Government urged to drop novels with 'racial slurs' from Junior Cert syllabus

osarusan

I wonder what their place is in the curriculum. I mean, why are they there ahead of other novels?

Is To Kill a Mockingbird there to use as a springboard about discussion of racial inequality and so on? It obviously could be used like that, but I don't know if it is used like that. If it is used like that, I can see merit to pairing it with (not replacing it with) a novel which explores the same theme, but by a black author.

Of Mice and Men has only a brief and tengential reference to racism, with the treatment of Crooks the stablehand (who is warned that if he doesn't do what he's told, it's easy to get him hanged). It's a novel about itinerant labour during the great depression. I personally love the book, but i wonder what it's for in the curriculum - is it used as a gateway to different themes and so on.

So I wonder whether the novels are used in these ways, or whether they are just used as examples of certain types of storytelling or for some other reasons, without delving into any wider/historical context.

ohnonotgmail

osarusan wrote: »

I wonder what their place is in the curriculum. I mean, why are they there ahead of other novels?

Is To Kill a Mockingbird there to use as a springboard about discussion of racial inequality and so on? It obviously could be used like that, but I don't know if it is used like that. If it is used like that, I can see merit to pairing it with (not replacing it with) a novel which explores the same theme, but by a black author.

Of Mice and Men has only a brief and tengential reference to racism, with the treatment of Crooks the stablehand (who is warned that if he doesn't do what he's told, it's easy to get him hanged). It's a novel about itinerant labour during the great depression. I personally love the book, but i wonder what it's for in the curriculum - is it used as a gateway to different themes and so on.

So I wonder whether the novels are used in these ways, or whether they are just used as examples of certain types of storytelling or for some other reasons, without delving into any wider/historical context.

Of Mice and Men is a junior cert book. they dont ask questions about individual books specifically. they ask a question and you frame the answer in terms of a book you have read.

you can see some of the sample questions here

https://static1.squarespace.com/static/5083c23f84ae0236022a3d76/t/509cf4a4e4b046b4294bf425/1352463524406/Sample+Answers+The+Novel+Final+Version.pdf

titan18

If one of them read Shakespeare, their minds will break.

Wanderer78

titan18 wrote: »

If one of them read Shakespeare, their minds will break.

i couldnt read it at all, and not just because id have no interest, it would have seriously bored the sh1te outta me as a teenager

titan18

Wanderer78 wrote: »

i couldnt read it at all, and not just because id have no interest, it would have seriously bored the sh1te outta me as a teenager

I mean, it's hard to read at times, but a fair few of his stuff feature sex, murder, violence etc. It's actually great

Wanderer78

titan18 wrote: »

I mean, it's hard to read at times, but a fair few of his stuff feature sex, murder, violence etc. It's actually great

oh ive no doubt his work is great, and worthy of its praise, but some people simply arent into it, such as myself

endacl

Best not change the curriculum at all.

The books already on the list are already damaged beyond repair. Why add more to the list so future adults can lament the fact that they were forced to read them?

Sardonicat

El Tarangu wrote: »

I think people are getting a bit exercised about a storm in a teacup; an unspecified number of people (could have been as few as one or two) emailed the Dept of Education, and the Dept wrote back that they would look into it.




I don't think that Peig has been on the curriculum for about 30 years.

Nope, it was still there 30 years ago.Shortly after it was reserved for the Honours students. Not sure how long it took them to ditch it completely.

Quantum Erasure

If you were coming up with a curriculum from scratch, which books would you include on it?

Wanderer78

Quantum Erasure wrote: »

If you were coming up with a curriculum from scratch, which books would you include on it?

i have a bias towards politics, economics, psychology and social issues, so some books that try to wrap all that together, great question though

Ficheall

Please don't let Wanderer78 pick the books.

DelaneyIn

THE DEPARTMENT OF Education has said it is considering suggestions it should remove certain novels from the school curriculum in the wake of this year’s Black Lives Matter protests.

It follows complaints from members of the public in recent months about a number of works on the Junior and Leaving Certificate syllabuses which contain racial slurs.

https://www.thejournal.ie/government-racist-novels-junior-cert-black-lives-matter-5201948-Sep2020/?utm_source=twitter_short

Good news, folks. We once again have the concept of "acceptable reading material".

LessOutragePlz

Next they'll want to get rid of the blackboard too because that is also clearly racist.

Ficheall

DelaneyIn wrote: »

https://www.thejournal.ie/government-racist-novels-junior-cert-black-lives-matter-5201948-Sep2020/?utm_source=twitter_short

Good news, folks. We once again have the concept of "acceptable reading material".

Also "suggested reading material": the titles of other threads in the forum.

Edgware

Also remove any material with the words Paddy, Mick, Biddy.
Also the use of St. Paddys Day must be stopped.

y0ssar1an22

Slippery slope that. If you legislate for that, the wording will be something like any works containing racial slurs shall not be used.

Then you need to apply the same standard to all racial slurs. Then you will need to do that going forward as words evolve into racial slurs.

Padre_Pio

What a load of balls.

To Kill a Mockingbird, a story about how systemic and cultural racism results in the wrongful accusation and sentencing of a black man for rape and his eventual death, shot seventeen times no less, while apparently attempting to escape from prison.

It literally couldn't be more culturally relevant, yet a group of woke idiots want it banned because it uses the work "n*gger" and "n*gger-lover".

Considering how much of popular media uses the n word frequently, music, games, TV, movies etc, why is this being targeted?

sabat

Black teenagers in Dublin have taken to addressing each other as "Nigga" and I don't think they're picking it up from classic novels. Are there calls to scrub about a million hip-hop tunes from existence?

Sardonicat

Wanderer78 wrote: »

i have a bias towards politics, economics, psychology and social issues, so some books that try to wrap all that together, great question though

It's not merely the topics that need to be chosen, but the style, genre, etc. It's the study of literature not social issues or historical events. The tricky job is choosing books that cover the aspects of literature they want to teach at that level but will also appeal to as many young people as possible. That's not an easy task, especially now in our digital age of diminishing attention spans.

Jimbob1977

Huckleberry Finn has no chance!

Junkyard Tom

Edgware wrote: »

Also remove any material with the words Paddy, Mick, Biddy.
Also the use of St. Paddys Day must be stopped.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jchuUKxlW5U

8-10

sabat wrote: »

Black teenagers in Dublin have taken to addressing each other as "Nigga" and I don't think they're picking it up from classic novels. Are there calls to scrub about a million hip-hop tunes from existence?

I don't think hip hop is on the Leaving Cert syllabus

lalababa

Yep, a farce . Something about nothing. The parents/people complaining about books should themselves go back to school and learn a bit of logic.

TomTomTim

8-10 wrote: »

I don't think hip hop is on the Leaving Cert syllabus

No one said it was. His point was in relation to wider society. It is wider society that is being used to decide these matters, he's simply point out the hypocrisy.

McDermotX

CrabRevolution

screamer wrote: »

Forget mockingbird, Peig was an absolute lesson in the hardships of life and misery whilst eking out an existence on a god forsaken rock In the Atlantic Ocean. It was depression inducing knowing that it was a true account of a miserable existence. That should be removed if kids still have to endure it.

Peig hasn't been required on the Irish syllabus since the mid 90's (unless a teacher voluntarily chooses to have the class study it, which I've never heard any do).

Padre_Pio

8-10 wrote: »

I don't think hip hop is on the Leaving Cert syllabus

It's the hypocrisy that a word is commonplace, accepted and promoted outside a classroom, but inside the classroom it's a slur and offensive.

Mockingbird IMO is a hugely important book that shows an innocent man's struggle against an entire culture that is against him purely for the colour of his skin, and how awful and evil that is.

But the occurrence of a single word in that book is cause to ban the whole book, so that it's message is never heard by the people who need to hear it.

GarIT

Wanderer78 wrote: »

I actually think movements such as blm should be a part of the curriculum, do kids truly connect with books such as mocking bird, and is the curriculum truly designed to suit us adults more so? Younger generations are different, they see the world differently, they want a different world than us adults

What about AntiFa, Al-Quieda or ISIS should they be covered too? Why just one of the terrorist groups?

Perhaps we should ask that font of all knowledge when it comes to books. I am, of course, referring to that uber-meta-bibliophile Mr Ryan Tubridy.

Gatling

I'm surprised we haven't seen Tupac and jay-z been mentioned for the curriculum