Cocaine etc is everywhere?

GiftofGab

The lads that say they never see it must think there is an awful lot of people in bars/clubs that constantly need to take a s*it.

GiftofGab

Was chatting to an Australian guy before in a bar on Harcourt street. He asked me where could I get some in Dublin city centre. Told him who to look out for and which places to visit - he had a bag within 30 mins and first time in the city.

corner of hells

Gretas Gonna Get Ya! wrote: »

But if the crane driver kills someone, and they find illegal drugs in his system what happens to him currently? They'll nail him to the wall.

If cocaine is legal, what happens to him? How long do these drugs stay in your system for? Much longer than alcohol in many cases.

It just seems totally unworkable when you really think about it on a practical level. Those are only a few professions I thought up off the top of my head - you could think of dozens and dozens more!

If these drugs are legal, why shouldn't the medical professionals have their fun at the weekend too? They work hard during the week... let them have their coke at the strip club too!

I thought you guys wanted these drugs to be legal? Oh, but not for the surgeon operating on you, right? And not for anyone else who you rely on to do their job to high standard on a monday morning... (Which basically means most of society in reality)

People have not thought through the full ramifications of legalizing all these drugs. You would be opening a giant big can off worms, with new problems that will crop up every year. It's a minefield of headaches - nothing like the overly simplistic utopian vision that many delusional potheads have cooked up in their brains!

I'm not so sure you can do a drugs test on an employee in Ireland unless its written into a contract of employment and even then sourcing an analysis may be difficult.

Gretas Gonna Get Ya!

begbysback wrote: »

If that’s what the doctor wants then yes, same as if he drinks too much or goes into work drunk, no difference, there are already requirements for work practices in place today for such roles.

So then the Doctor can't enjoy these legal drugs safely and still do his/her job on a monday morning? Great we have that sorted. Thanks for answering my question.

Now, who else cannot consume these drugs at the weekend and safely do their job on monday morning?

What about a humble warehouse worker, earning minimum wage? Can that guy go out on the weekend and have his fun like everyone else with these new legal drugs?

Is he safe to do his job on monday morning in the warehouse, driving his forklift etc?

I can keep going on all day picking out different professions, if you like?

kenmm wrote: »

Yeah look, if you are a Dr, driver, whatever then you know you can't go to work half from cut the night before. If drug whatever was made legal tomorrow, then it would be regulated which means working out safe limits to have in your system for consumption, driving etc. Anyone exceeding these would be done (as is the case now).

But which professions can take these drugs at the weekend, and still be safe to do their job on monday morning? How long does each drug stay in your system, and how will citizens responsibly use these drugs and know that they are safe to work the following monday?

You'll find yourself running out of people pretty soon, who can realistically use these drugs in a responsible way. But they're completely legal, and widely available - so many people will be tempted to try them.

Alcohol actually leaves your system very quickly compared to many other recreational drugs. So it's not a great example to compare with many of these other drugs.

kenmm

Gretas Gonna Get Ya! wrote: »

So then the Doctor can't enjoy these legal drugs safely and still do his/her job on a monday morning? Great we have that sorted. Thanks for answering my question.

Now, who else cannot consume these drugs at the weekend and safely do their job on monday morning?

What about a humble warehouse worker, earning minimum wage? Can that guy go out on the weekend and have his fun like everyone else with these new legal drugs?

Is he safe to do his job on monday morning in the warehouse, driving his forklift etc?

I can keep going on all day picking out different professions, if you like?



But which professions can take these drugs at the weekend, and still be safe to do their job on monday morning? How long does each drug stay in your system, and how will citizens responsibly use these drugs and know that they are safe to work the following monday?

You'll find yourself running out of people pretty soon, who can realistically use these drugs in a responsible way. But they're completely legal, and widely available - so many people will be tempted to try them.

Alcohol actually leaves your system very quickly compared to many other recreational drugs. So it's not a great example to compare with many of these other drugs.

Ye, so tough luck then if you are a Dr and you like to smoke a lot of weed.
I don't know how long the effects of coke, for example, really stay in the system, probably nothing a Monday off couldn't cover. If you like drugs more than your job then the choice is clear anyway.
The limits would need to be determined. It's probably not gonna happen.

Btw, there are already industries where drug testing is standard part of contracts.

kenmm

And btw, I dunno how we turned this into a legalisation thread, but as you can see it's a complete minefield and that's *just" talking about those that would want to use whatever would be made legal..

Never mind the support that would be needed for those who would need it and how to sell drugs in a controlled manner and in what formats and by who etc .

john123470

Jeez, the place is bad enough without legalizing Coke.

If Coke were legalized, we would have pure uncut product. I don't do Coke but pure, uncut, i'd probly queue up for that. Its 20 odd yrs since i tried the stuff. I remember being given a sample. I tried it once the dealer had left and was at his door before he got home from our meet up. Looking for more.

True, not everyone will behave like me but if you make the stuff legal, readily available - you are asking for trouble.

If you want to legalize anything, legalize weed. At least there's less chance you'll be out mugging old ladies to score.
The powders are another matter entirely. Sure, you may do it for a long while without any problems. But, with enough usage, it will start destroying your nasal cavities; your physical health; the come downs will be hellish. It will affect your relationships, general sense if well being

And one fine day, when life throws you a realcurve ball - as she does - your usage will go off the charts. I've seen it happen with too many people. Simply not worth even trying the stuff.

Diminishing returns from 1st usage, unless you use very sparingly. But again, as above, when hard times roll in, there is a very high possibility you will reach for your substance to help you through it all

Best high i've ever had was from physical training. Being slave to a substance is a nightmare. Run from the Beast !

kenmm

john123470 wrote: »

Jeez, the place is bad enough without legalizing Coke.

If Coke were legalized, we would have pure uncut product. I don't do Coke but pure, uncut, i'd probly queue up for that. Its 20 odd yrs since i tried the stuff. I remember being given a sample. I tried it once the dealer had left and was at his door before he got home from our meet up. Looking for more.

True, not everyone will behave like me but if you make the stuff legal, readily available - you are asking for trouble.

If you want to legalize anything, legalize weed. At least there's less chance you'll be out mugging old ladies to score.
The powders are another matter entirely. Sure, you may do it for a long while without any problems. But, with enough usage, it will start destroying your nasal cavities; your physical health; the come downs will be hellish. It will affect your relationships, general sense if well being

And one fine day, when life throws you a realcurve ball - as she does - your usage will go off the charts. I've seen it happen with too many people. Simply not worth even trying the stuff.

Diminishing returns from 1st usage, unless you use very sparingly. But again, as above, when hard times roll in, there is a very high possibility you will reach for your substance to help you through it all

Best high i've ever had was from physical training. Being slave to a substance is a nightmare. Run from the Beast !

I'd agree with a kit if that, except maybe the weed. A lot if people would be fine, but a lot of people struggle with long term effects, particularly with the stronger strains that are appearing these days..

I doubt any change in legalisation will happen, except maybe decriminalisation.

B.A._Baracus

I cannot understand why anyone does coke.
I like a drink myself so I am not some t-total "my body is a temple" type of person. So I like a buzz as much as the next man. But how coke is made is shocking.

Plenty of documentaries made over the years. One even by Gordon Ramsey who am sure given his profession and celebrity fame has surely dabbed in it at some point. But his documentary shows all the chemicals that goes into it such as using petrol or kerosene to break down the coca leaf. Then they use bleach and lye to further refine to make the paste. then the paste is sold to the cartels to turn it into powder. Adding their own processes.

Then it gets cut down with only God knows what along the chain before you snort it up your nose.

Just doesn't make much sense to take it. I'm not a drug person. Don't even take hash but at least with hash it's herbal. It's natural. I can see the arguments made about it. But not coke.

Hey, each to their own tho I guess.

Lockheed

Gretas Gonna Get Ya! wrote: »

So then the Doctor can't enjoy these legal drugs safely and still do his/her job on a monday morning? Great we have that sorted. Thanks for answering my question.

Now, who else cannot consume these drugs at the weekend and safely do their job on monday morning?

What about a humble warehouse worker, earning minimum wage? Can that guy go out on the weekend and have his fun like everyone else with these new legal drugs?

Is he safe to do his job on monday morning in the warehouse, driving his forklift etc?

I can keep going on all day picking out different professions, if you like?



But which professions can take these drugs at the weekend, and still be safe to do their job on monday morning? How long does each drug stay in your system, and how will citizens responsibly use these drugs and know that they are safe to work the following monday?

You'll find yourself running out of people pretty soon, who can realistically use these drugs in a responsible way. But they're completely legal, and widely available - so many people will be tempted to try them.

Alcohol actually leaves your system very quickly compared to many other recreational drugs. So it's not a great example to compare with many of these other drugs.

You seem to have absolutely no clue of the social effects that banning a substance has on a society.

Also i dont know what dream land you think a country with legalized drugs is like, but it isn't cocaine on every shelf in every shop, and you won't see everyone from the doctor to the cleaner on drugs.
All it does is further reduce the negative social impact from the black market for drugs, it stops putting addicts behind bars (who are the victims, addiction is a disease), and better still, the millions of euros going into the pointless fight against drugs can be put to better use in community employment schemes and rehabilitation facilities.

Portugal is a great example, legalising drugs recreationally lead to lower crime across all departments. Less people were caught drug driving - because get this - it lead to a decrease in drug use. Legalizing drugs correlates with drug use going down, which is the opposite to what you seem to believe would happen. More people had the chance to go to rehab, instead of a prison cell. The gangsters were hit hard and the addicts were given a chance to break free from the vicious cycle that banning drugs perpetuates.

Gretas Gonna Get Ya!

Lockheed wrote: »

You seem to have absolutely no clue of the social effects that banning a substance has on a society.

Also i dont know what dream land you think a country with legalized drugs is like, but it isn't cocaine on every shelf in every shop, and you won't see everyone from the doctor to the cleaner on drugs.
All it does is further reduce the negative social impact from the black market for drugs, it stops putting addicts behind bars (who are the victims, addiction is a disease), and better still, the millions of euros going into the pointless fight against drugs can be put to better use in community employment schemes and rehabilitation facilities.

Are you naive enough to think that doctors and cleaners are not already taking drugs?

If you make them legal and easy to obtain, then more doctors and cleaners will be taking them... that's guaranteed. Why would it be any different to alcohol in how ubiquitous it becomes?

If drugs like coke are popular already, even while illegal, stands to reason they will grow in popularity when we legalize them and make them easier to obtain. Its just obvious and common sense.

Handing out stiff fines for personal possession, can also be used for drug rehabilitation and awareness etc.

Legalizing drugs will only get rid of the criminality. It does nothing to stop the problem of widespread drug use in society. (which is a much bigger problem than the drug gangs)

Portugal is a great example, legalising drugs recreationally lead to lower crime across all departments. Less people were caught drug driving - because get this - it lead to a decrease in drug use. Legalizing drugs correlates with drug use going down, which is the opposite to what you seem to believe would happen. More people had the chance to go to rehab, instead of a prison cell. The gangsters were hit hard and the addicts were given a chance to break free from the vicious cycle that banning drugs perpetuates.

Portugal didn't legalize drugs. They decriminalized them. There is a difference.

And contrary to some reports, drug use has not been reduced significantly by these measures, because they simply codified into law what they had already basically been practicing already by being extremely lenient on drug users in the court system. Overall it is very difficult to accurately gauge what the long term effects of decriminalization will be in portugal - it's a wait and see scenario.

Many experts actually believe that it's easier to get serious drug users into rehab, when they are in the prison system. Everyone with a drug dependency problem in Ireland, that enters our prison system, gets sent into drug rehab. It's usually part of the conditions if they want any chance at early release or reduced sentence etc.

kenmm

B.A._Baracus wrote: »

I cannot understand why anyone does coke.
I like a drink myself so I am not some t-total "my body is a temple" type of person. So I like a buzz as much as the next man. But how coke is made is shocking.

Plenty of documentaries made over the years. One even by Gordon Ramsey who am sure given his profession and celebrity fame has surely dabbed in it at some point. But his documentary shows all the chemicals that goes into it such as using petrol or kerosene to break down the coca leaf. Then they use bleach and lye to further refine to make the paste. then the paste is sold to the cartels to turn it into powder. Adding their own processes.

Then it gets cut down with only God knows what along the chain before you snort it up your nose.

Just doesn't make much sense to take it. I'm not a drug person. Don't even take hash but at least with hash it's herbal. It's natural. I can see the arguments made about it. But not coke.

Hey, each to their own tho I guess.

If you are the curious type and get an, ahem, nose for it then you will not give a flying f how it's made. Ethics and thoughts about petrol etc go out the window when you are chasing a high. It's just how bias and our brains work.
(Remember, at times when alcohol has been illegal, people have been drinking all sorts of dodgy alcohols)

Additionally, weed and hash over the years hasn't exactly been free from tampering. Smoked many a plastic bag or tyre in my younger days..

B.A._Baracus

kenmm wrote: »

If you are the curious type and get an, ahem, nose for it then you will not give a flying f how it's made. Ethics and thoughts about petrol etc go out the window when you are chasing a high. It's just how bias and our brains work.
(Remember, at times when alcohol has been illegal, people have been drinking all sorts of dodgy alcohols)

Additionally, weed and hash over the years hasn't exactly been free from tampering. Smoked many a plastic bag or tyre in my younger days..

A good point.

corner of hells

Gretas Gonna Get Ya! wrote: »

Are you naive enough to think that doctors and cleaners are not already taking drugs?

If you make them legal and easy to obtain, then more doctors and cleaners will be taking them... that's guaranteed. Why would it be any different to alcohol in how ubiquitous it becomes?

If drugs like coke are popular already, even while illegal, stands to reason they will grow in popularity when we legalize them and make them easier to obtain. Its just obvious and common sense.

Handing out stiff fines for personal possession, can also be used for drug rehabilitation and awareness etc.

Legalizing drugs will only get rid of the criminality. It does nothing to stop the problem of widespread drug use in society. (which is a much bigger problem than the drug gangs)



Portugal didn't legalize drugs. They decriminalized them. There is a difference.

And contrary to some reports, drug use has not been reduced significantly by these measures, because they simply codified into law what they had already basically been practicing already by being extremely lenient on drug users in the court system. Overall it is very difficult to accurately gauge what the long term effects of decriminalization will be in portugal - it's a wait and see scenario.

Many experts actually believe that it's easier to get serious drug users into rehab, when they are in the prison system. Everyone with a drug dependency problem in Ireland, that enters our prison system, gets sent into drug rehab. It's usually part of the conditions if they want any chance at early release or reduced sentence etc.

Nobody get sent to rehabilitation in the Irish prison services , if you enter custody on methadone you will be provided your prescription, if you need to or want to start on a methadone maintenance program, the option is there once you meet the criteria.
Theres a very small number of supervised medical detox beds .
With some individuals stabilisation is as good as it gets with detox not achievable .

john123470

Lockheed wrote: »

Portugal is a great example, legalising drugs recreationally lead to lower crime across all departments. Less people were caught drug driving - because get this - it lead to a decrease in drug use. Legalizing drugs correlates with drug use going down, which is the opposite to what you seem to believe would happen. More people had the chance to go to rehab, instead of a prison cell. The gangsters were hit hard and the addicts were given a chance to break free from the vicious cycle that banning drugs perpetuates.

^^is not entirely accurate. Portugal decriminalized Not "legalized" drugs - a big difference. In fact, if you are caught with more than 10 days supply of a drug (whatever drug), you can still be penalized eg given community service etc tho this is rarely enforced.
What does happen is that, if caught, you are encouraged tho not obliged, to seek treatment.

Also outreach programmes see volunteers go out in the field and supply clean needles etc. Some supervised injection centres have also opened.

The article concludes :

"There is essentially no relationship between the punitiveness of a country’s drug laws and its rates of drug use. Instead, drug use tends to rise and fall in line with broader cultural, social or economic trends"

Ref:
https://transformdrugs.org/drug-decriminalisation-in-portugal-setting-the-record-straight/

Tomaldo

Gretas Gonna Get Ya! wrote: »

Are you naive enough to think that doctors and cleaners are not already taking drugs?

If you make them legal and easy to obtain, then more doctors and cleaners will be taking them... that's guaranteed. Why would it be any different to alcohol in how ubiquitous it becomes?

If drugs like coke are popular already, even while illegal, stands to reason they will grow in popularity when we legalize them and make them easier to obtain. Its just obvious and common sense.

Handing out stiff fines for personal possession, can also be used for drug rehabilitation and awareness etc.

Legalizing drugs will only get rid of the criminality. It does nothing to stop the problem of widespread drug use in society. (which is a much bigger problem than the drug gangs)



Portugal didn't legalize drugs. They decriminalized them. There is a difference.

And contrary to some reports, drug use has not been reduced significantly by these measures, because they simply codified into law what they had already basically been practicing already by being extremely lenient on drug users in the court system. Overall it is very difficult to accurately gauge what the long term effects of decriminalization will be in portugal - it's a wait and see scenario.

Many experts actually believe that it's easier to get serious drug users into rehab, when they are in the prison system. Everyone with a drug dependency problem in Ireland, that enters our prison system, gets sent into drug rehab. It's usually part of the conditions if they want any chance at early release or reduced sentence etc.

It's gas the way u use the words 'will, would or guaranteed' when you're talking about the future. Will u lend me ur crystal ball, I wanna get the winning lottery numbers. Sadly you're not the only prohibitionist who confuses opinion as fact.

Gretas Gonna Get Ya!

corner of hells wrote: »

Nobody get sent to rehabilitation in the Irish prison services , if you enter custody on methadone you will be provided your prescription, if you need to or want to start on a methadone maintenance program, the option is there once you meet the criteria.
Theres a very small number of supervised medical detox beds .
With some individuals stabilisation is as good as it gets with detox not achievable .

That's not the same picture that's been given to me by several prison guards and ex-prison guards.

Rhode Island in the US has shown huge success by locking up addicts. Their prison-based opiate treatment has been shown to work very well. 61% decline in overdoses from former prisoners, and 12% decline in the general population after they implemented their program.

So that would appear to fly in the face of the notion that you shouldn't lock up addicts.

Tomaldo wrote: »

It's gas the way u use the words 'will, would or guaranteed' when you're talking about the future. Will u lend me ur crystal ball, I wanna get the winning lottery numbers. Sadly you're not the only prohibitionist who confuses opinion as fact.

If you want a crystal ball, go look at how they're getting on in San Francisco or LA with decriminalization / legalization measures. One of the worst drug crisis in their country's history. (Which some are trying to cover up by referring to it as a homelessness crisis - a giant lie and a cover up job!)

Tomaldo

Gretas Gonna Get Ya! wrote: »

That's not the same picture that's been given to me by several prison guards and ex-prison guards.

Rhode Island in the US has shown huge success by locking up addicts. Their prison-based opiate treatment has been shown to work very well. 61% decline in overdoses from former prisoners, and 12% decline in the general population after they implemented their program.

So that would appear to fly in the face of the notion that you shouldn't lock up addicts.



If you want a crystal ball, go look at how they're getting on in San Francisco or LA with decriminalization / legalization measures. One of the worst drug crisis in their country's history. (Which some are trying to cover up by referring to it as a homelessness crisis - a giant lie and a cover up job!)

McCartney, Jagger, Bill Clinton, Steve Jobs, Richard Branson and Brian Cowen took it, as far as I know, none of them ended up homeless

Wanderer78

Gretas Gonna Get Ya! wrote:

So that would appear to fly in the face of the notion that you shouldn't lock up addicts.

Its always important to realise, data always includes 'inherent and confirmation biases', particulary in relation to complex human behavioural issues, always take it with a pinch of salt, it's extremely difficult to gather accurate data, from such situations, because of these complexities, and then to make assumptions from such data, it becomes extremely messy and gray, very quickly.

I wouldn't lock up addicts in jails as such, as it signifies 'punishment', for what is an extremely complex psychological issue or issues, which may or may not be similar to other inmates. Of course, if those addicts commit crimes, that are worthy of incarceration, and are jailed via the justice system, so be it, but rehabilitation is absolutely necessary from within the prison system then. But jailing addicts for just being addicts, absolutely not!

Gretas Gonna Get Ya! wrote:

If you want a crystal ball, go look at how they're getting on in San Francisco or LA with decriminalization / legalization measures. One of the worst drug crisis in their country's history. (Which some are trying to cover up by referring to it as a homelessness crisis - a giant lie and a cover up job!)

Addiction and homelessness is extraordinary complex, clear cut correlations currently cannot be truly made, but we are learning extremely quickly, but we will probably be always searching for the deeper reasons for their existence, and in ways, thankfully so. I do believe decriminalization/delegalistion is possibly a better way to 'manage' these complexities, but that will introduce it's own set of problems and exasperate pre-existing ones, I.E. There's currently, no perfect, clear cut solutions to these complex issues, and in fact, there may never be, unfortunately, but I have heard from mental health professionals, without some sort of security in accommodational needs, you can't even begin to deal with the addition issues, disturbingly, we re all, mostly, and currently, following this path!

Wanderer78

Tomaldo wrote:

McCartney, Jagger, Bill Clinton, Steve Jobs, Richard Branson and Brian Cowen took it, as far as I know, none of them ended up homeless

Again, the correlation between using drugs, and homelessness, is far from clear cut, an astonishing level of complexity occurs for such outcomes

dartboardio

Yes, it is everywhere. Even online.

My friend ordered some online a few times, no issues either, postman dropped it right in the letter box :V

Wanderer78

dartboardio wrote: »

Yes, it is everywhere. Even online.

My friend ordered some online a few times, no issues either, postman dropped it right in the letter box :V

fair play to him, sound postman

IAMAMORON

I see and hear people name dropping famous people into the mix when whatabouting etc.

I have a friend who works in media in the UK. Everyone is on it. Not just the media, all the paper journalists working in " celeb" media, the photographers, the cameramen, the TV hosts, X factor judges you name it.

He says that obvious some musicians are heavy also, but he said also you would be surprised about how " woke " artists can be towards drug abuse. Some modern pop stars would not touch it, regularly anyways. The days of sex n drugs n rock n roll can depend on the appetite of the artist or the band. Some do, some don't. The Z listers and media hounds are all on it.

He says awards ceremonies are just one large great big cocaine orgy, they go on for days.

I would love to hear what the craic is with Irish media, but I doubt there is much of a difference?

kenmm

IAMAMORON wrote: »

I would love to hear what the craic is with Irish media, but I doubt there is much of a difference?

Probably the same - also some other industries - recruitment/sales for example - full o the young uns with lots of tasty big bonuses to be spent!

Wanderer78

IAMAMORON wrote: »

I see and hear people name dropping famous people into the mix when whatabouting etc.

I have a friend who works in media in the UK. Everyone is on it. Not just the media, all the paper journalists working in " celeb" media, the photographers, the cameramen, the TV hosts, X factor judges you name it.

He says that obvious some musicians are heavy also, but he said also you would be surprised about how " woke " artists can be towards drug abuse. Some modern pop stars would not touch it, regularly anyways. The days of sex n drugs n rock n roll can depend on the appetite of the artist or the band. Some do, some don't. The Z listers and media hounds are all on it.

He says awards ceremonies are just one large great big cocaine orgy, they go on for days.

I would love to hear what the craic is with Irish media, but I doubt there is much of a difference?

spot on, thankfully more and more are becoming more aware of the dangers, and are simply not touching it, id be fcuked now if i did, unfortunately people will probably always indulge, we just need to change and adapt how we deal with it, because we really arent doing that at the moment

Gretas Gonna Get Ya!

Gretas Gonna Get Ya! wrote: »

But if the crane driver kills someone, and they find illegal drugs in his system what happens to him currently? They'll nail him to the wall.

If cocaine is legal, what happens to him? How long do these drugs stay in your system for? Much longer than alcohol in many cases.

It just seems totally unworkable when you really think about it on a practical level. Those are only a few professions I thought up off the top of my head - you could think of dozens and dozens more!

If these drugs are legal, why shouldn't the medical professionals have their fun at the weekend too? They work hard during the week... let them have their coke at the strip club too!

I thought you guys wanted these drugs to be legal? Oh, but not for the surgeon operating on you, right? And not for anyone else who you rely on to do their job to high standard on a monday morning... (Which basically means most of society in reality)

People have not thought through the full ramifications of legalizing all these drugs. You would be opening a giant big can off worms, with new problems that will crop up every year. It's a minefield of headaches - nothing like the overly simplistic utopian vision that many delusional potheads have cooked up in their brains!

I'm sorry but this is a load of nonsense - the proportion of people who do not partake in drugs solely due to their illegal status is minimal. In the current market anybody who wants to take drugs can generally get their hands on it within 24hrs.

You're making it out as if people are suddenly going to take up heroin in their droves as soon as it becomes legal, as if legality was the thing holding them back from that. Simply not the case - yeah with legalisation you'd probably observe a small temporary increase in use, but that'd only be due to novelty and things would return to equilibrium quite soon.

And as to your first point, were cocaine to be legalised and found in the system of a crane operator who killed someone, why would it be any different to him killing someone while pissed out of his skull on morning vodka?

Tomaldo

IAMAMORON wrote: »

I see and hear people name dropping famous people into the mix when whatabouting etc.

I have a friend who works in media in the UK. Everyone is on it. Not just the media, all the paper journalists working in " celeb" media, the photographers, the cameramen, the TV hosts, X factor judges you name it.

He says that obvious some musicians are heavy also, but he said also you would be surprised about how " woke " artists can be towards drug abuse. Some modern pop stars would not touch it, regularly anyways. The days of sex n drugs n rock n roll can depend on the appetite of the artist or the band. Some do, some don't. The Z listers and media hounds are all on it.

He says awards ceremonies are just one large great big cocaine orgy, they go on for days.

I would love to hear what the craic is with Irish media, but I doubt there is much of a difference?

I believe Elvis and Michael Jackson didn't take illegal drugs but wasn't it legal ones that contributed/caused their deaths. I heard Mr Presley ate a lot of junk food so that probably didn't help him.
Regarding the Irish media, we know Gerry Ryan did and Eamon Dunphy said u can't get good coke 'round here. I'd be amazed if they were/are the only ones.

IAMAMORON

Wanderer78 wrote: »

spot on, thankfully more and more are becoming more aware of the dangers, and are simply not touching it, id be fcuked now if i did, unfortunately people will probably always indulge, we just need to change and adapt how we deal with it, because we really arent doing that at the moment

Sounds easy spouting that from behind the safe confines of your Laptop. But I give you 2 weeks hanging around the media/music scene in London with wannabe models, PR agents, record dealers and rest of it and see how long you might last wanderer. You might never come home:).

Wanderer78

IAMAMORON wrote: »

Sounds easy spouting that from behind the safe confines of your Laptop. But I give you 2 weeks hanging around the media/music scene in London with wannabe models, PR agents, record dealers and rest of it and see how long you might last wanderer. You might never come home:).

you re dead right, id end up in jail, after sticking an axe into one of them!

Duffy the Vampire Slayer

I've yet to see anybody concerned about the negative impact of legalisation take the suffering in producer countries into account.

CrankyHaus

Batrachotox wrote: »

I'm sorry but this is a load of nonsense - the proportion of people who do not partake in drugs solely due to their illegal status is minimal. In the current market anybody who wants to take drugs can generally get their hands on it within 24hrs.

You're making it out as if people are suddenly going to take up heroin in their droves as soon as it becomes legal, as if legality was the thing holding them back from that. Simply not the case - yeah with legalisation you'd probably observe a small temporary increase in use, but that'd only be due to novelty and things would return to equilibrium quite soon.

To be fair, that brief period when legal highs including Mephadrone were being sold from shops was an eye opener into how the profile of drug users changes depending on their legal status.
People who would normally not do drugs were getting heavy into it; and often with the total lack of restraint that they approached drinking with. There used to be a queue outside the shop on South William Street all through Friday and Saturday night.


Conversely prior to the passing of the 1914 Harrison Act in the US the profile of drug users was more weighted towards middle-aged women, as the likes of Solpadeine abuse is now, than the young men that came to dominate the drugs market after prohibition.


I support decriminalisation btw. I just think it's a more nuanced issue than it is commonly represented.

IAMAMORON

kenmm wrote: »

Probably the same - also some other industries - recruitment/sales for example - full o the young uns with lots of tasty big bonuses to be spent!

Most of the best looking "young uns" have themselves a "friend" who is dealing anyways. They won't be wasting too much spends on novocaine. Manolo Blahniks are € 400 a pop and liddle black numbers add up after a while too. It happens alot.

Definately rampant in advertising and media etc. You know the types. Not exclusively either, I know Barristers, Doctors, Accountants etc etc etc, The banger does not discriminate.

kenmm

Duffy the Vampire Slayer wrote: »

I've yet to see anybody concerned about the negative impact of legalisation take the suffering in producer countries into account.

It was discussed a couple of pages back..

IAMAMORON

I agree on the legalisation argument. If you legalised Coke a lot more people would be getting wired and god knows how cheap it would be. There would be mayhem.

Actually having it illegal is more of a deterrent than you would think. It does not stop the flow, but office professionals are not comfortable walking down the quays to score.

In saying that everyone's cousins, uncles, brothers, sisters, lovers, best friends mother etc etc. Not that hard to get your hands on it at all, particularly if you want to.

the purple tin

If you are ever stuck for some charlie just find the nearest Blue Peter presenter :pac:

kenmm

the purple tin wrote: »

If you are ever stuck for some charlie just find the nearest Blue Peter presenter :pac:

For sure, can be found as soon as you step outside your time machine

MOR316

Tomaldo wrote: »

I believe Elvis and Michael Jackson didn't take illegal drugs but wasn't it legal ones that contributed/caused their deaths. I heard Mr Presley ate a lot of junk food so that probably didn't help him.
Regarding the Irish media, we know Gerry Ryan did and Eamon Dunphy said u can't get good coke 'round here. I'd be amazed if they were/are the only ones.

Elvis got addicted due to fame and personal issues. It's often said he thought getting drugs off a doctor was good and wouldn't kill him. He'd often go in and out of coma's and by then, the addiction had a hold on him and he couldn't get out of it.

Michael Jackson was diagnosed with Lupus 1982/83. In 1984, he was badly burned in a Pespi commercial that caused him great pain for the rest of his life and forced him into wearing wigs. It was this that exposed him to painkillers and other such prescription drugs. In early 1993, he had an operation to try and heal the injury from the commercial but, he got badly hooked on the painkillers. Allegations in 1993 hit and it spiralled out of control until he went into rehab. In 2009, he had issues sleeping and went looking for the drug to help him sleep. The Doctor, illegally, gave it to him but, the dose that killed him, he gave to him while he was asleep, which is beyond suspicious

Moral of the story, don't become that famous

Wanderer78

MOR316 wrote: »

Elvis got addicted due to fame and personal issues. It's often said he thought getting drugs off a doctor was good and wouldn't kill him. He'd often go in and out of coma's and by then, the addiction had a hold on him and he couldn't get out of it.

Michael Jackson was diagnosed with Lupus 1982/83. In 1984, he was badly burned in a Pespi commercial that caused him great pain for the rest of his life and forced him into wearing wigs. It was this that exposed him to painkillers and other such prescription drugs. In early 1993, he had an operation to try and heal the injury from the commercial but, he got badly hooked on the painkillers. Allegations in 1993 hit and it spiralled out of control until he went into rehab. In 2009, he had issues sleeping and went looking for the drug to help him sleep. The Doctor, illegally, gave it to him but, the dose that killed him, he gave to him while he was asleep, which is beyond suspicious

Moral of the story, don't become that famous

fame truly fcuks many up, most of my favorite famous people have experienced psychological problems, partly due to it, but i think the artistic mind in particular, is vulnerable to it, its known in the mental health sector also

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

the purple tin wrote: »

If you are ever stuck for some charlie just find the nearest Blue Peter presenter :pac:

Is that still going?

Duffy the Vampire Slayer

kenmm wrote: »

It was discussed a couple of pages back..

It's often discussed but rarely by people opposed to decriminalization.

corner of hells

Gretas Gonna Get Ya! wrote: »

That's not the same picture that's been given to me by several prison guards and ex-prison guards.

Rhode Island in the US has shown huge success by locking up addicts. Their prison-based opiate treatment has been shown to work very well. 61% decline in overdoses from former prisoners, and 12% decline in the general population after they implemented their program.

So that would appear to fly in the face of the notion that you shouldn't lock up addicts.



If you want a crystal ball, go look at how they're getting on in San Francisco or LA with decriminalization / legalization measures. One of the worst drug crisis in their country's history. (Which some are trying to cover up by referring to it as a homelessness crisis - a giant lie and a cover up job!)

Prison officers have nothing to do with drug treatment.

Rhode Island prisons appear to offer oddly enough, an opioid treatment program..... just like the Irish Prison Service.

I used to work in low threshold drug services with an agency who provided therapeutic services in Mountjoy
prison and now work in low threshold homeless services mainly with addicts and ex prisoners.

kenmm

Duffy the Vampire Slayer wrote: »

It's often discussed but rarely by people opposed to decriminalization.

If you are looking to get high you probably already know the downsides and you are choosing to ignore them. Decriminalisation is the same as currently. I don't know what the legalise folks would say - maybe hoping this wonderful, freely available pharma strength coke will be ethically sustainable?

If it ever happens I must remember to buy shares in the first vegan friendly ethical cocaine co!

Tomaldo

Duffy the Vampire Slayer wrote: »

I've yet to see anybody concerned about the negative impact of legalisation take the suffering in producer countries into account.

I saw a documentary and a farmer in S. America said he grew the coca plant 'cos they don't get the same subsidies as European farmers. He could grow legal crops but he wouldn't earn enough to support his family. Legalisation might improve their lives 'cos they wouldn't have to worry about police raids and having to deal with criminals.

Duffy the Vampire Slayer

Tomaldo wrote: »

I saw a documentary and a farmer in S. America said he grew the coca plant 'cos they don't get the same subsidies as European farmers. He could grow legal crops but he wouldn't earn enough to support his family. Legalisation might improve their lives 'cos they wouldn't have to worry about police raids and having to deal with criminals.

It definitely would. It would also mean that instead of the war on drugs being a massive drain on resources for states like Colombia and Bolivia, they could earn some money on the crops.

Quantum Erasure

I'd love to go on a mad one with all that's going on. It's been a while since I took etc.

pgj2015

Quantum Erasure wrote: »

I'd love to go on a mad one with all that's going on. It's been a while since I took etc.

I think a few mushrooms would do everyone the world of good with what is going on these days.

fryup

^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

liberty caps should be sprouting soon

LuasSimon

We will all have to start taking cocaine and dancing on the phoneboxs like below in killarney.

Neighbours , couple in mid 30s were in Killarney for staycation start of August and in one night he was offered cocaine three different times to buy in the pubs-restaurants of killarney , he refused but local was telling him dealers were from ballyspillane part of killarney which is far removed from ring of kerry.

kippy

LuasSimon wrote: »

We will all have to start taking cocaine and dancing on the phoneboxs like below in killarney.

Neighbours , couple in mid 30s were in Killarney for staycation start of August and in one night he was offered cocaine three different times to buy in the pubs-restaurants of killarney , he refused but local was telling him dealers were from ballyspillane part of killarney which is far removed from ring of kerry.

I find this extremely difficult to believe.
Three random strangers, unsolicitied, offers random stranger cocaine three times in the one night, in Killarney......
With those odds, you'd expect every visitor to Killarney getting approached with offers.
Yeah.

kenmm

kippy wrote: »

I find this extremely difficult to believe.
Three random strangers, unsolicitied, offers random stranger cocaine three times in the one night, in Killarney......
With those odds, you'd expect every visitor to Killarney getting approached with offers.
Yeah.

I'd say there's a chance in a touristy as **** area like that. Been offered out in the open street in temple bar before.
F knows what ****e it is tho..