Have NPHET lost the attention of people?

McHardcore

Andrewf20 wrote: »

Because cases have been rising for months now (not just weeks) in alot of places but not deaths which are still very low or inline for whats expected at this time of the year. Big questions about the validity of pcr testing catching active viruses instead of older remnants that don't pose a threat also throws a big spanner in the works. Hence the casedemic that seems to be emerging.

Its not just the "casedmic" case numbers, hospitalisations and ICU numbers are increasing too. The number of deaths will lag behind these numbers, but will follow the same curves, in particular when these ICUs start reaching capacity again.



The graph above is from last week. They announced tonight that the number in hospital has increased to 179 and the number in ICU has increased from 22 yesterday to 30 today.

Andrewf20

McHardcore wrote: »

Its not just the "casedmic" case numbers, hospitalisations and ICU numbers are increasing too. The number of deaths will lag behind these numbers, but will follow the same curves, in particular when these ICUs start reaching capacity again.



The graph above is from last week. They announced tonight that the number in hospital has increased to 179 and the number in ICU has increased from 22 yesterday to 30 today.

I think you are right, the deaths will lag but rise also. But I'm trying to get a picture of respiratory hospitalisation for previous years. So for example if respiratory hospitalisation for the last few years in early October was say on average 36 cases vs 179 now and icu numbers were an average of 9 instead of 30, id say fair enough. Things could be kicking off. But if the numbers for previous years were similar to now, it may be a sign of nothing to be alarmed about.

I'd basically like to see your graph go back 2 - 3 years.

Vieira82

McHardcore wrote: »

Its not just the "casedmic" case numbers, hospitalisations and ICU numbers are increasing too. The number of deaths will lag behind these numbers, but will follow the same curves, in particular when these ICUs start reaching capacity again.



The graph above is from last week. They announced tonight that the number in hospital has increased to 179 and the number in ICU has increased from 22 yesterday to 30 today.

Very interesting graphic and it's very similar to many cases in Europe. I have a theory that covid was around Europe earlier than we think it was, there was a few cases in France detected in Jan/Dec. That would explain that the beginning of it in Europe went mostly hidden in normal hospitalizations for that period and only it really started to ramp up ICUs and Deaths and the fact we had confirmation of a new virus then we have that sharp increase.

Of course this is just a theory and not exactly much to prove it atm. We're still very much concerned of how this will play out in the next months. And once this is done there will definetly be studies that will go to the root cause of this virus. Just like the Spanish Flu though, still to this day there isn't a concrete origin of it.

Andrewf20

So I found some figures for Influenza and Other Seasonal Respiratory Viruses in Ireland, 2018/2019 & 2017/18.

2018/2019:

https://www.hpsc.ie/a-z/respiratory/influenza/seasonalinfluenza/surveillance/influenzasurveillancereports/seasonsummaries/Influenza%202018-2019%20Season_Summary.pdf

Influenza cases: 7,943
Influenza hospitalizations (critical care): 3,244 - “Age specific rates for confirmed influenza cases hospitalised and admitted to critical care during the 2018/2019 influenza season, in Ireland” as per page 17.
Influenza ICUs: 159
Influenza deaths: 97

Is there a big difference between critical care and intensive care. Not sure for Ireland but theres a big difference in the numbers (159 vs 3244) as shown above. The mater mentions that their critical care unit includes ICU and HDU, so I assume thats similar to other hospitals also?)

However a UK website implies they may be the same: "Critical care - also known as Intensive Care (ICU) – is a multi-disciplinary healthcare team looking after people with life-threatening conditions. Critical care units are areas within the hospital which are specially staffed, equipped and designed to closely monitor and treat patients with life-threatening conditions."

Hospital respiratory admissions started to rise around early Sept (page 13 graph)

2017/2018:

https://www.hpsc.ie/a-z/respiratory/influenza/seasonalinfluenza/surveillance/influenzasurveillancereports/seasonsummaries/Influenza%202017-2018%20Annual%20Summary_Final.pdf

Influenza cases: 11,889
Influenza hospitalizations (critical care): 4,713
Influenza ICUs: 191
Influenza deaths: 255

Hospital respiratory admissions started to rise around early Sept (page 15 graph)

If ICU numbers for respiratory & influenza in 2017/18 and 2018/19 were 159 & 191 instead of the critical care figures of 3,244 & 4,713 as shown in the links, then 30 ICUs at this stage does sound concerning alright.

Note that the link below mentions around 4000 deaths of the respiratory system in the last few years.

https://www.statista.com/statistics/660231/disease-of-the-respiratory-system-deaths-ireland/

karlitob

Andrewf20 wrote: »

Just another 2 things:

We are getting very hung up on numbers but do we have any visibility for what kind of icu hospitalisations we have in a normal year ( for respiratory infections ideally)? Can't find any info on this to get a bench mark..

Not exactly sure what you’re looking for. Patients aren’t admitted to icu on the basis of a diagnosis, per se, but on their symptoms and whether or not the treatments provided in icu would be effective and - I would imagine - a strong possibility that you would come off a vent. Obviously their primary condition is tracked.

Other patients are admitted ‘electively’ in that surgeons known that a patient needs a few hours in icu post surgery because of their risk.

Some data here for you to be going on with.


http://s3-eu-west-1.amazonaws.com/noca-uploads/general/Irish_National_ICU_Audit_Annual_Report_2018_FINAL.pdf

Might be something in here: https://data.gov.ie/

Finally, you can get an FoI of HIPE data from HSE.

karlitob

Andrewf20 wrote: »

So I found some figures for Influenza and Other Seasonal Respiratory Viruses in Ireland, 2018/2019 & 2017/18.

2018/2019:

https://www.hpsc.ie/a-z/respiratory/influenza/seasonalinfluenza/surveillance/influenzasurveillancereports/seasonsummaries/Influenza%202018-2019%20Season_Summary.pdf

Influenza cases: 7,943
Influenza hospitalizations (critical care): 3,244 - “Age specific rates for confirmed influenza cases hospitalised and admitted to critical care during the 2018/2019 influenza season, in Ireland” as per page 17.
Influenza ICUs: 159
Influenza deaths: 97

Is there a big difference between critical care and intensive care. Not sure for Ireland but theres a big difference in the numbers (159 vs 3244) as shown above. The mater mentions that their critical care unit includes ICU and HDU, so I assume thats similar to other hospitals also?)

However a UK website implies they may be the same: "Critical care - also known as Intensive Care (ICU) – is a multi-disciplinary healthcare team looking after people with life-threatening conditions. Critical care units are areas within the hospital which are specially staffed, equipped and designed to closely monitor and treat patients with life-threatening conditions."

Hospital respiratory admissions started to rise around early Sept (page 13 graph)

2017/2018:

https://www.hpsc.ie/a-z/respiratory/influenza/seasonalinfluenza/surveillance/influenzasurveillancereports/seasonsummaries/Influenza%202017-2018%20Annual%20Summary_Final.pdf

Influenza cases: 11,889
Influenza hospitalizations (critical care): 4,713
Influenza ICUs: 191
Influenza deaths: 255

Hospital respiratory admissions started to rise around early Sept (page 15 graph)

If ICU numbers for respiratory & influenza in 2017/18 and 2018/19 were 159 & 191 instead of the critical care figures of 3,244 & 4,713 as shown in the links, then 30 ICUs at this stage does sound concerning alright.

Critical care is the care of any critically ill patient - someone who’s pretty ****ed unless they the right care, NOW. That can be pre-hospital, emergency care etc. but in normal language it’s ICU and HDU - some hospitals have a specific cardio-thoracic icu and cardiorhoracic hdu.

https://www.hse.ie/eng/services/publications/clinical-strategy-and-programmes/model-of-care-for-adult-critical-care.pdf

karlitob

If ICU numbers for respiratory & influenza in 2017/18 and 2018/19 were 159 & 191 instead of the critical care figures of 3,244 & 4,713 as shown in the links, then 30 ICUs at this stage does sound concerning alright./[/url][/quote]

Exactly

Andrewf20

karlitob wrote: »

If ICU numbers for respiratory & influenza in 2017/18 and 2018/19 were 159 & 191 instead of the critical care figures of 3,244 & 4,713 as shown in the links, then 30 ICUs at this stage does sound concerning alright./[/url]

Exactly[/QUOTE]

The links say influenza deaths were 97 & 255 in the 2 winter seasons mentioned yet the link at the bottom of my post gives a figure of around 4000 respiratory deaths in each year. The reports with 97 and 255 deaths were called "influenza and other respiratory illnesses" so strange how numbers are so low even if it only covers the winter "season" instead of 12 months. I'm not sure what to believe.

Another article from the Irish times in 2015 said that an average of 2800 people die in Ireland each winter from respiratory diseases. If the "winter" season is taken as 3 months it works out at about 30 deaths per day.

There alot of data and interpetation of sift through with these reports I find so I could be easily missing something. I'll need more time to get my head around it.

bb1234567

Vieira82 wrote: »

Very interesting graphic and it's very similar to many cases in Europe. I have a theory that covid was around Europe earlier than we think it was, there was a few cases in France detected in Jan/Dec. That would explain that the beginning of it in Europe went mostly hidden in normal hospitalizations for that period and only it really started to ramp up ICUs and Deaths and the fact we had confirmation of a new virus then we have that sharp increase.

Of course this is just a theory and not exactly much to prove it atm. We're still very much concerned of how this will play out in the next months. And once this is done there will definetly be studies that will go to the root cause of this virus. Just like the Spanish Flu though, still to this day there isn't a concrete origin of it.

I think at this stage the theory is quite plausible. We saw in Europe in July how a large case load led to very few deaths for several weeks in Spain and France, definitely not enough deaths to significantly alter national mortality rates or be anything noticeable. This may be skewed by the fact that older and vulnerable people still cocooning in those countries over the summer though, and hence not giving an accurate picture of how it may have spread in the country in the weeks before the large increase in excess deaths from March onward

NewMan1982

Another point to note is all the restrictions we have in place currently would also help stop the spread of other viruses like influenza.

Divisadero

"Have NEPHET lost the attention of the people?"

I would say it's the opposite in that a certain segment of the population are no longer paying attention to NEPHET. Or it seems are the Govt. Not that I relish their position! It has got to the stage now where some of the population who believe in the science and listen to actual experts and are doing their best to do the right thing for their loved ones and society as a whole are also getting frustrated. Not with NEPHET but with conspiracy theorists and the selfish and the feckless.

Unfortunately at this stage the only solution is robust enforcement. And I don't mean the Guards with no real specific enforcement powers annoying most of the population with checkpoints which only serve as optics and something to show on the Six One news. Proper enforcement where for example large gatherings are actually dispersed. For example the marches in Dublin. Regardless of whether they are for BLM or the anti-Covid crowd or whatever. Rather than the Guards having to stand around watching them and then saying they will investigate it after the fact. What good is that? Any damage will already have been done. And the public order resources available near Grafton Street for example are considerable but still last weeks march was allowed to proceed.

If the restrictions were enforced properly previously we might have avoided Level 3 and what is to come. Not that I have any hope in our Govt. having the spine to do what is required. And regarding the police state slippery slope argument I mean temporary legislation until the Covid crisis is resolved.

Andrewf20

Divisadero wrote: »

"Have NEPHET lost the attention of the people?"

I would say it's the opposite in that a certain segment of the population are no longer paying attention to NEPHET. Or it seems are the Govt. Not that I relish their position! It has got to the stage now where some of the population who believe in the science and listen to actual experts and are doing their best to do the right thing for their loved ones and society as a whole are also getting frustrated. Not with NEPHET but with conspiracy theorists and the selfish and the feckless.

Unfortunately at this stage the only solution is robust enforcement. And I don't mean the Guards with no real specific enforcement powers annoying most of the population with checkpoints which only serve as optics and something to show on the Six One news. Proper enforcement where for example large gatherings are actually dispersed. For example the marches in Dublin. Regardless of whether they are for BLM or the anti-Covid crowd or whatever. Rather than the Guards having to stand around watching them and then saying they will investigate it after the fact. What good is that? Any damage will already have been done. And the public order resources available near Grafton Street for example are considerable but still last weeks march was allowed to proceed.

If the restrictions were enforced properly previously we might have avoided Level 3 and what is to come. Not that I have any hope in our Govt. having the spine to do what is required. And regarding the police state slippery slope argument I mean temporary legislation until the Covid crisis is resolved.

It's an uphill battle for nphet to convince the masses. It's like the saying, if everyone owns this, then no one owns it. A lot of people are fed up with lockdown, leading to lockdown fatigue. Bbc news did an article on it, saying that people are less likely to adhere to the rules a 2nd time around.

The great barrington declaration and Ivor Cummins etc will further erode confidence in the powers that be. Gatherings and face masks are visually easy to spot but adherance for hand washing and touching surfaces or coughing into hands is more tricky to monitor so it would be impossible to get everybody to follow all the rules all the time.

Richard Hillman

I think it's the fact that when the Virus first came we were treated with horror stories in the media of China and Italy, as if it was like Ebola. People were hidden away in their homes afraid to come out to this death Virus.

Then when it did come to our shores, it was nothing like they portrayed it on TV. Life went on pretty much normally bar everything was closed and we were told to stay close to home.

It was hyped up as a death virus, killing regular folk left right and centre. What transpired was that it killed people that were already at deaths door. Healthy people were barely affected, some wouldn't even know they had it.

So the publics increasing lazze-fáire attitude is more to do with the reality of the Virus. Its very unlikely to kill you. A few days of being very uncomfortable and that's your lot.

Loafing Oaf

Andrewf20 wrote: »

The great barrington declaration and Ivor Cummins etc will further erode confidence in the powers that be.

well tbh if you're taking your lead from “Dr Johnny Bananas” and “Professor Cominic Dummings” I doubt you were too committed to the 'official narrative' in the first place.

Divisadero

Andrewf20 wrote: »

It's an uphill battle for nphet to convince the masses. It's like the saying, if everyone owns this, then no one owns it. A lot of people are fed up with lockdown, leading to lockdown fatigue. Bbc news did an article on it, saying that people are less likely to adhere to the rules a 2nd time around.

The great barrington declaration and Ivor Cummins etc will further erode confidence in the powers that be. Gatherings and face masks are visually easy to spot but adherance for hand washing and touching surfaces or coughing into hands is more tricky to monitor so it would be impossible to get everybody to follow all the rules all the time.

I completely get that people are fed up and worried about their jobs etc. Most of the people I know are. So am I! But if most of us don't buy in and make the effort not only will lockdowns continue but they won't even be effective. It is also frustrating for those still trying their best to comply and to see mass gatherings etc. with no real effort by the Guards to stop them. It makes it all so pointless and more likely that some of those currently complying will throw their hat at it too. I also realise that would make many on here happy! I know many are so weary but I and many others are still very concerned about our health system not being able to cope. It can hardly cope at the best of times especially in winter. Not being able to deal with a Covid related surge and other non-Covid related care including cancer services being suspended again is as most realise the main concern. Lockdowns are a crude, frustrating and damaging measure but if they keep the health system functioning they are worth it. But of course if a significant amount of the population carry on as normal they won't work even as a temporary measure to avoid swamping the hospitals. Which is all they are really good for. Unfortunately appealing to people's better nature isn't working.

We are not all in this together any more. Robust enforcement even of a couple of high profile events might send a message to some. It would also encourage those who support the measures. They would see that the state are really supporting them in practice and give the lockdown the best chance of success rather than feeling that they are sacrificing for nothing. So it's not only the anti-lockdown crowd who are frustrated. If I was a health worker I would be livid. A lack of buy-in and all the pain economic, psychological and otherwise will really be for nothing.

Anyway I'm done. Just thought I would get it off my chest after reading some of the posts on here over the last few weeks.

irishblessing

Richard Hillman wrote: »

So the publics increasing lazze-fáire attitude is more to do with the reality of the Virus. Its very unlikely to kill you. A few days of being very uncomfortable and that's your lot.

That's not true. Up to 20% require hospitalisation. Though most may not die, people can suffer terribly and there's a real risk of something called "long covid." You are trivialising the reality. Is it some sort of protective mechanism so you can try and feel better or what? It seems like you're trying to portray indifference or bravery, but I think what it actually reveals deep down is fear.

eddie73

irishblessing wrote: »

That's not true. Up to 20% require hospitalisation. Though most may not die, people can suffer terribly and there's a real risk of something called "long covid." You are trivialising the reality. Is it some sort of protective mechanism so you can try and feel better or what? It seems like you're trying to portray indifference or bravery, but I think what it actually reveals deep down is fear.

10.8% required hospitalisation.(3,800 out of 40,000). I don't know how many of these people actually stayed in hospital or just turned up as out patients.

Of this number, 480 required icu. (1.2%).

One thing that really needs to be addressed is the home treatment strategy of Coronavirus. This would leave hospital beds free for critical patients. (cancer and cardio especially).

irishblessing

eddie73 wrote: »

10.8% required hospitalisation.(3,800 out of 40,000). I don't know how many of these people actually stayed in hospital or just turned up as out patients.

Of this number, 480 required icu. (1.2%).

One thing that really needs to be addressed is the home treatment strategy of Coronavirus. This would leave hospital beds free for critical patients. (cancer and cardio especially).

What time frame does your figure refer to?

10.8% however is still a very large number. And if the virus were to become more and more widespread our hospitals would not be able to cope.

There is another large percentage of people that still really suffer with it and don't end up in hospital. That is the reality I refer to in response to the poster who said it's just a few days of being "uncomfortable."

Agree on the home treatment... what would that entail? More robust numbers of PHN's?

mohawk

eddie73 wrote: »

10.8% required hospitalisation.(3,800 out of 40,000). I don't know how many of these people actually stayed in hospital or just turned up as out patients.

Of this number, 480 required icu. (1.2%).

One thing that really needs to be addressed is the home treatment strategy of Coronavirus. This would leave hospital beds free for critical patients. (cancer and cardio especially).

I wonder how of that 10.8% were already in hospital for something unrelated to Covid. I don’t think the HSE know themselves.

Jackman25

Divisadero wrote: »

I completely get that people are fed up and worried about their jobs etc. Most of the people I know are. So am I! But if most of us don't buy in and make the effort not only will lockdowns continue but they won't even be effective. It is also frustrating for those still trying their best to comply and to see mass gatherings etc. with no real effort by the Guards to stop them. It makes it all so pointless and more likely that some of those currently complying will throw their hat at it too. I also realise that would make many on here happy! I know many are so weary but I and many others are still very concerned about our health system not being able to cope. It can hardly cope at the best of times especially in winter. Not being able to deal with a Covid related surge and other non-Covid related care including cancer services being suspended again is as most realise the main concern. Lockdowns are a crude, frustrating and damaging measure but if they keep the health system functioning they are worth it. But of course if a significant amount of the population carry on as normal they won't work even as a temporary measure to avoid swamping the hospitals. Which is all they are really good for. Unfortunately appealing to people's better nature isn't working.

We are not all in this together any more. Robust enforcement even of a couple of high profile events might send a message to some. It would also encourage those who support the measures. They would see that the state are really supporting them in practice and give the lockdown the best chance of success rather than feeling that they are sacrificing for nothing. So it's not only the anti-lockdown crowd who are frustrated. If I was a health worker I would be livid. A lack of buy-in and all the pain economic, psychological and otherwise will really be for nothing.

Anyway I'm done. Just thought I would get it off my chest after reading some of the posts on here over the last few weeks.

They will continue regardless. Lock down, open up, lock down, open up. We don't seem to have any other strategy so no wonder people aren't buying into it.
We had probably the longest lockdown in Europe over the summer. It was a bad mistake to keep people so restricted when we had a handful of cases for a month or 2 over the summer. It made no difference only to ensure that this time round there is much less interest in being locked down again.

eddie73

irishblessing wrote: »

What time frame does your figure refer to?

10.8% however is still a very large number. And if the virus were to become more and more widespread our hospitals would not be able to cope.

There is another large percentage of people that still really suffer with it and don't end up in hospital. That is the reality I refer to in response to the poster who said it's just a few days of being "uncomfortable."

Agree on the home treatment... what would that entail? More robust numbers of PHN's?

Here is where I got data from. RTE website. 40,000 cases in total from start to current date. https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/summary/

I don't know what the home help strategy would be. Common sense would dictate that younger people only go to hospital as a last resort.

How many people are instructed to go to hospital by a GP/test centre after testing positive for Corona?

irishblessing

irishblessing wrote: »

That's not true. Up to 20% require hospitalisation. Though most may not die, people can suffer terribly and there's a real risk of something called "long covid." You are trivialising the reality. Is it some sort of protective mechanism so you can try and feel better or what? It seems like you're trying to portray indifference or bravery, but I think what it actually reveals deep down is fear.

Most people are getting mild or no symptoms.
My 7 month pregnant daughter got Covid , so did her husband , her mother and father in law ,both overweight and 60 . All got mild symptoms, all kept working from home. No doctors, no hospitalization, no side effects. Too much scaremongers and heresay . The fact is very few are getting more than mild symptoms.

Obesity ,old age and heart disease are the underlying conditions that CAN make Covid worse, this has been flagged. The entire country should not be on lockdown . Vulnerable people should shield themselves , there should be an education marketing campaign that spells out what makes people vulnerable.

Over 19,500 test were carried out on Friday, the highest number of tests ever ! OBVIOUSLY cases will rise if we are testing this amount. Expect a huge rise today or tomorrow. It’s only numbers .

MOH

Divisadero wrote: »

"Have NEPHET lost the attention of the people?"

I would say it's the opposite in that a certain segment of the population are no longer paying attention to NEPHET. Or it seems are the Govt. Not that I relish their position! It has got to the stage now where some of the population who believe in the science and listen to actual experts and are doing their best to do the right thing for their loved ones and society as a whole are also getting frustrated. Not with NEPHET but with conspiracy theorists and the selfish and the feckless.

Andrewf20 wrote: »

It's an uphill battle for nphet to convince the masses. It's like the saying, if everyone owns this, then no one owns it. A lot of people are fed up with lockdown, leading to lockdown fatigue. Bbc news did an article on it, saying that people are less likely to adhere to the rules a 2nd time around.

I've lost all faith in the government or NPHET, and I've pretty much given up on following their recommendations. But it's not because I'm some kind of conspiracy theorist, or I don't believe in masks or social distancing, or the need for restrictions.

I'll still wear a mask, and keep my distance from people, and limit my contacts (I've seen nine people since March), because that's basic common sense during a respiratory pandemic and I want to protect myself and the people I care about. And I'll follow whatever seems to be international best advice. Because I want to get back to some level of normality, and clearly some level of restrictions are necessary.

But the problem is, it's all pointless.

We were told back in March that we needed to flatten the curve. To buy time to ramp up resources and infrastructure to deal with the pandemic. And for the most part, the public did their part (apart from the muppets who insisted on having mates over and house parties).

The government and medical services didn't. The lockdown went on longer than necessary because they failed to get the required levels of testing implemented in time.
We were supposed to be contact tracing - the chairman of NPHET said in June that with the additional testing and tracing capacity we should be able to quickly target and isolate clusters and quarantine contacts, instead of returning to a national-level lockdown. Instead, we find out a few weeks ago that there's zero effort being put into tracing how clusters started, which is why 70% of them are recorded as being in private homes. We're told we don't have the resources to do this "academic exercise", despite the fact that this is the most valuable information we could have in terms of suppressing the pandemic. And that we were standing down contract tracing centres as the country reopened because there wasn't enough for them to do. When instead we could have seen
as things opened exactly how it was starting to spread.

We have a whole cadre of medical professional pushing a so-called "zero-covid" approach (what happened to "flatten the curve"?), despite the fact that it is blindingly obvious that this is impossible. We share a very porous land border with a country that's recording new cases five times as fast as us. Which is irrelevant, because we have failed to enforce any kind of quarantine in our own airports. I know people who visited relatives in Europe during the summer and were checked on a regular basis, in person, that they were where they were supposed to be or face a fine of 1500. Here, people aren't even bothering to fill in the forms on arrival. We are not New Zealand, how ever much Leo might crave the level of attention and praise Jacinda Ardern has received.

There was a ton of fanfare about the wonderful, detailed, clearly-defined five stage plan the government had prepared, so that we would all know in advance exactly what moving to each stage would mean for everyone. Aside from the chaos of the launch, and the muppetry last weekend, the plan is meaningless. It's been edited at least three times this week. There's no point having an advance plan if you keep changing it every five minutes.

The government and NPHET are facing an uphill battle because they have utterly failed the people of this country (although admittedly a large part of the blame lies with Leo's previous government).

How do you expect people to respect you, and make difficult sacrifices, when you repeatedly fail to live up to your end of the bargain?

mr zulu

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Most people are getting mild or no symptoms.
My 7 month pregnant daughter got Covid , so did her husband , her mother and father in law ,both overweight and 60 . All got mild symptoms, all kept working from home. No doctors, no hospitalization, no side effects. Too much scaremongers and heresay . The fact is very few are getting more than mild symptoms.

Obesity ,old age and heart disease are the underlying conditions that CAN make Covid worse, this has been flagged. The entire country should not be on lockdown . Vulnerable people should shield themselves , there should be an education marketing campaign that spells out what makes people vulnerable.

Over 19,500 test were carried out on Friday, the highest number of tests ever ! OBVIOUSLY cases will rise if we are testing this amount. Expect a huge rise today or tomorrow. It’s only numbers .

Yes, talked to my friend last night, his daughter with a underlying condition went for a blood test, they tested her for covid and she had it, father, mother and brother were tested positive as well, not one of them had symptoms.

Riesen_Meal

My mother got it, she was hospitalised for 4 days on a breathing machine, she is probably the healthiest person I know, even more than me, 6 months later she is still getting fatigue in the evenings and her hair is falling out rapidly after it...

Andrewf20

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

well tbh if you're taking your lead from “Dr Johnny Bananas” and “Professor Cominic Dummings” I doubt you were too committed to the 'official narrative' in the first place.

There's 6000 experts signed up now according to BBC.

normanoffside

NPHET are now completely going against WHO advice which is to avoid lockdowns.


https://twitter.com/spectator/status/1314573157827858434

^^^ that should be compulsory viewing

MelbourneMan

normanoffside wrote: »

NPHET are now completely going against WHO advice which is to avoid lockdowns.

To be fair to them, they might have been, but have now recongised they are wrong, and arent advocating a change from Level 3. So while Holohan is still saying the situation has deteriorated in the last few days, it no longer warrants the level 5 he wanted last Sunday. No explanation of where they got it wrong, nor it seems, an apology for the mayhem he caused.
My read - NPHET was doing fine. Tony rolled in, was out of touch and panicked, and pushed the level 5 lever. Probably giving Glynn a kicking on the way about not going level 4 or 5 three days earlier. Then gets put back in his box by the govt. Scientific impartial advice is still scientific advise 4 days later again on Thursday - and this time they are fine with Level 3. He needs to hold his hand up a bit more publicly now, and while they are no angels and masters of deflection and spin, he really dropped the politicians, and the country in it. At least NPHET in its deed if without the contrition they should bring with it, are no acknowledging they feked up.

normanoffside

MelbourneMan wrote: »

To be fair to them, they might have been, but have now recongised they are wrong, and arent advocating a change from Level 3.

I don't think they recognised they are wrong, they just recognised they weren't going to get their way.