The wondrous adventures of Sinn Fein (part 2)

James Brown · 12-01-2021 9:55pm

NovemberWren wrote: »

A most interesting post. And maybe this just shows that S.F. have actually just been deliberately giving a wrong impression in the south. An impression of gauche, uncomprehending, politic neophytes; and that serves as a cover for their pre-meditated army thugishness to the poorer locals that they manage to extract votes from.

Except they don't come from Mars and were created and consist of the same people they represent.

McMurphy · 12-01-2021 9:58pm

blanch152 wrote: »

Once you confirm you agree with me on the point made about the road taken by John Hume.............

You need someone to comment on something completely unconnected and unrelated before you will condemn what went on in the states mother and baby homes?

Have I got this right?

blanch152 · 12-01-2021 10:01pm

McMurphy wrote: »

You need someone to comment on something completely unconnected and unrelated before you will condemn what went on in the states mother and baby homes?

Have I got this right?

No, you don't have it right.

I didn't introduce whataboutery into this thread. Someone just having a dig at me rather than discussing the issue of the thread. Pretty much standard procedure from certain sources.

McMurphy · 12-01-2021 10:03pm

blanch152 wrote: »

No, you don't have it right.

Well it certainly reads that way, others can make up their own minds.

smurgen wrote: »

Blanch. FFG were in power when thousands of children died in mother and child homes and that report was out today. You're so concerned about death I'm wondering why I didn't see you comment on that today. Or the brutality and neglect overseen by the government and institutions at those times.

blanch152 wrote: »

Once you confirm you agree with me on the point made about the road taken by John Hume.............

FrancieBrady · 12-01-2021 10:07pm

McMurphy wrote: »

You need someone to comment on something completely unconnected and unrelated before you will condemn what went on in the states mother and baby homes?

Have I got this right?

Death at the hands of the state or because of the state just doesn't spin some people's moral compass.

jm08 · 12-01-2021 11:03pm

blanch152 wrote: »

Based on what evidence? They can't bring FDI to Belmullet or West Donegal, so what chance Northern Ireland?

Belmullet has a population of about 1,000. Having available labour would be an issue for any major employer. I suspect that would also be an issue for West Donegal along with poor road/transport infracture.

Now Northern Ireland would be a completely different kettle of fish and certainly the North East should be as attractive to FDI as Cork, Limerick or Galway who all have thriving pharma and tech FDI which makes the Munster region No. 3 region in GDP in the EU (after Central London and Luxembourg. Leinster is No. 5).

jm08 · 12-01-2021 11:08pm

blanch152 wrote: »

You put up a Twitter link to some eejit who had written to the SoS about a border poll. I had a good laugh at his letter.

The ''eejit'' who tweeted the bit about the Fine Gael research about a UI is Professor of the School of Law in Queens University. He teaches

International Human Rights Law
Migration and Human Rights
Contemporary Issues in British and Irish Human Rights
Constitutional Law

https://pure.qub.ac.uk/en/persons/colin-harvey

blanch152 · 13-01-2021 12:37am

jm08 wrote: »

The ''eejit'' who tweeted the bit about the Fine Gael research about a UI is Professor of the School of Law in Queens University. He teaches
International Human Rights Law

Migration and Human Rights

Contemporary Issues in British and Irish Human Rights

Constitutional Law

https://pure.qub.ac.uk/en/persons/colin-harvey

Bit of an eejit with his letter to the SOS, academics can be the biggest eejits of the lot.

blanch152 · 13-01-2021 12:38am

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Death at the hands of the state or because of the state just doesn't spin some people's moral compass.

The deflection array is fully deployed tonight.

jm08 · 13-01-2021 12:51am

smurgen wrote: »

John Hume was mocked ridiculed and derided by the establishment in his day. The Indo and Sunday Indo derided him on a weekly basis. If it was today you'd be mocking him in here.

Mary McAlease was scathing about the south and particularly RTE last Sunday on Miriam, in how poorly the situation of northern Ireland catholics was understood and how she was treated with distain when working for RTE on Today Tonight. She also spoke about how the Irish media with the help of some leaks tried to paint her as a Sinn Fein/PIRA supporter and how she nearly withdrew because of it (she had been involved in the talks with John Hume and Gerry Adams). Well worth a listen to.
https://www.rte.ie/radio/radioplayer/html5/#/radio1/11270743

jm08 · 13-01-2021 12:58am

blanch152 wrote: »

Bit of an eejit with his letter to the SOS, academics can be the biggest eejits of the lot.

What is ''eejity'' about the letter. I'm curious to know why you dismiss it with such arrogance.

RandomViewer · 13-01-2021 1:14am

blanch152 wrote: »

Based on what evidence? They can't bring FDI to Belmullet or West Donegal, so what chance Northern Ireland?

West Donegal has a fairly good record on FDI, Udarus na Gaeltachta estate has been going since 1972, one of the companies on the estate was bought by an American Multi-national yesterday,

blanch152 · 13-01-2021 10:35am

jm08 wrote: »

What is ''eejity'' about the letter. I'm curious to know why you dismiss it with such arrogance.

As I said already, it ignores the bleedin' obvious.

The nationalist share of the vote has declined over the last decade or more from 40-43% to 38-40%, yet the sense of the letter is wonderment over why a border poll hasn't been called.

Looking at the facts, there is no pressure for a vote on the SoS. Sure there is political noise, but hard cold analysis would demonstrate that the evidence doesn't support it - the voting patterns being the most obvious. Very surprised that an academic wouldn't understand this.

FrancieBrady · 13-01-2021 10:39am

blanch152 wrote: »

As I said already, it ignores the bleedin' obvious.

The nationalist share of the vote has declined over the last decade or more from 40-43% to 38-40%, yet the sense of the letter is wonderment over why a border poll hasn't been called.

Looking at the facts, there is no pressure for a vote on the SoS. Sure there is political noise, but hard cold analysis would demonstrate that the evidence doesn't support it - the voting patterns being the most obvious. Very surprised that an academic wouldn't understand this.

He wasn't asking for a poll to be called blanch...read the bleedin' letter.

Why do you misrepresent what posters say here and what others are saying so much?

blanch152 · 13-01-2021 10:43am

FrancieBrady wrote: »

He wasn't asking for a poll to be called blanch...read the bleedin' letter.

Why do you misrepresent what posters say here and what others are saying so much?

He was asking the SoS to explain the bleeding obvious. The reasons why a poll hasn't been called are clear and obvious. If he doesn't understand why a poll hasn't been called, and why no explanation is needed, then he is an eejit.

FrancieBrady · 13-01-2021 11:06am

blanch152 wrote: »

He was asking the SoS to explain the bleeding obvious. The reasons why a poll hasn't been called are clear and obvious. If he doesn't understand why a poll hasn't been called, and why no explanation is needed, then he is an eejit.

He wasn't looking for 'reasons a poll hasn't been called' either. Perhaps you might see what was being asked for if you read what this representative asked too, which re-iterates the issue:

SDLP leader Colum Eastwood, who in November asked the secretary of state in Westminster what criteria he would employ when deciding to call a referendum, said the approach taken by Mr Lewis and the NIO was "totally deficient".

"Whether the legal obligation to provide the circumstances for a poll exists or not, it is clearly in the interests of a fulsome debate on this island’s future that everyone knows how the decision will be made," he said.

Are the SDLP being 'eejits' too?

Jinglejangle69 · 13-01-2021 11:12am

Kraftwerk wrote: »

Just popped in to see the latest. Francie rounding on 2k posts in a single thread and shinners still flat out with the whataboutery.

Have you lads seriously nothing better than to do with your lives than live in here posting the same thing over and over and over again?

€€€€€€€

jh79 · 13-01-2021 11:43am

FrancieBrady wrote: »

He wasn't looking for 'reasons a poll hasn't been called' either. Perhaps you might see what was being asked for if you read what this representative asked too, which re-iterates the issue:

Are the SDLP being 'eejits' too?

Was this not dealt with already with the McCord case?

Regarding the letter, there is no indication that NI wants out of the UK so can't see where their right to self determination is being denied. They want to remain in the UK and the UK voted to leave the EU.

It's no different than an individual county having to accept the majority national vote in a referendum in the Republic.

McMurphy · 13-01-2021 11:46am

jh79 wrote: »

Was this not dealt with already with the McCord case?

Regarding the letter, there is no indication that NI wants out of the UK so can't see where their right to self determination is being denied. They want to remain in the UK and the UK voted to leave the EU.

It's no different than an individual county having to accept the majority national vote in a referendum in the Republic.

The North voted by a clear majority to remain in the EU though, so its not as clear cut as your post makes it out to be either.

FrancieBrady · 13-01-2021 12:06pm

jh79 wrote: »

Was this not dealt with already with the McCord case?

Regarding the letter, there is no indication that NI wants out of the UK so can't see where their right to self determination is being denied. They want to remain in the UK and the UK voted to leave the EU.

It's no different than an individual county having to accept the majority national vote in a referendum in the Republic.

Yes it was dealt with in the McCord case. That doesn't diminish the fact that blanch is 'misrepresenting' what was being asked for.

jh79 · 13-01-2021 12:20pm

McMurphy wrote: »

The North voted by a clear majority to remain in the EU though, so its not as clear cut as your post makes it out to be either.

Well it is, if they want to remain part of the UK they have to respect the wishes of the majority. There is no indication that they want to leave the UK since Brexit.

No different than Roscommon having to respect the wishes of the majority in the SSM referendum.

McMurphy · 13-01-2021 12:50pm

jh79 wrote: »

Well it is, if they want to remain part of the UK they have to respect the wishes of the majority. There is no indication that they want to leave the UK since Brexit.

No different than Roscommon having to respect the wishes of the majority in the SSM referendum.

Anything more recent than the 27th October 2020 do you know?

MORE people would vote for a united Ireland than to maintain the north's union with Britain, according to the findings of a new opinion poll.

jm08 · 13-01-2021 1:11pm

blanch152 wrote: »

He was asking the SoS to explain the bleeding obvious. The reasons why a poll hasn't been called are clear and obvious. If he doesn't understand why a poll hasn't been called, and why no explanation is needed, then he is an eejit.

He asks in the letter to explain what the SoS's criteria would be in calling a border poll. He also asks if he will be consulting with the Irish Government among other things.

Do tell if you know the answers to all of his questions.

jh79 · 13-01-2021 1:39pm

McMurphy wrote: »

Anything more recent than the 27th October 2020 do you know?

MORE people would vote for a united Ireland than to maintain the north's union with Britain, according to the findings of a new opinion poll.

That's the same poll showing more support to remain in the UK if a consequence of unification was the loss of free health care.

jh79 · 13-01-2021 1:41pm

jm08 wrote: »

He asks in the letter to explain what the SoS's criteria would be in calling a border poll. He also asks if he will be consulting with the Irish Government among other things.

Do tell if you know the answers to all of his questions.

It's one of the weaknesses of the GFA, the SoS is under no obligation to explain any decision made with regards to a border poll.

FrancieBrady · 13-01-2021 2:01pm

jh79 wrote: »

It's one of the weaknesses of the GFA, the SoS is under no obligation to explain any decision made with regards to a border poll.

Works both ways jh79.
There is also no onus on the SoS not to explain what his criteria might be, when asked.

jh79 · 13-01-2021 3:22pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Works both ways jh79.
There is also no onus on the SoS not to explain what his criteria might be, when asked.

Self determination as long as the British approve.

FrancieBrady · 13-01-2021 3:43pm

jh79 wrote: »

Self determination as long as the British approve.

Precisely. Now you are getting to the nub of nationalist issues.

jh79 · 13-01-2021 3:47pm

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Precisely. Now you are getting to the nub of nationalist issues.

When the McCord case was in the news were you not of the opinion that it was the only solution to how a border poll was called? Me and others at the time were pointing it out as a major failing of the GFA especially from a Republican perspective.

FrancieBrady · 13-01-2021 3:51pm

jh79 wrote: »

When the McCord case was in the news were you not of the opinion that it was the only solution to how a border poll was called? Me and others at the time were pointing it out as a major failing of the GFA especially from a Republican perspective.

The Irish State signed the GFA jh79.

Republicans signed up to it. Denial of self determination has been an issue since partition...hadn't you noticed?

The wondrous adventures of Sinn Fein (part 2)

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