Ulster vs. Leinster, Saturday 29th August, 19.35 (Eir Sport)

sydthebeat

That was ulster thirds yeah??

Clegg

Delighted by the performance. On paper the Ulster 23 was far stronger but Leinster handled them quite well. Thought Ulster's stronger bench could have pipped it for them, but Leinster coped well with them too.

Seems like Leinster have carried on their form from earlier in the season. Players can be rotated in, but the structure in defence and attack remains the same no matter who is playing.

I didn't think Cooney was offside I must say.

Where was the offside line for the Cooney try? I wish they'd superimpose it on the pitch when making the decision. From memory, it was uncontested, so the line would have been forward of the other Ulster players near the breakdown.

stephen_n

Well now.

Neil3030

Very excited to see more of H. Byrne for sure

JohnniDrama

Leinster are a serious team. Very impressive.

Ulster very poor. Again.

Something not quite right up there.

cameramonkey

JohnniDrama wrote: »

Leinster are a serious team. Very impressive.

Ulster very poor. Again.

Something not quite right up there.

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2058104875

JohnniDrama

Neil3030 wrote: »

Very excited to see more of H. Byrne for sure

He was really impressive. That will be a tough one to handle🥺

mfceiling

Well this has been a birthday to remember.

Ulster are gone to fcuk.

awec

Pack it in, we’re some joke.

Squidgy Black

Basil3 wrote: »

Where was the offside line for the Cooney try? I wish they'd superimpose it on the pitch when making the decision. From memory, it was uncontested, so the line would have been forward of the other Ulster players near the breakdown.

They had said it was because he was ahead of the hindmost foot of 13. Thought it was harsh enough myself, although I'd rather they didn't go with a football VAR style setup with drawing lines and matching lines etc

ongarite

The 6 month break hasn't been kind to Ulster's form.
Playing like it's pre-season rather than end of season.

Cooney's non-try at the end though is what they were doing early in the season. Hope they can step it up next weekend.

Rigor Mortis

Imagine how grouchy Ferris is going to be when he gets into his 70s

awec

awec wrote: »

Pack it in, we’re some joke.

There is a whiff of un-professionalism about how Ulster have handled lockdown, but I also remember Leinster taking a few heavy losses on their way to the double.

Nothing on the line yet and not enough depth to make selection an issue in Ulster, but a reaction is definitely required now - that was abject.

Bazzo

mfceiling wrote: »

Well this has been a birthday to remember.

Ulster are gone to fcuk.

Happy birthday!

Kevski

I thought that was a harsh call to disallow the Ulster try. It looked to me that no ruck had been formed as there was only leinster players on the ground, therefore there would have been no offside line.

Kevski

Kevski wrote: »

I thought that was a harsh call to disallow the Ulster try. It looked to me that no ruck had been formed as there was only leinster players on the ground, therefore there would have been no offside line.

There is an offside line, it's just created by the Leinster players when only one team is contesting. That law was changed a year or two ago after England were undone by uncontested rucks.

Dog Botherer

any word on Stockdale’s injury? one of the few Ulster players to not play like utter rubbish.

Clegg

Seems like Ulster have forgotten everything Dan McFarland drilled into them over the last 18 months. Over the the last few seasons they've developed a physical pack that can punch holes through you and a good back line to take advantage.

However, much like last week they can't seem to find that level consistently. Raise their physicality for a minute or two, but drop the ball or knock it on and kill their own momentum. After that they revert to the Ulster under Les Kiss. Slow in thought and soft around the edges.

Rigor Mortis

Kevski wrote: »

I thought that was a harsh call to disallow the Ulster try. It looked to me that no ruck had been formed as there was only leinster players on the ground, therefore there would have been no offside line.

Didnt that law change post the Italy v Eng game.

Kevski

Basil3 wrote: »

There is an offside line, it's just created by the Leinster players when only one team is contesting. That law was changed a year or two ago after England were undone by uncontested rucks.

Ah, my mistake. That England game was exactly what I thought of!

Kevski

Kevski wrote: »

I thought that was a harsh call to disallow the Ulster try. It looked to me that no ruck had been formed as there was only leinster players on the ground, therefore there would have been no offside line.

A ruck is created (and therefore an offside line) by any one player now, you don't need a contest.

Edit, I see this has been mentioned a few times, don't mind me.

StackSteevens

Maurice Full Meteoroid wrote: »

I didn't think Cooney was offside I must say.

Reminded me of England's disallowed try against the New Zealand strollers in Twickers in 2018 when Courtney Lawes was adjudged to be offside by Jako Piper.

I didn't think that Courtney was offisde either!

Neil3030

If Ulster had a Covid scare during the week, surely the preparation was disrupted in terms of contact in training. If the errors were tightened up this one would have been a lot closer.

Bazzo

Dog Botherer wrote: »

any word on Stockdale’s injury? one of the few Ulster players to not play like utter rubbish.

McFarland just now said it wasn't very serious in his post match interview but when asked if we'd be seeing him next week blank ignored it

stephen_n

Kevski wrote: »

I thought that was a harsh call to disallow the Ulster try. It looked to me that no ruck had been formed as there was only leinster players on the ground, therefore there would have been no offside line.

Doesn’t need to be any opposition players involved for a ruck to be formed. You could call it the Italy Law.

sydthebeat

[Deleted User] wrote: »

There is a whiff of un-professionalism about how Ulster have handled lockdown,.

I think it was cian treacy made a very good point on OTB about how the British furlough process hampered the likes of ulster and their training.

They didn't start with the same freedom rep teams did

StackSteevens

I felt a bit sorry for Madigan - clearly wanted to impress and tried his hardest - but that dropped kick under virtually no pressure was a howler.

molloyjh

stephen_n wrote: »

Doesn’t need to be any opposition players involved for a ruck to be formed. You could call it the Italy Law.

Yep and Cooney never got himself into an onside position. Right call.

I feel for Ulster though. There were flashes of what they are about there today. They just couldn't put it together at all.

Clegg

Frawley won MotM. It was a really impressive debut at 12 I thought. Could see clearly that Leinster have been working hard at bringing a second playmaker into the back line. The grubber through for Ed Byrne's try is an obvious example, but there were a few instances in that first half where he got the ball at second receiver and just delayed the pass slightly before releasing to put Ulster's defence on their toes.

Henshaw is clearly our first choice 12, but the more game time Frawley gets there the more he'll develop as a genuine second playmaker. Could really open things up for the backline.

Richie_Rich89

I thought Clancy was very hasty in disallowing the try. To me it was distinctly nonobvious that Cooney was offside. I'd like to see it again.

Buer

Ulster had a purple patch for about 15-20 minutes which could well have wound up with them pinching the game. Their bench made an impact but, in response, Leinster dug in and tightened things up. They started to go through the phases and starve Ulster which completely killed their momentum. Smart play and the replacement halfbacks were at the centre of it which was really good to see.

McFarland will be frustrated, no doubt. Flashes of what he's trying to do and some slick back line movement and width being put on the ball at times. It will carve up weaker teams at times but not against Leinster who have very few weak areas. Leinster were able to scramble and put pressure on in defence which will always tell eventually if they can't land a killer blow. It was the same with Munster last week who had to go through multiple phases and would eventually make an error in attack.

I thought the Leinster back row (including the replacements) were brilliant. They were the difference for large parts along with the scrumhalves. Cooney's performance was poor and it's almost good in a way that the try wasn't allowed as it would paper over the cracks. People would be talking about his impact and opportunism when it should focus on the poor fundamental play which really hurt his side.

The one positive from an Ulster and Ireland perspective is Stockdale. I really like what I see from him at 15. If he gets a run of rugby there, I can see him wearing that jersey in green and there's no reason he shouldn't. I could see him very much as a Chris Latham type player with a comfortable efficiency from deep with a try scoring threat.

Buer

Clegg wrote: »

Frawley won MotM. It was a really impressive debut at 12 I thought. Could see clearly that Leinster have been working hard at bringing a second playmaker into the back line. The grubber through for Ed Byrne's try is an obvious example, but there were a few instances in that first half where he got the ball at second receiver and just delayed the pass slightly before releasing to put Ulster's defence on their toes.

Henshaw is clearly our first choice 12, but the more game time Frawley gets there the more he'll develop as a genuine second playmaker. Could really open things up for the backline.

Very promising. I thought he was quieter in the second half which is understandable given the flow of the game but some really good signs and he benefits from the reduced scrutiny and decision making at 12.

I wouldn't have necessarily have given him MOTM though. I thought one of the Leinster back row deserved that and, given he was the only one who went the distance, I'd have gone with Deegan. 22 carries compared to 27 from the other 7 starters in the Leinster pack. Worked his balls off.

I thought Ross Molony had a very tidy game too. He's simply too good to be 5th choice lock and needs to go somewhere else. He's going to waste his talent in Leinster.

Richie_Rich89

Looking at it there on twitter, there's no "clear and obvious" offside from Cooney. Try should have stood; and then Ulster have a shot at winning it with another try.

Stringer doesn't seem to know the laws, suggesting there's no offside line because there's no ruck. There's an offside line alright, but I think Cooney's grounded feet are behind it. An Ulster player binds on to form the ruck, which would shift the offside line further back, but this is at the same instant or fractionally after Osborne pulls the ball out. So no "clear and obvious" offside, for me. Poor decision from the officials.

Buer

Only getting to watch the after match analysis now. Stringer claiming there was no ruck and it's therefore open play for the Cooney non-try. For someone that would be viewed as quite a cerebral player, it's surprising to see the lack of knowledge.

Clegg

Buer wrote: »

Very promising. I thought he was quieter in the second half which is understandable given the flow of the game but some really good signs and he benefits from the reduced scrutiny and decision making at 12.

I wouldn't have necessarily have given him MOTM though. I thought one of the Leinster back row deserved that and, given he was the only one who went the distance, I'd have gone with Deegan. 22 carries compared to 27 from the other 7 starters in the Leinster pack. Worked his balls off.

I thought Ross Molony had a very tidy game too. He's simply too good to be 5th choice lock and needs to go somewhere else. He's going to waste his talent in Leinster.

Agreed on Frawley. He played well, but there were more deserving candidates. I think sometimes the commentators and pundits but into the prevailing narrative. For the last few weeks we've read stories about Leinster's link up with Crusaders and how they wanted to develop an attacking kicking game and also get a second playmaker into the backline. Frawley was successful in both aspects this evening. Since it's an area a lot of people are looking at closely it makes sense that a good performance from Frawley would be noticed.

thomond2006

Buer wrote: »

I thought Ross Molony had a very tidy game too. He's simply too good to be 5th choice lock and needs to go somewhere else. He's going to waste his talent in Leinster.

Agreed. Even with Fardy in his last year and Toner winding down the door to a starting role is likely to remain closed due to Baird. Then there's always the conveyor belt who will produce someone new. He's just turned 26 so he may need to cash in upon his next contract.

Buer

thomond2006 wrote: »

Agreed. Even with Fardy in his last year and Toner winding down the door to a starting role is likely to remain closed due to Baird. He's just turned 26 so he may need to cash in upon his next contract.

Good age profile and a good injury profile. He could get a solid contract in France or England and have 10 more years of rugby there.

Superfoods

thomond2006 wrote: »

Agreed. Even with Fardy in his last year and Toner winding down the door to a starting role is likely to remain closed due to Baird. Then there's always the conveyor belt who will produce someone new. He's just turned 26 so he may need to cash in upon his next contract.

At this stage has any player in the Leinster squad not had a recommendation to move to another club?

bilston

Imagine waiting almost 6 months for your team to play...only for them to serve up two performances like that in consecutive weeks...depressing...I don't think we are miles away, but the danger now is we lose to Edinburgh and probably lose away to Toulouse and that will be 4 defeats on the bounce. That would be tough to turnaround before the 2020/21 campaign starts in a month or so time.

Dave_The_Sheep

bilston wrote: »

Imagine waiting almost 6 months for your team to play...only for them to serve up two performances like that in consecutive weeks....

Ah here, Leinster are doing alright...

thomond2006

Superfoods wrote: »

At this stage has any player in the Leinster squad not had a recommendation to move to another club?

If I've left any out please shout.

Former Former

A very competent performance by Leinster given the number of changes and guys who were playing their first match in six or seven months. Connors was excellent and I'm very excited by Harry Byrne. Very solid shift from Cronin and Ed Byrne too.

The scoreline was a bit harsh on Ulster, there was a fair bit to be happy about. Stockdale is really looking the part at 15 and the pack looked a lot better than against Connacht.
Madigan actually went well apart from the obligatory unforced error.

Burkie1203

I thought cooney was offside. Marginally. Think the fact the closest 4 or 5 team mates either side of him all being 2-3 feet behind him swayed Clancy quite quickly.

ROL yellow boots, think Cooney is level with him When he has to be behind him

Looked at the highlights this morning and yeah I think Cooney was in front of the hindmost foot as the ref said. It's very tight though you probably have players in that position at every ruck that doesn't get called.

padjocollins

if the decision is marginal (he's 60 or more metres away from the try line with a lot to do) , i would have given it . got to reward going for it.

salmocab

padjocollins wrote: »

if the decision is marginal (he's 60 or more metres away from the try line with a lot to do) , i would have given it . got to reward going for it.

I don’t agree, refs shouldn’t be rewarding anything on a whim he’s either offside or he’s not and the ref needs to call it as it is within the laws.

padjocollins

padjocollins wrote: »

if the decision is marginal (he's 60 or more metres away from the try line with a lot to do) , i would have given it . got to reward going for it.

You can't ignore an offside even if it's marginal, you're not playing rugby anymore if you give it.

padjocollins

not saying ignore it, i'm saying if the decision is marginal, if it's not clear,give him the benefit of the doubt especially as he had so much left to do anyway. He's either offside or he's not is the theory, in practice even reviewing the video, where is the last bound player in the ruck ? Does he go when the ball is picked up by the scrum half. He was switched on and up for it. Very tight calls. benefit of the doubt i'd be giving.