Weekends Boxing 22/8 (Whyte v Povetkin, Taylor v Persoon, Alvarez v Smith Jr etc)

walshb

Deleted User wrote: »

There is no good way to lose a fight. But that’s about the best way possible.
.

I don’t think the KO victims would agree..

A KO loss is a tough tough way for a boxer to lose, to take and to accept..

Huge amount pride on being tough and durable and still standing type feel..

The KO loss to a boxer breeds a fragility and vulnerability..

Nothing better to a fighter than to be able to say, they was never knocked out!!!

A real machismo!!! Badge of honor..fighters’ chins and durability rank so so high!!

deisedevil

deisedevil wrote: »

Ya AJ said that after too. Should have been ruthless when he had him in trouble.

I'm just sickened as I had Whyte backed to get KO in rounds 1-6.

That’s what got AJ mauled by Ruiz though.
I think Whyte was right to take his time.
But again, at HW you are only ever 1 shot from the canvas.

walshb

walshb wrote: »

I don’t think the KO victims would agree..

A KO loss is a tough tough way for a boxer to lose, to take and to accept..

Huge amount pride on being tough and durable and still standing type feel..

The KO loss to a boxer breeds a fragility and vulnerability..

Nothing better to a fighter than to be able to say, they was never knocked out!!!

A real machismo!!! Badge of honor..fighters’ chins and durability rank so so high!!

Haha maybe you are right.
AJ against Ruiz and Wilder / Fury were worse loses for me though.

Both got beaten to a pulp in those fights.

Although not knocked out as badly as Whyte tonight.

walshb

Deleted User wrote: »

Haha maybe you are right.
AJ against Ruiz and Wilder / Fury were worse loses for me though.

Both got beaten to a pulp in those fights.

Although not knocked out as badly as Whyte tonight.

I suppose from a health point, it may be argued that a clean KO loss is better for fighters than a beating, pulverising...

Both very dangerous, though..

I guess it shows how inherently lethal the sport is...

I always think some forget this aspect...

It’s sole, or main aim is to inflict trauma to the head...madness when you think about it..

blueser

walshb wrote: »

Isn’t AJ such a nice dude!!!

According to someone on here, he's a "dick".
:rolleyes:

walshb

blueser wrote: »

According to someone on here, he's a "dick".
:rolleyes:

Who?

generalgerry

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1jBBe7Xcm-I

Edward is "devastated", methinks he is a bit happy because this helps to keep Whyte away from AJ. Says that Persoon said "you won" to Katie Taylor, so he thinks that puts the argument on tonight's fight to bed.

Oh and there is a rematch clause so we will have to run the Whyte vs Povetkin back again

walshb

generalgerry wrote: »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1jBBe7Xcm-I

Edward is "devastated", methinks he is a bit happy because this helps to keep Whyte away from AJ. Says that Persoon said "you won" to Katie Taylor, so he thinks that puts the argument on tonight's fight to bed.

Oh and there is a rematch clause so we will have to run the Whyte vs Povetkin back again

Whyte away from AJ?

Do people think he’s scared of AJ v Whyte?

Why???

Fear of losing? Could say that about anyone, really..

AJ has shown fragility and vulnerability, and even a past it and old Pulev presents risks. As much risk as Whyte IMO..

iebamm2580

walshb wrote: »

Who?

me, read some of the stuff he has said, whyte always talks about how aj is all an a ct, his dms with eddie chambers were revealing about his psyche.

squinn2912

A knockout is a traumatic way to end a sporting contest and there’s something about a heavyweight being iced like that. Abig powerful giant left in a heap. Whyte has a fair bit to do to come back from this.
It all depends on how he handles this mentally if he can cling to the positives from the fight or not.
It’s a real shame POV had those bans and fights cancelled say around the time he was meant to fight wilder.

blueser

walshb wrote: »

Who?

Sorry for the late reply; went to bed after posting last night. Here you go;

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=114392791&postcount=350

squinn2912

Watching it back here in round 3 AP landed a lot of body shots and as both fatigued he whyte became more open

walshb

iebamm2580 wrote: »

me, read some of the stuff he has said, whyte always talks about how aj is all an a ct, his dms with eddie chambers were revealing about his psyche.

I see..

My post last night about AJ was a wee bit facetious..

Many believe that AJ is all a controlled image. And that he is not as affable and as clean and as nice as he portrays..

nacho libre

walshb wrote: »

I don’t think the KO victims would agree..

A KO loss is a tough tough way for a boxer to lose, to take and to accept..

Huge amount pride on being tough and durable and still standing type feel..

The KO loss to a boxer breeds a fragility and vulnerability..

Nothing better to a fighter than to be able to say, they was never knocked out!!!

A real machismo!!! Badge of honor..fighters’ chins and durability rank so so high!!

Yes, particularly for someone like Whyte. I think he'll get over it by saying he was bossing the fight and got complacent. The reason he was not more aggressive when he knocked down Povetkin is because he was still wary of Povetkin's getting him on the counter. He found out the hard way that there is a big difference between fighting Del Boy and Lucas Browne than fighting Povetkin.

Morrison J

generalgerry wrote: »

I feel really bad for Dillian, they have f**ked him over every which way bar give him his shot at the title. He's taken every single risky fight they have thrown at him and eventually one of them was going to go bad.

I don't have any sympathy for him tbh. He bottled fights with Joshua, Pulev and Ortiz (twice) in order to keep his cushy position of fighting easier fights for good money on PPV. Has bitched and moaned about how poorly he was treated yet he was in one of the most privileged positions imaginable. Never a PPV fighter. Finally takes a proper risk last night and comes up short.

walshb

What are people’s thoughts on Katie?

I really think she should be considering wrapping up soon..

I know she is undefeated, but I just cannot see any real great women that she has beaten..Persoon is rough and tough, but predictable and crude..

It’s such a tough sport, and two areas for me see Katie suffering. Her lack of any type power, and her physical weakness..Her engine also has a question mark.

Maybe 1-2 more and get out, Katie. Enjoy your health and life..

I think she probably will retire within the next 9-12 months..

Mantis Toboggan

Yeah I thought she was lucky enough to get the decision. Persoon is just a machine and was walking through her. Must be something in the food in Belgium because she was relentless.

Showed good boxing skills and was very avasive. Good movement. But she lacks power, hasn't really adjusted to the pro game. Doesn't really have a jab is is very predictable. Uppercut was the shot all night but don't think she even tried it.

Might be time to go out on top. She's surely made enough money at this stage. Certainly if I was her I'd be looking to finish up in the next 12 months.

Johner

I had Katie winning 6-4 but could have went either way. She looked good for a few rounds but then had nothing left to deter Persoon or keep her off. Persoon was very wild though and missed with a lot. Katie’s stamina seems to go quite early and she loses any pop she had in her punches quite early. I don’t know enough about Serrano to predict if she will lose that and I’m not sure if there is anyone out there to beat Katie but I’m not sure there’s a whole lot left in the tank.

Joe_ Public

Was a bit concerned R8 where Persoon came on very strong but Taylor weathered that storm and, if anything, finished out thr stronger of the pair for me. Certainly not weaker for me and the Belgian is like the original Duracell bunny as regards stamina from what I've seen.

Whatever she decides would be fine by me, there's not much left she absolutely needs to do, but 34 is still young enough to bow out and see no reason why there wouldn't be potentially 2-3 good years left yet. Depends on results going forward.

She could have a nice fight next against the Spanish boxer who has the wba title and then Serrano, which I'm sure she still really wants. We know she's not materially minded but its good money and think what plans she could make with it when she does step away.

Remember all those projections about their being no money in womens boxing. There's a few of them doing alright as it turned out!

squinn2912

Fair points on Katie a flailer like that she shouldn’t need to go right to the bottom of the well to defeat.

She has a lot of miles on the clock and has her legacy cemented. I expected her to find that work easier.

Take on the mega fight and maybe a procession homecoming which would have been nice to have in Croker... then tip on and thank you for the memories

SHOVELLER

walshb wrote: »

What are people’s thoughts on Katie?

I really think she should be considering wrapping up soon..

I know she is undefeated, but I just cannot see any real great women that she has beaten..Persoon is rough and tough, but predictable and crude..

It’s such a tough sport, and two areas for me see Katie suffering. Her lack of any type power, and her physical weakness..Her engine also has a question mark.

Maybe 1-2 more and get out, Katie. Enjoy your health and life..

I think she probably will retire within the next 9-12 months..

I dont know. She is obsessed with boxing to a degree that is absent anywhere else. Yes her legacy is cemented for sure and she has made the money but I feel she will carry on for more than a year. She bought a home in Connecticut and that is not something one would do if there were thoughts of going home and she is definitely a homebird.

Back to last night and I genuinely fail to understand anyone who thought that fight was close. While Persoon is game, and that is being kind, Katie showed who is clearly the better boxer. All about levels here and to be fair Persoon knew she was beaten. The windmill approach got her nowhere and the ref certainly didnt help by ignoring the constant holding. Simply put Katie landed the majority of the clean shots and the judges responded accordingly.

Josh Taylor, a professional boxer, had Katie losing. This blows my mind. Are they that influenced by sky? I mercifully had a Russian stream so didnt have to listen to ill informed comments.

Delighted with the Povetkin win as Whyte is a complete BS artist. Coming to the ring in a stab vest with a green wolf on the back spoke volumes. Yes two juicers or ex juicers going at it but that KO is a highlight reel and also saved us all from what could have been a boring slugfest!

Hearn gets a lot of stick but credit where credit is due. It was good to see the fights again even in that setting.

funkey_monkey

I said last night that I thought she let DP back in again on the mid rounds up to about 9 when she bit down again.
Got sucked back into a war made it again closer than it should have been.

These have been the only two fights where she has been really tested - most of her other fights would not have not put too many miles on the clock. There is less chance of a knockout with 2 minute rounds so she done what she had to do, but her recklessness in getting sucked into a war made it look like a closer fight. As the caliber of opponent increases the discipline needs to get better.

The early rounds where she jabbed, some quick 1-2's and then got out of there showed the gulf in boxing class between them. DP was always going to have a golden period though, but it took Katie to rd 9 to assert dominance again.

Some people like the slugger type, but the better boxer won. If DP had even a modicum of skill beyond the basics she would have wiped the floor but a good engine is not sufficient - likewise for KT a good skillset is not sufficient without a good engine.
It was a clash of styles and whilst probably entertaining for a neutral, it was not the type of fight I'd like to see KT in again.


Are the stats in yet for this fight?

walshb

Just finished watching it again. More studious this time, as not live and no distractions..

I scored it 97-94...Taylor.

Rd 1 Taylor
Rd 2 Taylor
Rd 3 Persoon. Very close
Rd 4 Taylor. Close
Rd 5 draw
Rd 6 Persoon
Rd 7 Taylor. Close
Rd 8 Persoon
Rd 9 Taylor
Rd 10 Taylor. Very close..

Several close rds. No cards wrong here.

Overall Katie landed cleaner and better shots..

Persoon was wild, rugged, and missing so much..

Sorry, anyone scoring that for Persoon must have been putting most of their score into forward aggression...

normanoffside

walshb wrote: »

Just finished watching it again. More studious this time, as not live and no distractions..

I scored it 97-94...Taylor.

Rd 1 Taylor
Rd 2 Taylor
Rd 3 Persoon. Very close
Rd 4 Taylor. Close
Rd 5 draw
Rd 6 Persoon
Rd 7 Taylor. Close
Rd 8 Persoon
Rd 9 Taylor
Rd 10 Taylor. Very close..

Several close rds. No cards wrong here.

Overall Katie landed cleaner and better shots..

Persoon was wild, rugged, and missing so much..

Sorry, anyone scoring that for Persoon must have been putting most of their score into forward aggression...

Yep, and I don't have an issue with the 98-93 card either, 7 rounds to 2 with 1 draw seems a reasonable score.
I think I scored it the same as you except I gave Taylor the 5th too, I had it 97-93

walshb

normanoffside wrote: »

Yep, and I don't have an issue with the 98-93 card either, 7 rounds to 2 with 1 draw seems a reasonable score.
I think I scored it the same as you except I gave Taylor the 5th too, I had it 97-93

I mixed rds 8 and 9...When initially scoring last night.

I like to score the fight, as well as give an overall view..

Overall Katie a clearer winner than the individual rounds suggest..

The fight reminded me of Mayweather v Maidana 1...

Katie really suffered and struggled to contain and deal with and discouragethe non-stop awkward aggression from Persoon..

Mayweather was the same in fight 1 vs. Maidana..

Man with broke phone

If she beats serrano she can bash tomato cans for the next 3 years making a fortune, if she wants.

Morrison J

Rewatched it there. Have had it the same both times 96-94 Taylor. Gave her rounds 1, 2, 5, 7, 9 & 10. Plenty of close rounds though and could definitely see arguements either way.

As always she boxed far better off the back foot. Felt she really lost her way in a few of the mid rounds standing in the pocket. Once she took a step back and gave herself room to box she was far better. Really don't rate her trainer at all tbh. Why he was telling her that she was doing good work inside boggles the mind. Literally the only way she could lose that fight was staying inside.

walshb

There were several inside exchanges where Katie was doing very well..

She just had to fight and to stand her ground.. had to. And Macklin was spot on the times he said this..

Really, she boxed everywhere. Front, back, side, inside...and had to..it was that type of a non stop attacking maul..

Very awkward and sloppy looking fight for large parts, but they worked...I enjoyed the whole scrap!!!

ebbsy

walshb wrote: »

This is not a shock..

Whyte is not great..

AP is hardy, and can punch..

AJ blasted Whyte a few years ago, and plodder Del Boy almost beat him..

True

Aj or Fury were never going to fight him anyway

Not enough cash in it for them.

Pighead

Morrison J wrote: »

I don't have any sympathy for him tbh. He bottled fights with Joshua, Pulev and Ortiz (twice) in order to keep his cushy position of fighting easier fights for good money on PPV. Has bitched and moaned about how poorly he was treated yet he was in one of the most privileged positions imaginable. Never a PPV fighter. Finally takes a proper risk last night and comes up short.

I see what you're saying but think you're being a bit harsh. I guarantee had Whyte won the other night yourself and most people in here wouldn't have given him a whole lot of credit. The Povetkin is completely washed up narrative would have been wheeled out.