The wondrous adventures of Sinn Fein (part 2)

Bishop of hope

Bishop of hope wrote: »

Maybe!

If they did or do I'm sure it would raise questions.
Like if FG and FF for instance registered in NI surely they could accept donations there and funnel them south too.
Maybe that should be looked at?

FFG are registered in the north already afaik

They deffo have some presence in the colleges?


Nothing to stop em doing this now,afaik its suspected FF funnel money (deffo resources)to sdlp to help eastwood get elected

(hence the unease at senior FF members around the FG video dissing shinners around this issue)

Loafing Oaf

Mary Lou has had the mother of all makeovers:P



https://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/dublin-girl-11-dresses-up-22938069

Bishop of hope

Not wanting to go down the road of Leo, is NI regarded as foreign when it comes to political parties?
We have SF claiming to be an all Ireland party, but for donation purposes, two separate entities.
If that's so, even if SF NI get massive donations as per the rule up there then surely SF Republic must be subject to our donation rules down here.
And even if its SF NI donating the money south then surely our rules must apply to SF Republic?

SIPO must surely have a role in overseeing that.
Our rules are,

"There is a ban on foreign donations. The legal maximum for anonymous donations is set at €100, rather low when compared to other countries. The annual maximum for all donors is €6,350 per party and €2,540 per parliamentary candidate".
From Wikipedia.

FrancieBrady

Bishop of hope wrote: »

Not wanting to go down the road of Leo, is NI regarded as foreign when it comes to political parties?
We have SF claiming to be an all Ireland party, but for donation purposes, two separate entities.
If that's so, even if SF NI get massive donations as per the rule up there then surely SF Republic must be subject to our donation rules down here.
And even if its SF NI donating the money south then surely our rules must apply to SF Republic?

SIPO must surely have a role in overseeing that.
Our rules are,

"There is a ban on foreign donations. The legal maximum for anonymous donations is set at €100, rather low when compared to other countries. The annual maximum for all donors is €6,350 per party and €2,540 per parliamentary candidate".
From Wikipedia.

Current events seem to suggest you get privilege and inside info without even having to make a donation.

We are a partitioned island and that makes things complicated and impossible to police. As said above there are rumours FF pumped money Eastwood's way.

Bishop of hope

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Current events seem to suggest you get privilege and inside info without even having to make a donation.

We are a partitioned island and that makes things complicated and impossible to police. As said above there are rumours FF pumped money Eastwood's way.

But is that illegal or wrong going on NI rules?

Truthvader

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Current events seem to suggest you get privilege and inside info without even having to make a donation.

We are a partitioned island and that makes things complicated and impossible to police. As said above there are rumours FF pumped money Eastwood's way.

"Rumours"? What happened to Francie's obsession with "proof" and "evidence"

FrancieBrady

Truthvader wrote: »

"Rumours"? What happened to Francie's obsession with "proof" and "evidence"

Difference between me and you is I stated clearly that it is a 'rumour'.

FrancieBrady

Bishop of hope wrote: »

But is that illegal or wrong going on NI rules?

No idea. Aa I said, it doesn't concern me greatly.
Money flows south, money flows north, part of the reality of partition.

Bishop of hope

FrancieBrady wrote: »

No idea. Aa I said, it doesn't concern me greatly.
Money flows south, money flows north, part of the reality of partition.

It doesn't concern you greatly?
Of course it doesn't but everything everyone else does.
As I said before, you're a gas man.

FrancieBrady

Bishop of hope wrote: »

It doesn't concern you greatly?
Of course it doesn't but everything everyone else does.
As I said before, you're a gas man.

Are you only concerned about one party here Bish?

You kinda gave it away in the above post.

It doesn't greatly concern me if FG FF or SF etc do it.

How do you police it properly? Would you agree with another poster that 'a certain print company in Donegal should have their accounts looked at?'

Bishop of hope

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Are you only concerned about one party here Bish?

You kinda gave it away in the above post.

It doesn't greatly concern me if FG FF or SF etc do it.

How do you police it properly? Would you agree with another poster that 'a certain print company in Donegal should have their accounts looked at?'

Don't know anything about a print company in Donegal.
Why you change the subject?

FrancieBrady

Bishop of hope wrote: »

Don't know anything about a print company in Donegal.
Why you change the subject?

I'm not changing the subject. We are talking about rumours of rule breaking.

Bishop of hope

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I'm not changing the subject. We are talking about rumours of rule breaking.

Were we, grand.

FrancieBrady

Bishop of hope wrote: »

Were we, grand.

Well you accused me of only being concerned about what everyone else does.

You want a discussion of the rules but it only seems to be rules governng what SF does or doesn't do.

The rules apply to all parties. There is as another poster said, a rumour that FF pumped cash northwards to an SDLP candidate.

I don't actually have any great issue about that either.

Bishop of hope

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Well you accused me of only being concerned about what everyone else does.

You want a discussion of the rules but it only seems to be rules governng what SF does or doesn't do.

The rules apply to all parties. There is as another poster said, a rumour that FF pumped cash northwards to an SDLP candidate.

I don't actually have any great issue about that either.

I was excepting your explanation of what happened with the donation and how it was handled.
I thought as you knew so much about it that you might be aware of the ramifications if some of the money were drifted to SF Republic.
You deflected it yourself to a chat about all parties.
But you don't know anymore than I do on that it seems.
Fair play for trying to divert anyway.

FrancieBrady

Bishop of hope wrote: »

I was excepting your explanation of what happened with the donation and how it was handled.
I thought as you knew so much about it that you might be aware of the ramifications if some of the money were drifted to SF Republic.
You deflected it yourself to a chat about all parties.
But you don't know anymore than I do on that it seems.
Fair play for trying to divert anyway.

Are the rules not designed for everybody?

Or are they only to catch out SF?

I.E. Why wouldn't I talk about the generality of these rules?

Bishop of hope

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Are the rules not designed for everybody?

Or are they only to catch out SF?

I.E. Why wouldn't I talk about the generality of these rules?

Thréad maybe?
But you're right of course the rules do apply to all.
So in essence essentially we haven't SF the all Ireland party, we have two SFs.
SF NI and SF Republic.

FrancieBrady

Bishop of hope wrote: »

Thréad maybe?
But you're right of course the rules do apply to all.
So in essence essentially we haven't SF the all Ireland party, we have two SFs.
SF NI and SF Republic.

I view it the same way SIPO do.

There is nothing illegal about a party that is, for organisational purposes, a single entity, having statutory obligations in more than one jurisdiction.

Higgins5473

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

Not really, dude.

Where have you gone, dude, please come back, your overlord has a lot of questions to answer for and you’ve disappeared. Please come back xoxoxo

a very cool kid

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I view it the same way SIPO do.

There is nothing illegal about a party that is, for organisational purposes, a single entity, having statutory obligations in more than one jurisdiction.

So Sinn Fein don't spend any funds raised through the NI entity in Ireland? Ireland has very strict maximum limits...

If this is the case then they are fine.

FrancieBrady

a very cool kid wrote: »

So Sinn Fein don't spend any funds raised through the NI entity in Ireland? Ireland has very strict maximum limits...

If this is the case then they are fine.

Let's clear up this first:

Can you link to anything that says 'SIPO are already investigating Sinn Fein'?

Bishop of hope

I joked the other day about the SF draw being cancelled with a link to tickets on the SF bookshop website.
Joking as there was 30000 euros or pounds sterling advertised prizes.
Then today this happens, any ó you know what happened? :D

https://www.sinnfeinbookshop.com/sinn-fein-national-draw-ticket-2020/

FrancieBrady

Bishop of hope wrote: »

I joked the other day about the SF draw being cancelled with a link to tickets on the SF bookshop website.
Joking as there was 30000 euros or pounds sterling advertised prizes.
Then today this happens, any ó you know what happened? :D

https://www.sinnfeinbookshop.com/sinn-fein-national-draw-ticket-2020/

Had you bought a ticket Bish or do you be just randomly perusing the SF website at 8am in the morning?

I'm sure my local SF councillor posted a list of winners on FB recently. I'll check it out.

Bishop of hope

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Had you bought a ticket Bish or do you be just randomly perusing the SF website at 8am in the morning?

I'm sure my local SF councillor posted a list of winners on FB recently. I'll check it out.

Just having a laugh Francie.

blanch152

FrancieBrady wrote: »

No idea. Aa I said, it doesn't concern me greatly.
Money flows south, money flows north, part of the reality of partition.

If money flowing north is legal, but money flowing south is illegal, does that make a difference in your opinion?

Or is respect for the law an ephemeral thing?

blanch152

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Link to claim that 'SIPO are already investigating Sinn Fein'?

SIPO wrote to SF last year seeking clarification and got it, and as far as I am aware have no issues. From their annual report:

Are you suggesting that the reference in their annual report is to the allegations against Sinn Fein?

If so, was there a formal report, and if so, where is it? Do you believe it should be published in full?

FrancieBrady

blanch152 wrote: »

If money flowing north is legal, but money flowing south is illegal, does that make a difference in your opinion?

Or is respect for the law an ephemeral thing?

My comments were about what I think the law 'should be'.

blanch152

FrancieBrady wrote: »

My comments were about what I think the law 'should be'.

So you believe that political parties should be free to raise as much money as they want in as many ways that they want, and accept donations from other jurisdictions?

Just like the DUP did taking the foreign money to campaign for Brexit? That was fine?

Or should the law only be changed for good political parties?

FrancieBrady

blanch152 wrote: »

Are you suggesting that the reference in their annual report is to the allegations against Sinn Fein?

If so, was there a formal report, and if so, where is it? Do you believe it should be published in full?

Reported in The Irish Times as 'a comment on the matter'.

Note the heading in the report:

Donations to Parties with North/South Presence
The Commission notes that there are some political parties that operate in this State and in
Northern Ireland. Separate electoral regimes exist in the two jurisdictions, with separate
registration and reporting requirements.
Donations are subject to different acceptance and disclosure thresholds in the two jurisdictions,
and donations received in one jurisdiction may be acceptable where they would not be in the
other jurisdiction. Likewise, assets and liabilities of a party organisation that is structured as a
single entity may be held for reporting purposes in one jurisdiction or the other.
There is nothing illegal about a party that is, for organisational purposes, a single entity
having statutory obligations in more than one jurisdiction. Given the differences in statutory
requirements, this may have the practical effect of sometimes benefiting or disadvantaging a
party. It is recommended that the issue be explored further by an electoral commission, once
established.

https://www.sipo.ie/reports-and-publications/annual-reports/2019-SIPOC-AR-English.pdf

FrancieBrady

blanch152 wrote: »

So you believe that political parties should be free to raise as much money as they want in as many ways that they want, and accept donations from other jurisdictions?

Just like the DUP did taking the foreign money to campaign for Brexit? That was fine?

Or should the law only be changed for good political parties?

As long as it is legal and transparent, I don''t have any issue with it happening on this island.

As a republican committed to a UI I think everyone who identifies as Irish (and anybody else for that matter) should have an unfettered right to support whatever democratic political party they want.

It would be a bit ridiculous to support extending voting rights and not allow support.

Already said that it should apply to all parties and got scolded for trying to deflect.