PHIL HOGAN NEEDS TO RESIGN.

Happydays2020

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

I wonder is there an actual 'code of conduct' for judges that puts this sort of thing out of bounds, as it were, or are they just expected to use their 'judgement'?

This may be of interest -

Ex-Chief Justice Denham to probe golfing outing
Former Chief Justice Susan Denham has been requested to consider certain questions arising out of the attendance of Mr Justice Seamus Woulfe at the Oireachtas Golf Society outing and dinner in Connemara, Co Galway last week.

The report’s conclusions and recommendations will then be given to the Chief Justice Frank Clarke.

Justice Denham has agreed to the requested review and will commence her work immediately.

Justice Denham has been asked to consider whether Mr Justice Woulfe should have accepted the invitation to dinner in a Clifden hotel, following the golf outing at Connemara Golf Club in Ballyconneely.

Situation
The former chief justice will also consider whether Mr Justice Woulfe should, in all the circumstances, have left the hotel in the light of the situation prevailing.

Furthermore, the former chief justice will examine whether Mr Justice Woulfe should have attended the golf event without attending the dinner.

In the context of those questions, Justice Denham has also been asked to consider whether there are any relevant codes of practice or guidelines and to make any recommendations in that regard which she considers appropriate.

A Courts Service statement said that this non-statutory approach has been necessitated because relevant sections of the Judicial Council Act 2019 have not yet been commenced.

Mr Justice Woulfe was appointed attorney general in June 2017 and was appointed to the Supreme Court on 24 July this year.

Charles Babbage

Psychiatric Patrick wrote: »

It was a jolly get together that was a slap in the face to the many people who have followed the lockdown rules.

Will the hotel or the organiser be prosecuted?

If these people state to the participants that the event is within the rules, should all the participants resign etc while the hotel gets off Scot free?
If I go to some restaurant and there are 60 there instead of 50, is that my fault or theirs?

First Up

mick087 wrote:

This chaos and future chaos can be avoided. Bring Demorachy to the EU citizens, make unelected, selected commissioners accountable to the Citizens of the EU in a democratic EU. Give us the people the Citizens of the EU the vote make them accountable to its citizens not its selected elite.

You have been banging this empty drum for some time, seemingly untroubled by any understanding of how either representative democracy or the multi- nation European Union work.

Please educate yourself and stop trotting out meaningless cliches and slogans.

Psychiatric Patrick

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

I wonder is there an actual 'code of conduct' for judges that puts this sort of thing out of bounds, as it were, or are they just expected to use their 'judgement'?

From what Martin said in that radio interview and from the fact there is an investigation, it would appear there is a code of conduct.

Maybe it is supposed to be just using good judgement but ultimately I think it amounts to the same.

Happydays2020

Psychiatric Patrick wrote: »

It was a jolly get together that was a slap in the face to the many people who have followed the lockdown rules.

It was also a jolly get together that his colleagues in the judiciary deem his attendance worthy of investigation.

I should have added that it was former Chief Justice Catherine McGuinness who said that. It was in the context of interactions between the judiciary and politicians which was the point that you had raised. But then again, what would she know about justice, due process and looking at the facts and nuances of a case before rushing to judgement.

Seanergy

One bad lie after another with Phil Hogan, I wouldn't trust his handicap.

RandomViewer

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

I wonder is there an actual 'code of conduct' for judges that puts this sort of thing out of bounds, as it were, or are they just expected to use their 'judgement'?

Judge is a vocal member of FG , I think that membership of any political party should exclude anyone from being a judge

Psychiatric Patrick

screamer wrote: »

I was thinking of the low bar it will set, as in lying and fudging is totally acceptable if he is kept on....

I see now that should have to me when I read your post.

Sorry.:o

mick087

seamus wrote: »

Nah, the British people bought that nonsense because they'd been subjected to four decades of anti-EU propaganda.

Nonsense

Because one don,t agree with you don,t not mean they was subjected to decades of anti-EU propaganda. In fact when i lived in the UK the people was very much pro EU.
There was 2 sides leave and remain neither was propaganda. and neither side was subjected to it.

Psychiatric Patrick

Gerry Hatrick wrote: »

Pat Kenny going to bat for Hogan on Newstalk

Clearly Kenny has not heard that clip of Hogan saying "if they knew wI was a commissioner..."

stockshares

Allison I Connor on Claire Byrne now saying Phil has to go. She said she was against this initially but that after hearing the Interview the Rubicon was crossed.

I don't think this is what Claire wanted.

Happydays2020

Charles Babbage wrote: »

Will the hotel or the organiser be prosecuted?

If these people state to the participants that the event is within the rules, should all the participants resign etc while the hotel gets off Scot free?
If I go to some restaurant and there are 60 there instead of 50, is that my fault or theirs?

Indeed, in the same way that it was the fault of the fans in Hillborough and the attendees at the stardust. Extreme example and not analogous but you are right that the establishments need to take some responsibility. Individuals also need to show some common sense - I left a hotel a few weeks back as I did not feel safe.

IAMAMORON

Happydays2020 wrote: »

Indeed, in the same way that it was the fault of the fans in Hillborough and the attendees at the stardust. Extreme example and not analogous but you are right that the establishments need to take some responsibility. Individuals also need to show some common sense - I left a hotel a few weeks back as I did not feel safe.

Of course you did, how good of you.

Happydays2020

RandomViewer wrote: »

Judge is a vocal member of FG , I think that membership of any political party should exclude anyone from being a judge

To be honest, that has always made me uneasy (this is a bit of a tradition linked to appointment of justices). Interestingly that was part of the motives for the reforms Shane Ross wanted to introduce.

At the same time, I think in 100 years we have been extremely well served by our judiciary - and they do have a strong public service ethos and take significant pay cuts to serve as justices (more so Court of Appeal and the Supreme Court).

RandomViewer

Charles Babbage wrote: »

Will the hotel or the organiser be prosecuted?

If these people state to the participants that the event is within the rules, should all the participants resign etc while the hotel gets off Scot free?
If I go to some restaurant and there are 60 there instead of 50, is that my fault or theirs?

The owners were at the do, they have no defence when the licence comes up for renewal, direct provision centre by Christmas

dublin99

What is the logic behind Hogan's claim that a negative Covid test meant he did not have to quarantine?

Look at all the countries where arrivals are ALL tested at the Airport, then released for 14 days quarantine with tracing App if test is negative, or straight to hospital if tested positive!

smelly sock

Sneaky Phil was having dinner and drinks in the KClub restaurant on the day he flew back to Ireland.

Hawthorn Tree

Hawthorn Tree wrote: »

The dinner was in honour of the late Mark Killilea who was a well known FF TD

And that’s the real kicker. I’m going to be blunt here....

The man died 2 years ago and anyone who wanted to pay their respects at his funeral could do so. Nobody would ever have imagined at that time what life in 2020 would be like.
But they did get to the funeral and yet they still thought a get together for a man that’s dead 2 years was a great idea in the middle of restrictions on families who were burying their loved ones.

There was no respect shown at all.

elperello

RandomViewer wrote: »

Judge is a vocal member of FG , I think that membership of any political party should exclude anyone from being a judge

We already have separation of powers.

Are you suggesting that anyone who has been involved in democratic politics should be disbarred from the judiciary?

Happydays2020

dublin99 wrote: »

What is the logic behind Hogan's claim that a negative Covid test meant he did not have to quarantine?

Look at all the countries where arrivals are ALL tested at the Airport, then released for 14 days quarantine with tracing App if test is negative, or straight to hospital if tested positive!

I think those regimes are more a risk management approach. And indeed would have a deterrence effect - people with symptoms certainly don’t want to be sitting in an accommodation centre for two weeks in a foreign country.

A fully fool proof system would be daily tests for up to 21 days.

gmisk

smelly sock wrote: »

Sneaky Phil was having dinner and drinks in the KClub restaurant on the day he flew back to Ireland.

I wonder was it in his report to Ursula...

RandomViewer

Happydays2020 wrote: »

Indeed, in the same way that it was the fault of the fans in Hillborough and the attendees at the stardust. Extreme example and not analogous but you are right that the establishments need to take some responsibility. Individuals also need to show some common sense - I left a hotel a few weeks back as I did not feel safe.

Walked out of local Aldi a few months ago for the same reason, they've tightened things up since but would still be uncomfortable with too many people in one place.

Psychiatric Patrick

Charles Babbage wrote: »

Will the hotel or the organiser be prosecuted?

If these people state to the participants that the event is within the rules, should all the participants resign etc while the hotel gets off Scot free?
If I go to some restaurant and there are 60 there instead of 50, is that my fault or theirs?

I have said several times that the clubs/hotels and their management need to be punished also.

The IHF also need to be penalised for telling the hotel management to cancel it when they were do dopey to know themselves.

stockshares

dublin99 wrote: »

What is the logic behind Hogan's claim that a negative Covid test meant he did not have to quarantine?

Look at all the countries where arrivals are ALL tested at the Airport, then released for 14 days quarantine with tracing App if test is negative, or straight to hospital if tested positive!

This morning there has been an effort by Verona Murphy to equate what the Taoiseach did with what Phil Hogan did .

A guest on Claire Byrne just refuted this saying you can't equate a tourist coming into the country to play golf(Phil) with the most essential worker in the Country(The Taoiseach).

I think it was an accurate observation by the guest(who's name I missed btw but maybe someone else heard it)

Hawthorn Tree

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

And that’s the real kicker. I’m going to be blunt here....

The man died 2 years ago and anyone who wanted to pay their respects at his funeral could do so. Nobody would ever have imagined at that time what life in 2020 would be like.
But they did get to the funeral and yet they still thought a get together for a man that’s dead 2 years was a great idea in the middle of restrictions on families who were burying their loved ones.

There was no respect shown at all.

To be fair I think they were also trying to introduce Mark's son to the great and the good of Ireland. He is a FF councillor who came 6th in the Galway East constituency in GE20. There have been calls for him to consider his position on Regional Health Forum West because of the Clifden Elite debacle.

RandomViewer

elperello wrote: »

We already have separation of powers.

Are you suggesting that anyone who has been involved in democratic politics should be disbarred from the judiciary?

Yes, separation of judiciary from politics , Woulfe has made decisions to suit the political party he belongs to rather than in the interests of everyone.

First Up

Strawberry Milkshake wrote:

The man died 2 years ago and anyone who wanted to pay their respects at his funeral could do so. Nobody would ever have imagined at that time what life in 2020 would be like. But they did get to the funeral and yet they still thought a get together for a man that’s dead 2 years was a great idea in the middle of restrictions on families who were burying their loved ones.

The event wasn't organised just to honour Mark Killalea. It is was happening anyway. It is customary for organisations to have an honoree at such bashes. It was just his turn.

Psychiatric Patrick

Happydays2020 wrote: »

I should have added that it was former Chief Justice Catherine McGuinness who said that. It was in the context of interactions between the judiciary and politicians which was the point that you had raised. But then again, what would she know about justice, due process and looking at the facts and nuances of a case before rushing to judgement.

I didn't rush to any judgment about any of this.

And the fact is that common decency and common sense should have told all those involved that this event would be a slap in the face to Irish people just like decency and sense told this to Enda Kenny

Psychiatric Patrick

RandomViewer wrote: »

Judge is a vocal member of FG , I think that membership of any political party should exclude anyone from being a judge

An actual member of FG or an FG voter?

Psychiatric Patrick

stockshares wrote: »

Allison I Connor on Claire Byrne now saying Phil has to go. She said she was against this initially but that after hearing the Interview the Rubicon was crossed.

I don't think this is what Claire wanted.

What does Byrne want?

Do you mean she was hoping for an argument?