The wondrous adventures of Sinn Fein (part 2)

Danzy

Hamsterchops wrote: »

Yes, of course from a Provisional IRA/terrorism perspective that day was a great success. But don't expect kudos from this State, our President, or the Dail for terrorist attacks.

That's their choice, doesn't explain the bandwagon over Stanley.

FrancieBrady

Hamsterchops wrote: »

Yes, of course from a Provisional IRA/terrorism perspective that day was a great success. But don't expect kudos from this State, our President, or the Dail for terrorist attacks.

Not yet anyhow.
They had to lock away the testimonies of what was done in the struggle to independece so controversial and divisive was it. Time passed and now they are presented as jewels of our history the exact same acts sanitised by time and the absence of the perpretrators and any victims.
It's how it works.

markodaly

FrancieBrady wrote: »

please be my guest and show us your proof that anybody sent anyone and this wasnt just a chat over the garden wall.

https://twitter.com/aoifegracemoore/status/1334978386972831745

Are you saying she is making it all up?

A high ranking SF member, with a long long history with the party and the IRA goes to her house and asks her to delete tweets critical of the party.



You deny this happened? Go on Francie, tell us what you really think.

I guess she isn't 'Irish' either?

https://twitter.com/christineomg5/status/1335188509494284288

walshb

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Brid Smith claimed on RTE today that FG have employed somebody to do this full time. Trawl twitter and FB.

FG intend to get down and dirty rather than give up power. Fun times ahead.

I heard her..

And she should have been lifted out of it..

An and pure chancer that one..

Tell me you’re not putting g any stock with that woman says..

Loafing Oaf

markodaly wrote: »

Hillarious stuff...already shedding members of their youngest party members, and they arent even in government yet... :D

If this trickle becomes a flow, MLM could be facing a bona fide crisis, and Stan the Man may have to be dispatched under the nearest omnibus. There is a strong herd mentality among these young right-on types, so if a few ethnic minority/LGBT Shinners decide the party is insufficiently 'woke', many more could feel obliged to 'consider their position' within SF...

markodaly

FrancieBrady wrote: »

It's how it works.

That is how revisionism works, something SF have been trying now since the GFA.
They dressed up a failed military campaign for a UI, as a fight for civil rights after the fact. A complete 180 on the main topic at hand.

I don't think in 100 years times, we will be glorifying the murder of 3-year-old toddlers Francie.

Melanchthon

Bonniedog wrote: »

for the record, I don't see why either of Stanley's tweets ought to make him some sort of a Pariah. He supported the IRA in 1979 and sees it as no different to 1920. The "homophobic" one was a rather silly dig at Leo, but pertinent to a point and the outrage sums up the woke left and its contradiction between "social" liberalism and pretty much apathy to anything to do with real concerns of working people.

If I was a republican who still votes or is in SF I would be more concerned at the haste to set the band wagon jumpers like Reilly on him.

The outrage of some of the newbies and their hanger on like Shortall and others in the gay rights industry is re-assuring in that it predicts that the current SF constituency will eventually fall apart as it was doing prior to their winning the Lotto in February.

(Just noticed i like a Francie post. Must lie down!)

This a million times this, SF definitely have their problems in particular in relation to an authoritarian internal party structure and a split voter base between the Republicans, the traditional working class types and the more woke student crowd but the attack on Stanley should have been brushed of by the SF leadership.
He has a good record on gay rights issues- his tweet was clearly meant from the perspective that it's positive to have things like gay marriage but that the traditional left wing things are important.
He didn't tweet about a nasty or highly controversial IRA attack like Kingsmill or even Lord Mountbatten (same day as Warren point), he talked two attacks on active service British army units with particular histories in Ireland seperated by 50 years.

SF shouldn't be paying so much attention to the college student and young south Dublin type crowd, they are fluid voters who will probably jump to the soc dems or greens at the drop of a hat, even look at FG and Labour, they both thought they had those groups sown up at various times but the support can not be relied upon, they aren't even that important a voting group they just have a loud voice online.

SF need to stop letting their top down style and the crowd Mary Lou courts get themselves into trouble by over reacting themselves, come down hard on things that are important like the Bobby Story funeral as that actually looked terrible but stop trying to have complete control as that will just end up with another split. Let some young voters be lost to the Soc Dems with proper messaging to the 25+ to 50 something lower middle-class to working class demographics the small number of votes can easily be replaced

walshb

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Simple.
The reason I voted SF is that I hope they can break the power swap.
Other than that, I am not a member and would not be actively promoting them. More concerned with getting rid of one of the civil war parties (no odds which one as they are the same) hence I would talk more about them I suppose.

Anything else mark?, you seem overly concerned with me.

Ah come off it.

No casual SF voter (which you seem to be implying here) would be so so so defensive about practically any perceived criticisms..

I don’t think even SF members would be defending them as strongly and vociferously as you..

FrancieBrady

walshb wrote: »

Ah come off it.

No casual SF voter (which you seem to be implying here) would be so so so defensive about practically any perceived criticisms..

I don’t think even SF members would be defending them as strongly and vociferously as you..

As I said, water off a duck's back. I am who I am and I am who I say I am.

Floating republican voter whose vote belongs to no-one, happy to vote for SF as a credible candidate to break the hold of a toxic power swap.

markodaly

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

If this trickle becomes a flow, MLM could be facing a bona fide crisis, and Stan the Man may have to be dispatched under the nearest omnibus. There is a strong herd mentality among these young right-on types, so if a few ethnic minority/LGBT Shinners decide the party is insufficiently 'woke', many more could feel obliged to 'consider their position' within SF...

It is the biggest problem with SF, there are too many separate groupings there.
Do you honestly think that 25% of people who voted for them in the last GE care about a UI?

Sure, there is a core that do. Perhaps 12-13% of the die-hard republican types, but the new voters, especially the younger ones don't give an iota of a $hite about a UI, Republicanism and all that crap, which is SF's main goal.

Which leaves them in a bind, as they are trying to herd cats.
In SF you have 3 groupings.

a) The hardcore republican types, the ex-IRA types, the 'Up da Ra' types, Nationalists, more working-class, more anti-vax, more like the MAGA hat-wearing Trump supporters. Lots and lots of bots in this group.

b) The middle-class republican types, think MLMD, Eoin O'Brion types. More polished for sure, but perhaps less gung-ho about a UI, then the foaming of the mouth in the group a). More about getting power and skirting some hard issues to get there. Want to replace Labour as the Centre-left option in the Dail for the next few years.

c) The new woke types, usually young, usually don't care an iota about a UI, they are populist and young and naive. They graduated to SF, merely because they paint themselves as anti-establishment. Some gripes include a housing which may be valid, but usually live off soundbites and social media memes. They will be the first to leave once SF get to power and there is no pot of gold behind that rainbow. E.g. The Greens

You cannot keep type A and type C happy in this group, as the type A people are full of hateful xenophobic, Trump-like anti-vax fools. Type C are sensitive souls, so will make their voices heard.

Good luck SF! You will need it.

FrancieBrady

markodaly wrote: »

That is how revisionism works, something SF have been trying now since the GFA.
They dressed up a failed military campaign for a UI, as a fight for civil rights after the fact. A complete 180 on the main topic at hand.

I don't think in 100 years times, we will be glorifying the murder of 3-year-old toddlers Francie.

Nobody is doing that even now mark, why woukd they do it in 100 years?
Are you saying all the acts of violence carried out in our quest for independence are glorified/celebrated?

Finty Lemon

markodaly wrote: »

It is the biggest problem with SF, there are too many separate groupings there.
Do you honestly think that 25% of people who voted for them in the last GE care about a UI?

Sure, there is a core that do. Perhaps 12-13% of the die-hard republican types, but the new voters, especially the younger ones don't give an iota of a $hite about a UI, Republicanism and all that crap, which is SF's main goal.

Which leaves them in a bind, as they are trying to herd cats.
In SF you have 3 groupings.

a) The hardcore republican types, the ex-IRA types, the 'Up da Ra' types, Nationalists, more working-class, more anti-vax, more like the MAGA hat-wearing Trump supporters. Lots and lots of bots in this group.

b) The middle-class republican types, think MLMD, Eoin O'Brion types. More polished for sure, but perhaps less gung-ho about a UI, then the foaming of the mouth in the group a). More about getting power and skirting some hard issues to get there. Want to replace Labour as the Centre-left option in the Dail for the next few years.

c) The new woke types, usually young, usually don't care an iota about a UI, they are populist and young and naive. They graduated to SF, merely because they paint themselves as anti-establishment. Some gripes include a housing which may be valid, but usually live off soundbites and social media memes. They will be the first to leave once SF get to power and there is no pot of gold behind that rainbow. E.g. The Greens

You cannot keep type A and type C happy in this group, as the type A people are full of hateful xenophobic, Trump-like anti-vax fools. Type C are sensitive souls, so will make their voices heard.

Good luck SF! You will need it.

SF sent a party member around to Christine O Mahoneys house to demand she remove social media content. That is some behaviour from a democratic party.
I assume he was from Category A, to maximise the effect. The woke kids have no idea who they are running with.

markodaly

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Nobody is doing that even now mark, why woukd they do it in 100 years?

Ah, but they do Francie.

You excused the murder of a 3-year-old toddler, by trying to invoke the Atomic bombs dropped on Japan FFS. Whataboutery at its finest, that was.

Melanchthon

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

If this trickle becomes a flow, MLM could be facing a bona fide crisis, and Stan the Man may have to be dispatched under the nearest omnibus. There is a strong herd mentality among these young right-on types, so if a few ethnic minority/LGBT Shinners decide the party is insufficiently 'woke', many more could feel obliged to 'consider their position' within SF...

I actually agree with this but it will only be an issue since the MLM crowd will make it an issue.
That is a small enough voting group that isn't party loyal, Greens, Labour and to some extent FG have tried to win them in the past and it doesn't result in success.

Like the lady who they called around to mentioned in the previous post.
She's a Human rights studying, UCD head , minority background person, instead of trying to win her over concentrate on builders from crumlin or 30 something couples that live in Carlow but have to commute to a Dublin they are priced out of.
At the same time this is the important thing, don't try and get all authoritarian on her that's a terrible look and plays into the idea that SF aren't a normal party, let her and her buddies disagree , SF shouldn't be trying to control their opinions, they might end up putting the Soc dems or greens as first preference but they will probably still through SF a second preference anyway and they are likely to do this no matter what SF do because those smaller parties will always be able to go further than SF on the socially liberal scale because they don't have any traditional working class base at all.

Unfortunately with MLM leading the party I can see them throwing away a bigger group of voters to concentrate on the twitter crowd.

FrancieBrady

markodaly wrote: »

Ah, but they do Francie.

You excused the murder of a 3-year-old toddler, by trying to invoke the Atomic bombs dropped on Japan FFS. Whataboutery at its finest, that was.

Stop lying.

You asked what they achieved and I answered that the bombing campaign in England at that time got the IRA to the table.
Just like the atomic bombs achieved the surrender of Japan.

Both acts of terror...both acts that I never justified or supported but both acts that achieved results regardless of what I thought.

You can't take thst on board...your issue not mine

walshb

Finty Lemon wrote: »

SF sent a party member around to Christine O Mahoneys house to demand she remove social media content. That is some behaviour from a democratic party.
I assume he was from Category A, to maximise the effect. The woke kids have no idea who they are running with.

She was absolutely bang out of order..

Who does she think she is?

She chose the party, and then thinks she has the right to do as she pleases in the party?

Like I said..what sort people are SF taking in here..?

Melanchthon

walshb wrote: »

She was absolutely bang out of order..

Who does she think she is?

She chose the party, and then thinks she has the right to do as she pleases in the party?

Like I said..what sort people are SF taking in here..?

But the point is it's better just to ignore these types, you'l never please them anyway and will end up with eternal internal faction fighting, concentrate on the bigger groups of actual voters.
Look at corbyns labour in the UK , if you rely on these types you end up loosing a much larger voter group and still have internal arguments because you can never please them anyway.

McMurphy

walshb wrote: »

She was absolutely bang out of order..

Who does she think she is?

She chose the party, and then thinks she has the right to do as she pleases in the party?

Like I said..what sort people are SF taking in here..?

I agree to a certain extent, in what organisation, be it a political party or a private business, can a member or employee expect to publicly criticise that organisation, and not expect for them to be asked to remove publicly critical comments?

Take boards for example, how long do people think a mod would last here if he/she was openly challenging admin decisions/policy in one of the public forum's?

I would expect their comments to be swiftly deleted and mod invited to discuss their concerns privately.

You can't have your cake and eat it.

Ireland2020

markodaly wrote: »

It is the biggest problem with SF, there are too many separate groupings there.
Do you honestly think that 25% of people who voted for them in the last GE care about a UI?

Sure, there is a core that do. Perhaps 12-13% of the die-hard republican types, but the new voters, especially the younger ones don't give an iota of a $hite about a UI, Republicanism and all that crap, which is SF's main goal.

Which leaves them in a bind, as they are trying to herd cats.
In SF you have 3 groupings.

a) The hardcore republican types, the ex-IRA types, the 'Up da Ra' types, Nationalists, more working-class, more anti-vax, more like the MAGA hat-wearing Trump supporters. Lots and lots of bots in this group.

b) The middle-class republican types, think MLMD, Eoin O'Brion types. More polished for sure, but perhaps less gung-ho about a UI, then the foaming of the mouth in the group a). More about getting power and skirting some hard issues to get there. Want to replace Labour as the Centre-left option in the Dail for the next few years.

c) The new woke types, usually young, usually don't care an iota about a UI, they are populist and young and naive. They graduated to SF, merely because they paint themselves as anti-establishment. Some gripes include a housing which may be valid, but usually live off soundbites and social media memes. They will be the first to leave once SF get to power and there is no pot of gold behind that rainbow. E.g. The Greens

You cannot keep type A and type C happy in this group, as the type A people are full of hateful xenophobic, Trump-like anti-vax fools. Type C are sensitive souls, so will make their voices heard.

Good luck SF! You will need it.

The largest party on the island.

One of the big 2 parties with FF in the 26 now since the election.

SF don't need much luck, alls going good

Finty Lemon

walshb wrote: »

She was absolutely bang out of order..

Who does she think she is?

She chose the party, and then thinks she has the right to do as she pleases in the party?

Like I said..what sort people are SF taking in here..?

Is posting a tweet the worst thing that anyone in SF has done? Come on.
The point remains that sending someone over to her house is clearly intimidation.

McMurphy

Finty Lemon wrote: »

Is posting a tweet the worst thing that anyone in SF has done? Come on.
The point remains that sending someone over to her house is clearly intimidation.

I read that the "someone" was actually a friend and neighbour.

FrancieBrady

McMurphy wrote: »

I agree to a certain extent, in what organisation, be it a political party or a private business, can a member or employee expect to publicly criticise that organisation, and not expect for them to be asked to remove publicly critical comments?

Take boards for example, how long do people think a mod would last here if he/she was openly challenging admin decisions/policy in one of the public forum's?

I would expect their comments to be swiftly deleted and mod invited to discuss their concerns privately.

You can't have your cake and eat it.

I just love the way..someone whose oath wouldn't be believed on Friday is absolutely believed on Sinday and dare anyone question.
We seen it all before.

Solutionking

I see SF have set the online mob on attacking this poor lady. You would think they would have some basic manners and leave her alone.
First it was accusation of lying
Then she was a "non entity"
Now we have more lies to cover up. Next they will be saying it was really her mother who called over
No wonder the party have no standard

IAMAMORON

markodaly wrote: »

It is the biggest problem with SF, there are too many separate groupings there.
Do you honestly think that 25% of people who voted for them in the last GE care about a UI?

Sure, there is a core that do. Perhaps 12-13% of the die-hard republican types, but the new voters, especially the younger ones don't give an iota of a $hite about a UI, Republicanism and all that crap, which is SF's main goal.

Which leaves them in a bind, as they are trying to herd cats.
In SF you have 3 groupings.

a) The hardcore republican types, the ex-IRA types, the 'Up da Ra' types, Nationalists, more working-class, more anti-vax, more like the MAGA hat-wearing Trump supporters. Lots and lots of bots in this group.

b) The middle-class republican types, think MLMD, Eoin O'Brion types. More polished for sure, but perhaps less gung-ho about a UI, then the foaming of the mouth in the group a). More about getting power and skirting some hard issues to get there. Want to replace Labour as the Centre-left option in the Dail for the next few years.

c) The new woke types, usually young, usually don't care an iota about a UI, they are populist and young and naive. They graduated to SF, merely because they paint themselves as anti-establishment. Some gripes include a housing which may be valid, but usually live off soundbites and social media memes. They will be the first to leave once SF get to power and there is no pot of gold behind that rainbow. E.g. The Greens

You cannot keep type A and type C happy in this group, as the type A people are full of hateful xenophobic, Trump-like anti-vax fools. Type C are sensitive souls, so will make their voices heard.

Good luck SF! You will need it.

It is a nice post, but warrants a bit of preening.

Mary Lou is a crossover hit and has the peoples touch. She might be middle class ,but she would share her sandwiches with you. She is sound out, a true gael and Mna na hEireann love her, so do I. She oozes leadership and no one can shoot from the hip better. FF must rue the day they let her go. She is brilliant and all walks of life are fond of her, from the single mother in Blanch to the ladies who lunch in the Shelbourne, she is likeable. No one cares what "class" you are in this country as long as you are sound about it.

I can't speak for millenials but you tend to be more openminded in your 20's, but how anyone thinks that SF are cool or hip is beyond me. They are a sightfest of a party with borderline ( pun ) sociopathic almost fascist outlook, not on my watch, I love this country far too much to let a gang of spoofers have a go at the wheel.

If Mary Lou or the shadow health minister ( i always forget her name she is another brilliant politician) were not around they would be lucky to have a handful of seats.

On a final note the day Pearse Doherty started using his mobile phone to antagonise Leo during the leakies witchunt i lost massive respect for him. Twitter should have no influence on a Dàil debate, particulary the ramblings of some nobody thinking he is some sort of whistleblower. He acted like a numpty and went massively down in my estimation as a result.

Sinn Fèin aren't even in power and they continue to make naive assumptions about the people of Ireland. Their day will come, but with flutes like stanley posting verbal diarrohea about the RA putting it up to the Brits you just know they really are full a shight. The jokes over as far as I can see. There is no glory in blowing up a pensioners brass band or chopping dentists fingers off. Killing toddlers in Warrington or 20 year olds from Wexford with poorly detonated bombs. It needs to stop, for the future of this country.

walshb

Finty Lemon wrote: »

Is posting a tweet the worst thing that anyone in SF has done? Come on.
The point remains that sending someone over to her house is clearly intimidation.

Simple: someone like this should be expelled from the party..

Same for any party member who thinks they can go and publicly criticise and damage the party that they are a member of..

How would any organization survive when the very members are the ones that are damaging you..,

blanch152

McMurphy wrote: »

I agree to a certain extent, in what organisation, be it a political party or a private business, can a member or employee expect to publicly criticise that organisation, and not expect for them to be asked to remove publicly critical comments?

Take boards for example, how long do people think a mod would last here if he/she was openly challenging admin decisions/policy in one of the public forum's?

I would expect their comments to be swiftly deleted and mod invited to discuss their concerns privately.

You can't have your cake and eat it.

I have never seen a post so vehemently against whistleblowing.

Omerta rules in your world.

walshb

blanch152 wrote: »

I have never seen a post so vehemently against whistleblowing.

Omerta rules in your world.

She wasn’t whistleblowing..

She was running around social media looking for attention..

McMurphy

blanch152 wrote: »

I have never seen a post so vehemently against whistleblowing.

Omerta rules in your world.

What "whistleblowing" took place here, can you elaborate please?

Finty Lemon

walshb wrote: »

Simple: someone like this should be expelled from the party..

Same for any party member who thinks they can go and publicly criticise and damage the party that they are a member of..

How would any organization survive when the very members are the ones that are damaging you..,

No room for opinion so. All decisions taken in the darkened rooms in Andersonstown. As I thought.

walshb

Finty Lemon wrote: »

No room for opinion so. All decisions taken in the darkened rooms in Andersonstown. As I thought.

You are missing the point..

There has to be some bloody rules and regulations..

You think any party member can go shouting the odds publicly at anything that the party stand for that maybe they don’t agree with?

A free for all?

This is absurd..