Waterford GAA Thread - Mod note post #1

JD60

Can’t blame Fergal Horgan this time.

carter10

We again the inability to execute the basic skills of the game costs us. Abysmal effort. Bevins must be pulling his hair out

carter10

I wonder would Giveitfong do a count on the number of times a waterford player failed to pick a ball or hold onto a pass?

PTH2009

From the bits I saw we played good and had some quality scores but Galway seemed to get some very quick scores. Disappointing to here we made basic errors once again

Wonder will we play a weaker team next weekend but then again Cahill would love to beat his native Tipperary

JohnGreenFan

carter10 wrote: »

I wonder would Giveitfong do a count on the number of times a waterford player failed to pick a ball or hold onto a pass?

An awful amount of missed lifts of the ball, or absolute hospital passes. They seemed to lose all ability to pass off the ball in the second half, instead waiting for Galway to surround them before firing it any direction!

A real shame when the first half seemed quite promising.

Jjjjjjjjbarry

Agree on the basic handling skills. Some of them were shocking at this level. One in particular led to a Galway goal and the player being taken off a minute later. The Galway forwards were also really good today so would have troubled any team. We did get turned too easily on many occasions though. What's worrying is that we only had an ageing Moran and Fives to bring on. We once had an abundance of defenders and trouble in the forwards but we're a bit the other way now.

On a positive, we did really well in attack! Callum got 5 points from play from half back. Shane Bennett set up Jack for a fantastically taken goal and scored a classic goal himself. Dessie was lethal today. Stephen Bennett had an off day but always gives his all so good to see others chipping in with scores. One issue I had was the short passing and messing - at times. We gave the ball away a lot and it costs us scores from positions where we had time and space to deliver good balls into our forwards. When the forwards are on top and winning their own balls, they should get the ball played early. We did deliver a lot of good ball into the corners today though so really positive from that perspective.

Not sure what we can do to sort out the defence as even though Galway were good, we are weak at the back and have given up a lot of goals to date.

Shane Bennett's goal was a thing of beauty though.

seananigans

32 points is some scoring and would win the vast majority of matches ,lets not get carried away.

our defence let us down, at the end, but the real problem is we got off to a flying start then put on the brakes, when you go up agaiunst a team by 5, you have to make it 10 or 15 not just have a break, kilkenny were masters at it, we dont know how to put a game away in the first half, and will rue this one as one that got away

Jjjjjjjjbarry

2-12 at half time I think. Limerick scored 20 points in the first half yesterday and had the game won.

formerlyET

Will Gleeson continue at 6?

JD60

formerlyET wrote: »

Will Gleeson continue at 6?

That experiment is ongoing but would prefer to see him in the forwards. Too loose at marking and tackling to be in defence.

Is it just me but has Jamie Barron regressed, though didn’t have much support from his midfield partner.

At least Dessie has his eye in and Shane Bennett is starting to peak nicely. Callum Lyons outstanding I thought.

Junior Hurler

3-23 is a fine score to rack up. But conceding 4-28 is just the 6 points better than the legendary and memorable concession of 5-31 in 1982. Gulp. #onlytheleague.

PTH2009

Only 3 weeks out from Championship

wfdrun

JD60 wrote: »

That experiment is ongoing but would prefer to see him in the forwards. Too loose at marking and tackling to be in defence.

Is it just me but has Jamie Barron regressed, though didn’t have much support from his midfield partner.

At least Dessie has his eye in and Shane Bennett is starting to peak nicely. Callum Lyons outstanding I thought.

Agree school day for austin.

Hope callum shares whatever explosivity training he does.

it works

Mastermcgrath

seananigans wrote: »

32 points is some scoring and would win the vast majority of matches ,lets not get carried away.

our defence let us down, at the end, but the real problem is we got off to a flying start then put on the brakes, when you go up agaiunst a team by 5, you have to make it 10 or 15 not just have a break, kilkenny were masters at it, we dont know how to put a game away in the first half, and will rue this one as one that got away

3-23 is not enough to win against the top teams the way the current game is going.

blue note

Mastermcgrath wrote: »

3-23 is not enough to win against the top teams the way the current game is going.

It would have been enough to beat limerick in last year's final. Or limerick in their other win. Or Galway in theirs.

TheScoringGoal

I think Jamie Barron needs a physical presence in midfield with him. In my view he played his best hurling with Kevin Moran and Michael Walsh beside him. I can see why Jake Dillon was tried in the role but it hasn't worked. Maybe this is the place for Austin because I'm struggling to see who else could fill that role. I don't think Morans legs would be up to it.

Billy Ocean

Not from Waterford myself but thinking could Moran play a sitting role at 6 with Lyons and Daly loads of legs beside him at 5 and 7 with Barron and Aussie in midfield, then play yesterday's forward line with maybe Fagan in for Montgomery.

blueflame

Not too concerned about Sunday's result , some negatives some positives, but would not read too much into league matches and Salthill has always been somewhere we have struggled badly. Have heard a bit of negative comments about Seamus Keating, but in my opinion it is way to early to be judging this lad. he needs plenty of game time to get up to speed at this level considering he has only come back into the set up this year

No doubting that deBurca is a massive loss, he would be for any team in the country, Aussie seemed a little bit lost on Sunday but let's be honest when was the last time he got any sort of a run playing at centre back, again we need a bit more patience to see how this works. Daly, Moran and Fives are all viable options for the backs who will add strength and experience.

Great to see the three Bennett's playing together, and once again we are seeing improving options in the forwards with Dessie and Curran looking sharper with each game. I think again Montgomery is getting a bit of unwarranted criticism, he is still very young and i thought he done alright and yesterday will have brought him on again.

Special word of mention for Calum Lyons, what a dynamo this guy is and on that comment would like to remind all those who wrote him off as a young lad saying he was not strong or physical enough - these lads all need time to develop.

I don't think Cahill will be too disappointed as it gives him plenty of food for thought and plenty to work on. Had we beaten Galway last Sunday it would have been blown out of all proportion and we would have been favourites for the All Ireland in some peoples eyes, because we had beaten Limerick and Galway!!!!!!!!. A bit of realism is no harm.

We are moving along nicely in my mind, getting important game time under lads belts, very important to do this while avoiding hype and injuries over the next three weeks.

formerlyET

blueflame wrote: »

Special word of mention for Calum Lyons, what a dynamo this guy is and on that comment would like to remind all those who wrote him off as a young lad saying he was not strong or physical enough - these lads all need time to develop.

Why not try Lyons at 6?
Or Kevin Moran as a sitting midfielder in front of Daly and Lyons at 5 and Austin at 7?
Have enough things been tried?

Patchin

Will ye be able for clare

skaface

Few weeks now to tweak our team for the Championship.. 16/1 or near enough for the All lreland, so no pressure or expectation on this young team.. A lot of hard work and a rub of the green and a bit of steel drilled into them by Cahill and i believe we'll have a big say in the Championship this year.. DÉISE ABÚ

Pogue eile

skaface wrote: »

Few weeks now to tweak our team for the Championship.. 16/1 or near enough for the All lreland, so no pressure or expectation on this young team.. A lot of hard work and a rub of the green and a bit of steel drilled into them by Cahill and i believe we'll have a big say in the Championship this year.. DÉISE ABÚ

16/1 is a bit of an insult to be fair and it is definitely the value bet of the championship. Hard to see why a few teams above them in the betting are considered more likely to win.

I would consider Waterford right now as the fourth best team in the Championship and not a million miles away from the top 3 either.

PTH2009

as ever Munster is really a mine field and any of the 5 teams can beat the other on there day. Leinster is also competitive but realistically one of Kilkenny, Wexford and Galway will win it, Dublin average enough but can be troublesome. Antrim having a great League campaign and Laois the weakest in the LM cup

The qualifiers will be very tough no doubt and if were in them so be it

I imagine the group stage will return for the 2022 Championship and as we all know it hasn't been the best for us

seananigans

PTH2009 wrote: »

as ever Munster is really a mine field and any of the 5 teams can beat the other on there day. Leinster is also competitive but realistically one of Kilkenny, Wexford and Galway will win it, Dublin average enough but can be troublesome. Antrim having a great League campaign and Laois the weakest in the LM cup

The qualifiers will be very tough no doubt and if were in them so be it

I imagine the group stage will return for the 2022 Championship and as we all know it hasn't been the best for us

group stage straight knockout who gives a toss, to be the best you need to beat the best, and if you cant do that then you dont deserve the trophies

PTH2009

I imagine Thomas Douglas didn't make the panel ?

JD60

PTH2009 wrote: »

I imagine Thomas Douglas didn't make the panel ?

Dunno. A very promising colleges player but hasn't made the grade so far.
==============================================

It's a strange finale to a league, where the finishing places are meaningless. I think most managers will be running down the clock and hoping to avoid any injuries.

JD60

JD60 wrote: »

Dunno. A very promising colleges player but hasn't made the grade so far.
==============================================

It's a strange finale to a league, where the finishing places are meaningless. I think most managers will be running down the clock and hoping to avoid any injuries.

Clarification:
Meaningless, unless you finish bottom of your group, in which case the 2 bottom teams get the dubious honour of playing out the relegation match as a preview to the AI final ; who came up with that absurd idea.

Giveitfong

Probably the best starting point to judge last Sunday’s game in Galway is to look at Liam Cahill’s performance on the sideline. From what we saw on TV, Cahill spent the entire game on his own and never seemed to show any emotion. This is a sharp contrast with his highly animated sideline involvement during Waterford’s championship games last year.

It would appear, therefore, that Cahill was not particularly concerned about the outcome of the game, and will presumably have been happy enough with certain aspects of the team’s performance, particularly the big score they put up without busting a gut. This despite a low-key contribution by their normal scorer-in-chief, Stephen Bennett, who got just seven possessions during the game and one point from play, while his usually super ball control left him down on numerous occasions during the game.

Waterford’s excellent start to the game seemed to catch Galway on the hop, but some judicious changes and presumably a roasting from Shane O’Neill during the water break saw the Westerners take control in the second quarter, during which they shot 3-8 compared with just 0-5 in the first quarter. They are a big, strong, mobile, skillful and well-organised team, and once it became apparent that Waterford were not prepared to match their commitment level, the result was inevitable.

It didn’t help that Liam Cahill continued his baffling policy of putting Jake Dillon out on the pitch and leaving him there for most of the match. Given Dillon’s usual non-contribution (just three possessions in 57 minutes compared, for example, to Cathal Mannion’s 21 possessions over the whole game), it was no surprise that Galway obtained a decisive advantage in the midfield area. In a situation such as this, I am inclined not to be too critical of the Waterford fullback line, as Galway’s outfield players were able to pick out their inside men at will. At the same time, it was notable how the Waterford corner backs struggled in the air against bigger opponents.

Things improved significantly in the midfield area when Darragh Lyons was introduced in place of Dillon, with Peter Hogan also adding some good work rate for the last ten minutes. Lyons managed eight possessions, and three shots at goal, during his 19-minute stint. Surely it would have made more sense to give these players more game time, and Dillon less (or, preferably, none at all).

By then, of course, the game had degenerated into a training exercise, with marking going out the window. An interesting statistic is that, in the third quarter, the two teams had 64 possessions between them (fairly evenly divided) whereas in the final quarter, this almost doubled to 115. This is because there were loose players all over the field taking and then giving passes to other loose players. In this period, Shaun O’Brien repeatedly found unmarked team mates out the field with his puckouts. This was just as well, as when the game was more competitive, Waterford won only one third of their long, contested, puckouts.

The big positive takeaway from the game from a Waterford perspective was, of course, Dessie Hutchinson’s performance. It is very rare to see a corner forward getting 15 possessions and, indeed, coming second in the team’s overall possession count. It was like watching John Mullane on speed. It was almost amusing in the second half to see Waterford players raining ball after ball into Hutchinson’s corner, which he repeatedly won.

Waterford’s other star performer, of course, was the irrepressible Calum Lyons, who secured 21 possessions and hit five points. In making a goal, scoring a peach of a goal, and hitting a good point, Shane Bennett showed glimpses of what he is capable of, while Jack Prendergast also put in a good shift. On the downside, there was another poor performance from Neil Montgomery, who would appear to be better suited, temperamentally, to a substitute role. Seamus Keating also had little impact and probably needs more time to get up to speed at this level of hurling.

Waterford possession counts: S. O’Brien (3); C. Gleeson (11), C. Prunty (6), S. McNulty (7); C. Lyons (21), A. Gleeson (12), S. Keating (2); J. Barron (10), J. Dillon (3); N. Montgomery (6), J. Prendergast (11), K. Bennett (10); Shane Bennett (5), Stephen Bennett (7), D. Hutchinson (15); J. Fagan (3), D. Lyons (8), P.Curran (4), B. Power (0), K. Moran (5), S. Fives (1), P. Hogan (4).

seananigans

PTH2009

seananigans wrote: »

Didn't expect a team that strong to be named

Be brilliant to get a win