The wondrous adventures of Sinn Fein (part 2)

Solutionking

FrancieBrady wrote: »

And you were linked to the news. Where you will find out whatever it is you need to know.

The executive is working away on any number of things. Was it something specific you wanted to know?

I was asking if SF was going to help stop people dying in Northern Ireland because of Covid. Seemingly they are incapable of doing that. What a useless party

FrancieBrady

IngazZagni wrote: »

Excuse me? Go and watch the Prime Time interview with Varadker on the day NPHET announced that. The issue isn't that they were recommending level 5 but the completely out of the blue last minute way they announced it. They only agreed 2 days prior that level 3 was fine. They agreed 1 week later that level 3 was fine too.

Nothing came 'out of the blue'. Stop making excuses for FG (Varadkar) and Donnelly.

At around the same time, at the daily Nphet meeting, Dr Holohan drops a new bombshell. He disclosed his contacts with Mr Donnelly on Saturday, and before and after the Nphet meeting on Sunday.

It dilutes the Tánaiste’s comments on Monday that the information had come “out of the blue”.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/timeline-nphet-level-5-recommendation-who-knew-what-and-when-1.4375677

Nobotty

Solutionking wrote: »

I was asking if SF was going to help stop people dying in Northern Ireland because of Covid. Seemingly they are incapable of doing that. What a useless party

Disingenuousness again
Its not Sinn Féins fault as you know
But any excuse to bash with no substance just lies yeah ?

FrancieBrady

Solutionking wrote: »

I was asking if SF was going to help stop people dying in Northern Ireland because of Covid. Seemingly they are incapable of doing that. What a useless party

Is that the best you have?

How predictably pathetic not to mention completely uninformed.

blanch152

Deleted User wrote: »

Essentially yes,stormont has been.a failure,hence the need for reunification


The petition of concern can be used by either side to stop one side bullying other and prevent institional sectarianism....the dup used this to stop covid restrictions

Its been used 49 times since it was brought in,47 of them.by the DUP to close down things like irish language acts,funding for gaa clubs etc etc....a wholy committed bunch of bigots,who have gone too far with their carryon surronding covid.......

these people have no time for,nor interest in powersharing,never will,its time to press on with reunification

If it has been used predominantly by one party, shouldn't the question be whether it is that party is the problem rather than the system?

I have pointed earlier to the fact that neither of the large parties have demonstrated an ability to govern outside of Northern Ireland, despite both having had opportunities.

Pressing on with reunification, while ignoring the genuine concerns and ambitions of the other side, is repeating the mistakes of the past.

FrancieBrady

blanch152 wrote: »

If it has been used predominantly by one party, shouldn't the question be whether it is that party is the problem rather than the system?

I have pointed earlier to the fact that neither of the large parties have demonstrated an ability to govern outside of Northern Ireland, despite both having had opportunities.

Pressing on with reunification, while ignoring the genuine concerns and ambitions of the other side, is repeating the mistakes of the past.

A 'system' that cannot remove the veto of unionists and religious fundamentalists is a failed system.
And the reason it has failed is always going back to the origin of the problem - a partition that was designed to give them a veto in the first place.

Dyr

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Desperate lying again.
Victims exploited, now a dead man exploited for the political digs.

You know that there was never supposed to be a 'burial'. Pointing out the evidence of that in his funeral notice isn't enough. You have no shame.

Parading around a cemetary in full regalia when there's isn't a burial seems fairly tacky tbh but SF do like to do show funerals


For a government party during a lockdown to break its own regulations to parade around a cemetary like some sort of paramilitary panto is not acceptable and there was no accountability from SF on it.

Are their opponents using it as a stick to beat them with? Yes, but its a stick of their own making.

Solutionking

Deleted User wrote: »

Essentially yes,stormont has been.a failure,hence the need for reunification


The petition of concern can be used by either side to stop one side bullying other and prevent institional sectarianism....the dup used this to stop covid restrictions

Its been used 49 times since it was brought in,47 of them.by the DUP to close down things like irish language acts,funding for gaa clubs etc etc....a wholy committed bunch of bigots,who have gone too far with their carryon surronding covid.......

these people have no time for,nor interest in powersharing,never will,its time to press on with reunification

If anything this proves it is not time for reunification. If Northern Ireland is in such a flux then a reunification vote is last thing they need, that will only increase the issues
SF need to sit down and act like a proper political party, which they claim to be, and work for the people that voted them in. Not sit back watching them die and blame others.

FrancieBrady

Bambi wrote: »

Parading around a cemetary in full regalia when there's isn't a burial seems fairly tacky tbh but SF do like to do show funerals


For a government party during a lockdown to break its own regulations to parade around a cemetary like some sort of paramilitary panto is not acceptable and there was no accountability from SF on it.

Are their opponents using it as a stick to beat them with? Yes, but its a stick of their own making.

Yes, SF deserve criticism for the mistake. But it's the hypocrisy of those wielding the sticks that is hilarious and the lies they have to tell about fake funerals and empty coffins that are preposterous.

IngazZagni

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Nothing came 'out of the blue'. Stop making excuses for FG (Varadkar) and Donnelly.



https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/timeline-nphet-level-5-recommendation-who-knew-what-and-when-1.4375677

Did you even read the full article? Tony comes to work 2 days early and it's only on Sunday evening that the Taoiseach and Tanaiste are informed of Tonys reccomendation of level 5 to be implemented 24 hours later! Thats after level 3 being okay on the Thursday meeting. Thats outrageous carry on from NPHET.

Anyway it's clear you have a different opinion so we will agree to disagree.

blanch152

grayzer75 wrote: »

Ah so if you're not buried you're not dead and your funeral is fake, dead on.

I was going to say it was a pageant but that would be inaccurate, more like a pantomine because Sinn Fein were playing the rest of us for laughs.

Nobotty

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Nothing came 'out of the blue'. Stop making excuses for FG (Varadkar) and Donnelly.



https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/timeline-nphet-level-5-recommendation-who-knew-what-and-when-1.4375677

To be fair Francie,if nphets position is level 3 on Friday and level 5 on Sunday including a hasty return to work on a Saturday by Dr Holohan it is out of the blue,no matter who was texting who on the saturday

This in the Irish times Saturday reckons Vradakar was right on the 1st level 5 call

https://www.irishtimes.com/business/economy/stalled-progress-suggests-varadkar-was-right-in-claire-byrne-interview-1.4413826

After he changed his mind, the public narrative coalesced around a vague notion that Varadkar was too hasty when he raised concerns over a move to Level 5, and that he was wrong to say what he said that night.

But was he, really? Let’s remind ourselves of his complaints about the then-proposed four-week move to the strictest tier of restrictions, and compare that to where the State is now, just over four weeks into the latest round of restrictions. He doesn’t seem too far wrong from this vantage
Varadkar complained that there was no evidence that a Level 5 lockdown, which has put hundreds of thousands of people out of work, would be “enough”, although he didn’t define what enough might be. He asked a reasonable question about what would happen if Level 5 didn’t sufficiently drive down virus numbers.

As the decline in the infection numbers has stalled over the last week and the daily rate has settled between 350 and 450 new cases, Varadkar’s thesis looks like it may be about to be tested.

Some public health experts have suggested in recent days that the decline in the daily rate may have stalled temporarily due to the schools’ midterm break and the celebrations around Halloween. We can still hope that it turns out to be the case and the downward trajectory resumes to some degree.

But what if it doesn’t?

Varadkar said on Claire Byrne Live that, if progress under lockdown stalled, the State would have to make a choice between “abandoning the process or proceeding regardless”. Nphet, he argued, hadn’t “contemplated” that situation. Unless the current situation improves, it looks as if it may need to contemplate it soon.

Ministers, including Minister for Health Stephen Donnelly, have suggested there is “no appetite” for extending the Level 5 restrictions beyond December 1st, regardless of whether there is further improvement or not. Economic lobbyists, meanwhile, are up in arms.


The point is that Varadkar seemed to anticipate six weeks ago that a lockdown might not work as well as hoped and that the public’s support for it could wane, whereas Nphet didn’t appear to have considered that as a real issue at all. The public health advisers seemed prepared to junk the economy for a month or more because they were apparently so sure that it would be worth it. But the current situation suggests Varadkar may have been correct to raise his concerns.

While some friction between the Government and Nphet might actually be a good thing in helping to find the right balance between public health concerns and the economy, it does have one major downside – it gives a licence to the cranks among us who are only too gleeful to lambaste everybody else for laxity in adhering to the what is among the strictest anti-virus regimes in Europe.

Here, Nphet has made some clear errors. For example, Holohan’s deputy, Ronan Glynn, was, I believe, ill advised this week to speak publicly about a supposedly “selfish minority” that a few cranks then sought to blame for the stalling of progress on case numbers.

Glynn was responding to the latest in a long line of behaviour-shaming videos on social media, which this time showed people drinking takeaway pints outside in small groups, albeit all on the same street, in Dublin.

The self-righteous sensed the nod from above and had a field day, even though there is no significant risk attached to outdoor drinking in small groups, and the video was too recent for the behaviour it captured to be a factor in the trajectory of virus numbers that we are now seeing.

A certain amount of human failure should be expected in any coherent strategy. So let’s not burn our fellow citizens at the stake for their failings just yet. There is also still a week-and-a-half to go of the Level 5 restrictions and the hope that a modicum of progress may resume has not yet evaporated completely. Then, it will be time to reopen the economy again, and also to hold our nerve

Solutionking

Solutionking wrote: »

If anything this proves it is not time for reunification. If Northern Ireland is in such a flux then a reunification vote is last thing they need, that will only increase the issues

Meh,points to me stormont has failed and will never work,time to pull the plug on that experiment

SF need to sit down and act like a proper political party, which they claim to be, and work for the people that voted them in. Not sit back watching them die and blame others.

Dress it up,whatever way yous want,the DUP are ones who pulled the plug on covid restrictions,when all this covid is over (likely by april imo),its time to pull plug on stormont,they have been let away with bladgarding too long abusing the POC

blanch152

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Yes, SF deserve criticism for the mistake. But it's the hypocrisy of those wielding the sticks that is hilarious and the lies they have to tell about fake funerals and empty coffins that are preposterous.

Shoot the messenger again.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/sinn-feins-dublin-office-paid-for-advertising-for-party-event-in-belfast-39777578.html

In the meantime, the money resting in accounts goes around in circles from North to South. How can SF be considered a normal political party?

FrancieBrady

IngazZagni wrote: »

Did you even read the full article? Tony comes to work 2 days early and it's only on Sunday evening that the Taoiseach and Tanaiste are informed of Tonys reccomendation of level 5 to be implemented 24 hours later! Thats after level 3 being okay on the Thursday meeting. Thats outrageous carry on from NPHET.

Anyway it's clear you have a different opinion so we will agree to disagree.

He is the appointed expert. It was a fluid situation. We had to go to Level 5 anyway.

Had Varadkar the PR addict held his tongue all of this would have stayed where it belonged - confidential. Maybe he had his nasty little attack for the 'good of the country'.

NPHET did their job. Did the government? Within days they had to review the 'job' they did and go to Level 5.

FrancieBrady

blanch152 wrote: »

Shoot the messenger again.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/politics/sinn-feins-dublin-office-paid-for-advertising-for-party-event-in-belfast-39777578.html

In the meantime, the money resting in accounts goes around in circles from North to South. How can SF be considered a normal political party?

Deflecting from you fake funeral lies are you blanch?

If they broke the rules then they should pay whatever penalty is set for breaking them.

IngazZagni

FrancieBrady wrote: »

He is the appointed expert. It was a fluid situation. We had to go to Level 5 anyway.

Had Varadkar the PR addict held his tongue all of this would have stayed where it belonged - confidential. Maybe he had his nasty little attack for the 'good of the country'.

NPHET did their job. Did the government? Within days they had to review the 'job' they did and go to Level 5.

I'm assuming you didn't have to worry about losing your job once level 5 kicked in. That was the biggest issue. The supports needed to be in place and it would have been impossible in that scenario.

blanch152

Solutionking wrote: »

SF need to sit down and act like a proper political party, which they claim to be, and work for the people that voted them in. Not sit back watching them die and blame others.

SF are not able to act like a proper political party. Think back to election night and "Up the Ra" and "Come out you black and tans" alongside cries of having won the election. There was no attempt made to reach out to other parties on a partnership basis to form a government - it was all we have won, the civil war parties have lost, we are leading, follow us everyone else.

As a government-forming approach, it was a complete and utter failure, doomed from the start, an arrogant approach to everyone else that was catastrophic for them. It seems that that lesson hasn't been learned.

blanch152

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Deflecting from you fake funeral lies are you blanch?

If they broke the rules then they should pay whatever penalty is set for breaking them.

Carrying a body to a graveyard, pretending to have a graveside oration and ceremony before sneaking the body off to be cremated elsewhere fits the definition of a fake funeral.

Solutionking

Deleted User wrote: »

Meh,points to me stormont has failed and will never work,time to pull the plug on that experiment




Dress it up,whatever way yous want,the DUP are ones who pulled the plug on covid restrictions,when all this covid is over (likely by april imo),its time to pull plug on stormont,they have been let away with bladgarding too long abusing the POC

You refer to the North as "Meh". How many people died to get the Good Friday Agreement in place and you say "Meh".
I am sure all those men, women and children that got killed to get the GFA would expect the political parties to start working, not look for excuses

FrancieBrady

blanch152 wrote: »

Carrying a body to a graveyard, pretending to have a graveside oration and ceremony before sneaking the body off to be cremated elsewhere fits the definition of a fake funeral.

Lies...anyone who read the funeral notice and the SF release would know this.

Nobody 'pretended' anything. Ask the PSNI if they knew that Storey was going to the crematorium? Ask the council if they knew.

You are blatantly lying to keep your 'FAKE' outrage going.

Solutionking

Solutionking wrote: »

You refer to the North as "Meh". How many people died to get the Good Friday Agreement in place and you say "Meh".
I am sure all those men, women and children that got killed to get the GFA would expect the political parties to start working, not look for excuses

I refered to stormont as meh....it deosnt work and never will


Why waste any more time or resources pretending it will,better off putting the time and resources into reunification imo



Can you honestly see stormont working ever,with the way the DUP carryon?

Hide behind hysterical and emotional posting all you want,but they've had 20 years to make it work and its been an utter failure

FrancieBrady

IngazZagni wrote: »

I'm assuming you didn't have to worry about losing your job once level 5 kicked in. That was the biggest issue. The supports needed to be in place and it would have been impossible in that scenario.

What the f***?

You aprrot Varadkar and expect to be taken seriously?

NPHET's job was to advise on health grounds - they did that in a fluid situation.

Donnelly and Varadkar fudged that with 'out of the blue' lies and unwarranted criticism in the middle of a pandemic for political gain.

blanch152

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Lies...anyone who read the funeral notice and the SF release would know this.

Nobody 'pretended' anything. Ask the PSNI if they knew that Storey was going to the crematorium? Ask the council if they knew.

You are blatantly lying to keep your 'FAKE' outrage going.

Doesn't wash Francie, doesn't wash.

No matter how many times you explain that in some Sinn Fein email or an obscure death notice hidden in page 17 of An Phravda it was made clear, it doesn't wash. Even some of the media reports on the day reported him being buried in the cemetery.

It was a fake funeral presented to the world as something it wasn't.

grayzer75

blanch152 wrote: »

I was going to say it was a pageant but that would be inaccurate, more like a pantomine because Sinn Fein were playing the rest of us for laughs.

Most of what you say about this is from the fictional thoughts inside your wee head.

FrancieBrady

blanch152 wrote: »

Doesn't wash Francie, doesn't wash.

No matter how many times you explain that in some Sinn Fein email or an obscure death notice hidden in page 17 of An Phravda it was made clear, it doesn't wash. Even some of the media reports on the day reported him being buried in the cemetery.

It was a fake funeral presented to the world as something it wasn't.

Pathetic as usual.

Trump engages in this 'fake' mantra up even though he has been outed again and again.

Solutionking

Deleted User wrote: »

I refered to stormont as meh....it deosnt work and never will


Why waste any more time or resources pretending it will,better off putting the time and resources into reunification imo



Can you honestly see stormont working ever,with the way the DUP carryon?

Hide behind hysterical and emotional posting all you want,but they've had 20 years to make it work and its been an utter failure

I'm not hiding behind anything. Thousands of people died to get a GFA and Stormont and now it just "Meh". The utter failure is on the part of SF and DUP. The lack of ability for either party to work for the voters. So fix those two and then Stormont is prefect.
A bit of respect would be nice around this forum.

joeguevara

If the Republic of Ireland SF bank accounts are going to be paying for advertising for NI SF and for hotel events for NI SF then there is a huge question to answer as to why the 4m received from a deceased person's will was not declared into the Republic of Ireland Bank Account and faced whatever tax is applicable. Pick and choose. Pick and choose.

blanch152

grayzer75 wrote: »

Most of what you say about this is from the fictional thoughts inside your wee head.

More shooting the messenger. The Bobby Storey funeral is still making headlines in the North months later. Why? Because Sinn Fein tried to pull the wool over the eyes of the public.

The latest email announcing the wake was a public event will cause a lot of trouble.

aido79

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I refered to stormont as meh....it deosnt work and never will


Why waste any more time or resources pretending it will,better off putting the time and resources into reunification imo



Can you honestly see stormont working ever,with the way the DUP carryon?

Hide behind hysterical and emotional posting all you want,but they've had 20 years to make it work and its been an utter failure

Maybe it's time for Sinn Fein to head over to Westminster and do what they actually get paid for if stormont isn't working?

How exactly do you see reunification panning out? Border poll, little discussion between North and South on how to move forward and then carry on as a United Ireland...or complete sh$tshow? My money is on option 2.