The Great Reset

Quiner

Fighting Tao wrote: »

We already had this discussion.

If you don’t test for covid, you don’t have official cases.

But is life back to normal there or not? Is life normal in Ireland?

Quiner

A blogger describes life in Tanzania:

"If there were a health crisis caused by the coronavirus, a number of vulnerable people would unfortunately die from it. So I decided to visit graveyards. This wouldn’t enable me to do a statistically reliable survey, but there should be signs of an increased death rate in the form of new graves, or a cluster of recent death dates, or signs that the graveyards are filling up.

I had seen similar signs of tragedy in Zambia during the HIV epidemic, and in Angola during the Marburg virus epidemic.

Here in Dar es Salaam, I visited three graveyards in the center of the city. To my astonishment I found one or two new graves per graveyard, with the newest one dated in June. The median age in Tanzania is low, so I would expect a lower mortality rate, but if the country was suffering a major epidemic like in the United States, Brazil or Russia, there should have been more.

Then I passed by a hospital. Entering proved difficult because of tight security. But the entrance of the main hospital in Dar es Salaam showed no signs of panic. There were no ambulances rushing in and out, no beds outside on the compound marking a crisis."

aido79

Quiner wrote: »

Completely normal life vs lockdowns for what could be forever. The first is Tanzania, the second is Ireland. You can focus on their praying to God, but the fact is that life is normal there, while here we can barely do anything.

It's ironic that you are using Tanzania as an example for how to successfully deal with covid19. It is exactly the type of country that most of these conspiracy theory threads think the world will end up like with authoritarian governments and a repressed population.
If Boris Johnson said tomorrow that covid19 had been eradicated from the UK overnight would you believe him?
I'm guessing not but that's what happened in Tanzania. They went from over 500 cases one day with very little testing to eradication of covid19 the next day. Do you really think prayer is that powerful in a country with such a mix of religions?

aido79

Quiner wrote: »

A blogger describes life in Tanzania:

"If there were a health crisis caused by the coronavirus, a number of vulnerable people would unfortunately die from it. So I decided to visit graveyards. This wouldn’t enable me to do a statistically reliable survey, but there should be signs of an increased death rate in the form of new graves, or a cluster of recent death dates, or signs that the graveyards are filling up.

I had seen similar signs of tragedy in Zambia during the HIV epidemic, and in Angola during the Marburg virus epidemic.

Here in Dar es Salaam, I visited three graveyards in the center of the city. To my astonishment I found one or two new graves per graveyard, with the newest one dated in June. The median age in Tanzania is low, so I would expect a lower mortality rate, but if the country was suffering a major epidemic like in the United States, Brazil or Russia, there should have been more.

Then I passed by a hospital. Entering proved difficult because of tight security. But the entrance of the main hospital in Dar es Salaam showed no signs of panic. There were no ambulances rushing in and out, no beds outside on the compound marking a crisis."

Here's an update from the same guy when he left Tanzania
https://www.voanews.com/episode/reporter-returns-kenya-and-new-coronavirus-reality-4419446

Spoiler alert:
He is very mistrusting of how Tanzania are dealing with it. They wouldn't tell him what would happen if he tested positive. That seems to have set off alarm bells for him and he is glad to have been finally allowed to leave Tanzania after being trapped there for 6 months against his will.

Quiner

aido79 wrote: »

It's ironic that you are using Tanzania as an example for how to successfully deal with covid19. It is exactly the type of country that most of these conspiracy theory threads think the world will end up like with authoritarian governments and a repressed population.
If Boris Johnson said tomorrow that covid19 had been eradicated from the UK overnight would you believe him?
I'm guessing not but that's what happened in Tanzania. They went from over 500 cases one day with very little testing to eradication of covid19 the next day. Do you really think prayer is that powerful in a country with such a mix of religions?

I'm not holding Tanzania up as the model for how to deal with covid. I'm just comparing life there with life here. Life is normal there, while here we're looking at lockdowns for who knows how long. I'm not referring to how people are treated there. I'm simply comparing life being pre March there vs life here. Another two month heinous lockdown from tomorrow.

I wouldn't believe Johnson. I don't believe a word that comes out of his mouth.

I'm saying that it definitely helped in terms of the people's perspective on covid. None of the hysteria you get here. Praying was enough for the people.

Timberrrrrrrr

Quiner wrote: »

I'm not holding Tanzania up as the model for how to deal with covid. I'm just comparing life there with life here. Life is normal there, while here we're looking at lockdowns for who knows how long. I'm not referring to how people are treated there. I'm simply comparing life being pre March there vs life here. Another two month heinous lockdown from tomorrow.

I wouldn't believe Johnson. I don't believe a word that comes out of his mouth.

I'm saying that it definitely helped in terms of the people's perspective on covid. None of the hysteria you get here. Praying was enough for the people.

Weren't you saying you are going to leave the country if they wanted to bring in vaccine verification apps? Tanzania sounds right up your street, when will you be moving over?

Fighting Tao

Quiner wrote: »

But is life back to normal there or not? Is life normal in Ireland?

Have you done any research on Tanzania to be able to declare that life is normal? State sponsored media holds no water as a reference in such a nation. The leader saying prayers to rid the nation of it and declares it works, yet they are not testing properly for it and so they can officially say that they have no detections.

I think it was Burundi that said they had no covid early on because they couldn’t afford the tests. No testing = no cases.

Quiner

Fighting Tao wrote: »

Have you done any research on Tanzania? The leader saying prayers to rid the nation of it and declares it works, yet they are not testing properly for it and so they can officially say that they have no detections.

I think it was Burundi that said they had no covid early on because they couldn’t afford the tests. No testing = no cases.

But that doesn't change the fact that life is back to normal there, i.e.no masks, distancing etc. Back to life as it was pre March. Whether you believe it was because of prayer or not, it's still back to normal. People have long forgotten about it and moved on.

While in this part of the world they move the goalposts every few days. This man said back to normal by spring a few weeks ago. Now it's 2022, and even then only a 'semblance of normality': https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/midlands-news/matt-hancock-confident-life-return-19514073.amp

Quiner

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Weren't you saying you are going to leave the country if they wanted to bring in vaccine verification apps? Tanzania sounds right up your street, when will you be moving over?

I would definitely consider it. The main criteria is (a) no masks and (b) freedom not depending on a green light on a health passport.

I'm making plans. I hope it will be next year.

Timberrrrrrrr

Quiner wrote: »

I would definitely consider it. The main criteria is (a) no masks and (b) freedom not depending on a green light on a health passport.

I'm making plans. I hope it will be next year.

Set up a go fund me page, I'll happily donate €5

Don't forget to login and regale us with tales of how wonderful life is in the utopia that is Tanzania.

Quiner

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Set up a go fund me page, I'll happily donate €5

Thanks. Unlike those celebrities in the US who vowed they'd leave the country if Trump got elected, I hope to do it.

Fighting Tao

Quiner wrote: »

But that doesn't change the fact that life is back to normal there, i.e.no masks, distancing etc. Back to life as it was pre March. Whether you believe it was because of prayer or not, it's still back to normal. People have long forgotten about it and moved on.

While in this part of the world they move the goalposts every few days. This man said back to normal by spring a few weeks ago. Now it's 2022, and even then only a 'semblance of normality': https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/midlands-news/matt-hancock-confident-life-return-19514073.amp

If a government denies covid, state directed media deny it, most are too poor to find out otherwise, then they just get on with life. Many don’t have access to proper health facilities. If someone dies, they die. That is just the way life is there. You are in denial if you think that covid doesn’t exist and life is normal. Have you visited it ever to see what the country is like when there isn’t a pandemic, yet alone when there is a pandemic? I have, and I wouldn’t fancy being sick there at any time.

Timberrrrrrrr

Quiner wrote: »

Thanks. Unlike those celebrities in the US who vowed they'd leave the country if Trump got elected, I hope to do it.

I'm sure your wife/children will thank you for this opportunity.

Quiner

Fighting Tao wrote: »

If a government denies covid, state directed media deny it, most are too poor to find out otherwise, then they just get on with life. Many don’t have access to proper health facilities. If someone dies, they die. That is just the way life is there. You are in denial if you think that covid doesn’t exist and life is normal. Have you visited it ever to see what the country is like when there isn’t a pandemic, yet alone when there is a pandemic? I have, and I wouldn’t fancy being sick there at any time.

But your misunderstanding me. I'm not saying covid is gone from Tanzania. I'm saying that the President declared it gone, people accepted it, whether they believed it or not, and moved on. While here we'll be lucky with 'some semblance' of normality, whatever that means, by 2022!

I will visit and see what life is like there for myself. But there have been no reports of Tanzania being full of covid victims since the President declared that God had removed covid from the country.

Andrewf20

Quiner wrote: »

I see. I wonder whether there will be riots and social unrest. From what I can see, and based on opinion polls, huge majorities support the destruction of the economy, mass unemployment, and all the other dire consequences of yo-yo lockdowns.

Have you an example? Id be interested in hearing their argument.

Quiner

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

I'm sure your wife/children will thank you for this opportunity.

I'll go anywhere where there are no masks and health passports (if, as I fear, and as the likely introduction of 'freedom passes' suggests, they are rolled out here and across the West). I'm just waiting for a few countries to ditch the masks.

Timberrrrrrrr

Quiner wrote: »

I'll go anywhere where there are no masks and health passports (if, as I fear, and as the likely introduction of 'freedom passes' suggests, they are rolled out here and across the West). I'm just waiting for a few countries to ditch the masks.

:rolleyes:

Fighting Tao

Quiner wrote: »

But your misunderstanding me. I'm not saying covid is gone from Tanzania. I'm saying that the President declared it gone, people accepted it, whether they believed it or not, and moved on. While here we'll be lucky with 'some semblance' of normality, whatever that means, by 2022!

I will visit and see what life is like there for myself. But there have been no reports of Tanzania being full of covid victims since the President declared that God had removed covid from the country.

You won’t hear of the deaths from there either from their government or government directed media. How come you believe their government but you don’t believe other governments about covid? Is it the religion aspect?

Andrewf20

Quiner wrote: »

That's true, but there'll be a lot to build back better. They're destroying lots of businesses and the economy. And I have barely heard a peep out of any of the governments about the economy. They seem to be very relaxed about the destroyed economy and the huge and growing levels of debt, massive unemployment etc. In my opinion that is because they are destroying on purpose so that it can be reset and built back better. It's not normal for there to be so little concern from the governments about the catastrophic consequences of lockdowns.

Which is worse - destroying businesses and the economy or destroy ecosystems and cause global warming. This is effectively the conundrum we are facing unfortunately.

Quiner

Andrewf20 wrote: »

Have you an example? Id be interested in hearing their argument.

In Germany, for example, 70-80% of people support the current lockdown. The Querdenker movement, while growing, is still representative of around 20% of the population. And in any opinion polls I've heard about, or seen, support across the West is very high for the lockdowns. We're talking upwards of 70%.

It would be interesting to know whether there is any country where it is the opposite, i.e. 80% are against lockdowns and government policy. Does such a country exist? Maybe Kosovo. According to a survey carried out there a few months ago a third of the people don't believe covid exists. I'll post links.

Quiner

Fighting Tao wrote: »

You won’t hear of the deaths from there either from their government or government directed media. How come you believe their government but you don’t believe other governments about covid? Is it the religion aspect?

I'm not saying I believe the President or their government. I'm just saying that life has been normal there since around June or July. That's true according to numerous articles. I'm comparing how people have moved on there with how people in the West are looking at a semblance of normality in 2022.

Fighting Tao

Quiner wrote: »

I'm not saying I believe the President or their government. I'm just saying that life has been normal there since around June or July. That's true according to numerous articles. I'm comparing how people have moved on there with how people in the West are looking at a semblance of normality in 2022.

You are believing the government saying that life is normal there.

Quiner

Fighting Tao wrote: »

You are believing the government saying that life is normal there.

I'm believing the articles I read that say life is back to normal there.

Fighting Tao

Anyone that uses Tanzania as a role model has zero credibility, and can’t be taken seriously on anything. So I think you are either bat**** crazy, or taking the urine.

https://rsf.org/en/news/tanzanian-media-unable-cover-covid-19-epidemic

Quiner

Fighting Tao wrote: »

Anyone that uses Tanzania as a role model has zero credibility, and can’t be taken seriously on anything. So I think you are either bat**** crazy, or taking the urine.

https://rsf.org/en/news/tanzanian-media-unable-cover-covid-19-epidemic

You're free to think that, but it doesn't change the fact that Tanzania is back to normal, while in this part of the world it's at least another year of lockdowns and heavy restrictions before we might get a 'semblance of normality'.

Fighting Tao

Quiner wrote: »

You're free to think that, but it doesn't change the fact that Tanzania is back to normal, while in this part of the world it's at least another year of lockdowns and heavy restrictions before we might get a 'semblance of normality'.

In your mind it is back to normal. Evidence is thin on the ground.

Quiner

Fighting Tao wrote: »

In your mind it is back to normal. Evidence is thin on the ground.

The articles (in international newspapers) I read say it's back to normal. That blogger I quoted described life there (no masks, distancing etc). That's what my opinion is based on. Now, unless those articles are wrong, then life is back to normal there. That's what I'm basing my opinion on.

aido79

Quiner wrote: »

The articles (in international newspapers) I read say it's back to normal. That blogger I quoted described life there (no masks, distancing etc). That's what my opinion is based on. Now, unless those articles are wrong, then life is back to normal there. That's what I'm basing my opinion on.

There are very few articles in international newspapers about life in Tanzania so I'm not sure how you can get a picture of how life is there right now. The blogger you keep referring to left Tanzania months ago having been trapped there for 6 months. He lived there for 6 months and still didn't trust what the government was saying about there being no covid19 there. There is however some evidence that people living in sub saharan Africa may already have some immunity or resistance to covid due to previous exposure to coronavirus which I would be more inclined to believe over the power of prayer that you seem to think eradicated covid19 from Tanzania.

https://www.news-medical.net/news/20201115/High-prevalence-of-cross-reactive-anti-SARS-CoV-2-antibodies-in-sub-Saharan-Africa.aspx

Andrewf20

Quiner wrote: »

In Germany, for example, 70-80% of people support the current lockdown. The Querdenker movement, while growing, is still representative of around 20% of the population. And in any opinion polls I've heard about, or seen, support across the West is very high for the lockdowns. We're talking upwards of 70%.

It would be interesting to know whether there is any country where it is the opposite, i.e. 80% are against lockdowns and government policy. Does such a country exist? Maybe Kosovo. According to a survey carried out there a few months ago a third of the people don't believe covid exists. I'll post links.

Interesting. I wonder if the opinion poll results have such positive support for lockdowns because people feel they are a short term thing in light of the vaccines. Short term pain for long term gain and all that.

I just read an article from early December from Germany which said that their ICU capacity was running critically low. I suspect that this + the fact that the peak flu month of January has yet to hit could be a major catastrophy in the making that people want to avoid at all costs. They likely also saw what was happening next door in Belgium and got scared.

runawaybishop

Quiner wrote: »

The articles (in international newspapers) I read say it's back to normal. That blogger I quoted described life there (no masks, distancing etc). That's what my opinion is based on. Now, unless those articles are wrong, then life is back to normal there. That's what I'm basing my opinion on.

You read selective articles. Tanzania is absolutely riddled with covid. All its neighbours have had to instigate mandatory testing of anyone coming from there, it's freight truck drivers have routinely been turned back for testing positive. It is illegal to talk about covid in that country. Huge surges in covid number have been detected in Tanzania corrider locations. The government has told people to not even bother going to hospital.

Of all the dumb and dangerous tripe you have posted this is absolutly breathtaking.

You want a real conspiracy? Go look at the government in Tanzania's cover up of their current situation. Again, it is illegal to talk about covid there unless you are one of the government mandated propagandists.

Seriously, if you think that place is ok you need your head examined.