Boomer Wealth

Lillyfae

GreeBo wrote: »

Ah he then went and threw in the big "but" and went on to blame the banks.

Reading to the end of a sentence is very important, especially when taking exams..

Ya, and understanding a whole sentence and not just the last bit of it. I'll make shorter sentences so it's nice and easy for you to understand:

His parents borrowed irresponsibly.
The bank lent irresponsibly.
They were all responsible for the ensuing debt that occurred.
He's not responsible for the debt but he's paying it back regardless.

lainey_d_123

GreeBo wrote: »

*YOU* brought Dublin 6 into the thread as "a normal place" where normal people should be able to live.

I can go quote the posts for you again if you have forgotten what you said?

No, I linked a tiny little studio as an example of how little you get for 200K in a 'nice' bit of the city, and you obsessed about me expecting to live in Rathgar, because you can't read or comprehend the most basic information.

I also linked an absolute kip of a place in Dolphin's Barn, which was barely any cheaper or any bigger and needed significant work doing to it, to illustrate that actually, even the 'not nice' areas are too pricey for someone on an average wage but weirdly you ignored that one because it didn't suit your narrative.

Harry lyme

GreeBo wrote: »

Ah he then went and threw in the big "but" and went on to blame the banks.

Reading to the end of a sentence is very important, especially when taking exams..

Honestly you just seem to be wanting to argue for the sake of it.

Unnecessary personal debt is due to 2 reasons people borrowing who can't afford the repayments (which is what my parents did) and lending institutions lending money to people who clearly can't afford the repayments (which is what the banks did).

If one of the 2 parties involved in the loan behaved in a responsible manner then I wouldn't be in the mess I'm in. Banks/Credit Unions etc have a responsibility to their shareholders to not give money to people who can't afford it.


If the banks had looked at my parents circumstances more carefully and acted in a more prudent fashion then no remortgaging of the house would have have occured and they wouldn't be out money (as they could well be if I decided to tell my parents to **** off and go my own way)

JimmyVik

Geuze wrote: »

Should a single person on average FT earnings (47k) be able to buy an apt inside the M50?

I think they should.

47 * 3.5 = mortgage of 165k

This means we need 80 sqm 2-bedroom apts for 200k inside the M50.

I don't mean in Donnybrook, etc., I mean in places like Glasnevin, Crumlin, etc.

They will be competing with lots of double income couples for those places though. They would be very lucky to have the buying power to beat a double income couple.

GreeBo

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

I literally feel like banging my head off a table.

Can nobody around here actually read?

I'm from Dublin. I could have commuted there no bother, except I couldn't live at home because of family issues including mental illness, abuse and alcoholism. I was asked to pack my bags as soon as I turned 18. Not everyone has a nice, lovely safe home they can live in until they're 30 or when they feel like moving out.

It must be so nice to be as sheltered as you are, Nox. I can't imagine it.

It must be so nice to have a non-normal life and still expect that it should lead to a normal house.

How exactly do you think you should be able to complete with the vast majority of people who didn't leave home at 18 due to family issues and have been working and saving since leaving college?

lainey_d_123

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

I couldn't live at home because of family issues including mental illness, abuse and alcoholism.

If you posted this detail before I didn't see it. I can understand why you had to move out now and it very much makes sense.

A lot of people who "had to move out" simply wanted to though but I am not including you in that bracket given the details you provided.

HerrKuehn

GreeBo wrote: »

It must be so nice to have a non-normal life and still expect that it should lead to a normal house.

How exactly do you think you should be able to complete with the vast majority of people who didn't leave home at 18 due to family issues and have been working and saving since leaving college?

That is a dreadful comment. It wouldn't take a lot to have a bit of empathy for someone who had a rough time.

osarusan

GreeBo wrote: »

It must be so nice to have a non-normal life and still expect that it should lead to a normal house.

How exactly do you think you should be able to complete with the vast majority of people who didn't leave home at 18 due to family issues and have been working and saving since leaving college?

How many f**king times has she said she's looking for a 1-bed flat.


You are seeing what you want to see, and making up what you can't see, so you can make the horsesh!t argument you want to make. Your posts are a joke.

GreeBo

Harry lyme wrote: »

Honestly you just seem to be wanting to argue for the sake of it.

Unnecessary personal debt is due to 2 reasons people borrowing who can't afford the repayments (which is what my parents did) and lending institutions lending money to people who clearly can't afford the repayments (which is what the banks did).

If one of the 2 parties involved in the loan behaved in a responsible manner then I wouldn't be in the mess I'm in. Banks/Credit Unions etc have a responsibility to their shareholders to not give money to people who can't afford it.


If the banks had looked at my parents circumstances more carefully and acted in a more prudent fashion then no remortgaging of the house would have have occured and they wouldn't be out money (as they could well be if I decided to tell my parents to **** off and go my own way)

But the banks are doing ok out of it, they still have the deeds and you are still paying the debt. Why wouldnt they loan in this scenario?

Former Former

SusieBlue wrote: »

If they can’t buy then the alternative is to spend the majority of their income on rent with zero security, where they’ll be out on their ear if they miss a payment. A payment they might not miss if their monthly payment was €900 rather than €1800.
How is that more favourable?

I’d love to know where all these couples earning 80k because it’s definitely not as common as is being made out here. Most earn well below that.

It's not more favorable to them. I understand that.

The average earnings of a full time employee in Ireland is 49k. Two average people will earn 98k.

s1ippy

GreeBo wrote: »

It must be so nice to have a non-normal life and still expect that it should lead to a normal house.

How exactly do you think you should be able to complete with the vast majority of people who didn't leave home at 18 due to family issues and have been working and saving since leaving college?

I'm 30 as well and the bulk of people I know left home at 18 when they started working. It's not at all uncommon.

Many moved back home but many stubborn fuckers like me and my partner toughed it out and never had to move back. We had a deposit and another good bit saved before the pandemic, but now the OH is furloughed so we won't be able to get a mortgage until after he gets back to work. It's a suckers market at the moment anyway, although I don't know if that's going to change in the future. We're staring down the barrel of a tiny home even though we'd prefer, y'know, a grown-up home. I suppose our €9pm Netflix subscription means that we don't deserve one.

Harry lyme

GreeBo wrote: »

But the banks are doing ok out of it, they still have the deeds and you are still paying the debt. Why wouldnt they loan in this scenario?

Excessive personal debt was one of the causes of the banking collapse back at the end of the last decade, the banks had to be bailed out by the taxpayer so they can't have been doing that well from giving all these loans to people if the taxpayer had to bail them out.

SusieBlue

SusieBlue wrote: »

I’d love to know where all these couples earning 80k because it’s definitely not as common as is being made out here. Most earn well below that.

To be honest off the top of my head I don't think there are too many in my circle of friends that by now (mid 30's) are not brining in a household income in the region of 80k or above. Not every single one would be but it would be the exception not to be.

Households are mixtures of public service jobs, finance, IT, engineering, trades people etc all who would be easily enough on 40k minimum by this stage of their career and some double it.

I'm not denying its a challenge to get mortgages even for people on 80k combined but these types of salaries are common place which some don't appear to realise.

GreeBo

HerrKuehn wrote: »

That is a dreadful comment. It wouldn't take a lot to have a bit of empathy for someone who had a rough time.

It's got nothing to do with empathy for a single person's situation.
Im asking how someone who has had it bad can/should expect to compete with someone who has had a normal life?

Other than social housing (which there isnt too much of in D6) how is it possible for both people to buy the same home?
The answer is that its not, and since 1 person has more money than the other, the person with the harder life is going to have to take the worse home in the worse area OR take what they are given by the state.

Complaining that you cant find anywhere nice in D6 or "you expect me to live in dolphins barn?" is living in dream land.

Smee_Again

Former Former wrote: »

It's not more favorable to them. I understand that.

The average earnings of a full time employee in Ireland is 49k. Two average people will earn 98k.

Average income is not good for comparison, median incomes in 2018 were €36,095 while median household income in 2016 was €45,256.

Tony EH

GreeBo wrote: »

It must be so nice to have a non-normal life and still expect that it should lead to a normal house.

Wow.

:rolleyes:

GreeBo

s1ippy wrote: »

I'm 30 as well and the bulk of people I know left home at 18 when they started working. It's not at all uncommon.

Many moved back home but many stubborn fuckers like me and my partner toughed it out and never had to move back. We had a deposit and another good bit saved before the pandemic, but now the OH is furloughed so we won't be able to get a mortgage until after he gets back to work. It's a suckers market at the moment anyway, although I don't know if that's going to change in the future. We're staring down the barrel of a tiny home even though we'd prefer, y'know, a grown-up home. I suppose our €9pm Netflix subscription means that we don't deserve one.

Its not uncommon, but its also not uncommon to live at home through college or rent with 3 other people.

Its probably less about the Netflix sub and more about the "stubborn fuckers" who wanted their own place instead of saving...

How many of the people living at home upto and beyond their 30s do you reckon would have preferred to have their own place but sacrificed that to save?

Wanderer78

GreeBo wrote:

Its probably less about the Netflix sub and more about the "stubborn ****ers" who wanted their own place instead of saving...

So by giving up on luxuries, will get you access to the housing market, even though other potential buyers, might be able to get access to more credit than you?

Former Former

Smee_Again wrote: »

Average income is not good for comparison, median incomes in 2018 were €36,095 while median household income in 2016 was €45,256.

Not really, because that includes all households. Your 90 year old granny living on her own is included in that but she's not really relevant to the housing market. A household completely dependent on social welfare is counted in that and brings it down.

If you're both working full time and not earning 80k combined, then you're below average and you can expect to be at the wrong end of the market.

GreeBo

Wanderer78 wrote: »

So by giving up on luxuries, will get you access to the housing market, even though other potential buyers, might be able to get access to more credit than you?

Why do you reckon the other buyers are getting more credit?
Friends with the bank manager, or perhaps just earn more?

Geuze

Smee_Again wrote: »

Average income is not good for comparison, median incomes in 2018 were €36,095 while median household income in 2016 was €45,256.

Note that the average earnings of mortgage applicants are published.

Hold on while I look for them.

Sheep Shagger

I still think boards isn't a good indication of what people are earning, if you are to believe what you read here the majority of the country in their mid 30s have already reached €50k pa and are still going.....

In reality there are tens if not hundreds of thousands of people working full time who will never get near €50k pa

blanch152

Smee_Again wrote: »

Average income is not good for comparison, median incomes in 2018 were €36,095 while median household income in 2016 was €45,256.

Those median figures, particularly the median household income are artificially depressed by the inclusion in the statistics of those dependant on social welfare.

If you really want to look at housing affordability, you would look at median earnings, excluding those entitled to social housing.

Geuze

Geuze wrote: »

Note that the average earnings of mortgage applicants are published.

Hold on while I look for them.

I think it's here:

https://www.centralbank.ie/publication/household-credit-market-report


https://www.centralbank.ie/docs/default-source/publications/household-credit-market-report/household-credit-market-report-2019.pdf?sfvrsn=6

Yes, see table 1.

Geuze

FTB average incomes per mortgage applicant

Dublin = 89k

Outside Dublin = 68.5k


SSB average incomes per mortgage applicant

Dublin = 137k

Outside Dublin = 98k

lainey_d_123

GreeBo wrote: »

It must be so nice to have a non-normal life and still expect that it should lead to a normal house.

How exactly do you think you should be able to complete with the vast majority of people who didn't leave home at 18 due to family issues and have been working and saving since leaving college?

You are an absolutely horrendous human being. Absolute scum.

I think you'll find that it is pretty 'normal' to move out at 18 for college and not go back, especially in the UK, and even in Ireland. I was not much of an outlier at all at college as someone living in a houseshare.

You should be able to afford to buy a modest home by your mid thirties without living with Mammy the entire time. I'd argue that's not 'normal'.

lainey_d_123

s1ippy wrote: »

I'm 30 as well and the bulk of people I know left home at 18 when they started working. It's not at all uncommon.

Many moved back home but many stubborn fuckers like me and my partner toughed it out and never had to move back. We had a deposit and another good bit saved before the pandemic, but now the OH is furloughed so we won't be able to get a mortgage until after he gets back to work. It's a suckers market at the moment anyway, although I don't know if that's going to change in the future. We're staring down the barrel of a tiny home even though we'd prefer, y'know, a grown-up home. I suppose our €9pm Netflix subscription means that we don't deserve one.

Exactly, this is normal life.

I love all the overgrown babies who sponged off their parents well into adulthood, getting free rent, free food, free broadband lecturing people who actually had to (or chose to) live normal adult lives with normal adult expenses.

It's really quite comical. We could all save a deposit if we sponged off parents while working full time, yes. Most people don't, or can't.

GreeBo

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

You are an absolutely horrendous human being. Absolute scum.

How pleasant.

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

I think you'll find that it is pretty 'normal' to move out at 18 for college and not go back, especially in the UK, and even in Ireland. I was not much of an outlier at all at college as someone living in a houseshare.

Its just as normal not to.

lainey_d_123 wrote: »

You should be able to afford to buy a modest home by your mid thirties without living with Mammy the entire time. I'd argue that's not 'normal'.

Why "should" you? Surely it depends on your income and how much you have saved?
Previous generations often lived at home until getting married and buying a house, with two incomes.

KindOfIrish

Geuze wrote: »

FTB average incomes per mortgage applicant

Dublin = 89k

Outside Dublin = 68.5k


SSB average incomes per mortgage applicant

Dublin = 137k

Outside Dublin = 98k

Excuse me, you are mistaken. It's not an applicant income. It's average household income of those who applied for mortgage.

KindOfIrish

KindOfIrish wrote: »

Excuse me, you are mistaken. It's not an applicant income. It's average household income of those who applied for mortgage.

I would imagine applicant refers to the application which could be either one or two people.