Republic of Ireland Team Talk/News/Rumours 2020/2021 - see Mod Note in OP [18/11/20]

Christy Browne

https://twitter.com/gavreilly/status/1329489250778288130

FAI launch investigation into 'political' video message shown to Ireland players ahead of England clash.

eire4

sugarman wrote: »

Hearing it was allegedly the Bloody Sunday documentary that was show on RTE last week, if so, anyone "offended" by it needs to cop onto themselves.

Totally agree if that is what it was.

HalloweenJack

Very convenient timing for it. It'd be very easy for them to shift Stephen Kenny for some "offense" caused. It probably wouldn't cost them as much as sacking him because of results.

gormdubhgorm

sugarman wrote: »

Hearing it was allegedly the Bloody Sunday documentary that was show on RTE last week, if so, anyone "offended" by it needs to cop onto themselves.

eire4 wrote: »

Totally agree if that is what it was.

Agreed. But how exactly was it suppose to help Ireland win the match though?

I am not sure any of the team are adept in military intelligence and guerrilla warfare!

Also what of the players who are not born in Ireland would it fire them up?

In any case it did not work whatever the point was.

expectationlost

sugarman wrote: »

Hearing it was allegedly the Bloody Sunday documentary that was show on RTE last week, if so, anyone "offended" by it needs to cop onto themselves.

loads of other people saying it was In the Name of the Father.... but dailymail called it a video showing Irish English relations, the RTE docs sounds more of a fit for that.

this is the doc https://twitter.com/RTEOne/status/1328384073195249671

lawred2

sugarman wrote: »

Hearing it was allegedly the Bloody Sunday documentary that was show on RTE last week, if so, anyone "offended" by it needs to cop onto themselves.

Why is he showing that?

Is that for motivational purposes?

That's base rabble rousing no? For a squad that mostly plays in England?

Whatever about people getting offended.. betrays that he's a bit of an idiot to me.

~Rebel~

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Agreed. But how exactly was it suppose to help Ireland win the match though?

I am not sure any of the team are adept in military intelligence and guerrilla warfare!

Also what of the players who are not born in Ireland would it fire them up?

In any case it did not work whatever the point was.

I had heard that since the players couldn't hang out with each other, or do any sort of team building or bonding because of Covid, that the staff were trying to find other ways of building a little bit of national pride and national association.

Makes more sense in that context... being less about the England match specifically, and more "this is the country we're representing and playing for".

Indeed, it doesn't seem to have pulled much extra emotion out of the players, but I can't say I particularly have a problem with trying something like that... just playing something distinctly Irish that packs an emotional punch.

Kermit.de.frog

To be fair it's hard to motivate players for an Ireland/England game in any sport without some sort of political element being inferred somewhere, even loosely.

Look at Rugby and all the stuff about Croke Park that was rammed down the throat of UK viewers at the time the stadium was made available.

Kenny should be judged for his team's performances.

~Rebel~

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

To be fair it's hard to motivate players for an Ireland/England without some political element being inferred somewhere.

Look at Rugby and all the stuff about Croke Park that was rammed down the throat of UK viewers at the time the stadium was made available.

Kenny should be judged for his team's performances.

Honestly, even ignoring the England match, regardless who you're playing - it's bound to be very hard to emotive content about Irish identity that isn't related to England. The whole story of our country's existence is pretty inextricably linked with England.

johnnyryan89

They watched a dvd of In The Name of The Father. Should be locked up for war crimes for upsetting the poor Brits watching a film about how scummy their justice system is.

Kermit.de.frog

johnnyryan89 wrote: »

They watched a dvd of In The Name of The Father. Should be locked up for war crimes for upsetting the poor Brits watching a film about how scummy their justice system is.

Agreed.

A good few of our players aren't actually Irish - I know they go on about grannies and all that but let's be real - they are journeymen who are only with us because they wouldn't get a chance with England.

Agent Coulson

Should have just got McClean to give a history lesson on the poppy and why it might offend.

The_Kew_Tour

You just got to laugh at this.

RonanG86

HalloweenJack wrote: »

Very convenient timing for it. It'd be very easy for them to shift Stephen Kenny for some "offense" caused. It probably wouldn't cost them as much as sacking him because of results.

This is probably exactly what'll happen.

expectationlost

Kermit.de.frog wrote: »

To be fair it's hard to motivate players for an Ireland/England game in any sport without some sort of political element being inferred somewhere, even loosely.

Look at Rugby and all the stuff about Croke Park that was rammed down the throat of UK viewers at the time the stadium was made available.

Kenny should be judged for his team's performances.

easy you are playing the team of the country that is said to have invented football, you wanna beat them right????



there ya go ultimate motivation, no politics

Dr. Bre

When Scotland play England at the euros next summer will they be shown braveheart before the game lol!

Zico !

So far kenny been a disaster but to sack him for this would be a complete disgrace

lawred2

Zico ! wrote: »

So far kenny been a disaster but to sack him for this would be a complete disgrace

Handy cover for the FAI to get rid of him without having to have the embarrassment of having to admit he probably should not have been there in the first place..

TheadoreT

Its hard to know exactly what criteria to judge him on but below would be an assessment of some areas.

Results: 2/10. No easy games but only England would be considered completely out of our league. Our return was simply not good enough by any measurable.

Developing Youth: 6/10 Probably forced on him more than anything but he hasn't been backward in giving the less experienced players some game time. A bit slow to make changes in recent games which indicates perhaps a lack a trust in all of them, hard to know if justified or not.

Tactical nous: 3/10 style bordering on delusional at times with players at disposal. Set piece success which have always been a big part of our goal returns have dried up. Commitment to trying to play better is admirable but little ability shown to be able to turn this into winning football.

Motivational ability 4/10. Players devoid of confidence. Commitment hasn't been completely lacking but I wouldn't say he's getting anything extra from them either, which is a shame as we've often punched above our weight on sheer wanting it more than the opposition in the past.

Overall: 4/10 Far more negatives than positives so far but luck has very much not been on his side which has to be factored in giving it's a small enough sample of games to judge him on. He's very likely out of his depth at this level but probably deserves another handful of games to see if he has more facets to his managerial playbook than he's shown thus far.

Zico !

TheadoreT wrote: »

Its hard to know exactly what criteria to judge him on but below would be an assessment of some areas.

Results: 2/10. No easy games but only England would be considered completely out of our league. Our return was simply not good enough by any measurable.

Developing Youth: 6/10 Probably forced on him more than anything but he hasn't been backward in giving the less experienced players some game time. A bit slow to make changes in recent games which indicates perhaps a lack a trust in all of them, hard to know if justified or not.

Tactical nous: 3/10 style bordering on delusional at times with players at disposal. Set pieces success which have always been a big part of our goal returns have dried up. Commitment to trying to play better is admirable but little ability shown to be able to turn this into winning football.

Motivational ability 4/10. Players devoid of confidence. Commitment hasn't been completely lacking but I wouldn't say he's getting anything extra from them either, which is a shame as we've often punched above our weight on sheer wanting it more than the opposition in the past.

Overall: 4/10 Far more negatives than positives so far but luck has very much not been on his side which has to be factored in giving it's a small enough sample of games to judge him on. He's very likely out of his depth at this level but probably deserves another handful of games to see if he has more facets to his managerial playbook than he's shown thus far.

Saying all that he's missing half his first team every match and he's only in the job a few months needs more time

johnnyryan89

lawred2 wrote: »

Handy cover for the FAI to get rid of him without having to have the embarrassment of having to admit he probably should not have been there in the first place..

Where's this big of money that the FAI suddenly found to sack him, and the second big bag to hire someone else.

lawred2

johnnyryan89 wrote: »

Where's this big of money that the FAI suddenly found to sack him, and the second big bag to hire someone else.

Well there may be no need for the first bag..

~Rebel~

Zico ! wrote: »

Saying all that he's missing half his first team every match and he's only in the job a few months needs more time

This sums up the Irish team right now in pretty much every way.

We don't even need more time in terms of matches or Irish training camps - we just literally need more time to pass.

We're in a weird no-mans-land right now. Our last generation of players were by and large abject, and our next generation are promising but still mostly teenagers. We desperately just need the likes of Parrott, Connolly, Obafemi, Knight, Molumby, Kellegher etc etc to play as much as possible, and develop as much as possible in their own careers. What can actually be accomplished in the 10 days or so every few months that the national team gathers is almost irrelevant at this point. Just playing a waiting game!

gormdubhgorm

~Rebel~ wrote: »

Indeed, it doesn't seem to have pulled much extra emotion out of the players, but I can't say I particularly have a problem with trying something like that... just playing something distinctly Irish that packs an emotional punch.

I think under managers I believe they used to play rebel songs. Can see the point of that more instead of a film. At least a song can fire people up if done the right way. Can enhance communal sense of belonging.

johnnyryan89

lawred2 wrote: »

Well there may be no need for the first bag..

Yeah I'm sure the argument of they watched a movie holding up in court if they try sack him for gross misconduct.

~Rebel~

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

I think under managers I believe they used to play rebel songs. Can see the point of that more instead of a film. At least a song can fire people up if done the right way. Can enhance communal sense of belonging.

True, though that's even more dangerous jingoistic territory to be treading at this stage, depending on the song!

Also Covid rules out singing in anything like close proximity, so is out the window as an option - unless they're all told to sit there socially distanced and listen quietly.

Film is actually a great option I think. Though I'm not sure the right Irish film exists to use really, not sure we have any that fire you up. Most of our more nationalistic films more likely to leave you melancholic... should've just thrown on Rocky 4!

tastyt

I can see him being moved aside sooner rather than later and Duff been given the gig as the cheap option

Obviously no experience to speak of but at least the players would respect him ( yes, i do remember Stan before anyone says it )

lawred2

johnnyryan89 wrote: »

Yeah I'm sure the argument of they watched a movie holding up in court if they try sack him for gross misconduct.

I doubt that they are going to sack him.. they haven't a pot to piss in..

However overt political statements would likely be grounds for sanction... Depends on what the content of the video was, but it might not prove to be that hard to argue a case for bringing the organization into disrepute..

Either way, I don't think he'll be fired or anything. But I do find this rather basic stuff. Was he really expecting something like this to achieve something?

Brings his judgement into question really

Agent Coulson

tastyt wrote: »

I can see him being moved aside sooner rather than later and Duff been given the gig as the cheap option

Obviously no experience to speak of but at least the players would respect him ( yes, i do remember Stan before anyone says it )

Keane is still on the payroll a Keane and Duff managerial team

Zico !

They'll treat Kenny like kerr like a piece of trash hopefully this new ceo takes none of this sh1t serious just a word in his ear will do.

Some of the blazers must be in the background still

~Rebel~

Zico ! wrote: »

They'll treat Kenny like kerr like a piece of trash hopefully this new ceo takes none of this sh1t serious just a word in his ear will do.

Some of the blazers must be in the background still

Aside from the story content, that article itself was quite weird, and left a bad taste in my mouth.

Every single paragraph in the article is about the video, or peoples reaction to it, or the investigation into it that is going to take place. Except the last one. Which is about Alan Kelly choosing to not come to Dublin for the 3rd game over Covid concerns. The context it's framed in feels like an attempt to try to link Kelly leaving with the video, which seems like really shitty and agenda driven journalism.

Zico !

I just think there's no need for an over reaction here needs time. O Neill went 15 games for NI without winning a game. A word with kenny is enough

~Rebel~

Zico ! wrote: »

I just think there's no need for an over reaction here needs time o Neill went 15 games for NI without winning a game. A word with kenny is enough

Not to mention that the world has been on fire throughout his tenure so far.

It's been bad, but I find it hard to get too fired up about the negatives, considering the broader context that all of this is taking place within. It all just rolls together into the larger ball of "I wish this were not happening the way it is" frustration that describes every other aspect of life this year.

Weepsie

TheadoreT wrote: »

Motivational ability 4/10. Players devoid of confidence. Commitment hasn't been completely lacking but I wouldn't say he's getting anything extra from them either, which is a shame as we've often punched above our weight on sheer wanting it more than the opposition in the past.

On this. We're a team who has, more than most in internaetional football, heavily relied on fans, and atmosphere. There have been games where it has definitely made a difference.

But if you look around the international results, there have been awful and generally bad or uncharacterist performances by quite a few teams.

Personally I believe international football at senior level should have been canned for the year. Maybe have u23 tournaments and such in bubbles, but they have lacked quality across the board and not just Ireland games, with a couple of exceptions

Ferris_Bueller

This whole thing with the video and someone taking offence is one of the most bizarre things I've heard about the team in ages. Obviously we don't know what was shown exactly, some rumours saying it was 'In the Name of the Father', others saying the RTE doc and others saying it was a 3 min montage with some historic Irish clips. Regardless of what it was, how could this be deemed offensive and who would have made this official complaint?

eire4

Ferris_Bueller wrote: »

This whole thing with the video and someone taking offence is one of the most bizarre things I've heard about the team in ages. Obviously we don't know what was shown exactly, some rumours saying it was 'In the Name of the Father', others saying the RTE doc and others saying it was a 3 min montage with some historic Irish clips. Regardless of what it was, how could this be deemed offensive and who would have made this official complaint?

I totally agree. Assuming it was anything that you mentioned or along those lines to claim offense is risible. Screams of someone with an agenda IMHO.

Listen we have immense problems with our football team what they watched last week before the England game is not one of them in any way shape or form. I will just also reiterate here again what I have said before that this Ireland squad even at full strength is the worst Ireland squad from a talent standpoint since the 1970's. We via the FAI have abdicated the responsibility to set up the proper pathways and infrastructure within Ireland to bring through consistently Irish players who are capable of playing at the highest levels of the game with success because they have had the right education technically and they have learned to play and want the ball and be comfortable with it even under pressure. That abdication for decades is now fully manifested in the lack of talent at the senior team level.

I am not saying Stephen Kenny is or is not the answer but the fact is we will not be qualifying for the next World Cup Finals that and what we face right now is a long term rebuild and one that must be from the ground up with the proper pathways and infrastructure put in place as well as an ethos that demands at all levels we are teaching our players how to play a modern possession based game. There will be many who will not accept this and will demand Kenny's head now and or very soon I understand that but the only way to save Irish football IMHO is to look to the long term.

Captain Havoc

Congratulations to Shane Duffy on getting the FAI senior international goal of the year award.

johnnyryan89

Captain Havoc wrote: »

Congratulations to Shane Duffy on getting the FAI senior international goal of the year award.

Technically goal of the year is now chosen between any goal scored by one of the international teams, whether it be men's, women's or underage since last year. Though I think they only take goals by the U21s. Troy Parrott won it last year.

athlone99

eire4 wrote: »

I totally agree. Assuming it was anything that you mentioned or along those lines to claim offense is risible. Screams of someone with an agenda IMHO.

Listen we have immense problems with our football team what they watched last week before the England game is not one of them in any way shape or form. I will just also reiterate here again what I have said before that this Ireland squad even at full strength is the worst Ireland squad from a talent standpoint since the 1970's. We via the FAI have abdicated the responsibility to set up the proper pathways and infrastructure within Ireland to bring through consistently Irish players who are capable of playing at the highest levels of the game with success because they have had the right education technically and they have learned to play and want the ball and be comfortable with it even under pressure. That abdication for decades is now fully manifested in the lack of talent at the senior team level.

I am not saying Stephen Kenny is or is not the answer but the fact is we will not be qualifying for the next World Cup Finals that and what we face right now is a long term rebuild and one that must be from the ground up with the proper pathways and infrastructure put in place as well as an ethos that demands at all levels we are teaching our players how to play a modern possession based game. There will be many who will not accept this and will demand Kenny's head now and or very soon I understand that but the only way to save Irish football IMHO is to look to the long term.

Here here. First bit of sense someone has spoken. The quicker most fans realise we need to rebuild the better. I think SK will do well and i think the FAI should back him for the long term so the players know its either play for him or retire.

Weepsie

Also, personally, I have zero interest in a Qatar world cup. 2024 and 2026 are of far more interest to me, and what should be looked at, and even then as a starting point.

Need to take the German/Belgian approach and aim for something long term rather than getting hung up on getting into the next tourament so we can all have a jolly

Beechwoodspark

FAI to investigate England pre-match video

https://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2020/1119/1179281-fai-to-investigate-pre-match-political-video/

My two cents....fai lookin to dump Kenny

There's a big flaw in the dumping Kenny angle.

The FAI paid to bury a story involving the drunk CEO singing a rebel song. And have put up with players and teams singing such songs.

To sack someone for allegedly introducing politics in a more controlled environment and as part of some motivation would give that person a whopping big claim.

Azatadine

Beechwoodspark wrote: »

FAI to investigate England pre-match video

https://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2020/1119/1179281-fai-to-investigate-pre-match-political-video/

My two cents....fai lookin to dump Kenny

Yeah, its all over twitter. Looking to get rid of him for sure.

The ill conceived experiment of SK is a disaster but not his fault they appointed him in the first place.

elefant

Azatadine wrote: »

Yeah, its all over twitter. Looking to get rid of him for sure.

The ill conceived experiment of SK is a disaster but not his fault they appointed him in the first place.

There's pretty much zero chance they'll get rid of him over this, for many reasons.

expectationlost

RTÉ Sport understands that two-and-a-half minutes of the video was famous goals scored against England, from Ray Houghton, Kevin Sheedy, Niall Quinn, Tony Cascarino and Shane Long, followed by 30 seconds of "historical context" of the relationship between Ireland and England.

https://www.rte.ie/sport/soccer/2020/1119/1179281-fai-to-investigate-pre-match-political-video/

Dr. Bre

Prime time are going to talk about it

LuckyLloyd

Seems to me that a player leaked it because they aren't buying what he's selling. Convenient reason to get rid by all concerned except Kenny tbh.

Pauliedragon

Just as I thought we could relax and regroup until March. Is this mutiny or what's going on?

franglan

Such a load of bollocks, sport what ever way you look at it is them against us. If you use historical events between two rival nations or paper cuttings or "you'd want to hear what them boys are saying about you" so what. Sick of this mass hysteria about everything.

noodler

I think it's pathetic it was thought it was needed and obviously pathetic someone leaked it.

With so many lads English born, it probably wasn't a wise move for many reasons.

Can't see it leading to a sacking.