorates, but I do want to know the truth about politicians looking for my vote, which bit of that do you have a problem with?

Always defending the liars and charlatans of Sinn Fein and supporting them hiding from the truth.

James Brown

Edgware wrote: »

Apart from the sectarian murder campaign which their military wing carried out the magic beans economics policies would hammer decent working people and benefit the welfare spongers

FG are spending your money to put this mystery number of dole spongers in hotels, 25 year leases in luxury apartments and rentals to benefit private rental companies.

James Brown

blanch152 wrote: »

Again, answer me this, who is looking for votes in this country? I don’t give a fu@k about Trump or Johnson looking for votes or what their states have done, that is for their electorates, but I do want to know the truth about politicians looking for my vote, which bit of that do you have a problem with?

Always defending the liars and charlatans of Sinn Fein and supporting them hiding from the truth.

MLMD a sniper now?
Trying to get context here. If you are condemning all similar acts by everyone the same, good on you.
I'm well aware of what the IRA did and what SF stand for. Their housing policies serve the tax payer better than FG's. Thats their lure for my vote.

FrancieBrady

blanch152 wrote: »

Which British or loyalist politicians are looking for votes in the South.

Again, I ask, is it too much to expect truth and honesty from the politicians of Sinn Fein?

Like I said it isn't ALL about you and never will be.

You can try and run a onesided retribution campaign but until you start looking for the truth from all players in the conflict/war (including FF/FG and the parties in power here) then you will not be able to vote foe SF, because they are not going there and are fully correct imo not to go there, for the reasons I stated earlier.
I'm sure they'll be gutted you won't be voting for them.

markodaly

blanch152 wrote: »

Again, answer me this, who is looking for votes in this country? I don’t give a fu@k about Trump or Johnson looking for votes or what their states have done, that is for their electorates, but I do want to know the truth about politicians looking for my vote, which bit of that do you have a problem with?

Always defending the liars and charlatans of Sinn Fein and supporting them hiding from the truth.

Its the usual tactic of deflection.


"SF targets civilians you say?"
"Well what about Dresden, Hamburg, Hiroshima, well what about THEM!!"

They simply cannot discuss the topic on its own merit because they do not want the unvarnished truth.

FrancieBrady

markodaly wrote: »

Its the usual tactic of deflection.


"SF targets civilians you say?"
"Well what about Dresden, Hamburg, Hiroshima, well what about THEM!!"

They simply cannot discuss the topic on its own merit because they do not want the unvarnished truth.

What deflection? WE allow the American war machine to use our country in their war mongering.

Of course it is relevant.

There hasn't been a war/conflict in history were civilians haven't paid a heavy price.

James Brown

markodaly wrote: »

Its the usual tactic of deflection.


"SF targets civilians you say?"
"Well what about Dresden, Hamburg, Hiroshima, well what about THEM!!"

They simply cannot discuss the topic on its own merit because they do not want the unvarnished truth.

I think you misread some posts.
Killing civilians is wrong.
It doesn't come into consideration when voting for the best policies for the country.
If MLMD was out snipering children it would.
I'm okay with former IRA being in SF.

markodaly

FrancieBrady wrote: »

What deflection? WE allow the American war machine to use our country in their war mongering.

Of course it is relevant.

There hasn't been a war/conflict in history were civilians haven't paid a heavy price.

Yes, talking about Dresden, Hamburg and the bombings of WWII Japan is relevant to a discussion about SF Omerta..!!

You got annoyed when I pointed out your constant equivocation about PIRA violence, yet now you carry on as I describe.

James Brown

markodaly wrote: »

Yes, talking about Dresden, Hamburg and the bombings of WWII Japan is relevant to a discussion about SF Omerta..!!

You got annoyed when I pointed out your constant equivocation about PIRA violence, yet now you carry on as I describe.

You cannot have an honest discussion about a conflict and ignore one side.

FrancieBrady

markodaly wrote: »

Yes, talking about Dresden, Hamburg and the bombings of WWII Japan is relevant to a discussion about SF Omerta..!!

You got annoyed when I pointed out your constant equivocation about PIRA violence, yet now you carry on as I describe.

Where is the 'equivocation'?

Because I reference other war/conflict situations?

There is OMERTA by all in the conflict/war here. It took 40 years for the British to admit to their fault in one of the pivotal events.

Ometa will not disappear because you wish to climb up on the high moral ground. You are going to have to do better than that and join the call for everyone to abandon 'omerta'. (Jaysus who thought they were being edgy coming up with that word? It doesn't even describe what SF and the IRA have done)

markodaly

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Where is the 'equivocation'?

Because I reference other war/conflict situations?

Yes, its classic whataboutism

FrancieBrady

markodaly wrote: »

Yes, its classic whataboutism

I want you to focus on 'everyone's misconduct' Mark. Not just your boogeymen and women.

Because I have said over and over that they ALL misconducted themselves and all the violence was wrong.

Have you said that yet? I don't think you have.

markodaly

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I want you to focus on 'everyone's misconduct' Mark. Not just your boogeymen and women.

.

This is a thread about SF.
Not the British Army, not the UVF, not the American Air Force, not Alexander the Great or Genghis Khan....

If you want to discuss those, start a thread and I may join you, otherwise, leave the classic whataboutism and your constant false equivalences aside.

James Brown

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I want you to focus on 'everyone's misconduct' Mark. Not just your boogeymen and women.

Because I have said over and over that they ALL misconducted themselves and all the violence was wrong.

Have you said that yet? I don't think you have.

There's no discussion. Its about SF being bad and here's why.
You cant' discuss SF or the IRA in a vacuum. Thats what they want. Its pointless and dishonest 'debate'.

FrancieBrady

markodaly wrote: »

This is a thread about SF.
Not the British Army, not the UVF, not the American Air Force, not Alexander the Great or Genghis Khan....

If you want to discuss those, start a thread and I may join you, otherwise, leave the classic whataboutism and your constant false equivalences aside.

:D:D You want to discuss SF without mention of the above?


My point exactly. Could you get anymore stark an explanation of what you guys are about. :D:D:D:D

blanch152

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Where is the 'equivocation'?

Because I reference other war/conflict situations?

There is OMERTA by all in the conflict/war here. It took 40 years for the British to admit to their fault in one of the pivotal events.

Ometa will not disappear because you wish to climb up on the high moral ground. You are going to have to do better than that and join the call for everyone to abandon 'omerta'. (Jaysus who thought they were being edgy coming up with that word? It doesn't even describe what SF and the IRA have done)

https://www.rte.ie/news/2020/0826/1161323-victims-tweet-troubles/

Here is an equivocation situation for you. Should Martina Anderson be expelled from Sinn Fein for her comments?

FrancieBrady

blanch152 wrote: »

https://www.rte.ie/news/2020/0826/1161323-victims-tweet-troubles/

Here is an equivocation situation for you. Should Martina Anderson be expelled from Sinn Fein for her comments?

Definitely shouldn't have said it that way and good that she deleted.
She needs to calm down and apologise and explain properly why some are angry about this scheme and how it contravenes previous agreements (Stormont House Agreement)


If she continues to hold that view and doesn't apologise she needs to consider her position, no equivocation here.

Truthvader

Same numb nut Sinn Fein IRA tactic of pretending "everyone" has questions to answer. Some may have but the overwhelming source of murder and misery was Sinn Sein IRA. Plus dont accept for a second that they or their supporters here regret any of it. Dishonestly bleating that the violence was wrong but at the same time voting for and promoting the thug scum and their proxies who perpetrated it . Corrupted Gangland animals and retards.

joseywhales

batman75 wrote: »

In terms of dealing with the past what would SF need to do to be more palatable to the majority of the Irish people?

As you can see, a few posters have made an effort to highlight what they find unpalatable, some have suggested what sinn fein could do to rectify that, such as actively releasing all information to the authorities on republican criminal activity that they have knowledge of.

Others want the truth revealed about all historic crimes that sinn fein have knowledge of.

However this will never happen.

Hopefully that answers your question.

FrancieBrady

joseywhales wrote: »

As you can see, a few posters have made an effort to highlight what they find unpalatable, some have suggested what sinn fein could do to rectify that, such as actively releasing all information to the authorities on republican criminal activity that they have knowledge of.

Others want the truth revealed about all historic crimes that sinn fein have knowledge of.

However this will never happen.

Hopefully that answers your question.

I posted the report from the ICLVR earlier. What it shows is that if the proper process is set up that there is a willingness to engage in finding resolution and the truth of what happened.

The same thing needs to happen for the rest of it and all democrats should be calling for it now, before it is too late.

A full and open transparent truth recovery process were all the players take part.
Painful, difficult and requires a lot of bravery.

Edgware

onh81 wrote: »

I see you’re living up to your name. If you’re going to pretend you know what you’re talking about, please don’t engage in revisionism.

508 civilian fatalities is 508 too many but still only constitutes 29% of those killed by the IRA. Compare that to the British army’s rate of civilian deaths (50%), the RUC (54%) the UDR (63%). The loyalists are even worse, now they *specifically* targeted civilians (almost 900)

Do you do the economic policies for S.F.? You sure know how to cook the figures

Edgware

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Definitely shouldn't have said it that way and good that she deleted.
She needs to calm down and apologise and explain properly why some are angry about this scheme and how it contravenes previous agreements (Stormont House Agreement)


If she continues to hold that view and doesn't apologise she needs to consider her position, no equivocation here.

She needs to realise that Boris and Arlene have wiped the floor with Mascara Michelle.
They have done the decent thing and made sure some scumbag who got plugged by the security forces doesen't end up with a pension.

blanch152

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Definitely shouldn't have said it that way and good that she deleted.
She needs to calm down and apologise and explain properly why some are angry about this scheme and how it contravenes previous agreements (Stormont House Agreement)


If she continues to hold that view and doesn't apologise she needs to consider her position, no equivocation here.

Sorry, but you didn't let Dara Calleary off with an apology, once again, different standards for Sinn Fein.