Boomer Wealth

HerrKuehn

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

Sure, but my point is that the narrative has changed.

When our parents did it, it was all 'poor them'. Forced to leave the country to have opportunities abroad, slaving away for a pittance, immigrants.

When millennials in their twenties do exactly the same thing for the same reason, suddenly it isn't 'emigrating', it's 'travelling' or 'gap years'. No recognition that many of us didn't really want to leave, or the emotional toll of living in a foreign country on your own.

If your dad had told you he had to live in a van because he couldn't afford a house, you'd be horrified. People in previous generations who did that were called what they were - homeless, vagabonds, itinerants. Now when millennials do it for the same reason, it's seen as some kind of hip 'lifestyle choice' because they might make a few quid off it for their YouTube channel.

The fact is that you need to call this stuff what it is - poverty. Someone being a millennial and owning a smartphone doesn't exempt them from being in poverty.

All of these 'luxuries' people bang on about are irrelevant. Most of them aren't even expensive. I guarantee you that I could sell every single thing I own and have it come in under two grand, including the laptop I need for my work. That's all the assets I have, and it isn't unusual for my generation to be in this position.

Out of interest, how old are you?

lainey_d_123

beauf wrote: »

You'd prefer to bang on about Netflix.

The reality is people have unrealistic expectations of where they can afford to live.

No, I don't think they do.

The issue is, why the heck is it now the norm to have a decent job and still not be able to buy a very, very modest, small home in the city where you grew up?

Most of us realise this is the reality - we're saying it shouldn't be.

Ush1

Wanderer78 wrote: »

most younger generations, cant actually get access to what they truly need, and they have limited capacity to do so, this is causing serious issues globally, for all citizens, including older generations. id imagine most younger generations have little or no ability to buy a house in dalkey, and know this, and in fact have little or no interest anyway, i.e. they are more realistic than that

Coulda fooled me!:pac:

lainey_d_123

HerrKuehn wrote: »

Out of interest, how old are you?

35.

Graduated right into the crisis, emigrated, came back and retrained and now finally in a position to save.

Why?

Wanderer78

Ush1 wrote: »

Coulda fooled me!:pac:

i dont know any younger generations thats currently are trying to get into the market, that are looking for houses in excess of 500,000, they are realistic, financial institutions would laugh at them if they even tried, and they know this, of course im sure there are a few that are trying to, and best of luck to them

beauf

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

Sure, but my point is that the narrative has changed.

When our parents did it, it was all 'poor them'. Forced to leave the country to have opportunities abroad, slaving away for a pittance, immigrants.

When millennials in their twenties do exactly the same thing for the same reason, suddenly it isn't 'emigrating', it's 'travelling' or 'gap years'. No recognition that many of us didn't really want to leave, or the emotional toll of living in a foreign country on your own.

If your dad had told you he had to live in a van because he couldn't afford a house, you'd be horrified. People in previous generations who did that were called what they were - homeless, vagabonds, itinerants. Now when millennials do it for the same reason, it's seen as some kind of hip 'lifestyle choice' because they might make a few quid off it for their YouTube channel.

The fact is that you need to call this stuff what it is - poverty. Someone being a millennial and owning a smartphone doesn't exempt them from being in poverty.

All of these 'luxuries' people bang on about are irrelevant. Most of them aren't even expensive. I guarantee you that I could sell every single thing I own and have it come in under two grand, including the laptop I need for my work. That's all the assets I have, and it isn't unusual for my generation to be in this position.

So you think emigration today is on a par with previous generations?

Wanderer78

Wanderer78 wrote: »

most younger generations are in serious trouble, regarding gaining access to their most critical of needs, then of course theres those that are in serious trouble, the unhoused etc

I'm sorry but I don't believe that younger generations are in serious trouble I just don't see any evidence to suggest it on a large scale. There are of course some but very much the minority.

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

Well, Nox, not everyone has the option of living at home with Mammy rent-free until they're 30. I've been paying rent since I turned 18.

Yes, I could have saved up a deposit easily if I could have stayed at home, but how is that relevant?

I love that you think most 30 somethings stay at home to save up and then are gifted a nice chunk of money by the parents. I'm sure that's lovely for those who have that option, but many of us don't.

I didn't say everyone lives at home until they are 30, some are lucky enough to be able to but many will move out in their early or mid 20's and houseshare. But no one in my extend group of friends rented alone at any point, either lived at home or shared.

I house shared for a number if years in my mid to late 20's and never paid more than 300 euro per month in rent and never in a bad house or bad area. Rent is more expensive now but you would have been renting all though this period so should have been paying low rent if you wanted to.

Some get gifted money some don't that was more addressing your dig at the older generation having some money at the end of their lives. The point was those that do have it are giving the benefit to their children so really its not correct to say that our parents generation are the only ones who benefit.

Yyhhuuu

beauf wrote: »

You also buy something in the North of England and come back in 20 yrs.

Do you think they will increase or decrease?

Wanderer78

Leilani Fast Windbreak wrote: »

I'm sorry but I don't believe that younger generations are in serious trouble I just don't see any evidence to suggest it on a large scale. There are of course some but very much the minority.

we may move in different circles, so i respect your opinion, but i strongly disagree, theres a reason why we re now experiencing radical election/voting outcomes, particularly in younger voters

lainey_d_123

beauf wrote: »

So you think emigration today is on a par with previous generations?

I wouldn't say it was far off. The majority of people I went to school and university with left the country in the midst of the 2008 crisis and a lot of them never came back.

Do you not think this is true?

Naos

Dizzyblonde wrote: »

It's difficult today, more difficult in some ways. Nobody is disputing that.

Well it did sound off like you were, implying people would rather have the latest iPhone & go on holiday vs save for their house, as if purchasing luxuries was the only obstacle.

Anyway, we'll leave it at that - appreciate the discussion!

Ush1

Wanderer78 wrote: »

i dont know any younger generations thats currently are trying to get into the market, that are looking for houses in excess of 500,000, they are realistic, financial institutions would laugh at them if they even tried, and they know this, of course im sure there are a few that are trying to, and best of luck to them

What's younger generations? The couple I'm talking about are early thirties. I bought my house when I was 28 in 2012 on my own and was one of the few from my social group who did, why? Cos I didn't fritter every penny I had on other stuff and saved since I started working. I bought a house in a working class area, not Dublin 6 as I couldn't afford it and went from there.

lainey_d_123

Leilani Fast Windbreak wrote: »

I'm sorry but I don't believe that younger generations are in serious trouble I just don't see any evidence to suggest it on a large scale. There are of course some but very much the minority.




I didn't say everyone lives at home until they are 30, some are lucky enough to be able to but many will move out in their early or mid 20's and houseshare. But no one in my extend group of friends rented alone at any point, either lived at home or shared.

I house shared for a number if years in my mid to late 20's and never paid more than 300 euro per month in rent and never in a bad house or bad area. Rent is more expensive now but you would have been renting all though this period so should have been paying low rent if you wanted to.

Some get gifted money some don't that was more addressing your dig at the older generation having some money at the end of their lives. The point was those that do have it are giving the benefit to their children so really its not correct to say that our parents generation are the only ones who benefit.

Nox, I have a chronic illness which has hugely worsened over the past year and means I can no longer share, but I still did share until I was 34! That's how I managed to save what I did. And even sharing was pretty expensive - certainly not 300 euro a month. We can't all live in the middle of nowhere for our jobs, and people house sharing well into their thirties and beyond is hardly good, is it? How can people have a normal adult life when they're living like students?

The J Stands for Jay

Dizzyblonde wrote: »

I'm being told that the tough years I lived through were actually a Utopian experience.

You aren't being told your experience was utopian, you are being told that your hardships enabled you to get the house on which your current wealth is based. It's not possible for the current generation to survive the hardships necessary to have a paid off house in Dublin by the age you managed it.

HerrKuehn

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

35.

Graduated right into the crisis, emigrated, came back and retrained and now finally in a position to save.

Why?

I was just wondering what was meant by younger generation. I am only 5 years older and I graduated during the tech bubble crash. So, I also emigrated for a while.

The J Stands for Jay

Tony EH wrote: »

I completely agree. The cost of houses have gone through the roof, which is the reason why so many young people are left out of the game. And will be left out of the game, probably for their entire lives, because their is no political inclination to do anything about it.

As I said before, it has bugger all to do with being "willing", or "college", or "emigration" either.

It's cost and opportunity.

The political class are landlords and/or voted in by landlords. They'll not go for policies that will reduce rents or property asset values

Wanderer78

Ush1 wrote: »

What's younger generations? The couple I'm talking about are early thirties. I bought my house when I was 28 in 2012 on my own and was one of the few from my social group who did, why? Cos I didn't fritter every penny I had on other stuff and saved since I started working. I bought a house in a working class area, not Dublin 6 as I couldn't afford it and went from there.

yea, from that age down, is in serious trouble, and this is a growing global problem also, the last crash has crushed these generations, many may never get access to the housing market, ever.

fair play to you for doing so, thats a hell of an achievement, but not all people are the same, not all have the same opportunities, or wishes in life, some want to just be young and have fun, and best of luck to them, lifes for living after all. best of luck with it, you re doing well, im sure its not easy

Yurt2

HerrKuehn wrote: »

I was just wondering what was meant by younger generation. I am only 5 years older and I graduated during the tech bubble crash. So, I also emigrated for a while.

The dot-com crash barely registered in Ireland and was highly industry specific where it did. Comparing the dot com bubble to the GFC is like comparing carpet burn to having your leg amputated.

JimmyVik

I listened to so many of the older generation telling me to buy a house over the years even if i had to live on straw for a few years.
I didnt believe them then.
I believe them now.

I listened to so many of my age group and younger telling me over the years that renting was better than buying.
I believed them.
I dont believe them now

Ush1

Wanderer78 wrote: »

yea, from that age down, is in serious trouble, and this is a growing global problem also, the last crash has crushed these generations, many may never get access to the housing market, ever.

fair play to you for doing so, thats a hell of an achievement, but not all people are the same, not all have the same opportunities, or wishes in life, some want to just be young and have fun, and best of luck to them, lifes for living after all. best of luck with it, you re doing well, im sure its not easy

Of course everyone has different circumstances and expectations. I have young kids and hope they will be able to afford a home later in life so I'm instilling in them the value of money and work ethic from a young age.

Don't ever expect a government to solve your problems would unfortunately be my advice.

HerrKuehn

Yurt! wrote: »

The dot-com crash barely registered in Ireland and was highly industry specific where it did. Comparing the dot com bubble to the GFC is like comparing carpet burn to having your leg amputated.

Well if you were in the industry it had the same effect!

Wanderer78

Ush1 wrote: »

Of course everyone has different circumstances and expectations. I have young kids and hope they will be able to afford a home later in life so I'm instilling in them the value of money and work ethic from a young age.

Don't ever expect a government to solve your problems would unfortunately be my advice.

i certainly hope so to, but be aware, younger generations currently have very limited abilities to change their circumstances, and if we dont change things soon, we could all end up in serious trouble. strangely enough, many of these younger generations are currently heavily dependent on the government as we speak, covid payments etc

Yurt2

HerrKuehn wrote: »

Well if you were in the industry it had the same effect!

Was it any better where you went to? Unlikely. That was a period of breakneck growth in Ireland, wage-growth wise (quality of life matters such as housing left aside) very few industries were hurting and tech wasn't as adversely affected as you're suggesting.

lainey_d_123

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

Nox, I have a chronic illness which has hugely worsened over the past year and means I can no longer share, but I still did share until I was 34! That's how I managed to save what I did. And even sharing was pretty expensive - certainly not 300 euro a month. We can't all live in the middle of nowhere for our jobs, and people house sharing well into their thirties and beyond is hardly good, is it? How can people have a normal adult life when they're living like students?

Firstly I was renting 1.5km from an irish city centre in a very nice estate for between 280 and 300 euro per month, not the middle of nowhere and that was the going rate from around 2009 until I stopped sharing around 2015 or so. I had housemates paying as low as 250 a month in box rooms.

I wasn't suggesting they would have to share into their 30's, I wouldn't do. But with working in your 20's and saving most should be in a position to buy come early 30's or rent with a partner while saving a bit longer etc.

I'm sorry you have a condition that makes things hard but that isn't the case for most. I'm the same age as you so I and all of my friends would have graduated undergrad or finished apprenticeships in the crash and out of lets say my group of friends since school/college so say around 15 or 16 people and the majority are home owners some since their late 20's some more recently. Now many have bought or built in the rural area we are from but houses are not cheap to built but obviously not Dublin prices.

HerrKuehn

Yurt! wrote: »

Was it any better where you went to? Unlikely. That was a period of breakneck growth in Ireland, wage-growth wise (quality of life matters such as housing left aside) very few industries were hurting and tech wasn't as adversely affected as you're suggesting.

It took me until 2005 to get back to work in Ireland. I went back to college for a year and moved abroad to a lower income country for a period of time. Unfortunately the property situation in Ireland in 2005 wasn't great either was it?

The tech industry at that time wasn't great for new grads, no. It wouldn't have been as bad for those with some experience.

JimmyVik

Ush1 wrote: »

Of course everyone has different circumstances and expectations. I have young kids and hope they will be able to afford a home later in life so I'm instilling in them the value of money and work ethic from a young age.

Don't ever expect a government to solve your problems would unfortunately be my advice.

I hear ya.
Im pointing at behaviours all the time certain generation in a certain age group and saying to my kids. "See them. Well dont be like them. Heres how you avoid ending up like them."

Wanderer78

JimmyVik wrote: »

I hear ya.
Im pointing at behaviours all the time certain generation in a certain age group and saying to my kids. "See them. Well dont be like them. Heres how you avoid ending up like them."

some of you folks are seriously living in bubbles, theres a reason why recent election outcomes are so!

Ush1

Wanderer78 wrote: »

i certainly hope so to, but be aware, younger generations currently have very limited abilities to change their circumstances, and if we dont change things soon, we could all end up in serious trouble. strangely enough, many of these younger generations are currently heavily dependent on the government as we speak, covid payments etc

Keep telling yourself you have no agency and you surely never will.

Wanderer78

Ush1 wrote: »

Keep telling yourself you have no agency and you surely never will.

sorry, no idea what you mean now? i know folks in their 60's - 20's, that would be lost without covid payments

beauf

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

I wouldn't say it was far off. The majority of people I went to school and university with left the country in the midst of the 2008 crisis and a lot of them never came back.

Do you not think this is true?

No looking at the stats last year its about a third of what it was in 2012/2013 (2008 wasnt a peak). 2008 was about 60% of the peak, and the 80s peak.