The wondrous adventures of Sinn Fein (part 2)

maccored

blanch152 wrote: »

He wasn't a member of the Executive.

Do you think it was ok for O'Mulleoir to break the confidence of the Executive and share confidential information with Ted?

he was a member of the sf ard chomhairle - so yes, it was perfectly acceptable to share that information. SF are part of the executive, the ard chomhairle is part of SF. Not hard logic to follow.

maccored

Deleted User wrote: »

Pat did what any good interviewer would do. Never interrupted waffle. And, boy, did she waffle!

so the 'tearing strips' you refer to is your own personal view of what waffle is?

mynamejeff

maccored wrote: »

he was a member of the sf ard chomhairle - so yes, it was perfectly acceptable to share that information. SF are part of the executive, the ard chomhairle is part of SF. Not hard logic to follow.

and the army council ? where do they slot in the chain of command ?

FrancieBrady

mynamejeff wrote: »

and the army council ? where do they slot in the chain of command ?

How long after the International Monitors state that the 'army' (IRA) is engaged in 'exclusively democratic means' does the term 'Army Council' cease to exist?

These people were invited into the democratic fold, and actively encouraged to by what are now hypocrites.

They use a defunct term to describe perfectly ordinary party members in order to exclude people from the democratic process. Exactly the same exclusionary tactics engaged in by sectarian and bigoted unionists that caused the problems for partition.

grayzer75

mynamejeff wrote: »

and the army council ? where do they slot in the chain of command ?

Probably in the heads of FFG supporters......

mynamejeff

the problem with lying is that if you do it all the time ,

people will assume that everything you say is a lie

there is no army council , Gerry was never in the ira , sf have no connection to organised crime and on and on and on

FrancieBrady

mynamejeff wrote: »

the problem with lying is that if you do it all the time ,

people will assume that everything you say is a lie

there is no army council , Gerry was never in the ira , sf have no connection to organised crime and on and on and on

Why would they require an Army COuncil for an organisation commtited to exclusively democratic means Jeff?


Are you saying the governments have been hoodwinked by the Monitoring agencies? Do explain yourself for once.

Brendan Bendar

Next thing they will try to tell you that large scale smuggling and diesel washing isn’t going on.

And that the PSNI have full control in certain areas and are welcome.

And then argue the toss for about 30 pages.

grayzer75

mynamejeff wrote: »

the problem with lying is that if you do it all the time ,

people will assume that everything you say is a lie

there is no army council , Gerry was never in the ira , sf have no connection to organised crime and on and on and on

The real problem is living in the past and not moving on with the times. All you comments about army councils etc are so last century so just leave it there.

FrancieBrady

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Next thing they will try to tell you that large scale smuggling and diesel washing isn’t going on.

Can you link to the data on this?

You say it is large scale, shouldn't be hard to give us the source of your information.

Brendan Bendar

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Can you link to the data on this?

You say it is large scale, shouldn't be hard to give us the source of your information.

Hold on Francie till I go on to the ‘Smuggling and Diesel Washing NI.co .uk ‘

site.

I’m sure these lads put all their activities on line.;)

mynamejeff

lol ,

one mention of the controlling power of sf and the "boys" go nuts.

mynamejeff

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Why would they require an Army COuncil for an organisation commtited to exclusively democratic means Jeff?


Are you saying the governments have been hoodwinked by the Monitoring agencies? Do explain yourself for once.

"On 20 October 2015, the Assessment on Paramilitary Groups in Northern Ireland, commissioned by the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland on the structure, role and purpose of paramilitary organisations reported the structures of the IRA remain in existence "

FrancieBrady

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Hold on Francie till I go on to the ‘Smuggling and Diesel Washing NI.co .uk ‘

site.

I’m sure these lads put all their activities on line.;)

So no data Brendi...just a feeling in your waters.


Fuel Fraud and smuggling are criminal matters.
If any political party is engaged in fraud then they should be dealt with.

joeguevara

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Can you link to the data on this?

You say it is large scale, shouldn't be hard to give us the source of your information.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/seven-arrested-in-psni-crackdown-on-money-laundering-crime-gang-1.4147016?mode=sample&auth-failed=1&pw-origin=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.irishtimes.com%2Fnews%2Fpolitics%2Fseven-arrested-in-psni-crackdown-on-money-laundering-crime-gang-1.4147016

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-30976759.html

mynamejeff

grayzer75 wrote: »

The real problem is living in the past and not moving on with the times. All you comments about army councils etc are so last century so just leave it there.

their victims have a way of holding onto things especially when there was no justice grayzer

that's legacy sf ira are very poor at dealing with and they keep popping up

the Quinns Maria Cahill etc , until they deal with these people property they will never go away

FrancieBrady

mynamejeff wrote: »

"On 20 October 2015, the Assessment on Paramilitary Groups in Northern Ireland, commissioned by the Secretary of State for Northern Ireland on the structure, role and purpose of paramilitary organisations reported the structures of the IRA remain in existence "

As usual you hypocritically cherrypick what you want to believe...or rather what you would like others to believe. Here are the full reports of the IMC and some of the bits you hypocritically left out of the 2015

The IMC’s report concluded that the IRA’s so-called military departments had been disbanded and its former terrorist capability had been lost. In addition, its army council was by conscious decision being allowed to fall into disuse.

“PIRA [the Provisional IRA] had in these ways completely relinquished the leadership and other structures appropriate to a time of conflict,” it found.

While a small number of former IRA members had given assistance to dissident republicans, it said this was not surprising following the dissolution of organisation’s structures.

On the issue of leadership, it found that in addition to “maintaining its clear stance against all forms of terrorist activity and involvement of members in crime”, the leadership continued in more specific ways to demonstrate its commitment to peaceful means.

https://cain.ulster.ac.uk/issues/politics/docs/imc/imcreports.htm

FrancieBrady

joeguevara wrote: »

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/seven-arrested-in-psni-crackdown-on-money-laundering-crime-gang-1.4147016?mode=sample&auth-failed=1&pw-origin=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.irishtimes.com%2Fnews%2Fpolitics%2Fseven-arrested-in-psni-crackdown-on-money-laundering-crime-gang-1.4147016

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-30976759.html

So?

We know it goes on.

How 'large scale' is it, was the question.

grayzer75

mynamejeff wrote: »

their victims have a way of holding onto things especially when there was no justice grayzer

that's legacy sf ira are very poor at dealing with and they keep popping up

the Quinns Maria Cahill etc , until they deal with these people property they will never go away

The IRA were willing to sign up to a Truth Commission but the Brits won't sign up for some reason (must have something to hide) so the full truth will never come out which is a pity for the victims and their families.

joeguevara

FrancieBrady wrote: »

So?

We know it goes on.

How 'large scale' is it, was the question.

Well the fact that in one bust it centred around 215 million operation.

An interesting scholar article discusses it https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/1057610X.2019.1678878?scroll=top&needAccess=true&journalCode=uter20 here and outlines the scale of it.

JohnnyFlash

At least 50 properties and 200 employees. Big party. Lot of money washing around......

FrancieBrady

joeguevara wrote: »

Well the fact that in one bust it centred around 215 million operation.

An interesting scholar article discusses it https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/abs/10.1080/1057610X.2019.1678878?scroll=top&needAccess=true&journalCode=uter20 here and outlines the scale of it.

Fuel Fraud was at 250 million in 2004

Fuel fraud costs the UK taxpayer hundreds of millions of pounds in lost revenue every
year. Northern Ireland alone is estimated to have lost £70 million in 2009-10. Only five
years ago this figure was as high as £250 million,

https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201012/cmselect/cmniaf/1504/1504.pdf

It was reckoned to be 40 million last year.

HMRC said in 2016-17, the illicit market for diesel in Northern Ireland resulted in an estimated loss of £30m in duty and a further £10m in VAT, giving a total loss of £40m.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-46844898

A diminishing problem the data suggests.

blanch152

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

At least 50 properties and 200 employees. Big party. Lot of money washing around......

It was those criminals over there, look, over there, nothing to do with us good republicans.

joeguevara

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Fuel Fraud was at 250 million in 2004



https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201012/cmselect/cmniaf/1504/1504.pdf

It was reckoned to be 40 million last year.



https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-46844898

A diminishing problem the data suggests.

In 2015 fuel and tobacco smuggling around the border was costing a billion to the exchequer annually.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/fuel-laundering-tobacco-smuggling-costing-1bn-annually-1.2114673?mode=sample&auth-failed=1&pw-origin=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.irishtimes.com%2Fnews%2Fireland%2Firish-news%2Ffuel-laundering-tobacco-smuggling-costing-1bn-annually-1.2114673

mynamejeff

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Fuel Fraud was at 250 million in 2004



https://publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201012/cmselect/cmniaf/1504/1504.pdf

It was reckoned to be 40 million last year.



https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-northern-ireland-46844898

A diminishing problem the data suggests.

So as long as one of the parts of the criminality that your party are directly involved with and profit from is diminishing its ok ?

FrancieBrady

mynamejeff wrote: »

So as long as one of the parts of the criminality that your party are directly involved with and profit from is diminishing its ok ?

...and more unbacked up lies.

Can we see Revenue, Garda and PSNI data that has linked SF to this activity?

Let me get this straight here: If a party member or members are caught demanding money in return for planning influence,(as has happened) is it ok to say to a FGer ' your party are directly involved with and profit from planning bribes'?

Would that be acceptable even here on boards.ie?

JohnnyFlash

https://twitter.com/sjamcbride/status/1326175299361513474?s=21

The sort of clear, no nonsense, decisive governance we have come to expect from SF and the DUP.

FrancieBrady

joeguevara wrote: »

Can I ask a question. Why is a senior sinn fein party member and solicitor acting on behalf of Daniel Kinahan?

Email them.

Why would I know why a solicitor takes a case?


Why would Jim O'Callaghan FF represent Gerry Adams, given his party's views?

Why would anyone accused of a crime get representation?

You might want to widen that debate out and ask the Law Society.

FrancieBrady

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

https://twitter.com/sjamcbride/status/1326175299361513474?s=21

The sort of clear, no nonsense, decisive governance we have come to expect from SF and the DUP.

I have been saying it for years. A failed state that cannot govern itself due to the problems created by a ridiculous partition.

Would you agree Johnny?

blanch152

grayzer75 wrote: »

The IRA were willing to sign up to a Truth Commission but the Brits won't sign up for some reason (must have something to hide) so the full truth will never come out which is a pity for the victims and their families.

Nothing stopping a unilateral Truth Commission or one restricted to Northern Ireland actors. Perhaps the Stormont Executive could provide for one is Sinn Fein not willing to do it themselves.