All Covid-19 measures are permanent, don't be a boiling frog!

GT89

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

To what end?

Why has it been "exaggerated to suit certain businesses and individuals"?

Who are they and what do they gain?

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2020/oct/07/covid-19-crisis-boosts-the-fortunes-of-worlds-billionaires

runawaybishop

GT89 wrote: »

Thought hsopitals were supposed to be overwhelmed? So lockdown, social distancing and masks every year then is it?

Not overwhelmed yet. Getting there though. Why would we need lockdown after everyone is vaccinated?

This is such a poor conspiracy theory

Dohnjoe

Since March the same stuff, over and over. Once again the lack of basic knowledge about this goes hand in hand with a belief in conspiracies

"It's the same as the flu" No it isn't
"Why all the fuss it's not that deadly" It has a fatality rate and it's threatening to overwhelm hospitals
"I think hospitals are fine" Watch the news
"If masks work why do we still have the virus" Masks reduce the spread
"We had a lockdown already, so why are people are still getting it" Lockdowns reduce the spread
"This doctor on Youtube said" Is likely a crank. Some professionals are loons.
"But they are saying it's all fake" Ignore the isolated loons, listen to the consensus of medical professionals
"But some people with other issues can't get treatment" All people won't be able to get treatment when hospitals are full
"1.7 mm people can't have died" That's the current global estimate based on figures from each country. If there is an alternative, with evidence, provide it
"I'm not taking the vaccine!" Then don't
"I'm just concerned about vaccine safety" Be more concerned about your lack of knowledge and perspective on vaccines
"I don't understand, therefore something is going on" Is not a rational argument for anything
"I can't believe this, so something must be happening" Is not a rational argument for anything
"Something is going on" Detail it, with evidence

GT89

runawaybishop wrote: »

Not overwhelmed yet. Getting there though. Why would we need lockdown after everyone is vaccinated?

This is such a poor conspiracy theory

Thought they were supposed to have gotten overwhelmed last April never happened though.

runawaybishop

GT89 wrote: »

Thought.

Doubt it. You have clearly spent zero time actually looking at reputable information.

GT89

Seen this video from the UK hospitals are completely empty
https://twitter.com/Yeadoncampaign/status/1344297371547672577?s=19

The Raging Bile Duct

She's filming in the outpatients section of the hospital...

Dohnjoe

GT89 wrote: »

Seen this video from the UK hospitals are completely empty

Christ..

England's hospitals are at their highest level of capacity, and many have been described as near "breaking point", over 400 people are dying of Covid every day, and cases have topped over 50k per day for the last week. If you bothered to read or watch a single piece of news from any outlet you'd know this.

runawaybishop

Didn't Antrim hospital put out a statement saying yeah, our corridors are empty - as they should be during a rampant infectious disease - everyone is in the wards. This was after someone claimed the hospital was empty.

Edit: also yeah, filmed in the outpatients section, you know, the one that closes over Xmas as there are no outpatients appointments. Also that crowd you tweeted are trying to drum up money

King Mob

NaFirinne wrote: »

Isn't there a 5g conspiracy theory running around somewhere?

Yes. It's complete anti-scientific nonsense.

NaFirinne wrote: »

I don't know what covid is -

Covid 19 is a type of Coronavirus.
This information is easy to find and readily available to educate yourself.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coronavirus_disease_2019

NaFirinne wrote: »

Might be worth looking into if the Covid Symtoms are similar too any type of radiation based side effects rather then the flu.

No they aren't.
Covid symtoms are not consistent with any type of radiation sickness.
Additionally, 5G cannot cause radiation sickness as it's not a source of ionizing radiation.

NaFirinne wrote: »

is the covid test an actually checking for an actual virus or just a genetic code that many people would have.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COVID-19_testing

They are checking for the RNA of the virus.
In some cases they look for the antibodies for the virus.

GT89, do you also believe that there is some connection between covid and 5G?

GT89

King Mob wrote: »

GT89, do you also believe that there is some connection between covid and 5G?

Not sure if that's really a relevant question. No I don't think they're linked but I still don't think 5g is nessecarily 100% safe

gmisk

GT89 wrote: »

Not sure if that's really a relevant question. No I don't think they're linked but I still don't think 5g is nessecarily 100% safe

Do you think 5g is any less safe than 4g? Or 3g?

King Mob

GT89 wrote: »

Not sure if that's really a relevant question.

It's what many conspiracy theorists are suggesting including NaFirinne

GT89 wrote: »

No I don't think they're linked but I still don't think 5g is nessecarily 100% safe

Why do you not think they are linked?
Why are the conspiracy theorists wrong about this?

Also, why do you think it's not safe?
There seems to be a correlation between people who believe conspiracy theories about health issues and those who don't understand how things like viruses and radiation work.

Dohnjoe

Covid deniers removed from "at capacity" hospital in Colchester

Security officers removed Covid-19 "deniers" who were taking pictures of empty corridors at a NHS hospital where the intensive care unit is at maximum capacity, its chief executive said.

The incident took place at Colchester Hospital at the weekend.

Chief executive Nick Hulme said it "beggars belief" some people were calling the pandemic a hoax.

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-essex-55531589

Just wow.

King Mob

Dohnjoe wrote: »

Covid deniers removed from "at capacity" hospital in Colchester

https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-england-essex-55531589

Just wow.

What's amazing is that these people would have to see and ignore the active, busy parts of the hospital entirely.

Not sure which is more worrying that people would be willing to be this deceptive during a crisis. Or that people could be that self deluded.

King Mob

https://www.cnbc.com/2021/01/04/prosecutor-wisconsin-pharmacist-thought-vaccine-was-unsafe-.html

A detective wrote in a probable cause statement that Brandenburg, 46, is an admitted conspiracy theorist and that he told investigators he intentionally tried to ruin the vaccine because it could hurt people by changing their DNA.

At least he's actually doing something about his false, wacky beliefs I suppose.

Merry Prankster

GT89 wrote: »

There are no flu cases in hospitals but loads of covid cases. Where has the flu gone has covid taken over?

You keep posting things along the line of 'isn't this suspicious?,' yet you don't interrogate these suspicions with any degree of critical depth. 'This looks suspicious...therefore my narrative is true.'

So...flu numbers are right down, and numerous posts have sought to explain to you why this is. You clearly feel that these low flu numbers suggest *something*, but don't explain exactly what. So...what do the low flu numbers mean exactly? Please provide evidence to support your allegation.

GT89 wrote: »

https://www.theguardian.com/business/2020/oct/07/covid-19-crisis-boosts-the-fortunes-of-worlds-billionaires

You suggest that the big tech companies' huge increase in profits demonstrates that they have something to do with this 'hoax,' (rather than just having businesses that are perfectly suited to lockdowns). Now, they were doing pretty well before the pandemic - do you think that they would engineer a pandemic (that has destroyed businesses and economies and upended people's lives around the world) just so that they can make even more money? And that the rest of society would be completely oblivious to this? Where's your evidence?

Here's where you're going wrong: normal investigative journalism (which every conspiracy theorist believes that they are engaged in) starts with EVIDENCE first...and this evidence leads to the DISCOVERY of a narrative. Conspiracy theorists start with the CREATION of a narrative first (global elites, control etc - off-the-shelf ones that have been around forever) and then look for 'evidence.' Which is identical to religions and cults, who see god everywhere despite no genuine evidence supporting their beliefs. It is a mindset.

As anyone who's ever used weed or acid and then had a bad 'un knows, once you've convinced yourself about a narrative, EVERYTHING seems to support that delusion. I brought a friend to a rave years ago - there were over a thousand people at it, yet he became convinced that the whole event had been organised specifically for him, and that we were all going to kill him at the end of it. Once he came down off all of the weed he had smoked, he realised it was the product of a feverish delusion. But before that point, everything he saw fed into this delusion, and nothing we could say could convince him otherwise.

GT89

Dohnjoe wrote: »

Christ..

England's hospitals are at their highest level of capacity, and many have been described as near "breaking point", over 400 people are dying of Covid every day, and cases have topped over 50k per day for the last week. If you bothered to read or watch a single piece of news from any outlet you'd know this.

If there was a really severe plague going on the hospitals would be out the door every square inch of space would be used including the outpatient area in fact there would be probably be field hospitals set up in the car park of the hospitals. But no there is plenty of unoccupied in the hsopitals and the nightingale have not been used for months but you continue to believe that UK hospitals are at breaking point when quite frankly they are not.

King Mob

GT89 wrote: »

If there was a really severe plague going on the hospitals would be out the door every square inch of space would be used including the outpatient area in fact there would be probably be field hospitals set up in the car park of the hospitals. But no there is plenty of unoccupied in the hsopitals and the nightingale have not been used for months but you continue to believe that UK hospitals are at breaking point when quite frankly they are not.

So you don't believe covid exists?

Why do doctors and medical professionals say that they are at breaking point? Are they lying because they are part of a conspiracy?

Timberrrrrrrr

GT89 wrote: »

If there was a really severe plague going on the hospitals would be out the door every square inch of space would be used including the outpatient area in fact there would be probably be field hospitals set up in the car park of the hospitals. But no there is plenty of unoccupied in the hsopitals and the nightingale have not been used for months but you continue to believe that UK hospitals are at breaking point when quite frankly they are not.

So the nurses/doctors who we see on TV giving interviews and saying they are at full capacity, they are lying? Are they actors/actresses?

Tell me, what good would a hospital bed in the outpatients department be to someone who needs a ventilator?

GT89

King Mob wrote: »

So you don't believe covid exists?

Why do doctors and medical professionals say that they are at breaking point? Are they lying because they are part of a conspiracy?

I don't believe it's as serious as is made out. How exactly are they at breaking point when there were nightingale hospitals put in place to deal with any surge in demand were empty when they were in use and have now been taken out of use because they weren't used. Here in Ireland the place in citywest berely used and the private hospitals weren't needed.

It's like saying a double decker bus is packed because everyone is standing downstairs even though there are loads of seats available on the upper deck.

King Mob

GT89 wrote: »

I don't believe it's as serious as is made out.

Ok. How serious is it really and how did you reach this conclusion? What sources and evidence did you use to reach this conclusion?
How do you explain all the doctors, medical professionals and other experts who contradict your opinion? Are they all part of the global conspiracy you believe in?
You ignored this question in my previous post, so I suspect that you are unwilling to admit this because you know how ridiculous such a claim is.
And rather than admit this, or that you conspiracy doesn't make sense, you ignore it and run away from the point.

GT89 wrote: »

How exactly are they at breaking point when there were nightingale hospitals put in place to deal with any surge in demand were empty when they were in use and have now been taken out of use because they weren't used. Here in Ireland the place in citywest berely used and the private hospitals weren't needed.

It's like saying a double decker bus is packed because everyone is standing downstairs even though there are loads of seats available on the upper deck.

Again, just because you personally don't understand something doesn't mean it's a conspiracy.

As has been pointed out, people sick from covid need things like specialised attention and care as well as equipment like ventilators.
It's not simply a matter of space. It's equipment, logistics and manpower.

Again, bald ignorance is not a valid basis for an opinion.
Just because you don't know and can't be bothered to find out or figure it out it doesn't mean the lazy and dishonest conclusion that it's a global conspiracy is correct.

GT89

King Mob wrote: »

As has been pointed out, people sick from covid need things like specialised attention and care as well as equipment like ventilators.
It's not simply a matter of space. It's equipment, logistics and manpower.

Again, bald ignorance is not a valid basis for an opinion.
Just because you don't know and can't be bothered to find out or figure it out it doesn't mean the lazy and dishonest conclusion that it's a global conspiracy is correct.

The UK bought nearly 21k ventilators and they were deemed surplus to requirements why?
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/sep/30/uk-spent-569m-on-20900-ventilators-for-covid-care-but-most-remain-unused

Tell then what was the point then of putting in the likes of the nightingale hospitals if they were never going to be able to deal with a surge in capacity?

Explain to me why during the bubonic plague dead bodies literally lined the streets but during covid no such thing not even close but yet we are supposed to believe this is a highly contagious deadly virus. Facts are during a deadly plague it's litterally a case of survival of the fittest. There's no going shopping, no going for 9€ meals and most certainly no plane loads of people coming into the country. Only death, misery, suffering and destruction of human life. If there was a plague the health service could not plan for such an occurence as it's impossible to plan for such a event and if one was to hit the health system would be useless.

Timberrrrrrrr

GT89 wrote: »

The UK bought nearly 21k ventilators and they were deemed surplus to requirements why?
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/sep/30/uk-spent-569m-on-20900-ventilators-for-covid-care-but-most-remain-unused

Explain to me why during the bubonic plague dead bodies literally lined the streets but during covid no such thing not even close but yet we are supposed to believe this is a highly contagious deadly virus. Facts are during a deadly plague it's litterally a case of survival of the fittest. There's no going shopping, no going for 9€ meals and most certainly no plane loads of people coming into the country. Only death, misery, suffering and destruction of human life. If there was a plague the health service could not plan for such an occurence as it's impossible to plan for such a event and if one was to hit the health system would be useless.

You mean the bubonic plague of 1665 when health care was practically unheard of except for the very wealthy?

You're really comparing covid treatment/survival today to a plague 350 years ago :pac:


Edit: Covid is not a plague.

Dohnjoe

GT89 wrote: »

I don't believe it's as serious as is made out.

"I can't believe it, therefore conspiracy"

People can't believe or comprehend the world is round, therefore to them it's a giant conspiracy. You do realise how dangerously close you are to that kind of thinking right..

And before anyone chimes in with any excuses, this poster has had a multitude of straightforward explanations, all the info is easily available, there is no excuse whatsoever

King Mob

GT89 wrote: »

...why?


Tell then ...

Explain to me ...

You're demanding a lot of explanations when they're readily available for you to find out. They've been explained to you.

At the same time, you're dodging questions about your own belief. This shows that you are being dishonest and/or you realise how ridiculous your conspiracy is and don't want to admit it.

ShatterAlan

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

So the nurses/doctors who we see on TV giving interviews and saying they are at full capacity, they are lying? Are they actors/actresses?

Tell me, what good would a hospital bed in the outpatients department be to someone who needs a ventilator?

What's your definition of "breaking point"?


It sounds as if they are overwhelmed by people dying as if this was war. As if it was akin to the Blitz of London. Were hospitals at breaking point in London, Birmingham and Coventry during the winter of 1940 through to the Summer of 1941?


Apparently there are less than 60 people in hospitals in Ireland in intensive care as a result of Covid-19. I'm open to correction on this figure but it seems like a tiny amount.



Do you know anybody who works in a hospital? My friend is a nurse in Beaumont and says nothing of this "breaking point" melodrama.


I'm just looking at some footage right now on the BBC regarding LA hospitals and the woman is saying the hospitals are being stretched to the "nth degree" and are near collapse and yet the footage behind her shows staff just walking around the hospital ward like nothing was out of the ordinary.


Where is this "breaking point"?



I would imagine that any hospital in Dublin on a normal Saturday night would have an ER festooned with drug, alcohol, violence, accident victims and a whole plethora of other cases....yet the hospitals are currently at breaking point?


Another friend of mine, an ex, works in the Mater. She's says nothing of this breaking point talk.


I can't talk about actors but I can tell you that both my acquaintances are not actors. They tell me what they see and deal with. Not only that but I've seen it with my own eyes. My friend's mother slipped and did her hip in while she was going for tests in Beaumont. We can't go inside to visit her other than to drop up some books, papers, socks, underwear etc. The place looks no different in the lobby or hallways than it ever was. Unless behind the doors of the main corridors it's absolute carnage and they are wheelbarrowing corpses out of the place as if it was "Black '47'

King Mob

GT89 wrote: »

The UK bought nearly 21k ventilators and they were deemed surplus to requirements why?
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2020/sep/30/uk-spent-569m-on-20900-ventilators-for-covid-care-but-most-remain-unused

Also, just to point out how dishonest you and other conspiracy theorists are being. And to highlight how easy it is to debunk your claims...
We'll just have a little read of the article past the headline, something I suspect you have not done.

Firstly, the article is from September of 2020 and is reporting on figures that were already old.
It is now January of 2021. The number of cases have once again risen even beyond the peaks back in April. Suggesting that the rest of these ventilators aren't going to be used is simply silly.
Suggesting things have not changed from April or September of last year is dishonest in the extreme.

Secondly that article states:

Meg Hillier, the MP who chairs the Commons public accounts committee, said: “The government was quick off the blocks when it seemed like there was a pressing need to increase the number of ventilators in the NHS.

“We were lucky the worst-case scenario didn’t come to pass before the extra ventilators had arrived. However, the NHS is now much better prepared for whatever happens next.

So we see that they were buying for the worst-case scenario, not for the numbers that were actually needed. They had no idea how many would have been needed because there's no such thing as psychic powers.

Thirdly:

Despite both departments vigorously pursuing more of the machines from mid-March, they had only acquired 1,800 extra by the time the peak of the pandemic struck in mid-April.

And they missed the government target to increase the NHS’s stock of ventilators from only 7,400 at the start of the crisis to 18,000 by the end of April and 30,000 by the end of August.

I'm not sure how these facts mesh with the conspiracy.

I'm not sure how any of this meshes with the conspiracy. I'd ask, but usually this question is ignored because there's no answer.
It doesn't mesh with the conspiracy. It makes no sense in the context of a conspiracy.
It doesn't make sense they would waste money for ventilators they know they won't need.
It doesn't make sense that they would order so many that it would expose the conspiracy.
It doesn't make sense that this would be reported in the mainstream media that supposed to be in on the conspiracy.
It doesn't make sense that they admit to it.

It only makes sense in a conspiracy if you just read the headline and literally don't think any deeper or longer on it.

King Mob

ShatterAlan wrote: »

Do you know anybody who works in a hospital? My friend is a nurse in Beaumont and says nothing of this "breaking point" melodrama.


I'm just looking at some footage right now on the BBC regarding LA hospitals and the woman is saying the hospitals are being stretched to the "nth degree" and are near collapse and yet the footage behind her shows staff just walking around the hospital ward like nothing was out of the ordinary.

Another friend of mine, an ex, works in the Mater. She's says nothing of this breaking point talk.


I can't talk about actors but I can tell you that both my acquaintances are not actors. '

Funny how there's always someone who knows someone....

So why is the woman in the LA hospital claiming that they are stretched?
Is she part of the conspiracy?
Why aren't your alleged acquaintances? Were they offered a part in the conspiracy and they turned it down?

sabat

The ventilators aren't used because it has transpired they are completely inappropriate for treating this type of respiratory illness and were a large factor in Italy's high death rate.