Have NPHET lost the attention of people?

tobefrank321

HSE has known for 8 months the importance of ICU when dealing with covid. The whole world has known a second wave was coming.

And yet they are now left scrambling around for ICU beds at the very last minute.

The incompetence is mind boggling. ICU beds are not easy to rustle up at short notice, but they should have been putting resources together, knowing well a second wave was on the way.

FintanMcluskey

facehugger99 wrote: »

It's killed way more people in the last 10 months than Covid - just not as many white westerners.

Ironically, obese white western's, 6 years beyond life expectancy.

Deleted User

Deleted User wrote: »

I certanly hope you aren't dealing with patients if this is your attitude.

Im 99% sure the comment was not the person calling people that. He merely meant that management dont consider the general public as worthy of the information

Vieira82

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

Heart disease.

About 18m deaths a year I believe

I just knew you would come up with something like this. No. A death caused by a new virus not something caused by dietary issues, or lifestyle choices... thanks.

facehugger99

Vieira82 wrote: »

I just knew you would come up with something like this. No. A death caused by a new virus not something caused by dietary issues, or lifestyle choices... thanks.

You managed to be wrong twice in a single post.

You asked for examples of "diseases" that kill more people - there are many.

And lifestyle choice is a huge contributory factor to the risk from Covid.

Seweryn

FintanMcluskey wrote: »

RIP has a hugh drop in postings for July, August and September compared with last year. Approximately 1000.

Q1 2020 had less deaths than Q1 2019, Q2 official figures will be published in late Novemeber.

2020 may well have less deaths than 2019

I can't find an increase in deaths for this year no matter how hard I look at the numbers...

Vieira82

Vieira82 wrote: »

I just knew you would come up with something like this. No. A death caused by a new virus not something caused by dietary issues, or lifestyle choices... thanks.

Ah so only within the limited restrictions and definitions that you have decided then? No, sorry doesnt work that way.

Has to be new. Define new. SARS still new? only since 2020? 2019?

Cannot be connected to life or diet choices. Does this include covid because fit, healthy people in their 20s are highly unlikely to even notice they have it nevermind result in death

Is a new strain of flu then considered 'new' in your narrow view?

Seweryn

Seweryn wrote: »

I can't find an increase in deaths for this year no matter how hard I look at the numbers...

To be fair, the population increased with more births.

Vieira82

Captain_Crash wrote: »

Black Death, HIV, Smallpoox, Swine Flu, Spanish Flu, Bubonic Plague (several of them), countless influenza outbreaks!! And these are just the ones off the top of my head.

So... Black Death and Bubonic plague are the same.

I wonder if you choose to ignore the question on purpose I asked on the first 10 MONTHS of existence.

But easily refutable.

HIV AIDS

First year deaths US: 13K (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HIV/AIDS_in_the_United_States)

Covid19 in the US: over 200k and counting

Swine Flu total deaths estimated over 280k
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2009_swine_flu_pandemic

Covid19: Over 1 Million in 10 months and counting

Spanish Flu first wave in the US. I'll leave you this quote "The first wave of the flu lasted from the first quarter of 1918 and was relatively mild.[32] Mortality rates were not appreciably above normal;[33] in the United States ~75,000 flu-related deaths were reported in the first six months of 1918, compared to ~63,000 deaths during the same time period in 1915."

But I'll give you that the second wave was deadlier "In the United States, ~292,000 deaths were reported between September–December 1918"

Though we haven't reached December yet and there's still hundreds of people dying in the US daily from covid

Covid19 in 10 months over 200k deaths in the US and counting!

As for the Bubonic Plague, Black Death, it was actually caused by a bacteria extremely exacerbated by bad hygiene practices and unscientific beliefs. It was just so bad it kept coming back decades later and only in the 20th century a cure was found.

However, due to the distance of the events it's hard to pinpoint how many died in the first 10 months of the plague. But if you find this data, please do share it!

Now, prove me wrong in any of the above facts, or you can choose to call me naïve or illogical like so many have done already, or whatever it suits your "ad hominian" narrative. Thanks

Vieira82

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

Ah so only within the limited restrictions and definitions that you have decided then? No, sorry doesnt work that way.

Has to be new. Define new. SARS still new? only since 2020? 2019?

Cannot be connected to life or diet choices. Does this include covid because fit, healthy people in their 20s are highly unlikely to even notice they have it nevermind result in death

Is a new strain of flu then considered 'new' in your narrow view?

If you want to go for Heart Disease and Cancer, then let's count all the way back to the Stone Age.

Obviously you just had to call it a "narrow" definition because it doesn't suit your narrative. So obviously any new strain of a virus is counted on said narrative.

Bu please explain me what do you achieve in being a dick in your arguments? I would really like to know how hard it is for people to admit their wrong. Is it really that hard to simply say "fair enough, would a flu strain make more sense"

Instead I find it laughable that so many covid deniers just can't help insulting others or just launching on personal attacks. That truly speaks loads about the ideology defended and how the only argument one can come up with is character attacks.

On topic: just replied to it in my latest comment.

Vieira82

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

Does this include covid because fit, healthy people in their 20s are highly unlikely to even notice they have it nevermind result in death

And as for this little comment... you couldn't be farther from the truth:

https://www.advisory.com/daily-briefing/2020/04/13/covid-young-people

https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-health-coronavirus-recovery/young-healthy-adults-with-mild-covid-19-also-take-weeks-to-recover-cdc-idUKKCN24P2BU

https://www.livescience.com/covid-19-causes-heart-damage-healthy-people.html

https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020/09/evidence-builds-covid-19-can-damage-heart-doctors-are-racing-understand-it

Those articles span from April to September, have fun reading them

Captain_Crash

Vieira82 wrote: »

.

Covid20 is that you

Vieira82

Vieira82 wrote: »

If you want to go for Heart Disease and Cancer, then let's count all the way back to the Stone Age.

Obviously you just had to call it a "narrow" definition because it doesn't suit your narrative. So obviously any new strain of a virus is counted on said narrative.

Bu please explain me what do you achieve in being a dick in your arguments? I would really like to know how hard it is for people to admit their wrong. Is it really that hard to simply say "fair enough, would a flu strain make more sense"

Instead I find it laughable that so many covid deniers just can't help insulting others or just launching on personal attacks. That truly speaks loads about the ideology defended and how the only argument one can come up with is character attacks.

On topic: just replied to it in my latest comment.

Em, I dont believe I have denied anything have I?

Your limits were laughable and designed to be covid specific but you then ignored the effect that overall health has on those numbers too as that kinds flew in the face of your argument.

As for being a dick, look in the mirror friend.

Vieira82

Vieira82 wrote: »

And as for this little comment... you couldn't be farther from the truth:

https://www.advisory.com/daily-briefing/2020/04/13/covid-young-people

https://www.reuters.com/article/uk-health-coronavirus-recovery/young-healthy-adults-with-mild-covid-19-also-take-weeks-to-recover-cdc-idUKKCN24P2BU

https://www.livescience.com/covid-19-causes-heart-damage-healthy-people.html

https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020/09/evidence-builds-covid-19-can-damage-heart-doctors-are-racing-understand-it

Those articles span from April to September, have fun reading them

Now, just so we are on the same page before we continue here'

Your maths is the same as mine right? one fifth is 20% and that means 80% that dont feel the effects and take weeks to fully recover right? That places the 'majority' in the 80% with little effect. Correct?

And under 44, whats the deaths?

Heres some reading for yourself dear chap

"For every 1,000 people infected with the coronavirus who are under the age of 50, almost none will die. For people in their fifties and early sixties, about five will die — more men than women. The risk then climbs steeply as the years accrue. For every 1,000 people in their mid-seventies or older who are infected, around 116 will die" (https://www.nature.com/articles/d41586-020-02483-2)

[Deleted User]

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I certanly hope you aren't dealing with patients if this is your attitude.

Depends if they are talking malarkey.

Dempo1

Well well, let's see who's paying attention tonight. Leo also eating humble pie. Welcome back Dr Houlihan

We actually need NPHET now more than ever. Those figures are very concerning. We are experiencing exponential growth.

Dempo1

[Deleted User] wrote: »

We actually need NPHET now more than ever. Those figures are very concerning. We are experiencing exponential growth.

Agreed and to be Frank, the only consistency shown throughout this crisis has infact been NPHET, Shocking numbers tonight, RIP to those who've sadly lost their lives.

Dempo1

expectationlost wrote: »

who is this TY student at the press conference?

TY Student?

Nobotty

Several attempts by journalists at the department of health news conference to draw out Dr Holohan and professor Nolan on a row with the government
The journalists must be disappointed because they are not getting the response they crave ie there's no row

The only solution is level 5.

Dempo1

Nobotty wrote: »

Several attempts by journalists at the department of health news conference to draw out Dr Holohan and professor Nolan on a row with the government
The journalists must be disappointed because they are not getting the response they crave ie there's no row

I think it's called professionalism, something clearly lacking in Leo, NPHET know there well covered and Leo knows this will come back to bite him and perhaps sooner than he thought based on the numbers

Loafing Oaf

Dempo1 wrote: »

TY Student?

transition year. presume the poster doesn't mean it literally

Dempo1

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

transition year. presume the poster doesn't mean it literally

sorry went over my head, yes she's from HSE and as per part of her brief, incredibly irratating.

karlitob

Vieira82 wrote: »

You clearly have not been admitted to a hospital in recent times or have to use the ER recently to be writing this. Or...

I have.

But not sure what your point is or how it relates to why healthcare staff do not get their vaccinations. Working hard - which I’m sure is the point that you’re trying to make and one which I agree with - is no excuse for not protecting patients.

Dempo1

We could be on. Level 5 by weeks end, this press conference laying it out bluntly and clearly.

expectationlost

Dempo1 wrote: »

sorry went over my head, yes she's from HSE and as per part of her brief, incredibly irratating.

talking about the very young reporter asking amateurish questions

Dempo1

expectationlost wrote: »

talking about the very young reporter asking amateurish questions

A now, I too was being sarcastic, but yes, some silly questions it has to be said. Professor Nolan is Hillarious, his contempt for stupidity is Hillarious, actually, just realised he reminds me of Trapper John MD for those old enough to remember.

karlitob

tobefrank321 wrote: »

HSE has known for 8 months the importance of ICU when dealing with covid. The whole world has known a second wave was coming.

And yet they are now left scrambling around for ICU beds at the very last minute.

The incompetence is mind boggling. ICU beds are not easy to rustle up at short notice, but they should have been putting resources together, knowing well a second wave was on the way.

We’re not scrambling. We know what our icu capacity and need is for the last 10 years. Every bed costs a million. Even if there was staff available the cost would be 1/4bn on top of the normal health budget. The only question is why would icu get that money and not all the other services who require investment. You’re only mouthing off about icu as if you know what you’re taking about because it’s in the news - you nothing of all the other equally valid and important needs out there. How much increase in tax are you willing to pay to fund all of those services. Or are you one of those people who think all the money that’s required is already available.

Secondly, we doubled our capacity in a few weeks and trained up hundreds of people. The only way we could do that is by not having any other patients on the wards ie cancelling services. The challenge now is to provide Covid AND non Covid care. So while we didn’t go anywhere near our capacity in March/April we have a much lower capacity now.

We have plenty of scope to use the private hospitals.

If we get overrun - then the ‘fault’ is with all of us citizens and taxpayers.

karlitob

Niner leprauchan wrote: »

To be fair, the population increased with more births.

To be fair, that’s the point of a rate.