All Covid-19 measures are permanent, don't be a boiling frog!

Timberrrrrrrr

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

I live in the UK, I have ignored everything she has ever said.

Fair enough, but I wouldn't be inclined to dismiss what she says since she's the Home Secretary. If she were a backbench MP then maybe. A person mightn't like Micheál Martin, but when he hints at domestic vaccine passports (https://www.irishmirror.ie/news/irish-news/taoiseach-says-people-could-prove-23328300), whether they like him or not, or choose to ignore what he says, doesn't mean it won't happen.

runawaybishop

runawaybishop wrote: »

Here is the actual quote. Why are you being so dishonest?

But he warned some of the less-restrictive curbs, like social distancing or occasional mask-use, could be here 'forever'.

Occasional mask use means all indoor spaces and public transport.

Timberrrrrrrr

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Occasional mask use means all indoor spaces and public transport.

Really? Do.you have to wear a mask in all indoor spaces now?

robinph

robinph wrote: »

You are the one claiming there is a conspiracy happening, but you have yet to explain any of why these measures are being made permanent or who is wanting these measures to be permanent?

But I didn't say the measures would be permanent. The poster who created the thread did. I fear masks will be permanent, but I don't think social distancing will be because it'd mean no concerts, clubbing, football matches, plays etc. But I could see it being permanent in the workplace. But I think people could live with that.

King Mob

Deleted User wrote: »

I fear masks will be permanent,

Why would masks be permanent?
Why do you believe there's a conspiracy to make masks permanent?

Are any other measures going to be permanent? If so, which ones? Why?

Deleted User wrote: »

Occasional mask use means all indoor spaces and public transport.

Please quote directly where he states this.

Timberrrrrrrr

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Really? Do.you have to wear a mask in all indoor spaces now?

Yes. Shops, post office, the bank. Everywhere else is closed. And on all public transport.

Timberrrrrrrr

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Yes. Shops, post office, the bank. Everywhere else is closed. And on all public transport.

So not everywhere, and I would have no issue with masks on public transport. The amount of people hacking thier guts up in winter and spreading whatever flu/cold/bug they have is disgusting.

King Mob

King Mob wrote: »

Why would masks be permanent?
Why do you believe there's a conspiracy to make mask permanent?

Are any other measures going to be permanent? If so, which ones? Why?

Because of potential variants. No conspiracy.

According to the UK Home Secretary, social distancing is "here to stay" in the UK. So she's saying that that measure will be permanent in the UK.

Timberrrrrrrr

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

So not everywhere, and I would have no issue with masks on public transport. The amount of people hacking thier guts up in winter and spreading whatever flu/cold/bug they have is disgusting.

And if restaurants, bars etc were open they people would have to wear them in them as well.

Voluntary wearing of masks would be okay with me.

robinph

[Deleted User] wrote: »

But I didn't say the measures would be permanent. The poster who created the thread did. I fear masks will be permanent, but I don't think social distancing will be because it'd mean no concerts, clubbing, football matches, plays etc. But I could see it being permanent in the workplace. But I think people could live with that.

If we are still wearing masks is that going to be because of risk from covid, or some shadowy organisation directing government from behind the scenes without them realising?

King Mob

Deleted User wrote: »

Because of potential variants.

Ok? And? Why would you fear masks then?
What are you afraid of?

Deleted User wrote: »

No conspiracy.

Oh so there's no plot to force people to wear masks.
Great.
So earlier when you made a stink about conspiracy theorists being right about their conspiracy theory that there was a conspiracy to force people to wear masks...?
https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=116451588&postcount=2335

Were you wrong then?

If you now believe that there's no conspiracy and that conspiracy theorists were actually wrong, what changed your mind?

Deleted User wrote: »

According to the UK Home Secretary, social distancing is "here to stay" in the UK. So she's saying that that measure will be permanent in the UK.

Cool. Provide the specific quote where she said:
Occasional mask use means all indoor spaces and public transport.

Please quote her directly using those words.

robinph

robinph wrote: »

If we are still wearing masks is that going to be because of risk from covid, or some shadowy organisation directing government from behind the scenes without them realising?

Does it matter? Either way it'd mean that the poster who created this thread was right when he said they'd be permanent.

Would you be okay with wearing a mask for ever because of potential variants? Or would you rather people be allowed to take their chances?

robinph

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Because of potential variants. No conspiracy.

I think you may have landed in the wrong thread then if you are just concerned about how long various restrictions will last and when we'll get back to how we were a year ago. We're all wondering that, but we don't think there is any conspiracy behind why we are currently following various restrictions.

This thread is for those who belive that the restrictions are in place to deal with a virus that doesn't exist, and probably also that it was developed in a lab by the Chinese, and that the wearing of masks and social distancing is being forced on us because... Well that's where the argument tends to go silent.

King Mob

Deleted User wrote: »

Does it matter? Either way it'd mean that the poster who created this thread was right when he said they'd be permanent.

Yes. It does matter
Suggesting that it's due to a vast irrational global conspiracy that doesn't make a lick of sense is ridiculous.

Do you agree that Suggesting that it's due to a vast irrational global conspiracy that doesn't make a lick of sense is ridiculous?

King Mob

King Mob wrote: »

Ok? And? Why would you fear masks then?
What are you afraid of?


Oh so there's no plot to force people to wear masks.
Great.
So earlier when you made a stink about conspiracy theorists being right about their conspiracy theory that there was a conspiracy to force people to wear masks...?
https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=116451588&postcount=2335

Were you wrong then?

If you now believe that there's no conspiracy and that conspiracy theorists were actually wrong, what changed your mind?


Cool. Provide the specific quote where she said:
Occasional mask use means all indoor spaces and public transport.

Please quote her directly using those words.

I don't want to wear one for ever. That's the fear. If you do then that's okay. That's up to you. But I don't.

I said that people were saying all of those things were conspiracy theories, and mocked people who warned about them, but when they actually came to pass (health passport in Israel). or were being pushed (permanent mask-wearing and permanent social distancing), they doubled down on them being conspiracy theories. So even when it happens (health passport in Israel) they still say it's a conspiracy theory.

You can read for yourself what professor Edmunds and Priti Patel said. I provided links. Or you can Google it if you don't like the sources.

robinph

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Does it matter? Either way it'd mean that the poster who created this thread was right when he said they'd be permanent.

Would you be okay with wearing a mask for ever because of potential variants? Or would you rather people be allowed to take their chances?

Yes it matters as that is the entire point of the thread. The thread claims that we are being fooled into following restrictions on mask wearing etc for no reason. As yet nobody has provided any reason for why the wearing of masks is being forced on us for no reason.

If you believe that mask wearing is required to prevent the transmission of the virus then you are arguing for the wrong side in what you are posting here, as that would mean you are in agreement with the rest of us. If you think there is someone tricking us into mask wearing then you are on the side of the OP and we'd just like to know what you think the reason for this trickery in making us wear masks is for?

robinph

robinph wrote: »

I think you may have landed in the wrong thread then if you are just concerned about how long various restrictions will last and when we'll get back to how we were a year ago. We're all wondering that, but we don't think there is any conspiracy behind why we are currently following various restrictions.

This thread is for those who belive that the restrictions are in place to deal with a virus that doesn't exist, and probably also that it was developed in a lab by the Chinese, and that the wearing of masks and social distancing is being forced on us because... Well that's where the argument tends to go silent.

I just reread the first post in this thread, and there's nothing in it about the virus not existing or it being developed in a lab. The poster said that the measures would be permanent for various reasons. I find his argument persuasive.

King Mob

Deleted User wrote: »

I don't want to wear one for ever. That's the fear. If you do then that's okay. That's up to you. But I don't.

But why would you fear that?
If you are at risk of catching a virus, why wouldn't you want to wear a mask?

Your fear seems a bit irrational.

Deleted User wrote: »

I said that people were saying all of those things were conspiracy theories, and mocked people who warned about them, but when they actually came to pass (health passport in Israel).

Yes. They are conspiracy theories because people were claiming that these things would be due to a vast global conspiracy.

You argee that it is not due to a vast global conspiracy and this claim is wrong.

Conspiracy theorists were also claiming a great many things that I pointed out and you ignored.
Do you believe those things?
Why did you ignore them?

Deleted User wrote: »

or were being pushed (permanent mask-wearing and permanent social distancing), they doubled down on them being conspiracy theories.

Again, pushed as a step towards a vast global plot that was much worse.

Deleted User wrote: »

So even when it happens (health passport in Israel) they still say it's a conspiracy theory.

But as we've seen, you are not very honest about your own claims, so it's not "happening" in Israel.

Deleted User wrote: »

You can read for yourself what professor Edmunds and Priti Patel said. I provided links. Or you can Google it if you don't like the sources.

So again, you cannot provide the quote. She did not say what you claimed she said.

robinph

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I don't want to wear one for ever. That's the fear. If you do then that's okay. That's up to you. But I don't.

I said that people were saying all of those things were conspiracy theories, and mocked people who warned about them, but when they actually came to pass (health passport in Israel). or were being pushed (permanent mask-wearing and permanent social distancing), they doubled down on them being conspiracy theories. So even when it happens (health passport in Israel) they still say it's a conspiracy theory.

You can read for yourself what professor Edmunds and Priti Patel said. I provided links. Or you can Google it if you don't like the sources.

It's not a conspiracy theory to say that we may have to live with mask wearing into the future if vaccines alone don't contol the virus and we need to change our social interaction to cope with the infection numbers.

It is a conspiracy theory to say "don't be a boiling frog" and there restrictions are permanent due to some unknown reasons that nobody is prepared to explain.

King Mob

Deleted User wrote: »

I just reread the first post in this thread, and there's nothing in it about the virus not existing or it being developed in a lab. The poster said that the measures would be permanent for various reasons. I find his argument persuasive.

Ok, so now you're changing your mind again and you do believe that there's a conspiracy?

Since you were convince again so easily, could you perhaps explain what the ulterior motive to force people to wear masks is?
The OP believes that it is not due to the virus, but we've not seen an alternative explanation.

robinph

robinph wrote: »

It's not a conspiracy theory to say that we may have to live with mask wearing into the future if vaccines alone don't contol the virus and we need to change our social interaction to cope with the infection numbers.

It is a conspiracy theory to say "don't be a boiling frog" and there restrictions are permanent due to some unknown reasons that nobody is prepared to explain.

Would you be willing to wear a mask for ever because of potential variants? And if covid went away, but the government mandated masks because of potential flu variants would you be willing to wear a mask?

But the OP explained why he believes the measures will be permanent. He said that too much money and time has been invested in changing the face of society for them to be temporary, and that he doesn't believe the government will relinquish power and control. It's a persuasive argument.

King Mob

Deleted User wrote: »

Would you be willing to wear a mask for ever because of potential variants? And if covid went away, but the government mandated masks because of potential flu variants would you be willing to wear a mask?

But the OP explained why he believes the measures will be permanent. He said that too much money and time has been invested in changing the face of society for them to be temporary, and that he doesn't believe the government will relinquish power and control. It's a persuasive argument.

Ok. SO then please explain the argument:

d) This last point I am sure some of you will not get, but I will make it anyway. These measures are being rolled out precisely because they have huge social and population control advantages for the state,

In what way does forcing people to wear masks give them an advantage?

The OP also claims that the measures were always planned to be permanent, which is a conspiracy. So do you now believe in a conspiracy after previously claiming there was none?

King Mob

King Mob wrote: »

But why would you fear that?
If you are at risk of catching a virus, why wouldn't you want to wear a mask?

Your fear seems a bit irrational.


Yes. They are conspiracy theories because people were claiming that these things would be due to a vast global conspiracy.

You argee that it is not due to a vast global conspiracy and this claim is wrong.

Conspiracy theorists were also claiming a great many things that I pointed out and you ignored.
Do you believe those things?
Why did you ignore them?


Again, pushed as a step towards a vast global plot that was much worse.


But as we've seen, you are not very honest about your own claims, so it's not "happening" in Israel.


So again, you cannot provide the quote. She did not say what you claimed she said.

Because I'd rather take the minuscule risk than cover my face for ever.

The OP gave his reasons for why he believes they will be permanent. He didn't mention anything about a global conspiracy.

So currently in Israel people who aren't vaccinated are not banned from gyms, bars, the theatre, restaurants etc? All the articles about the health / vaccine passport in Israel are inaccurate?

She said "social distancing is here to stay". You can wrap yourself in knots trying to spin it, but 'here to stay' means permanent.

Ans Professor Edmunds said masks would probably be required for ever. You can luck it up, or continue to insist that he didn't say it.

King Mob

King Mob wrote: »

Ok. SO then please explain the argument:


In what way does forcing people to wear masks give them an advantage?

The OP also claims that the measures were always planned to be permanent, which is a conspiracy. So do you now believe in a conspiracy after previously claiming there was none?

It's not for me to explain what brianhere meant. You'll have to ask him.

robinph

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Would you be willing to wear a mask for ever because of potential variants? And if covid went away, but the government mandated masks because of potential flu variants would you be willing to wear a mask?

I have to do far more painful and dangerous things every single day just to stay alive that an additional requirement to wear a mask is irrelevant.

If flu were to become such an issue that we were advised to wear masks to control its spread, why is that a bad thing?

But the OP explained why he believes the measures will be permanent. He said that too much money and time has been invested in changing the face of society for them to be temporary, and that he doesn't believe the government will relinquish power and control. It's a persuasive argument.

What is the benefit to any government to restrict their populations economic activity? How is any of these restrictions a good thing?

King Mob

Deleted User wrote: »

Because I'd rather take the minuscule risk than cover my face for ever.

But it's not a minuscule risk and you wouldn't be the only one at risk.
Unless you are now also going to once again flip flop and claim there is a conspiracy to over state the risk?

Deleted User wrote: »

The OP gave his reasons for why he believes they will be permanent. He didn't mention anything about a global conspiracy.

But it outlines that he believes it's a global conspiracy in the OP and elsewhere, particularly in the OP's conspiracy theory site.
Do you believe he's wrong about that?
Yes or no?

Additionally there have been many other conspiracy theorists who have popped into this thread since the OP ran off who have claimed a great many things.

Like for instance one poster claimed that the WEF was orchestrating the crisis to do... something.
https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=114713560&postcount=42
Do you believe this conspiracy theory is wrong?

Deleted User wrote: »

So currently in Israel people who aren't vaccinated are not banned from gyms, bars, the theatre, restaurants etc? All the articles about the health / vaccine passport in Israel are inaccurate?

I don't believe you are reporting them accurately because as we've seen you are not being very truthful, direct or honest.

Deleted User wrote: »

She said "social distancing is here to stay". You can wrap yourself in knots trying to spin it, but 'here to stay' means permanent.

Ans Professor Edmunds said masks would probably be required for ever. You can luck it up, or continue to insist that he didn't say it.

You said that they were stated: Occasional mask use means all indoor spaces and public transport.

So I'm asking you to provide this quote.
Can you not provide this quote where either of them state this?
If not, stop avoiding the point and just say so.

King Mob

Deleted User wrote: »

It's not for me to explain what brianhere meant. You'll have to ask him.

Dodging the question again. This is dishonest, but typical.

You here are admitting that you can't provide any reason for why forcing people to wear masks would give them an advantage.

Weird that you can't do this yet claim to have found the OP's argument convincing.

Personally if I found a big gaping plot hole in someone's theory that I can't explain, nor find any rational explanation for, I wouldn't find that theory convincing.

robinph

[Deleted User] wrote: »

It's not for me to explain what brianhere meant. You'll have to ask him.

You've said that you agree with them. What exactly is it that you agree with? What is the purpose of the conspiracy which is making all world governments get their citizenship to follow various restrictions?

robinph

robinph wrote: »

I have to do far more painful and dangerous things every single day just to stay alive that an additional requirement to wear a mask is irrelevant.

If flu were to become such an issue that we were advised to wear masks to control its spread, why is that a bad thing?



What is the benefit to any government to restrict their populations economic activity? How is any of these restrictions a good thing?

Well, the idea of permanent masks horrifies me, but to each their own.

That's a good question. Why is it that the government is completely relaxed about the banjaxed economy? I don't know why. Why do you think they are very relaxed about the dire economic situation of the country?

King Mob

King Mob wrote: »

Dodging the question again. This is dishonest, but typical.

You here are admitting that you can't provide any reason for why forcing people to wear masks would give them an advantage.

Weird that you can't do this yet claim to have found the OP's argument convincing.

Personally if I found a big gaping plot hole in someone's theory that I can't explain, nor find any rational explanation for, I wouldn't find that theory convincing.

I find what brianhere wrote to be persuasive. He gives and outlines the various reasons he believes the government is placing restrictions on the Irish people. There's no gaping hole in his hypothesis, as far as I can see. Ask brianhere what he thinks the government has to gain by forcing people to wear masks.