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The wondrous adventures of Sinn Fein (part 2)
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"If Lynch had invaded"
General idea was that we would have done well to hold Newry for 24 hours.
A Wikipedia entry seems to have the main bullet points.The plan to occupy Newry would not save any Catholic refugees, as it was a predominantly Catholic town with no inter-sectarian riots.
The Catholic parts of Derry had suffered assaults from the Royal Ulster Constabulary and Protestant mobs, but was effectively ring-fenced on the introduction of British troops in August; as of October 1969, further attacks were unlikely.
Invading the territory of a much larger and much more powerful country was too much of a risk to the security of Ireland.
The United Kingdom could retaliate massively. The possibility of British occupation as a result of the plan was highly likely.
The plan ignored the incompatibility of forces. The United Kingdom was a member of NATO, while the Irish Defence Forces were much smaller than the British Armed Forces, had inferior arms and transportation in comparison to British forces, and had only minimal air and naval capabilities. The Defence Forces were said to train for "World War II operations using World War I weapons", such as the Lee–Enfield rifle, although most Irish soldiers were armed with FN FAL 7.62 automatic rifles. Former Irish officers such as Vincent Savino recalled that the Irish Army was "so short of the basics", having been allowed to run down since 1945 by the same politicians who now wanted it to undertake such a dangerous mission. By contrast, British forces in Northern Ireland consisted of almost 3,000 heavily armed soldiers of the 2nd Queens Regiment, the Royal Regiment of Wales, and the Prince of Wales's Own Regiment of Yorkshire. These troops had considerable experience in training and conventional large-scale combat tactics, and many had returned from guarding NATO's Northern Flank. They were equipped with Humber Pig and Saracen armored personnel carriers. Royal Air Force F-4 Phantom and Harrier jets were also stationed at airbases within short flying time from Northern Ireland. These forces would have been capable of dealing decisively with any Irish military incursion into the area. The mismatch was reflected in the choice of title. According to security analyst Tom Clonan, "irrespective of the element of surprise, the Irish Army would have been subject to a massive British counterattack – probably within hours of their initial incursion. Irish casualties would have been very high as the British would have sought to swiftly and indiscriminately end the Republic's capabilities and occupy the Republic via military intervention".
In 1969, both the Republic and the UK were applying to join the European Economic Community. The Republic's application would likely have been jeopardised if it had invaded a "friendly neighbour".
While the Irish government had called for United Nations involvement in Northern Ireland in August 1969, launching a localised but technical invasion and then calling again for intervention would have led to universal condemnation, being contrary to international law. The Republic of Ireland had joined the UN only in 1955.
All members of NATO are bound by the North Atlantic Treaty to oppose a military incursion on a member state; this would probably force the United States and the rest of the NATO members to intervene.
The targets for covert operations, such as the BBC offices in Belfast, were already guarded by the British Army to protect them from local rioters. None of these targets were linked to the inter-sectarian riots.
An intrusion might have provoked new and more widespread sectarian rioting, causing hundreds of deaths.
An invasion of Northern Ireland by the armed forces of the Republic would likely have met with the same overwhelmingly negative international response as the UK's invasion of the Suez Canal zone during the Suez Crisis in 1956.
In other words, only a lunatic would have seriously considered the proposal as workable and achievable.
I know its easy to roll one's eyes at the Irish Republican keyboard warriors among when they trot out such outrageous stuff like this, but it is a good insight into the mentality. They actually really really believe the hype and their own propaganda, that plans like invading the North were workable and achievable.
This view of Irish Republicanism is more like a religious cult than a political movement in my opinion given the zealot and fanatical belief in their owns powers to achieve the impossible. That is why we still have jacked up idiots in the New IRA killing people, for 'the cause'.
It is no surprise. People like Sean MacStiofain, a megalomaniac idiot of the highest order pretty much demanded the surrender of the British upon their first secret meeting. The meeting was a disaster because the head of the PIRA thought himself as an Irish re-incarnation of Julias Ceaser.
Today, we have our own little Sean MacStiofain's online fighting the same fights, in a hope that they will be right, one day.
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A Wikipedia entry seems to have the main bullet points.
In other words, only a lunatic would have seriously considered the proposal as workable and achievable.
I know its easy to roll one's eyes at the Irish Republican keyboard warriors among when they trot out such outrageous stuff like this, but it is a good insight into the mentality. They actually really really believe the hype and their own propaganda, that plans like invading the North were workable and achievable.
This view of Irish Republicanism is more like a religious cult than a political movement in my opinion given the zealot and fanatical belief in their owns powers to achieve the impossible. That is why we still have jacked up idiots in the New IRA killing people, for 'the cause'.
It is no surprise. People like Sean MacStiofain, a megalomaniac idiot of the highest order pretty much demanded the surrender of the British upon their first secret meeting. The meeting was a disaster because the head of the PIRA thought himself as an Irish re-incarnation of Julias Ceaser.
Today, we have our own little Sean MacStiofain's online fighting the same fights, in a hope that they will be right, one day.
excuses excuses. travesties were going on and the south turned a blind eye virtually. Yet another who couldnt care less what happens to people in the north. you should be ashamed of yourself.0 -
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This is the true cause of the problems on this island, the knee jerk reaction to call to violent solution to every political problem.
It is the unfortunate legacy of the rising, which was a military defeat and disaster but stoked a change in mindset due to the British reaction.
Since then we have had numerous failed rebellions and campaigns to try and fight for Ireland's freedom, whatever that is, all of them failing.
The next big campaign will be the border poll which will set Ireland on course for unification as the young vote north and south will be mobilised to the max.
After that we will see the sad we faces of all the west brits boiling their piss when they realise they'll have to help fund it and SF will be the largest party on the island 0 -
The next big campaign will be the border poll which will set Ireland on course for unification as the young vote north and south will be mobilised to the max.
After that we will see the sad we faces of all the west brits boiling their piss when they realise they'll have to help fund it and SF will be the largest party on the island
Grade A for effort.
But you fail on the originality front.0 -
The next big campaign will be the border poll which will set Ireland on course for unification as the young vote north and south will be mobilised to the max.
After that we will see the sad we faces of all the west brits boiling their piss when they realise they'll have to help fund it and SF will be the largest party on the island
The last paragraph just sums up the sectarian triumphalism of Irish republicanism. It isn't about the ideals, it isn't about making peoples' lives better, it is just about being able to rub somebody's faces in it.
The "they'll have to fund it" just shows up the stupidity of it all.0 -
The next big campaign will be the border poll which will set Ireland on course for unification as the young vote north and south will be mobilised to the max.
After that we will see the sad we faces of all the west brits boiling their piss when they realise they'll have to help fund it and SF will be the largest party on the island
Generally speaking, I have very limited respect for people who think if you don't support SF you are a west brit. It's the mental equivalent of waving a big red flag that says "I'm a fooking idiot...."0 -
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This discussion has been closed.
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