Republic of Ireland Team Talk/News/Rumours 2020/2021 - see Mod Note in OP [18/11/20]

scouserstation

FixdePitchmark wrote: »

Yes - the LOI thing is bull****.

Has anyone from LOI playing in LOI at the time made any significant contribution to an Irish game ?

Load of calls - they have got a run out , but you can see they are not up to the pace.

In what games have league of Ireland players played badly for Ireland?

johnnyryan89

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

That is a trick I think. McClean is normally subbed after he gets his normal yellow by 60 minutes or so? No time if two quick yellows?

Before today he's only ever been subbed off in 16 games for Ireland after being booked. Friendly against Portugal in 2014 and Thursdays game against Slovakia.

FixdePitchmark

I know Michael Obafemi should be in squad.

But he is not the most prolific himself at present - he isn't playing and only has 4 goals in 2 years.

He doesn't look at present a solution.

plibige

Are you all gonna have the energy to keep being negative until Kenny leaves?

We were down 12 players from the original squad, plus a number of others who could have been called upon were with the 21's.

Rome wasn't built in a day

Father Hernandez

Faugheen wrote: »

This is something I don’t understand.

What has Jack Byrne done at club level to deserve a shot over five Premier League players?

I get he’s the flavor of the month but the quality he’s playing against week-in, week-out is far below the standard of the five lads ahead of him.

End of. Byrne doesn’t have a divine right to play. If he wants to show he’s better then go back over to England and prove it instead of sitting as the big fish in a tiny pond.

Completely get your point but what I don't understand is why is he in the squad in the first instance if he's not going to play him?

He was selected for a reason and then 2 players brought in after the original squad was announced get on ahead of him.

My opinion is that at least give him a chance to prove whether he is good enough or not before completely writing him off at this level. 30 mins to go there in a slow paced game when Hourihane and Hendrick were relatively anonymous would've been the perfcet time to do it.

ShamoBuc

tastyt wrote: »

I like Kenny and I’m all for giving him a chance

But some of the over the top positivity is doing my head in. He should be held to the same standards as any other manager .

NewMan1982 wrote: »

Jesus lads. The negative comments. Stop watching the team if it bothers you so much.

I saw plenty of positives this week. We just lack quality. We are playing to our level.

The Soccer Forum in a nutshell.:D

Corholio

Father Hernandez wrote: »

It's still extremely early days to write Kenny off straight away.

There has been improvement since hoof ball, not saying it's been fantastic but we're actually playing football. Injuries and Covid has played its part too.

Unfortunately, we haven't got a goalscorer, you can play all the best football but if no one can stick it in the net, we're píssing against the wind.

It's never early for some people to write managers off. The announcement of his appointment started the writing off for some. At least on a forum it's clear to see the agenda early on, and the overdramatic posting for attention. Same posters would be banging on about players taking pride in their shirts or walking over glass to play for their country etc, yet they don't even support a manager before a ball has kicked.

gormdubhgorm

tastyt wrote: »

To be fair Byrne hasn’t been selected in Irish squads for his performances against Sligo rovers or Finn harps.

He was selected last year on his form in Europe for rovers where he was the best player on the pitch in most games . He was selected this time for the same, playing very well against AC Milan a couple of weeks ago.

I’m not saying it should start but he’s definitely worth a place in the squad and a chance especially as he is a different style of player to what we have

That sold it for me against Milan he proved he was not overawed, and still played his positive game.

FixdePitchmark

scouserstation wrote: »

In what games have league of Ireland players played badly for Ireland?

The hype around Sean Maguire was a joke.

clsmooth

There’s been a huge improvement in our general play. Anyone with eyes can see that. If Hourihane takes his chance on Thursday or Long, Brady or Horgan take there’s today would there be the same negative voices? Results will come.

Feeling more optimistic with our current regime after each game. Great to see us actually play some actual football for the first time in years! Some decent young lads coming through too. The future is brighter than it’s been for the last 15 years

herbieflowers

Anyone know the name of the pundit on Sky? Kept missing his name when it came up (not Phil Babb)>

Father Hernandez

herbieflowers wrote: »

Anyone know the name of the pundit on Sky? Kept missing his name when it came up (not Phil Babb)>

Danny Gabbidon

herbieflowers

Father Hernandez wrote: »

Danny Gabbidon

Sorry, meant in the studio not the co-comm.

gmisk

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

Poor performance yet again. Probably the worst Wales side we've played in the last few years, missing Bale, missing Joe Allen, playing a central midfield duo of a Bristol City player and a Man City youth prospect, and we couldn't beat them.

Kenny has now had 4 games against pretty average opposition and hasn't won even one of them. 390 minutes of this supposed new brand of football and we've managed 1 goal - a Duffy header from a set-piece.

Leave aside the excuses about Covid-19. The reality is Kenny picked poor squads and has faced the consequences of those decisions.

It becomes harder and harder to see Kenny, Andrews and Duff as being the saviours of Irish football, as opposed to well-meaning folks in way over their heads. Very strong whiff of the Staunton era about this whole thing. They don't seem to know 4 games in what their best side is. What players are required to work the system they want to play? Why are we attempting a philosophy of possession-based football by selecting a pragmatic side without any possession footballers in it? It's bizarre.

If we don't see anything positive against another average side in Finland then it's perhaps time to question whether this experiment needs to be put out of its misery; otherwise, we may end up squandering the most exciting crop of players we have seen emerge in a generation. There has been no evidence so far to suggest these lads are up to the task at hand. We can't sacrifice the next few years in a vain attempt to save face against all the evidence before our eyes. We need to see something in the next game.

Picked poor squads? Who is missing?
Maybe Obafemi? Can't think of too many others

j8wk2feszrnpao

Man with broke phone wrote: »

Id go as far as to say I enjoyed watching the first half.

We played well enough in the first half, but the second was largely poor. Wales came to get a point. We didn't have the firepower up front; Brady and Long should have scored and we could have won the game.

ShamoBuc

Talon Calm Bobsled wrote: »

Jesus, what a post. This wales side on paper is a lot better than irelands today.
He's picked poor squads? Other than obafemi who else was there that should have been in ?
Calling for a manager to be sacked after 5 games is absolute madness.

Fair comment. He has us passing more, though some players passing ability is clearly not up to scratch. He is certainly limited with who he can select. Previous managers did seem to have better and more experienced players available to them. The whole Covid situation hasn't helped.
Should have won today with the few chances we simply didn't take, clearly not the managers fault. Brady and Long really will look back at their chances and rightly be annoyed at not scoring.
Another clean sheet is something to be happy about too.

Work done but clearly more to do.

dfx-

dr.kenneth noisewater wrote: »

Think it shows how far below the international level the LOI and Byrne are that a manager coming from LOI doesn't play him.

It doesn't show that in the slightest.

Kenny needs to be braver than picking the same old players. There is more creativity in Byrne's left foot than Wycombe, Stoke and Burnley players "at a higher level".

pgj2015

dundalkfc10 wrote: »

When we went down to 10 men he was never coming on.

Think he would have got last 10 mins otherwise[/QUOTE]


10 minutes is no good. its not like there are top class players in front of him.

Fromvert

Father Hernandez wrote: »

Completely get your point but what I don't understand is why is he in the squad in the first instance if he's not going to play him?

He was selected for a reason and then 2 players brought in after the original squad was announced get on ahead of him.

My opinion is that at least give him a chance to prove whether he is good enough or not before completely writing him off at this level. 30 mins to go there in a slow paced game when Hourihane and Hendrick were relatively anonymous would've been the perfcet time to do it.

Maybe he's getting completely overrun in training or he could have picked up a knock and Kenny doesnt want push him further but Byrne was happy to be in the squad with how depleted it was but was only there for an emergency. There could be plenty of reasons but we wont know why unless Kenny is asked and answers honestly.

But if he's fit, it's not a good sign for Byrne.

tayto lover

Jack Byrne is a good footballer in the LOI.
Ireland’s saviour...... I don’t get.

johnnyryan89

Talon Calm Bobsled wrote: »

Jesus, what a post. This wales side on paper is a lot better than irelands today.
He's picked poor squads? Other than obafemi who else was there that should have been in ?
Calling for a manager to be sacked after 5 games is absolute madness.

gmisk wrote: »

Picked poor squads? Who is missing?
Maybe Obafemi? Can't think of too many others

You're wasting your time with him, best off ignoring him.

Chalk McHugh

Kenny is looking at Jack Byrne every day in training with the Irish squad so you have to trust his judgement. If any Irish manager would love to play a League of Ireland player it would be him. I'm a Shamrock Rovers man myself and while i think Jack is a very tidy footballer i do sometimes think people lose the run of themselves with his praise.

pgj2015

FixdePitchmark wrote: »

Yes - the LOI thing is bull****.

Has anyone from LOI playing in LOI at the time made any significant contribution to an Irish game ?

Load of calls - they have got a run out , but you can see they are not up to the pace.

Graham burke scored on his debut for Ireland while playing in the LOI.

scouserstation

dfx- wrote: »

It doesn't show that in the slightest.

Kenny needs to be braver than picking the same old players. There is more creativity in Byrne's left foot than Wycombe, Stoke and Burnley players "at a higher level".

I thought Kenny would have been the type of manager who wasn't afraid to drop players that aren't performing, he showed this with the U21s at times, but again he went with the safe option of picking premiership players for the sake of it, Byrne could have easily done what Hourihan or Hendrick were doing and more, even Phil Babb was on sky saying he should have been brought on

Raoul

pgj2015 wrote: »

Graham burke scored on his debut for Ireland while playing in the LOI.

An awful goal that was probably going in anyway but Burke tipped it in on the line.

ShamoBuc

tayto lover wrote: »

Jack Byrne is a good footballer in the LOI.
Ireland’s saviour...... I don’t get.

Having seen what we have playing ahead of him, he could well be an improvement.
Until he actually plays there and does as good or better, I wouldn't shoot him down. If he was to play and play well, then it really would show up a lot of players - 'proven premier league ' players at that. Time will hopefully give us a more definitive answer.

Chalk McHugh

I couldn't understand Kenny's high praise of James McCarthy and bringing him back and playing him in the engine room. McCarthy is too injury prone. Always has been. Probably always will be. He's one player i would have left behind. You can't rely on players who are rarely fit. I was surprised with Kenny over that.

ShamoBuc

Raoul wrote: »

An awful goal that was probably going in anyway but Burke tipped it in on the line.

So, he scored.

Would have taken such a goal today.

Raoul

scouserstation wrote: »

I thought Kenny would have been the type of manager who wasn't afraid to drop players that aren't performing, he showed this with the U21s at times, but again he went with the safe option of picking premiership players for the sake of it, Byrne could have easily done what Hourihan or Hendrick were doing and more, even Phil Babb was on sky saying he should have been brought on

Then Phil Babb started talking about how "we have got the domestic game right.." I was like what, we have the Loi right..then he clarified he was talking about the premier league.

pgj2015

Raoul wrote: »

An awful goal that was probably going in anyway but Burke tipped it in on the line.

A goal is a goal especially these days, the current forwards we have would probably stop the ball going over the line.

Chalk McHugh

Raoul wrote: »

An awful goal that was probably going in anyway but Burke tipped it in on the line.

Correct. A truly awful goal. Although we cannot even score them at the moment.

j8wk2feszrnpao

ShamoBuc wrote: »

Having seen what we have playing ahead of him, he could well be an improvement.
Until he actually plays there and does as good or better, I wouldn't shoot him down. If he was to play and play well, then it really would show up a lot of players - 'proven premier league ' players at that. Time will hopefully give us a more definitive answer.

Or play badly and show up all those scouts from the PL and Championship that haven't signed him.
I agree that time is needed for the new manager/players.

pgj2015

just watched that burke goal again, sickens me seeing that traitor rice celebrating.

dfx-

scouserstation wrote: »

I thought Kenny would have been the type of manager who wasn't afraid to drop players that aren't performing, he showed this with the U21s at times, but again he went with the safe option of picking premiership players for the sake of it, Byrne could have easily done what Hourihan or Hendrick were doing and more, even Phil Babb was on sky saying he should have been brought on

It's the one thing that I would hint at a honeymoon period. Play the usual suspects with the new style and show it gets nowhere and it's safer to then bring in players he has worked with at u-21 and Byrne etc. Bazunu shouldn't be far off the GK bench either.

But you would worry that this is a sign of things to come - hoping players who haven't played a throughball or a taken a chance running with ball in midfield since they were 8 can do so.

Or worse, Byrne goes abroad and suddenly is the first name on the teamsheet.

ShamoBuc

munstermagic11 wrote: »

Or play badly and show up all those scouts from the PL and Championship that haven't signed him.
I agree that time is needed for the new manager/players.

Not really, as there are a few players that are currently playing and they are playing badly, again and again. Anyone scouting them certainly wouldn't go near them.
The fact that they keep being picked is a bit of a head scratcher to be honest.
I do think Kenny will have to drop a few from the team, as they are simply not performing.

Corholio

Chalk McHugh wrote: »

I couldn't understand Kenny's high praise of James McCarthy and bringing him back and playing him in the engine room. McCarthy is too injury prone. Always has been. Probably always will be. He's one player i would have left behind. You can't rely on players who are rarely fit. I was surprised with Kenny over that.

He played 33 times for Palace last season and the first 4 games this one.

Chalk McHugh

Corholio wrote: »

He played 33 times for Palace last season and the first 4 games this one.

We're talking about Ireland. He always seem to be crocked.

j8wk2feszrnpao

ShamoBuc wrote: »

Not really, as there are a few players that are currently playing and they are playing badly, again and again. Anyone scouting them certainly wouldn't go near them.
The fact that they keep being picked is a bit of a head scratcher to be honest.
I do think Kenny will have to drop a few from the team, as they are simply not performing.

I agree that some of the current players are not playing well. That doesn't translate to Byrne coming in and showing them up.

ShamoBuc

munstermagic11 wrote: »

I agree that some of the current players are not playing well. That doesn't translate to Byrne coming in and showing them up.

Of course it doesn't. But anyone who has watched him in the last few months would agree that he has been playing very well and would certainly offer more than what we are seeing currently. If he gets a few games under his belt in the team we might be able to compare better.
At the moment I really don't see how he could do worse.

RonanG86

RoryMac wrote: »

Lunged recklessly my hole, he pulled out of the challenge and there was little to no contact

Okay tbf, it wasn't as bad on replay as it looked first time.

As for Byrne, we won't know really what he's like in an international game until we try him. Might as well give him a go against Finland, imo. Nothing to lose.

Chalk McHugh

No matter how some try to dress it up and remain positive the fact is our national team has being performing abysmally and getting poor results for a long time.

It shows how far we've fallen and how low expectations are that many were 'proud' of our defeat in Slovakia. That gallant losers tripe that Roy Keane despised. We created a few chances and passed the ball better than in recent times deserves high praise in some quarters. Against a Slovakia on the wane from their excellent team from the not so distant past. Who were missing 3 or 4 of their best players?

We were rubbish in the group stages and couldn't win the one match we needed. When it came to the crunch we hadn't the talent to score. Creating chances is one thing. Finishing them is a skill Ireland have become redundant in.

People can point to more passing or more movement or whatever they like but it's mere crumbs of comfort for what is that but window dressing for a team that has forgotten what it's like to win.

ShamoBuc

Correct, for years and years, under several different managers, Ireland have been poor and very hard to watch.
If we can find a few crumbs in not losing a game we could have won, I'm okay with that.

In previous years I would have expected to lose the last 2 games.

simongurnick

Chalk McHugh wrote: »

No matter how some try to dress it up and remain positive the fact is our national team has being performing abysmally and getting poor results for a long time.

It shows how far we've fallen and how low expectations are that many were 'proud' of our defeat in Slovakia. That gallant losers tripe that Roy Keane despised. We created a few chances and passed the ball better than in recent times deserves high praise in some quarters. Against a Slovakia on the wane from their excellent team from the not so distant past. Who were missing 3 or 4 of their best players?

We were rubbish in the group stages and couldn't win the one match we needed. When it came to the crunch we hadn't the talent to score. Creating chances is one thing. Finishing them is a skill Ireland have become redundant in.

People can point to more passing or more movement or whatever they like but it's mere crumbs of comfort for what is that but window dressing for a team that has forgotten what it's like to win.

I 100% agree that we shouldn't just be happy to show up and that both players and fans should have high expectations, but sometimes we need to take a step back and realize our place in world football.
Slovakia, being on half of the former Czechoslovakia, has a far richer and deeper football history than we do. They appeared in two world cup final games in the 30s and 60s, an era when priests and teachers were beating the soccer out of Irish kids
Again, not saying we should be happy to make up the numbers but when you look at the global history of foot all, we have often punched above our weight

Ferris_Bueller

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

Poor performance yet again. Probably the worst Wales side we've played in the last few years, missing Bale, missing Joe Allen, playing a central midfield duo of a Bristol City player and a Man City youth prospect, and we couldn't beat them.

Kenny has now had 4 games against pretty average opposition and hasn't won even one of them. 390 minutes of this supposed new brand of football and we've managed 1 goal - a Duffy header from a set-piece.

Leave aside the excuses about Covid-19. The reality is Kenny picked poor squads and has faced the consequences of those decisions.

It becomes harder and harder to see Kenny, Andrews and Duff as being the saviours of Irish football, as opposed to well-meaning folks in way over their heads. Very strong whiff of the Staunton era about this whole thing. They don't seem to know 4 games in what their best side is. What players are required to work the system they want to play? Why are we attempting a philosophy of possession-based football by selecting a pragmatic side without any possession footballers in it? It's bizarre.

If we don't see anything positive against another average side in Finland then it's perhaps time to question whether this experiment needs to be put out of its misery; otherwise, we may end up squandering the most exciting crop of players we have seen emerge in a generation. There has been no evidence so far to suggest these lads are up to the task at hand. We can't sacrifice the next few years in a vain attempt to save face against all the evidence before our eyes. We need to see something in the next game.

I'm sorry but that post is nonsense.

Listing the players Wales are missing and conveniently leaving out literally half the squad that was missing for us. You mention that they have a lad playing for Bristol and a Man City youth player in midfield while again conveniently not mentioning they have lads playing for Juventus, Man United and Liverpool in the three ahead of them.

Has made poor squad selections and doesn't know his best team? Who exactly has he left out, maybe aside from Obafemi? It's pretty clear to me already the team he feels is his strongest apart from maybe one or two positions.

The last two times we played Wales in the nations league they mopped the floor with us and left our fans saying why can't we be more like Wales and blood younger players. Today we were the better team and probably should have won the game. If you can't see the progress then you must not have been watching us the past few years.

Yes football is a results business and the results haven't been good enough so far. But aside from the Slovakia game it's not hugely important in the grand scheme if we win these games once we are improving as a team. If it's still the same story this time next year and the results haven't come then maybe your point will have more weight but most of us are under no illusion that this is not a quick fix. The signs are good so far IMO and I have been happy with the improvement seen this international window compared with the two games last month.

D.Q

RonanG86 wrote: »

As for Byrne, we won't know really what he's like in an international game until we try him. Might as well give him a go against Finland, imo. Nothing to lose.

It is really mental that he wasn't even given 20 minutes today. Slow paced game, midfield struggling to create anything. Hendrick having played for 120 mins a few days ago. Surely at 70 mins you give it a go. Just to try something different.

The only reason I can see is that Kenny doesn't rate the LOI, which is fair enough, but then why even have him in the squad.

Can't get my head around it.

adaminho

D.Q wrote: »

It is really mental that he wasn't even given 20 minutes today. Slow paced game, midfield struggling to create anything. Hendrick having played for 120 mins a few days ago. Surely at 70 mins you give it a go. Just to try something different.

The only reason I can see is that Kenny doesn't rate the LOI, which is fair enough, but then why even have him in the squad.

Can't get my head around it.

Or it could be we're down to the bare bones of the squad and he wanted to save him for Wednesday?

BonnieSituation

After the shítshow on Thursday in here, this thread was again unsurprising.

Today was again another positive step. That's literally all we can ask given the tripe served up since Staunton was in charge.

Would I be right in saying that if we beat Finland on Wednesday, the misery brigade will be straight in to remind us that it was "only Finland"?

There's no winning with this crowd, best to leave them at it. Same souls here, YBIG and Foot.ie at it. Let them.

johnnyryan89

BonnieSituation wrote: »

Would I be right in saying that if we beat Finland on Wednesday, the misery brigade will be straight in to remind us that it was "only Finland"?

Yes, yes they will. All the while ignoring the fact that Finland qualified for the Euros and have been on an upward trajectory since the second half of 2016 while we've been on an downward spiral since 2017

D.Q

adaminho wrote: »

Or it could be we're down to the bare bones of the squad and he wanted to save him for Wednesday?

Yeah possibly, I'm definitely behind Kenny, think he's the right man for the job, and needs time. But just puzzled at the lack of action in terms of using the bench to change up the dynamics

Mr.Nice Guy

Ferris_Bueller wrote: »

I'm sorry but that post is nonsense.

Listing the players Wales are missing and conveniently leaving out literally half the squad that was missing for us. You mention that they have a lad playing for Bristol and a Man City youth player in midfield while again conveniently not mentioning they have lads playing for Juventus, Man United and Liverpool in the three ahead of them.

Has made poor squad selections and doesn't know his best team? Who exactly has he left out, maybe aside from Obafemi? It's pretty clear to me already the team he feels is his strongest apart from maybe one or two positions.

The last two times we played Wales in the nations league they mopped the floor with us and left our fans saying why can't we be more like Wales and blood younger players. Today we were the better team and probably should have won the game. If you can't see the progress then you must not have been watching us the past few years.

Yes football is a results business and the results haven't been good enough so far. But aside from the Slovakia game it's not hugely important in the grand scheme if we win these games once we are improving as a team. If it's still the same story this time next year and the results haven't come then maybe your point will have more weight but most of us are under no illusion that this is not a quick fix. The signs are good so far IMO and I have been happy with the improvement seen this international window compared with the two games last month.

Both sides missed players yet we had the more experienced players on paper. I mentioned the Welsh central midfield duo contained a Bristol City player and a Man City youth prospect - and that is a fact. As regards convenience, where were those of you singing the praises of a thirty minute spell against Slovakia pointing out that they were missing three of their key players, and had their home advantage deprived due to Covid-19?

Yes, he doesn't know his best team. If you dispute that, tell me what it is please. He left out Obafemi from his first two teams and then later bemoaned that his sides were toothless up top. He left out Byrne initially and then bemoaned that his team wasn't creative enough. He left out Dara O'Shea who can play all across the backline, and has started each game for his Premier League side, and then bemoaned that his team lacked options.

I've watched all of our games the last few years and I see no progress here. Anyone saying there has been anything to get excited about are simply sipping the sands of a mirage. 390 minutes of football against average opposition which has resulted in 1 set-piece goal and not a single win. Results that would have seen the previous coaches slated. Kenny has tried to use pragmatic grafters to play creative football, which is like putting square pegs in round holes. We could only muster 2 shots on target versus Wales and not a single effort on target in the first half. This is no more than we would have had under McCarthy and the same folks praising this would have been fuming about it under a previous regime.

Bottom line is it makes no sense to not select any creative midfielders for a side that is supposedly trying to play on the front foot with possession football. It made no sense to start Long and not provide him with any service down the channels; everything was to feet, and this is the coach who justified his bizarre first squad selection on the basis that 'it's about pace, we want pace.' There was no pace today whatsoever. It was pedestrian stuff with no urgency.

I'd love someone to answer this: why are we attempting a philosophy of possession-based football by selecting a pragmatic side without any possession footballers in it? Why is he not starting creative players? If the answer is that it's because he has no faith in such players, then that begs the question why we even replaced McCarthy with Kenny in the first place.