Boomer Wealth

Dizzyblonde

recyclops wrote: »

Which is a large part of the problem, a lot of people want to live in the same places. I grew up in Dublin and always thought I would live there. But soon realised that there was too many people wanting to do the same and this drove prices up.

Realistically I could have done if I saved more but i didn't, i decided the time was right to buy a house in north Wicklow, so I did and it was affordable, neither myself or my now wife earned more than 30000 at the time (which was in the last 4 years)

we can still get out to nights out in Dublin, still get night-links home still see our friends, still go to gigs and football matches etc.

But between 2013-2016 very little of those things happened except having friends over, we didn't stay overnight at friends weddings as that was 200 we could have saved, no holidays and lunches brought to work.

like I said if you want to live in Dublin you save just for a little longer, same reasons above is why I dont drive a Tesla regardless of how much I would want too.

You're living within your means - an alien concept for so many!

Smee_Again

Tony EH wrote: »

And it wouldn't even get you a sniff of a deposit for a house in Dublin.

Nope, and the house price scales up to about €80K-€90K. I've picked January 1983 as the base here for no other reason than it is the year I was born.

So working back from that house price and applying current rules of 10% deposit and 3.5 x salary a person/couple would need to be earning just over €23K to afford the house.

Mortgage payments on £22.5K @ 13% over 25 years would be €322 per month and the average nominal earnings were €815 per month, I'm not sure what take home would be on that though.

Compare that to 2015 when the average industrial wage was €2970.63 meaning an equivalent mortgage payment would be €1176.62 or €253500 @ 2.8% over 25 years.

Thats a decent sized mortgage, and bigger than mine, but you'd need a salary of €72500 to qualify. That salary is 3 times higher than the salary needed in 1983 to pay the same mortgage.

There's a lot that can be picked apart on this comment, but I'm just trying to show that for some there's no amount of living within their means that can change the fact that house prices have far outstripped wages over the last 40 odd years.

Wanderer78

Dizzyblonde wrote:

Good luck with that

It will happen, it has to happen, particularly for your kids and grandkids

Dizzyblonde wrote:

I agree that things are radically different nowadays, and that's a huge challenge for governments. Of course I want to see a better world for my children and grandchildren but nobody is going to tell us we haven't worked hard to have a roof over our heads and a pension. And nobody will be taking it away from us.

I've no doubt you and your partner have worked extremely hard for what you have, most people generally do, we have to stop these generational arguments, as this will require all generations, working together, to solve

PokeHerKing

Tony EH wrote: »

And it wouldn't even get you a sniff of a deposit for a house in Dublin.

Yeah but housing is now a 2 salary game and 40K would get you more than a sniff.

I'm 35 so I don't know what label I fall under and while I see arguments for certain problems I can't help but get the whiff of entitlement off a lot of the posts on this thread. Posters talking about young people have had several recessions at this stage, like age is somehow static..

We're all in the cycles together and believe it or not recessions tend to come round in some shape or form fairly regularly. Every generation sees their fair share of them.

Dizzyblonde

Wanderer78 wrote: »

It will happen, it has to happen, particularly for your kids and grandkids



I've no doubt you and your partner have worked extremely hard for what you have, most people generally do, we have to stop these generational arguments, as this will require all generations, working together, to solve

A lot of our generation are supporting our children with unpaid childcare and in every other way that we can. Not as a burden, we see it as a labour of love and a privilege. It's not the full solution, but it's a start.

Yurt2

markodaly wrote: »

OK, so African Americans can also be conservative and have different thoughts and politics than you or I or your run of the mill Democratic.

Therefore the rest of your argument is Null and void based on this very principal.



Would you have attacked his race if someone quoted a white-man instead of a black man?

Catch yourself on, I never attacked his race. Meh, on your first point.

markodaly

Yurt! wrote: »

Catch yourself on, I never attacked his race. Meh, on your first point.

You brought his race into the discussion and made it the central point of the argument against his views.

Again, would you have done the same if it were a white man who was quoted?

Yurt2

markodaly wrote: »

You brought his race into the discussion and made it the central point of the argument against his views.

Again, would you have done the same if it were a white man who was quoted?

If it was relevant to why he is a shoddy partisan (and it is very much the case with Sowell), then seven days a week I would. Satisfied? Probably not, but I don't care either way. We all know why the right wheels out Sowell, and we all know why he takes the appearance fees.

markodaly

Yurt! wrote: »

If it was relevant to why he is a shoddy partisan

So what does being African American have to do with his political and economic views?

BattleCorp

hotmail.com wrote: »

The 1980s were pretty bleak in Ireland with high unemployment and emigration.

But Jack Charlton 'God Bless His Soul' led us back into the light.

Wanderer78

Dizzyblonde wrote: »

A lot of our generation are supporting our children with unpaid childcare and in every other way that we can. Not as a burden, we see it as a labour of love and a privilege. It's not the full solution, but it's a start.

oh i know, i see it all the time around me, and you get to spend time with your grand kids and vice-versa, which is critical for everyone involved, but even offering encouragement to younger generations, to force some radical changes, might just help, we all need each other, for this to happen

Tony EH

Smee_Again wrote: »

There's a lot that can be picked apart on this comment, but I'm just trying to show that for some there's no amount of living within their means that can change the fact that house prices have far outstripped wages over the last 40 odd years.

I completely agree. The cost of houses have gone through the roof, which is the reason why so many young people are left out of the game. And will be left out of the game, probably for their entire lives, because their is no political inclination to do anything about it.

As I said before, it has bugger all to do with being "willing", or "college", or "emigration" either.

It's cost and opportunity.

Wanderer78

Tony EH wrote: »

I completely agree. The cost of houses have gone through the roof, which is the reason why so many young people are left out of the game. And will be left out of the game, probably for their entire lives, because their is no political inclination to do anything about it.

As I said before, it has bugger all to do with being "willing", or "college", or "emigration" either.

It's cost and opportunity.

credit, credit, credit, and even more credit!

Dizzyblonde

Wanderer78 wrote: »

oh i know, i see it all the time around me, and you get to spend time with your grand kids and vice-versa, which is critical for everyone involved, but even offering encouragement to younger generations, to force some radical changes, might just help, we all need each other, for this to happen

All very true - but who's going to break it to the "entitled ones" coming up behind you? That's a whole other story :pac:

Wanderer78

Dizzyblonde wrote: »

All very true - but who's going to break it to the "entitled ones" coming up behind you? That's a whole other story :pac:

well i guess it depends, who you mean by the entitled, we truly do need to de-personalise these debates, as our reality is in fact extremely complex, our wealth inequality issues are far more complex, that just wealthier individuals, theres an extremely strong potential for the whole ship to go down, and it wont matter how much wealth you have accumulated, if it does

Dizzyblonde

Wanderer78 wrote: »

well i guess it depends, who you mean by the entitled, we truly do need to de-personalise these debates, as our reality is in fact extremely complex, our wealth inequality issues are far more complex, that just wealthier individuals, theres an extremely strong potential for the whole ship to go down, and it wont matter how much wealth you have accumulated, if it does

The problem is, those with accumulated wealth never suffer the way the rest of us do. Do you think Bill Cullen, when he went bankrupt, was left homeless and renting a tiny flat? Not a chance.

You can't deny that there are a lot of 20-somethings who have been handed pretty much everything they wanted, and more, since birth, and it's going to be harder for them than for any generation before them to have to stand on their own feet. Not all of them, but a large enough portion. That's not personalising, that's fact.

Naos

Dizzyblonde wrote: »

All very true - but who's going to break it to the "entitled ones" coming up behind you? That's a whole other story :pac:

It really feels like you're not getting it, even after 'Smee Again' broke it down for you.

Also don't forget, the house you bought at 22 - new house or old house?

Heres Johnny

Bandana boy wrote: »

25K @20% over 20 years will cost you 100K not 30K

My god, the financial illiteracy of some people is shocking isn't it?
The interest in the first year is 5k alone.

Ush1

flynnlives wrote: »

have you seen the price of schooling? child care? etc.
Have you noticed many are having families later on in life, some even not bothering cause they cant afford it. Why is that?

They cant even afford a deposit for a house let alone childcare. This is on top of effectively paying the same rates of tax as our parents paid. Why? because salaries have not increased in line with inflation, yet dozens and dozens of stealth taxes have appeared.

Im afraid your not cognizant of the realities of Ireland today. And that reality is about to get significantly worse. This recession is only beginning.

im sorry but my generation is coming into power and we see were the wealth is. Its inevitable that older generations are going to need to contribute more.

And your point about socialism is funny. In the 60s,70s,80s the councils built massive amounts of social housing. That generation reaped that reward. Neo-liberalism stopped all that in the 90s.
That generation who got free housing voted to end it. And now look at the mess we are in. So im sorry, that generation, the older generation benefited quite nicely from socialism.


The truth is the older generation got their goodies on credit. Then pulled the ladder up. Now its the younger generation stuck with the tab.

There was never free housing, someone has to pay for everything.

The White Wolf

Edgware wrote: »

The 25 to 35 age bracket certainly have it difficult to purchase property. The reluctance of the older generation to downsize means that funds they could release to their children are being held back while often one elderly parent toddles around a large house complaing about the cost of heating. Smaller families now mean that when the parent dies the two or three children will get a cash injection. Even an average 3 bed in Dublin will be around the high 300 thousands. Inheritance figures allow up 360000 approx to be left to a child of the deceased tax free. That can be released earlier.
Greater availability of good quality retirement villages which offered services, social companionship etc should be developed where seniors could still have their freedom and own front door access. The present emphasis of putting Mammy into a nursing home and made sit down for the day listening to Fostrr and Allen hasnt proved to be a success particularly during Covid

Jesus, the bloody entitlement of this post. Shocking.

joseywhales

The White Wolf wrote: »

Jesus, the bloody entitlement of this post. Shocking.

It's like he forgot about the basic human right of autonomy and choice.

Dizzyblonde

Naos wrote: »

It really feels like you're not getting it, even after 'Smee Again' broke it down for you.

Also don't forget, the house you bought at 22 - new house or old house?

I get it all right. I'm not sure what you're actually looking for here - we saved, we bought a house, we lived hand to mouth for years while interest rates were through the roof and income tax was high. You might not think that's anything to be proud of but I do. I'm also proud of my kids who struggled and bought their own homes too, in the past few years.

It's difficult today, more difficult in some ways. Nobody is disputing that.

Heres Johnny

Myself, my brother and my sister all bought houses in West Dublin and North kildare in our late 20s in the last 10 years. Saved deposits and got mortgages. What's the problem with everyone else doing that? I shared rented house while saving too. So did my sister. My brother rented a room from me while saving and he had his deposit with his girlfriend in 2 years after returning from Australia.

Save 50 quid a week from when you start working and you've 25000 + for a deposit by time you're 30. 50000+ if 2 people do it.

flynnlives

flynnlives wrote: »

The truth is the older generation got their goodies on credit. Then pulled the ladder up. Now its the younger generation stuck with the tab.

The older generation have kids who they help with deposits, childcare etc. The older generation deserve every cent they have and I frankly think your opinions are disgusting.

The only people who should benefit from the wealth in a family is the next generation of that family.

genius200iq

Boomers now in retirement "have all the wealth" this wealth is dependent on the younger generations working and paying into the system, unfortunately the youth have gotten screwed by this deal and are checking out, and the whole system is undergoing a change before our eyes.
Dollar , Euro, Pound and other currencies are loosing value every month, printing presses running around the clock, the young are putting a few quid every month into crypto currency and not the stock market, the next 5 years will be really interesting.

coinop

genius200iq wrote: »

The young are putting a few quid every month into crypto currency and not the stock market, the next 5 years will be really interesting.

I don't think cryptocurrency is popular in Ireland at all. I'd be surprised if even 0.5% of the population possessed some. The country is full of people hiding cash under the mattress and who don't even trust bank accounts ffs. Have a quick browse of this thread if you want to lose all hope in Ireland.

Pkiernan

flynnlives wrote: »

There needs to be a rapid redistribution of wealth in this country from the over 55's to the younger demographics.

There is vasts amounts of wealth in this country locked away in property and gold plated public service pensions. Majority held in the older demographic.

The economy is unsustainable for Housing to continue to be unaffordable for young people. Never mind it being immoral.

What gets me most is this im alright jack attitude from the 55+ generation. Oh we had it bad in the 80s etc.
Thing is despite the high interest rates and income tax back then they could still afford a house on one income. They fail to mention that part.
You would need to be earning in the 1% today to get a single income mortgage in a Irish city.

LOL.

coinop

Pkiernan wrote: »

LOL.

You laugh but this is what PBP/Shinnerbots actually believe. People who have no vested interest in society and don't own anything because they never earned anything want to either steal it or destroy it.

Pkiernan

Dizzyblonde wrote: »

I get it all right. I'm not sure what you're actually looking for here - we saved, we bought a house, we lived hand to mouth for years while interest rates were through the roof and income tax was high. You might not think that's anything to be proud of but I do. I'm also proud of my kids who struggled and bought their own homes too, in the past few years.

It's difficult today, more difficult in some ways. Nobody is disputing that.

Modern snowflakes have it so tough, but still have money for E1200 phones, 2 holidays a year, PCP new cars, E7 pints and E4 coffees.

Try a concept known as "saving" .

beauf

genius200iq wrote: »

Boomers now in retirement "have all the wealth" this wealth is dependent on the younger generations working and paying into the system, unfortunately the youth have gotten screwed by this deal and are checking out, and the whole system is undergoing a change before our eyes......

I think you'll find the boomers aren't dependent on the younger generation. The foundations of what they have was earned before the younger generation was born.

If the younger generations "check out" all they are doing stripping the security of their older selves. They may realise this too late however.