Republic of Ireland Team Talk/News/Rumours 2020/2021 - see Mod Note in OP [18/11/20]

showpony1

I wonder if Stephen is enjoying his dream job all that much, he will again be picking an absolutely brutal team looking at the options above and lose all his games before eventually being sacked.

The_Kew_Tour

Hopefully it's the truth

~Rebel~

showpony1 wrote: »

I wonder if Stephen is enjoying his dream job all that much, he will again be picking an absolutely brutal team looking at the options above and lose all his games before eventually being sacked.

Even aside from results and injuries etc, I doubt it'd be very enjoyable anyway during Covid. International football is all about short term mood and atmosphere, especially for Ireland, and he's come into the job at a time when it's fundamentally impossible to build those sorts of things.

You get to create a certain small amount of on-field chemistry in training, but that time is so so limited. And then as soon as that's done, everyone is separated away from each other again and any chance at building camaraderie is snuffed out.

ebbsy

showpony1 wrote: »

I wonder if Stephen is enjoying his dream job all that much, he will again be picking an absolutely brutal team looking at the options above and lose all his games before eventually being sacked.

Playoffs is the best we can hope for, and even then there will be a semi final/final, not seeded against heavy hitters. These playoffs are also linked to our Nations League results. Enough said there.

It does not look good.

PTH2009

ebbsy wrote: »

Playoffs is the best we can hope for, and even then there will be a semi final/final, not seeded against heavy hitters.

It does not look good.

Use this campaign as a rebuilder while trying to keep our seed (we cant drop below 3rd seeds) and aim for qualification for Euro 2024.

Ferris_Bueller

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Hopefully it's the truth

It would seem strange for him to be announced in the squad in the first place and then for him to pull out for a fairly wishy washy reason. You could say that O'Connor, Kayode, McGuinness are just coming back from injury yet they all stay in the squad too and are much more important players at their club than Odubeko is.

Don't know the full story, but gut instinct is not good.

eire4

ebbsy wrote: »

Playoffs is the best we can hope for, and even then there will be a semi final/final, not seeded against heavy hitters. These playoffs are also linked to our Nations League results. Enough said there.

It does not look good.

Even if we had some decent quality in our side qualification would be very difficult because of how the playoffs are structured for this World Cup. But given the lack of any significant quality in our squad particularly in the attacking areas there is close to zero chance of us qualifying for the next World Cup Finals.

gormdubhgorm

PTH2009 wrote: »

Use this campaign as a rebuilder while trying to keep our seed (we cant drop below 3rd seeds) and aim for qualification for Euro 2024.

I agree and get some sort of settled team by the end of it. With an eye on the future. It looks like it will take a long time though. More than this campaign maybe two or three qualification stages.

I heard an item on the sports news about the football team today. The gist basically was Callum Robinson says Dara O'Shea is a good player.


As if there was nothing else to talk about and no positives anywhere, so that is all they could up with. It can only get better.

Coillte_Bhoy

ebbsy wrote: »

Playoffs is the best we can hope for, and even then there will be a semi final/final, not seeded against heavy hitters. These playoffs are also linked to our Nations League results. Enough said there.

It does not look good.

How so? I thought only 2 of the 12 play off places come from the NL?

eire4

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

I agree and get some sort of settled team by the end of it. With an eye on the future. It looks like it will take a long time though. More than this campaign maybe two or three qualification stages.

I heard an item on the sports news about the football team today. The gist basically was Callum Robinson says Dara O'Shea is a good player.


As if there was nothing else to talk about and no positives anywhere, so that is all they could up with. It can only get better.

I agree with you in terms of what we should be looking for from this campaign. I also think your right about this being a long term project. We are so far behind the rest of second tier nations in Europe never mind the top tier ones that for us to rebuild and put in place the structures to consistently produce capable top level modern players and thus have a consistently high level national team is going to take much longer then just one campaign.

showpony1

PTH2009 wrote: »

Use this campaign as a rebuilder while trying to keep our seed (we cant drop below 3rd seeds) and aim for qualification for Euro 2024.

so what you are saying is to give Stephen "time"?

johnnyryan89

Also don't think we can drop below third seeds in this campaign if you wanted to use it as a chance to rebuild a team. Pretty sure seeding for the Euro qualifiers goes by the nation league standings. It's why we weren't second seeds for the last euro qualifiers because we finished 23rd in the overall table.

tastyt

I’m even getting worried about Luxembourg at home now . Looking through their nation league results they are certainly no Gibraltar. Only lost 3-2 to Serbia away , 2-0 to Portugal and beat Cyprus and Montenegro .

Of course you’d expect to beat them but I am not so confident

noodler

tastyt wrote: »

I’m even getting worried about Luxembourg at home now . Looking through their nation league results they are certainly no Gibraltar. Only lost 3-2 to Serbia away , 2-0 to Portugal and beat Cyprus and Montenegro .

Of course you’d expect to beat them but I am not so confident

That's gonna be a tough game.

They've been decent in the last few years, we are down to the bare bones and the pressure is all on us to break them down.

johnnyryan89

tastyt wrote: »

I’m even getting worried about Luxembourg at home now . Looking through their nation league results they are certainly no Gibraltar. Only lost 3-2 to Serbia away , 2-0 to Portugal and beat Cyprus and Montenegro .

Of course you’d expect to beat them but I am not so confident

Another poster talked about us being so far behind the other second seeds, but there's the possibility that third seeds are going to start leaving us behind because a lot of these teams have proper structures in place for developing players while we still rely on teenegers going off to England to develop after getting the bare minimum training here*

Luxembourg piss all over us when you look at their full time academy for developing players. Their only problem for years was a lack of players in the player pool and those that were probably any decent were probably dual national.

Georgia recently started a full time academy or have one for a few years, as did Macedonia and Northern Ireland. And most of these teams have their own leagues that their national associations probably give a **** about and their young players will get that competitive experience at senior before moving on.

*Bar the odd teams of course but most 9 year olds in Holland have more contact hours with their coach than 16 year olds here in Ireland.

Rhys Essien

Defender Jake O'Brien scored his first goal for Palace u23's today after signing from Cork City.

Get him to the airport. : -)

https://twitter.com/CPFC/status/1374022920578666502?s=19

pjohnson

Is expecting a win not unrealistic for Kenny he needs time etc. etc.?

I thought we would happy with a solitary goal.

Francie Barrett

Ademipo Odubeko’s withdrawal was agreed between the Football Association of Ireland and West Ham United in the best interest of the player.

He will remain with his club for the international window having only recently returned from injury and, as a result of his busy training and match schedule of late, both parties agreed that it would be beneficial for him to continue working with his club at this time.

I know it's only a friendly, but how often does a player turn down an international call-up, or a club prevent a player from travelling? The excuse given that he's only back from injury just doesn't wash, he played a game today, and another last week. The Wales game isn't until Friday, there isn't a senior game for two weeks, plenty of time to recover for then.

Honestly, this has vibes of Declan Rice all over again and I really hope the player isn't just using us as an excuse to persuade England into calling him up themselves to block us.

johnnyryan89

Francie Barrett wrote: »

I know it's only a friendly, but how often does a player turn down an international call-up, or a club prevent a player from travelling? The excuse given that he's only back from injury just doesn't wash, he played a game today, and another last week. The Wales game isn't until Friday, there isn't a senior game for two weeks, plenty of time to recover for then.

Honestly, this has vibes of Declan Rice all over again and I really hope the player isn't just using us as an excuse to persuade England into calling him up themselves to block us.

Clubs do not have to release players for friendlies and since Covid teams can refuse to release players under certain conditions even for competitive games. Pretty sure it's why South American games are called off and why German based players aren't going abroad for international games.

Francie Barrett

johnnyryan89 wrote: »

Clubs do not have to release players for friendlies and since Covid teams can refuse to release players under certain conditions even for competitive games. Pretty sure it's why South American games are called off and why German based players aren't going abroad for international games.

Strange how the only player not joining the squad is the one we had doubts over.

The record of players rejecting call-up's subsequently appearing for us isn't good. Grealish, Rice, Liam Kelly, I even remember Barry Magure rejecting a call-up years ago. None ever came back.

I think if Odubeko wanted to play for us, he'd still be in the squad.

~Rebel~

Francie Barrett wrote: »

Strange how the only player not joining the squad is the one we had doubts over.

The record of players rejecting call-up's subsequently appearing for us isn't good. Grealish, Rice, Liam Kelly, I even remember Barry Magure rejecting a call-up years ago. None ever came back.

I think if Odubeko wanted to play for us, he'd still be in the squad.

I wouldn’t be at all surprised if you’re right - but I’m gonna give them the benefit of the doubt for the moment. If the same happens next international window, then we know something’s up.

Banjaxed82

sugarman wrote: »

Thats why Dan Rose cant travel for the u21s, will be required to quarantine for 2 weeks when he arrives back in Germany.

Theres a similar issue with Ligue 1 players where Serbia have called up players, not sure on the latest there but there was talk last week that their no.1 GK, Rajković and one of their first choice CBs, Mitrović, may no be available.

Hasn't Conor Noß flown in from Germany? His club obviously don't give a fook if he has to quarantine or not.

Zico !

hes had no luck kenny but hes done some shrewd moves in the background getting anthony barry and now david forde involved impressive reorganising

athlone99

For all those who want SK sacked, who would you replace him with?

Given what he did at Longford, Derry and Dundalk when he was given time, whats not to say he cant do that with Ireland? I'm of the opinion that a lot of people who want him gone were also backers of Delaney and happy to take free pints and lift him on their shoulders while he bled the FAI dry and we are now reaping the rewards of that.

I said it in November i would rather right off the campaign given we will probably finish 3rd anyway. Id rather see all the younger players get game time and build towards a proper run at the Euros campaign and possible the 2026 WC. Our squad is the worst in my living memory (30+ years) and needs time to be rebuilt.

noodler

athlone99 wrote: »

I'm of the opinion that a lot of people who want him gone were also backers of Delaney and happy to take free pints and lift him on their shoulders while he bled the FAI dry and we are now reaping the rewards of that.

Whilst not wanting him sacked myself, that's quite the charge for anyone who disagrees with you!


Some feel that "sacrificing" a campaign to blood youngsters will make us more ready for a run at WC2024. However, there are only a few qualifiers, spaced few and far between, and they won't be much use if said kids aren't playing for their clubs during the year.

Kenny will have to be more pragmatic. Appreciate we will probably fall on our faces regardless but if the public feel SK is deliberately not using everything at his disposal to get a result (whether that be our more seasoned players or cruder tactics) then he won't last very long either.

johnnyryan89

athlone99 wrote: »

For all those who want SK sacked, who would you replace him with?

Given what he did at Longford, Derry and Dundalk when he was given time, whats not to say he cant do that with Ireland? I'm of the opinion that a lot of people who want him gone were also backers of Delaney and happy to take free pints and lift him on their shoulders while he bled the FAI dry and we are now reaping the rewards of that.

I said it in November i would rather right off the campaign given we will probably finish 3rd anyway. Id rather see all the younger players get game time and build towards a proper run at the Euros campaign and possible the 2026 WC. Our squad is the worst in my living memory (30+ years) and needs time to be rebuilt.

Might as well ask 'if money wasn't an issue who would you like as manager', because when Kenny's current contract is up I can see whoever comes in next or if Kenny remains on he'll have to take a hefty pay cut on what he's currently getting.

LuckyLloyd

athlone99 wrote: »

For all those who want SK sacked, who would you replace him with?

Given what he did at Longford, Derry and Dundalk when he was given time, whats not to say he cant do that with Ireland? I'm of the opinion that a lot of people who want him gone were also backers of Delaney and happy to take free pints and lift him on their shoulders while he bled the FAI dry and we are now reaping the rewards of that.

I said it in November i would rather right off the campaign given we will probably finish 3rd anyway. Id rather see all the younger players get game time and build towards a proper run at the Euros campaign and possible the 2026 WC. Our squad is the worst in my living memory (30+ years) and needs time to be rebuilt.

This is a hugely disingenuous and inaccurate statement, though i appreciate the emotion that bristles from it. The assessment of the manager and the national team's objective is decoupled from an opinion on Delany's criminality and the governance issues that have plagued the FAI as a whole. Lumping any criticism of the performances to date and / or skepticism about Kenny's long term suitability for the role as support for Delany is way way wrong.

As for the rest, people clearly want Senior International Football to be something it isn't. The Senior team take the best of what is available and try to get the best result possible every game. The development needs to happen at youth and underage levels of the game. There are certain results outcomes that will not be tolerated.

Serbia away? Fine. That's a tough ask. He doesn't need to get a result there, but ideally we won't be hammered. Luxembourg at home? There is no ambiguity or sense of long term there. Must win. I don't hold him to having to qualify, but I equally won't excuse us starting to lose to 5th and 4th seeds. Nobody should.

Francie Barrett

I saw this article about the England team which discusses the options available to them of attacking players to support Kane - https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/56487138

They have come up with a shortlist of 7 players.

Foden
Grealish
Maddison
Mount
Rashford
Sancho
Sterling

Honourable mentions go to Bukayo Saka, Dominic Calvert-Lewin, Tammy Abraham, Harvey Barnes, Jesse Lingard, Dele Alli, Ross Barkley, Ollie Watkins and Patrick Bamford.

We obviously have no one anywhere near that standard.

Going down the list, there's a whole bunch other decent attacking players who would still eclipse anyone we have currently. Callum Wilson, Zaha, Ings, Antonio, Harvey Elliot, Toney, Solanke, Hudson-Odoi, Oxlade-Chamberlain, Greenwood, Bellingham. There's probably plenty more I am missing there.

How many English players would have to be unavailable before the likes of a Long, Connolly, or Brady would make the England squad? We're obviously a smaller country than England, but statistically speaking, surely we should have 2-3 players in those buckets?

Irish football is at a very low ebb at this moment.

topmanamillion

johnnyryan89 wrote: »

Might as well ask 'if money wasn't an issue who would you like as manager', because when Kenny's current contract is up I can see whoever comes in next or if Kenny remains on he'll have to take a hefty pay cut on what he's currently getting.

I think Kenny is on around the 500k mark which is about a quarter of what Trap was on and a fraction of the O`Neil/Keane set up so its already taking a good hit.

We were a complete joke rocking up at Euros with some of the best paid management teams in the world. The thinking was O`Neil and Trap were working miracles by getting lowly Ireland there, yet that was blown out of the water when we arrived and Albania, Iceland, The Nordies et.al were there too with managers on fractions of ours with all of them being competitive.

I certainly think the Champagne days of heading off to the Austrian Bundesliga for a "World Class Manger" are thankfully over.

Its outside the box thinking from here on out in term of appointing managers, and that`s promoting youth international managers or looking at people like Paul Cook or Jim Goodwin. And I'm all for that.

athlone99

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

This is a hugely disingenuous and inaccurate statement, though i appreciate the emotion that bristles from it. The assessment of the manager and the national team's objective is decoupled from an opinion on Delany's criminality and the governance issues that have plagued the FAI as a whole. Lumping any criticism of the performances to date and / or skepticism about Kenny's long term suitability for the role as support for Delany is way way wrong.

As for the rest, people clearly want Senior International Football to be something it isn't. The Senior team take the best of what is available and try to get the best result possible every game. The development needs to happen at youth and underage levels of the game. There are certain results outcomes that will not be tolerated.

Serbia away? Fine. That's a tough ask. He doesn't need to get a result there, but ideally we won't be hammered. Luxembourg at home? There is no ambiguity or sense of long term there. Must win. I don't hold him to having to qualify, but I equally won't excuse us starting to lose to 5th and 4th seeds. Nobody should.

Fair enough, was kinda tongue in cheek as i think many people believe that the senior team should be competing with bigger nations. People need a serious reality check. The English changed their academy system 10/15 years ago hence the talent they are now bringing through. We will be lucky to see real progress for 15/20 years given how broke the FAI are.

There are little to no managers who would take the job so i would stick long term with SK. He is the only manager to my memory to come in and think long term and link the senior team with the underage structure.

Tchaikovsky

topmanamillion wrote: »

I think Kenny is on around the 500k mark which is about a quarter of what Trap was on and a fraction of the O`Neil/Keane set up so its already taking a good hit.

We were a complete joke rocking up at Euros with some of the best paid management teams in the world. The thinking was O`Neil and Trap were working miracles by getting lowly Ireland there, yet that was blown out of the water when we arrived and Albania, Iceland, The Nordies et.al were there too with managers on fractions of ours with all of them being competitive.

Worth pointing out that we qualified for Euro 2012 (when it was 16 teams) and 2016. Blown out of the water in 2012, with the 2 finalists in our group, in 2016 I can't see how that was the case. We beat Italy, Germany, Bosnia, Austria and Wales in the space of 2 years under O'Neill.

Whatever about the football being dogsh1t - it obviously was - they were big results. Albania and Iceland have slipped quite a bit since 2016 and the Nordies haven't qualified for anything since then either.

athlone99

Tchaikovsky wrote: »

Worth pointing out that we qualified for Euro 2012 (when it was 16 teams) and 2016. Blown out of the water in 2012, with the 2 finalists in our group, in 2016 I can't see how that was the case. We beat Italy, Germany, Bosnia, Austria and Wales in the space of 3 years under O'Neill.

Whatever about the football being dogsh1t - it obviously was - they were big results. Albania and Iceland have slipped quite a bit since 2016 and the Nordies haven't qualified for anything since then either.

Or another way to look at that is if it wasn't an expanded Euros we would not have qualified, or if in a standard Euros we would not have gotten out of the group.

Tchaikovsky

athlone99 wrote: »

Or another way to look at that is if it wasn't an expanded Euros we would not have qualified, or if in a standard Euros we would not have gotten out of the group.

True, but then you could say if Europe didn't have so many spots in 1990 and 1994, we would've been in the playoffs or not qualified at all.

I'm pretty sure Portugal finished 3rd in their group at Euro 2016. They drew their 3 games anyway. If that was a 16-team competition, they wouldn't have won it. We got more points than Portugal and in a tougher group.

athlone99

Tchaikovsky wrote: »

True, but then you could say if Europe didn't have so many spots in 1990 and 1994, we would've been in the playoffs or not qualified at all.

I'm pretty sure Portugal finished 3rd in their group at Euro 2016. They drew their 3 games anyway. If that was a 16-team competition, they wouldn't have won it. We got more points than Portugal and in a tougher group.

Or again, we got lucky and played an Italy team that had already qualified and changed their whole team. If only SK could get a pinch of that kinda luck we'd be doing ok.

SomethingElse

athlone99 wrote: »

Or again, we got lucky and played an Italy team that had already qualified and changed their whole team. If only SK could get a pinch of that kinda luck we'd be doing ok.

We were competitive in our qualifying games against the higher seeds under O'Neill and Trap. The hammering against Germany is an exception that comes to mind. I can't see Kenny coming anywhere near that. Some posters on here are even beginning to talk up Luxembourg's chances against us

showpony1

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Luxembourg at home? There is no ambiguity or sense of long term there. Must win. I don't hold him to having to qualify, but I equally won't excuse us starting to lose to 5th and 4th seeds. Nobody should.

Almost definitely won't win the game - and "more time needed" will be the excuse for Stephen's men to be able to beat teams that are worse than us.

athlone99

SomethingElse wrote: »

We were competitive in our qualifying games against the higher seeds under O'Neill and Trap. The hammering against Germany is an exception that comes to mind. I can't see Kenny coming anywhere near that. Some posters on here are even beginning to talk up Luxembourg's chances against us

Well even do they are improving, not beating Luxembourg changes everything for me.as poor and out of form as the squad is we should be beating them.

We werent really competitive do.if you consider sitting back for 80 mins, having 25/30% possession and maybe scoring on the break or from a set piece competitive. I can at least see a plan from the current Ireland team, whether they are good enough to take the chance remains to be seen. The plan worked perfectly against Slovakia until Hourihane misses from 3 yards out. Everything would look different if that went in.

votecounts

SK will be sacked shortly, within a year. It's a results business and I feel he is simply not good enough to be a manager of an International team, never was.
Media will force him out when he fcuks up

Tchaikovsky

At least give him some games in front of fans, Jesus.

Amirani

votecounts wrote: »

SK will be sacked shortly, within a year. It's a results business and I feel he is simply not good enough to be a manager of an International team, never was.
Media will force him out when he fcuks up

He'll get the whole of the campaign barring any complete disaster. Doesn't make sense to do anything else (particularly given the FAI's precarious financial position).

johnnyryan89

Tchaikovsky wrote: »

At least give him some games in front of fans, Jesus.

No no he's correct. The FAI, who can't even afford to get rid of Robbie Keane are all of sudden gonna sack the national team manager within the year.

noodler

I think some posters are going to be a surprised at Luxembourg.

Tchaikovsky

noodler wrote: »

I think some posters are going to be a surprised at Luxembourg.

Just our luck that we haven't played them since 1987, during which time they've been whipping boys, and now they're a potential banana skin.

eire4

Tchaikovsky wrote: »

Just our luck that we haven't played them since 1987, during which time they've been whipping boys, and now they're a potential banana skin.

To be fair it is a measure of how bad we are in terms of the utter lack of attacking talent and lack of talent overall in our squad that we are looking at Luxembourg and not seeing that as a straight forward 3 points.
We clearly are better then Luxembourg even with the poor talent level we currently have but our lack of goals means that even weaker countries like Luxembourg it they sit in and defend well have a realistic chance of hanging on for a point.

votecounts

Amirani wrote: »

He'll get the whole of the campaign barring any complete disaster. Doesn't make sense to do anything else (particularly given the FAI's precarious financial position).

not a hope, if we're out of contention early, he's toast

votecounts

johnnyryan89 wrote: »

No no he's correct. The FAI, who can't even afford to get rid of Robbie Keane are all of sudden gonna sack the national team manager within the year.

Or maybe he'll do the honourable thing and resign when it's clear he's out of his depth. Robbie never should have taken those wages, proves he's a greedy fcuker

johnnyryan89

Tchaikovsky wrote: »

Just our luck that we haven't played them since 1987, during which time they've been whipping boys, and now they're a potential banana skin.

Yes because if you haven't noticed Irish football is declining while other nation's are improving. It's usually what happens when teams weaker than you improve while you decline. They become less easier to beat than before, example being Gibraltar when we scored three goals in two games when we've put five, six or seven past them under MON.

The_Kew_Tour

Luxembourg are no mugs. And their fans are thinking they can get third too by their fourms.

Draw tomorrow would feel like a win.

I would sadly take 0-0 now but head says 1-0 Serbia

johnnyryan89

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Luxembourg are no mugs. And their fans are thinking they can get third too by their fourms.

Draw tomorrow would feel like a win.

I would sadly take 0-0 now but head says 1-0 Serbia

Serbia themselves are in a funny place having replaced their manager and a new manager brought in with the intention of improving their style of play, and they could have issues with Covid if players aren't released from their clubs.

Think it's gonna come down to how our defence is going to fair. Can Duffy put his Celtic woes behind him and be that gladiator in defence he's been at times, and can our luck change at the other end of the pitch with someone hopefully putting one chance away unlike in Slovakia. Think 1-1 or 1-0 Serbia myself.

eire4

Wish I could feel more positive about tomorrow but the best I can see is a 1-0 defeat. My prediction though is a 3-0 defeat.