Republic of Ireland Team Talk/News/Rumours 2020/2021 - see Mod Note in OP [18/11/20]

Quazzie

wadacrack wrote: »

https://twitter.com/shumanskoo/status/1328577066284036097

Blow it up ref!

ebbsy

Quazzie wrote: »

Blow it up ref!

You might not be too far off the truth here.

ebbsy

I will wait until I see Kenny put out his full team before I cast judgement on him.


People are saying the World Cup qualifiers will be his true test, I think that it will be Euro 2024 before we know.

lawred2

wadacrack wrote: »

https://twitter.com/shumanskoo/status/1328577066284036097

the farce continues

gormdubhgorm

wadacrack wrote: »

https://twitter.com/shumanskoo/status/1328577066284036097

Quazzie wrote: »

Blow it up ref!

ebbsy wrote: »

You might not be too far off the truth here.

Would be no harm at all if it was called off.

noodler

ebbsy wrote: »

I will wait until I see Kenny put out his full team before I cast judgement on him.


People are saying the World Cup qualifiers will be his true test, I think that it will be Euro 2024 before we know.

Yeah, I think he will get the WC games.

johnnyryan89

ebbsy wrote: »

I will wait until I see Kenny put out his full team before I cast judgement on him.


People are saying the World Cup qualifiers will be his true test, I think that it will be Euro 2024 before we know.

Yeah I think he'll get both campaigns, the WC qualifiers are going to be a real **** show also with Covid. They've already scraped the June matches because of Euro 21 and we now play three games in March and three games in September.

loyatemu

noodler wrote: »

Yeah, I think he will get the WC games.

WC qualifiers take us up to this time next year - that's long enough for him to start showing progress. Hopefully we'll get some matches in front of a crowd by then as well.

Francie Barrett

wadacrack wrote: »

https://twitter.com/shumanskoo/status/1328577066284036097

Misery loves company.

I am really hopeful that Kenny should get his first win tomorrow. Bulgaria look to have 15 absences due to injury and COVID. It looks like they will start their 4th choice goalkeeper and their back line looks desperately short of quality and experience.

Our second team beat a stronger Bulgarian team 3-1 just last year, so we really have no excuses here. I'd expect us to control the game tomorrow and get a few goals.

Ireland to win 3-0.

Francie Barrett

Looking at the FIFA rankings, it's also still (remotely) possible for us to get into the second pot. Russia have had a bit of a collapse in form and are now in danger of being caught up.

If we win our game against Bulgaria we will be on 1,457.6 + 5.96 = 1463.56

If Russia are beaten by Serbia they will be on 1,468.8 - 7.23 = 1461.57

If Romania draw to N. Ireland (or are beaten) they will be in 1,458.3 - 0.27 = 1,458.03

If Norway draw to Austria (or are beaten) they will be on 1,456.0 + 1.09 = 1457.09

johnnyryan89

loyatemu wrote: »

WC qualifiers take us up to this time next year - that's long enough for him to start showing progress. Hopefully we'll get some matches in front of a crowd by then as well.

Doubt there'll be crowds at a match here in Ireland for another 12 months.

Kermit.de.frog

Francie Barrett wrote: »

Looking at the FIFA rankings, it's also still (remotely) possible for us to get into the second pot. Russia have had a bit of a collapse in form and are now in danger of being caught up.

If we win our game against Bulgaria we will be on 1,457.6 + 5.96 = 1463.56

If Russia are beaten by Serbia they will be on 1,468.8 - 7.23 = 1461.57

If Romania draw to N. Ireland (or are beaten) they will be in 1,458.3 - 0.27 = 1,458.03

If Norway draw to Austria (or are beaten) they will be on 1,456.0 + 1.09 = 1457.09

The reason nobody will be upset what pot we are in is two fold:

1. Everyone knows we don't deserve to be in the second pot

2. Nobody, but nobody, believes we are in contention to qualify for anything at the moment

There is too much disaffection with the team.

Try and find anyone who cared Ireland were playing Wales the other night, or will play Bulgaria...

There is just so much disaffection now and it's sad for all of us who use to follow religiously to see the state of us. And it's not just the team or management - it's the FAI, all the crap with Delaney, the incompetence. It all adds up on supporters. It gets to the stage where people just don't care anymore.

Captain Havoc

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

The reason nobody will be upset what pot we are in is two fold:

1. Everyone knows we don't deserve to be in the second pot

2. Nobody, but nobody, believes we are in contention to qualify for anything at the moment

There is too much disaffection with the team.

Try and find anyone who cared Ireland were playing Wales the other night, or will play Bulgaria...

There is just so much disaffection now and it's sad for all of us who use to follow religiously to see the state of us. And it's not just the team or management - it's the FAI, all the crap with Delaney, the incompetence. It all adds up on supporters. It gets to the stage where people just don't care anymore.

I disagree with that. I think the armchair supporters will lose interest because that's what they do and they'll be back when we win a few games. A lot of fans are unhappy with the fai but support the team because it's not the players fault. Other fans support the players but actively protest against the FAI. There will always be a hardcore that will follow the team.

Tchaikovsky

Captain Havoc wrote: »

I disagree with that. I think the armchair supporters will lose interest because that's what they do and they'll be back when we win a few games. A lot of fans are unhappy with the fai but support the team because it's not the players fault. Other fans support the players but actively protest against the FAI. There will always be a hardcore that will follow the team.

Agreed. It's pretty much the same as any other time when the team wasn't successful. There'll always be a big affection for the national team amongst a section of football fans and then the rest can come and go as the bandwagon passes.

gormdubhgorm

Captain Havoc wrote: »

I disagree with that. I think the armchair supporters will lose interest because that's what they do and they'll be back when we win a few games. A lot of fans are unhappy with the fai but support the team because it's not the players fault. Other fans support the players but actively protest against the FAI. There will always be a hardcore that will follow the team.

I think if it goes on much longer like this, it will be not only the armchair supporters who lose interest

1) Players will retire early from International football

2) Players will start finding injuries, and excuses not to show up

3) Players who do turn up will just treat it as a holiday.

4) Players who are eligible to play for Ireland (born outside Ireland who are halfway decent) will not declare interest.

Pudsy33

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

I think if it goes on much longer like this, it will be not only the armchair supporters who lose interest

1) Players will retire early from International football

2) Players will start finding injuries, and excuses not to show up

3) Players who do turn up will just treat it as a holiday.

4) Players who are eligible to play for Ireland (born outside Ireland who are halfway decent) will not declare interest.

That would say far more about the players than it would of Kenny.

Captain Havoc

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

I think if it goes on much longer like this, it will be not only the armchair supporters who lose interest

1) Players will retire early from International football

2) Players will start finding injuries, and excuses not to show up

3) Players who do turn up will just treat it as a holiday.

4) Players who are eligible to play for Ireland (born outside Ireland who are halfway decent) will not declare interest.

I don't think it relates to my point but I could see that happening, and maybe in the Didzy it already has. If Ireland were potential world beaters would Patrick Bamford be queuing outside the Irish embassy looking for a passport? Who knows? If players want to think that way, then good luck to them.

As an aside, I'm not having a go at armchair supporters, some people religiously follow other sports or whatever. I'm an armchair fan of other sports but soccer happens to be the one I played (along with cycling) and attend matches of.

gormdubhgorm

Captain Havoc wrote: »

I don't think it relates to my point but I could see that happening, and maybe in the Didzy it already has. If Ireland were potential world beaters would Patrick Bamford be queuing outside the Irish embassy looking for a passport? Who knows? If players want to think that way, then good luck to them.

As an aside, I'm not having a go at armchair supporters, some people religiously follow other sports or whatever. I'm an armchair of other sports but soccer happens to be the one I played (along with cycling) and attend matches of.

Ah sure everyone is an armchair supporter of some sport besides thier main ones. Weren't we all experts on sailing when Annalise Murphy was in the Olympics sailing? Or the O'Donovan lads in rowing?

Anyway, one thing I want to know how come McGoldrick was called Didzy?
Background to it?
Never heard anyone called David with it.

Annoying he retired, still easily Ireland's best forward.

johnnyryan89

Captain Havoc wrote: »

I don't think it relates to my point but I could see that happening, and maybe in the Didzy it already has. If Ireland were potential world beaters would Patrick Bamford be queuing outside the Irish embassy looking for a passport? Who knows? If players want to think that way, then good luck to them.

As an aside, I'm not having a go at armchair supporters, some people religiously follow other sports or whatever. I'm an armchair fan of other sports but soccer happens to be the one I played (along with cycling) and attend matches of.

Has four kids at home, very annoying that we've lost our only playmaker but understandable he wants to spend more time at home.

And reading interviews it seems this wasn't sprung out of the blue on Kenny and that McGoldrick was planning on retiring after the Euro 2020 campaign was over.

wadacrack

johnnyryan89 wrote: »

...................Randolph

...O'Shea - Duffy - Long Manning

.................Byrne - Cullen

.......Horgan - Knight - Brady

......................Parrott

Might as well go wild and just give some lads game time since so many first choice players are out. Plus honestly if Hourihane starts I've no interest in trying to source a stream to watch him be woefully useless yet again.

The fascination with starting u21 players should probably stop. Parrott has not played much and was sub for the u21 . Id be very surprised if he started.

Knight was very poor the other night and Byrne looked more impressive the 10 minutes he was on.

James Collins looked a threat the other night. I think he will start with Probably O'Dowda , Horgan or Maguire. 3 out of the 4.

Jack Byrne maybe is in with a chance of starting.

irish_goat

wadacrack wrote: »

Probably O'Dowda , Horgan or Maguire. 3 out of the 4.

O'Dowda is now doubtful, has a dead leg.

square ball

johnnyryan89 wrote: »

Has four kids at home, very annoying that we've lost our only playmaker but understandable he wants to spend more time at home.

And reading interviews it seems this wasn't sprung out of the blue on Kenny and that McGoldrick was planning on retiring after the Euro 2020 campaign was over.

In fairness McGoldrick was a bit of a journeyman prior to Sheffield United and is becoming a small bit injury prone. He is probably looking to protect his club career and look after his future as he is probably only on big bucks since he made it into the Premier League. He is a massive loss to us at the moment.

~Rebel~

irish_goat wrote: »

O'Dowda is now doubtful, has a dead leg.

I'm kind of ok with him not being picked... I like him as a player, but he just doesn't fit what the RWF position needs. He's just not a goal threat.

If we played 2 up top, and he was playing as a standard right winger, that would be fine. But as it is, with our lone striker playing back-to-goal those wing forwards have to be our main goal threat.

I think that's been our biggest weakness so far under Kenny, that those two wide players haven't been cutting in quite enough or taking enough shots. Or really just taking enough responsibility for goals.

tayto lover

It’s probably not a bad thing that so many are missing.
This competition is a chance for as many new lads as possible to get game time and try to impress.
You never know who will do well and make a position their own.
I’m liking that we are at least trying to play ground football and evolve from dinosaur football.
It will take time but hopefully it will pay off eventually.

Guffy

I thought byrne had a very good performance fir the 10 min or so he played. Created 2 or 3 half chances but, i think its was his wayward pass, that led to the break away for Hendrick's red? Wasn't arsed watching the game back so not certain but fair sure it was byrne and it could be held against him.

Hope it's not, hope he's fit enough for 90 min

Francie Barrett

Ukraine game called off due to Covid, decent chance our game will follow suit at this rate.

Brock Turnpike

Francie Barrett wrote: »

Ukraine game called off due to Covid, decent chance our game will follow suit at this rate.

Why would our game follow suit?

~Rebel~

Brock Turnpike wrote: »

Why would our game follow suit?

I think Bulgaria are missing 13 players now from Covid in this international window. Given that they're having more positives every few days, it would seem it's sweeping amongst the camp.

We've had 4 ourselves, with Browne, Doherty, McClean, and Robinson, and again with these popping up at intervals in the camp, suggesting it's on the move.

Tchaikovsky

27 years ago today we drew with the North to book a place at USA '94. Unbelievably tense night and one of the greatest in international football for what happened around Europe. I was watching the Ireland match at home with my mam and when I saw Alan McLoughlin coming on, I said 'Ahhh, he's sh1te!'

gormdubhgorm

Tchaikovsky wrote: »

27 years ago today we drew with the North to book a place at USA '94. Unbelievably tense night and one of the greatest in international football for what happened around Europe. I was watching the Ireland match at home with my mam and when I saw Alan McLoughlin coming on, I said 'Ahhh, he's sh1te!'

I think I still have a VHS tape of it.

eire4

~Rebel~ wrote: »

I think Bulgaria are missing 13 players now from Covid in this international window. Given that they're having more positives every few days, it would seem it's sweeping amongst the camp.

We've had 4 ourselves, with Browne, Doherty, McClean, and Robinson, and again with these popping up at intervals in the camp, suggesting it's on the move.

Wow for once a team with even worse breaks going for them then us. Think the game will still go ahead.

Brock Turnpike

~Rebel~ wrote: »

I think Bulgaria are missing 13 players now from Covid in this international window. Given that they're having more positives every few days, it would seem it's sweeping amongst the camp.

We've had 4 ourselves, with Browne, Doherty, McClean, and Robinson, and again with these popping up at intervals in the camp, suggesting it's on the move.

Yes, but the Swiss game was called off because of the Lucerne government refusing to allow it go ahead. UEFA, the FAs, etc. were happy to play it but weren't allowed.

I somehow can't see MM and Leo saying the match can't go ahead

scouserstation

Francie Barrett wrote: »

Ukraine game called off due to Covid, decent chance our game will follow suit at this rate.

Looks like the Ukrainians didn't follow health protocols and travelled with players who tested positive, as long as there's no skulduggery going on with the Bulgarian squad the game should be OK to go ahead

TheadoreT

Surprised we haven't fallen further down the rankings at this point. I guess we can still be thankful we had MON in charge for the games that carried more weight for the calculations and had us in a position far beyond the level of the squad we had.

JeffKenna

Tchaikovsky wrote: »

27 years ago today we drew with the North to book a place at USA '94. Unbelievably tense night and one of the greatest in international football for what happened around Europe. I was watching the Ireland match at home with my mam and when I saw Alan McLoughlin coming on, I said 'Ahhh, he's sh1te!'

Never forget that moment when McLoughlin scored and my mother being delighted. It was such a toxic atmosphere.

Ferris_Bueller

TheadoreT wrote: »

Surprised we haven't fallen further down the rankings at this point. I guess we can still be thankful we had MON in charge for the games that carried more weight for the calculations and had us in a position far beyond the level of the squad we had.

In fairness to MON he did a great job for the first three years or so, but we really fell off a cliff then and should have topped the group from the position we were in in the world cup qualifiers. From the Denmark hammering onwards it was tragic stuff really, as bad as this nations league campaign has been the last one was embarrassing. Still thankful for the job he did though.

TheadoreT

Ferris_Bueller wrote: »

In fairness to MON he did a great job for the first three years or so, but we really fell off a cliff then and should have topped the group from the position we were in in the world cup qualifiers. From the Denmark hammering onwards it was tragic stuff really, as bad as this nations league campaign has been the last one was embarrassing. Still thankful for the job he did though.

Yeah but think he took too much flack for his own over achievments early in that group. We came from the 4th pot. Austria, Serbia and Wales obviously not world beaters but were all ranked above us and had a few top quality players in their sides whereas we had Coleman and the rest of the plodders. Unbeaten in 9/10 of the group games and winning 5 is a superb achievement whatever way you cut it.

Agree he lost the dressing room after the playoff though.

~Rebel~

Ferris_Bueller wrote: »

In fairness to MON he did a great job for the first three years or so, but we really fell off a cliff then and should have topped the group from the position we were in in the world cup qualifiers. From the Denmark hammering onwards it was tragic stuff really, as bad as this nations league campaign has been the last one was embarrassing. Still thankful for the job he did though.

Yup, very much a tenure of two-halves. As things have turned out, it's a bit of a shame for everyone involved that he didn't get poached at his peak.

Almost feels like that 1-0 to 1-5 Denmark turnaround broke something in him.

johnnyryan89

~Rebel~ wrote: »

Yup, very much a tenure of two-halves. As things have turned out, it's a bit of a shame for everyone involved that he didn't get poached at his peak.

Almost feels like that 1-0 to 1-5 Denmark turnaround broke something in him.

Have always wondered how his tenure would have ended if McGoldrick wasn't injured for the first few games of 2018. Would Walters have been brought back in after his injuries and being more or less finished. Would the Keane outbursts still have been as bad if Walters wasn't called up etc etc. Because it seemed to me if it was just Keane shouting at Arter instead of nearly getting into a fight with Walters things wouldn't have been half as bad.

Obviously it all depends on if MON would have picked McGoldrick but given he experimented in those first few games and had O'Dowda playing in a three man midfield I could see him using McGoldrick if fit.

Zico

I wasn't in favour of SK taking the job.

Two days or two years out, his declared succession was wrong in my opinion. I was amazed the job Mick McCarthy managed to do in the circumstances. I didn't rate Stephen Kenny based on his history but I feel for him now. He is trying a style of play a lot of players won't be familiar with, especially up front. He hasn't had a full deck to play with yet, because of Covid. He deserves a proper go.

It's a mess that won't get any better changing horses now.

DM_7

I think more and more teams are playing in a similar ideal to what Kenny is trying to to do. The players coming thought like Idah can play that way.

It is a style of play Norwich use, they make pass over 500 and above 600plus passes a game.

Derby County had over 700 passes in their last game and Knight was in midfield. Molumby is playing for a progressive manager at Brighton.

Kenny needs to refine things to make sure play is progressive and I think the playoff game, as frustrating as the result was, is a fairer reflection on what he would like to achieve.

I would be more worried about needing to play these guys now when many players are missing. Idah has started 8 senior games in his career, with 4 of them for Ireland. Guys like Coleman and McCarthy are really missed.

Ideally players like this could be integrated into the side and developed as internationals, yet many of the senior players they will looking to when all are fit are guys like Doherty, Egan and Stevans who have less than 20 caps each and are still making their own way at this level.

Blanco100

DM_7 wrote: »

I think more and more teams are playing in a similar ideal to what Kenny is trying to to do. The players coming thought like Idah can play that way.

It is a style of play Norwich use, they make pass over 500 and above 600plus passes a game.

Derby County had over 700 passes in their last game and Knight was in midfield. Molumby is playing for a progressive manager at Brighton.

Kenny needs to refine things to make sure play is progressive and I think the playoff game, as frustrating as the result was, is a fairer reflection on what he would like to achieve.

I would be more worried about needing to play these guys now when many players are missing. Idah has started 8 senior games in his career, with 4 of them for Ireland. Guys like Coleman and McCarthy are really missed.

Ideally players like this could be integrated into the side and developed as internationals, yet many of the senior players they will looking to when all are fit are guys like Doherty, Egan and Stevans who have less than 20 caps each and are still making their own way at this level.

Idah needs to get in the Norwich team first.

As we have seen more and more players ruled out since the Slovakian game, surely there comes a point where we stop using these to make final conclusions about Kenny's ability and his future?

I mean, yes O'Neill did this and McCarthy did that, but if they were told 2, then 5, then 7, then 9 of their starting players were ruled out through illness as games progressed, we may not be able to remember the great nights when we beat Gibraltar, and use the comparison to criticise Kenny.

At this rate, the entire exercise is a farce, we all know it, it's very selective to say we can rely on results from this period to judge the manager. And that goes the other way, if we win 10-0 there is no big redemption, it seems like they're reduced to picking the kit man too.

TheadoreT

Duffy probably our most immediate problem now. He cant play this style effectively, Potter knew that and had him dropped from Brighton pretty sharpish and let go this season. Now playing at such a poor poor level where he'll only get worse too.

But rather pathetically he genuinely is our biggest goal threat. Usually a centre backs goal scoring ability is a nice bonus and not a criteria for picking them in their position but such is our lack of goals it may give him a stay of execution in the side right now.

Kingp35

Blanco100 wrote: »

Idah needs to get in the Norwich team first.

Idah has been poor for us when he's played. It's partly his fault and partly Kenny's fault for not giving him any support. However it's clear that he's not ready to start for the senior team yet and needs more time to develop.

loyatemu

Zico wrote: »

I wasn't in favour of SK taking the job.

Two days or two years out, his declared succession was wrong in my opinion. I was amazed the job Mick McCarthy managed to do in the circumstances.

what did Mick manage to do? He failed to get us out of a group where it would have been easier to qualify.

TheCitizen

TheadoreT wrote: »

Duffy probably our most immediate problem now. He cant play this style effectively, Potter knew that and had him dropped from Brighton pretty sharpish and let go this season. Now playing at such a poor poor level where he'll only get worse too.

But rather pathetically he genuinely is our biggest goal threat. Usually a centre backs goal scoring ability is a nice bonus and not a criteria for picking them in their position but such is our lack of goals it may give him a stay of execution in the side right now.

:pac: So much drivel in such few words.

Duffy played fine the other day v Wales. If Duffy manages to get back in the Celtic team and hold his position it will actually be the makings of him as a centre back. Amazing the way some people run with a narrative given to them and everything is viewed through that prism.

noodler

TheCitizen wrote: »

:pac: So much drivel in such few words.

Duffy played fine the other day v Wales. If Duffy manages to get back in the Celtic team and hold his position it will actually be the makings of him as a centre back. Amazing the way some people run with a narrative given to them and everything is viewed through that prism.

Huh?

He's clearly struggling.

TheCitizen

Deleted User wrote: »

As we have seen more and more players ruled out since the Slovakian game, surely there comes a point where we stop using these to make final conclusions about Kenny's ability and his future?

I mean, yes O'Neill did this and McCarthy did that, but if they were told 2, then 5, then 7, then 9 of their starting players were ruled out through illness as games progressed, we may not be able to remember the great nights when we beat Gibraltar, and use the comparison to criticise Kenny.

At this rate, the entire exercise is a farce, we all know it, it's very selective to say we can rely on results from this period to judge the manager. And that goes the other way, if we win 10-0 there is no big redemption, it seems like they're reduced to picking the kit man too.

Yes, I think with the way both teams are decimated this evening it's impossible to draw any great conclusions from what happens. Hopefully the players will play with no pressure and an opportunity for Jack Byrne in particular to stake a claim for a starting position in certain matches or more minutes on the pitch in future games.

TheCitizen

noodler wrote: »

Huh?

He's clearly struggling.

Huh? :pac: I'll have to spell it out for you obviously.

Yes I know he's struggling with his club. He's probably not exactly suited to the way Kenny wants him to play or what Neil Lennon wants from a centre back for that matter. The point i'm making is if he can get back in the Celtic team and keep his place it will mean he will have improved in terms of the demands made from modern centre backs. The exact opposite that the poster I quoted above is suggesting.

Anyway, he played fine v Wales. The poster I quoted described Shane Duffy as "our most immediate problem now". He's not, he's far from our most immediate problem right now. Ridiculous hyperbole.