Covid 19 Part XXII-30,360 in ROI(1,781 deaths) 8,035 in NI (568 deaths)(10/09)Read OP

mandrake04

speckle wrote: »

My apologies, I think I said Yale on my last post on this, I meant Harvard and Michael Mina epidemiologist and e25Bio at Cambridge, their saliva tests hence some crossed wires here.
They were what the original links to the I posted referred to, however he does mention the other type in the video along with later thepooled testing another potential idea.



https://www.theatlantic.com/health/archive/2020/08/how-to-test-every-american-for-covid-19-every-day/615217/


''Such tests exist—and have existed since April—and they are made by e25 Bio, a 12-person company in Cambridge. An e25 test is a paper strip, a few inches long and less than an inch wide. It needs only some spit, a saline solution, and a small cup—and it can deliver a result in 15 minutes. Like a pregnancy test, the strip has a faint line across its lower third. If you expose the strip to a sample and it fills in with color, then the test is positive. It does not require a machine, a reagent, or a doctor to work.


Its unusual quality is that it does not look for the same antigen as other tests. Instead of identifying nucleocapsid, the e25 test is keyed to something on the outside of the virus. It reacts to the presence of the coronavirus’s distinctive spike protein, the structure on the virus’s “skin” that allows it to hook onto and enter human cells. “I think we’re the only company in North America that has developed a spike antigen test,” Bobby Brooke Herrera, e25’s co-founder and chief executive, told us.


This has several advantages. It means, first, that the e25 test does not have to rupture the virus, which is why it doesn’t need reagents. And it means, second, that the e25 test is actually looking for something more relevant than the virus’s genetic material. The spike protein is the coronavirus’s most important structure—it plays a large part in determining the virus’s infectiousness, and it’s what both antibodies and many vaccine prototypes target—and its presence is a good proxy for the health of the virus generally. “We’ve developed our test to detect live viruses, or, in other words, spike protein,” Herrera said.


Working with two manufacturers, e25 thinks that it could make 4 million tests a month as soon as it receives FDA approval. Within six weeks of approval, it could make 20 million to 40 million tests a month. In short, e25 could single-handedly add as many as 1.2 million tests a day to the national total.''


thanks for the links re the kids and saliva tests yes those do still need processing but at least they are less traumatic for kids (some adults too) and less exposure for healthcare professionals. I was wondering how the the government had got a hold of the tests I was refering too, now it all makes sense.

Well we will see LOL

Pool testing not new, Germany has auto poolers on the front end of their Analysers and are able to do 200,000- 400,000 tests per day, most countries do it by hand as it saves reagents.

s1ippy

s1ippy wrote: »

In any other workplace fever and other symptoms such as coughing require self isolation and a test.

Same in schools. If the child has a fever or a cough they have to stay at home.

alexonhisown

The 2 grandkids, 2.5 and 3.5 had to have a test last friday, started off as a runny nose in creche on wed, but overnight both developed coughs, fever, sore throats and one had breathing difficulty. Luckily tests were negative, but very traumatic experience for them. There must be a very nasty cold/flu going around atm.

froog

s1ippy wrote: »

In any other workplace fever and other symptoms such as coughing require self isolation and a test.

fever and coughs are common covid symptoms. sniffles and sneezes are not.

s1ippy

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

How's full pay at home going?

Good I guess.

I'm not a teacher (got a new job) but I am working from home, and have been for the whole pandemic. Working very long hours actually but I don't mind because me and my family are safe.

s1ippy

froog wrote: »

fever and coughs are common covid symptoms. sniffles and sneezes are not.

I'll go again, because you obviously didn't read my post or watch the presser today.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/coronavirus-ireland-glynn-sounds-note-of-caution-about-cases-increasing-in-dublin-1.4337667

She said parents should not worry about children who “have a runny nose for every single day of winter” but should “start to pay attention” when children have a high temperature, a cough or other respiratory symptoms and should keep them home for 48 hours until symptoms settle.

Jinglejangle69

s1ippy wrote: »

I'm not a teacher (got a new job) but I am working from home, and have been for the whole pandemic. Working very long hours actually but I don't mind because me and my family are safe.

Lucky you.

Most of us have to work in the real world to keep things going.

Suppose your family is more important than the rest of us.

mandrake04

mandrake04 wrote: »

What makes you think I don't like saliva tests, I don't really care to be honest i'm just telling you the facts.



You did





They are being developed because the USA does not have enough instrumentation to do the number of tests required its that simple, necessity is the mother of invention and they will be using it for themselves first and foremost in a lab.

Not going to argue back and forth with you anymore.

Aggressive poster, who seems to see only their viewpoint as valid.

Reply back if you want. I won't be replying.

giveitholly

s1ippy wrote: »

I'll go again, because you obviously didn't read my post or watch the presser today.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/coronavirus-ireland-glynn-sounds-note-of-caution-about-cases-increasing-in-dublin-1.4337667

Yeah I don't see what the problem is with what you have quoted

speckle

mandrake04 wrote: »

Well we will see LOL

Pool testing not new, Germany has auto poolers on the front end of their Analysers and are able to do 200,000- 400,000 tests per day, most countries do it by hand as it saves reagents.

Yes often used for HIV, around since ww2. I take it we do not have it here... is it a lack of reagent, I thought we had managed to source our short fall via an Irish company? Do I presume then its equipment costs/lack of investment over the years? Labs being treated like cinderella's?


And genuiely, why LOL again is it costs or something political or slow government red tape etc? Or it is just not a good idea?

ceadaoin.

mandrake04 wrote: »

What makes you think I don't like saliva tests, I don't really care to be honest i'm just telling you the facts.



You did





They are being developed because the USA does not have enough instrumentation to do the number of tests required its that simple, necessity is the mother of invention and they will be using it for themselves first and foremost in a lab.

They were developed because the NBA paid for a quicker, less invasive test to test their players. They discovered it works and now they will be used for the general population

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/29667299/fda-allowing-saliva-based-test-funded-nba

s1ippy

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Lucky you.

Most of us have to work in the real world to keep things going.

Suppose your family is more important than the rest of us.

Replied via pm so as not to derail thread any further responding to personal attacks.

froog wrote: »

fever and coughs are common covid symptoms. sniffles and sneezes are not.

Yep, I agree. Tell Mary Favier

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Same in schools. If the child has a fever or a cough they have to stay at home.

giveitholly wrote: »

Yeah I don't see what the problem is with what you have quoted

https://www2.hse.ie/conditions/coronavirus/symptoms.html

If you have any common symptoms of coronavirus (COVID-19), you should self-isolate and phone your GP straight away to get a coronavirus test.

Common symptoms of coronavirus include:

a fever (high temperature - 38 degrees Celsius or above)
a cough - this can be any kind of cough, not just dry
shortness of breath or breathing difficulties
loss or change to your sense of smell or taste – this means you've noticed you cannot smell or taste anything, or things smell or taste different to normal

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/coronavirus-ireland-glynn-sounds-note-of-caution-about-cases-increasing-in-dublin-1.4337667

Dr Mary Favier, president of the Irish College of General Practitioners, acknowledged the anxiety amongst parents with schools reopening this week.

She said parents should not worry about children who “have a runny nose for every single day of winter” but should “start to pay attention” when children have a high temperature, a cough or other respiratory symptoms and should keep them home for 48 hours until symptoms settle.

Doublethink.

Queried

alexonhisown wrote: »

The 2 grandkids, 2.5 and 3.5 had to have a test last friday, started off as a runny nose in creche on wed, but overnight both developed coughs, fever, sore throats and one had breathing difficulty. Luckily tests were negative, but very traumatic experience for them. There must be a very nasty cold/flu going around atm.

So glad to hear your grandchildren tested negative, must have been a stressful few days, especially with the breathing difficulty.

Gerry Hatrick

Jinglejangle69 wrote: »

Lucky you.

Most of us have to work in the real world to keep things going.

Suppose your family is more important than the rest of us.

Of course people's own families are more important than others. What a ridiculous comment to make.

giveitholly

s1ippy wrote: »

https://www2.hse.ie/conditions/coronavirus/symptoms.html



https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/coronavirus-ireland-glynn-sounds-note-of-caution-about-cases-increasing-in-dublin-1.4337667



Doublethink.

Are you even reading what you are quoting? Sniffles and runny nose are not symptoms of covid,if a child has a cough or high temperature then they need to be kept at home. What is wrong with that advice?

s1ippy

giveitholly wrote: »

Are you even reading what you are quoting? Sniffles and runny nose are not symptoms of covid,if a child has a cough or high temperature then they need to be kept at home. What is wrong with that advice?

Look at the difference in recommendations.

HSE says if you have symptoms, self isolate and get a test. When it you test negative you may return after 14 days.

https://www2.hse.ie/conditions/coronavirus/managing-coronavirus-at-home/self-isolation.html

Last updated: 07 August 2020 at 12.50pm

Self-isolation means staying indoors and completely avoiding contact with other people. This includes other people in your household, as much as possible.

You will need to self-isolate:

if you have symptoms of coronavirus
while you wait for a test appointment and your test results, if you have symptoms of coronavirus.

If you are being tested as a close contact of a confirmed case of coronavirus and you don’t have any symptoms, you should restrict your movements instead

if you have had a positive test result for coronavirus:
Most people with coronavirus will only have mild symptoms and will get well within weeks. Even if you have mild symptoms or no symptoms, you can still spread the virus to others. If your symptoms get worse, get medical help.

Read advice from GOV.ie on travel into Ireland from a country not on the 'COVID-19 green list' and when you need to restrict your movements.

How to self-isolate
Stay indoors and avoid contact with other people. Behave as if you have the virus if you have symptoms. If you have been diagnosed with coronavirus or have symptoms, the people you live with will need to restrict their movements.

Do
Stay at home, in a room with a window you can open.

Keep away from others in your home as much as you can. Use a separate toilet if possible.

Check your symptoms - call a doctor if they get worse. Phone your doctor if you need to - do not visit them.

Cover your coughs and sneezes using a tissue - clean your hands properly afterwards.

Wash your hands properly and often.

Use your own towel - do not share a towel with others.

Clean your room every day with a household cleaner or disinfectant.

Don't
Do not go outside unless you have your own outdoor space where you can get some fresh air.

Do not go to work, school, religious services or public areas.

Do not share your things. For example, food, dishes, drinking glasses or other household items.

Do not use public transport or taxis.

Do not invite visitors to your home.

Keep away from older people, anyone with long-term medical conditions and pregnant women.

It's OK for friends, family or delivery drivers to drop off food or supplies. Make sure you're not in the same room as them when they do.

Watch out for signs that you are getting worse
You may be self-isolating because you have symptoms of coronavirus. If you are, phone your GP if you start to feel very unwell. Particularly if your breathing changes or becomes difficult, or your cough gets worse.

If you are very short of breath and cannot reach someone, call the emergency services on 112 or 999.

If you develop a fever or any respiratory symptoms phone your GP or HSELive on 1850 24 1850.

When you can stop self-isolating
Only stop self-isolation when both of these apply to you:

you have had no fever for 5 days
it has been 14 days since you first developed symptoms
Follow this advice to protect yourself and others from coronavirus.

If you live with other people and you are self-isolating
Keep away from other people in your home as much as you can.

Stay in a separate room with a window you can open.

If you have to go into a room with other people in it, try to keep a distance of 2 metres. If that is not possible, keep a distance of at least 1 metre from other people and wear a medical face mask.
Note: not possible in schools

If you can, use a toilet and bathroom that no one else in the house uses. If you have to share a bathroom with others, use the bathroom last and then clean it thoroughly.

Do not share any items you’ve used with other people.

...

Face masks
You may have to be in a room with someone who has coronavirus. If you do, the person with coronavirus should wear a face mask. They should put it on and take it off in the room in which they are self-isolating.

You should also wear a face covering or face mask while in the same room as someone with coronavirus.

Note: teachers are being discouraged from doing this

And for the third time

Dr Mary Favier, president of the Irish College of General Practitioners, acknowledged the anxiety amongst parents with schools reopening this week.

She said parents should not worry about children who “have a runny nose for every single day of winter” but should “start to pay attention” when children have a high temperature, a cough or other respiratory symptoms and should keep them home for 48 hours until symptoms settle.

They are recommending no test and wait 48 hours for children presenting with actual symptoms, not just sniffles and sneezes, but fever and cough.

This is in contravention to the public health advice given to all other groups.

fritzelly

s1ippy wrote: »

Look at the difference in recommendations.

HSE says if you have symptoms, self isolate and get a test. When it you test negative you may return after 14 days.

https://www2.hse.ie/conditions/coronavirus/managing-coronavirus-at-home/self-isolation.html



And for the third time



They are recommending no test and wait 48 hours for children presenting with actual symptoms, not just sniffles and sneezes, but fever and cough.

This is in contravention to the public health advice given to all other groups.

My scrolling finger thanks you for the RSI

s1ippy

fritzelly wrote: »

My scrolling finger thanks you for the RSI

It's for posterity in case they change the guidelines.

Ronan Glynn directly contradicted advice the WHO gave (after a question from Zara "Renaissance" King today who has, to my mind, redeemed herself since her terrible lines of questioning before) by saying they never said children over five should wear masks.

https://www.who.int/news-room/q-a-detail/q-a-children-and-masks-related-to-covid-19

I couldn't help but feel like he was very shaken and downtrodden today, almost like somebody who is having to knowingly give bad information to protect some group or other.

speckle

s1ippy wrote: »

They are recommending no test and wait 48 hours for children presenting with actual symptoms, not just sniffles and sneezes, but fever and cough.

This is in contravention to the public health advice given to all other groups.

In children stuffy nose and runny nose is a symptom, aprox 25%


https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/69/wr/mm6932e3.htm
see stats at end for break down



https://www.hopkinsmedicine.org/health/conditions-and-diseases/coronavirus/coronavirus-in-babies-and-children


I think our government is doing a cut and past job from the NHS and UK public health , and it would not be the first time regarding this pandemic they did it at the beginning also regarding adults.

fritzelly

s1ippy wrote: »

It's for posterity in case they change the guidelines.

Ronan Glynn directly contradicted advice the WHO gave (after a question from Zara "Renaissance" King today who has, to my mind, redeemed herself since her terrible lines of questioning before) by saying they never said children over five should wear masks.

https://www.who.int/news-room/q-a-detail/q-a-children-and-masks-related-to-covid-19

I couldn't help but feel like he was very shaken and downtrodden today, almost like somebody who is having to knowingly give bad information to protect some group or other.

The advice is all well and good but practice is another story
Making young kids wear a mask for 6-7 hours a day (even with small breaks) will be tough

JP Liz V1

They all need to be on the same page, same clear advice, the mixed messages is frustrating

fritzelly

JP Liz V1 wrote: »

They all need to be on the same page, same clear advice, the mixed messages is frustrating

Who - the WHO and regional health authorities?
Most countries have been ignoring the WHO for many months with good reasoning

speckle

s1ippy wrote: »

It's for posterity in case they change the guidelines.


I couldn't help but feel like he was very shaken and downtrodden today, almost like somebody who is having to knowingly give bad information to protect some group or other.

For posterity also download this from ECDC on the same day, it aslo mention stuffy/running noses etc and kids


https://www.ecdc.europa.eu/sites/default/files/documents/COVID-19-schools-transmission-August%202020.pdf

mandrake04

Deleted User wrote: »

Not going to argue back and forth with you anymore.

Aggressive poster, who seems to see only their viewpoint as valid.

Reply back if you want. I won't be replying.

Cant see where I was aggressive, you said

Great to hear DeGascun is looking into saliva tests. Common sense prevailing. The dogs on the street know this a no brainer. The public is demanding mass testing without the need for gold standard testing and all the lab work that goes with it.

I just pointed out that DeGascun is considering saliva tests but they will still be going to the lab and tested on the same instruments as the swabs.

You just looking butt hurt now, and thats my problem how?

JP Liz V1

fritzelly wrote: »

Who - the WHO and regional health authorities?
Most countries have been ignoring the WHO for many months with good reasoning

All, our Government, Depts of Health and Education, Dr. Glynn, WHO, HSE etc.,

fritzelly

JP Liz V1 wrote: »

All, our Government, Depts of Health and Education, Dr. Glynn, WHO, HSE etc.,

Main problem there is the government
Seems pretty clear that NPHET are not on good terms with the government

JP Liz V1

fritzelly wrote: »

Main problem there is the government
Seems pretty clear that NPHET are not on good terms with the government

Are NPHET asking for another full national lockdown?

KrustyUCC

JP Liz V1 wrote: »

Are NPHET asking for another full national lockdown?

It's certainly been heavily implied that NPHET have that view

Oranage2

Crazy to think we're still in phase 3 with even more restrictions. 3 weeks ago we had about 10 cases a day, we're now well over 100 cases. I love how people have goldfish memories, even Covid's mild symptoms can be dangerous with many people experiencing difficulties breathing as if they can't get oxygen into th their lungs no matter how hard they try. Many healthy health workers have died from this and it has killed 800,000 people globally. Opening the schools right now is a mistake in my opinion.

This isn't just a 'bad cold', you're not smarter than the many world leaders and experts who have recommended a lockdown. We're not an extremely sparsely populated country like Sweden (24 people /km²) that spend over 40 billion on their healthcare system a year twice what Ireland spends.

*Ireland (70 people/km²)

s1ippy

The Dublin situation appears to be escalating a lot in the previous days, coinciding with, and no offence Dublin people, but coinciding with them going back to the big smoke from their holidays around the country.

People in Kildare must be raging. If it was Cork they were locking down I can't imagine the same compliance.