Third Secretary & Development Specialist Campaign 2020

HartsHat

exitstageleft wrote: »

Well, finished up the assessments this morning but they were a bit of a disaster really. I can't say I felt confident about any section.
Most of my verbal answers were only slightly better than educated guess. It really feels like there just isn't time for comprehension, just scan and guess.
The logic was slightly harder than I expected too.

I wonder if the SJT would be slightly easier if you already had some experience in the civil service. It might be clearer how much authority you have yourself, and how often you should revert to your boss. I found that often the answers were all reasonable but I could've done with more context.

Anyway, guess the dream's not dead until the results come back in a few weeks!

Probably not really. TS tend to have far more autonomy and responsibility than equivalent grades (E.g. deputy head of mission or chargé, briefing Ministers directly etc.) so depends if the exams are calibrated to reflect that - if they are, experience of an equivalent role in the general CS could even be a disadvantage.

While some TS have prior PS experience, the majority do not.

blithe

Does anyone know when we might expect the results? The week after next, maybe?
Thanks!

Puguchung

If you didn’t get a TS/DSO role, which other department(s) would you want to work in? Are any other departments similar either in terms of scope of work, or autonomy, or environment, something else? Are there other departments where experience there stands you in good stead for one day moving into a TS//DSO role?

exitstageleft

blithe wrote: »

Does anyone know when we might expect the results? The week after next, maybe?
Thanks!

On the webpage that detailed the TS/DSO there was a rough schedule. I think the next part was results and feedback "early November", interviews "late November" and more testing "early December". Judging from that I'm guessing maybe toward the end of the week after next.

The page appears to be gone now and the same info is not in the booklet.

exitstageleft

Do people expect two separate order of merits for the Third Secretary and the Development Specialist Officer?

Has everyone applied for both too?

noodler

HairyCabbage wrote: »

Not sure if this has been asked before but I noticed the following text in the Information Booklet:

"Entry will be at the minimum of the scale and the rate of remuneration will not be subject to negotiation and may be adjusted from time to time in line with Government pay policy."

I am an existing Civil Servant currently on point three of the AO payscale. Does anyone know if this means that I will revert to point one? was anyone here a similar position previously? I don't see the same line in the AO Information Booklet so it's worrying!

There should be another line that says unless you are a public servant immediately prior to taking the post.

This is a well understood term. You will retain your incremental credit but make sure you contact who you need to confirm

ticklemonster

Just finished the tests. Found them all confusing tbh. At the beginning in the numerical I def got a few wrong as I couldnt tell if the information was related to the company in the question so put 'cannot tell'. Pretty sure I screwed that one up. Logical and verbal were ok though so hopefully that counts for me!

Paladin_

exitstageleft wrote: »

On the webpage that detailed the TS/DSO there was a rough schedule. I think the next part was results and feedback "early November", interviews "late November" and more testing "early December". Judging from that I'm guessing maybe toward the end of the week after next.

The page appears to be gone now and the same info is not in the booklet.

The timeline is mentioned at the end of this webpage if anyone wants to check (Steps 6 to 9): www[dot]publicjobs[dot]ie/en/graduate-opportunities/graduate-third-secretary

Interested to know if anyone going for TS also applied for the policy advisor positions in New York? www[dot]dfa[dot]ie/pmun/newyork/about-us/job-opportunities/job-vacancy-policy-advisor-posts-security-council-term.html

(Created a new Boards profile so can't share links yet)

completedit

I applied for the Security Council job and got a rejection e-mail last week.

PurpleRainx

Just finished the tests:

Logical reasoning-ok except seeing the answers I got wrong put me off. Also couldn't see how many questions there were unless I was just missing that so have no idea how many I completed.

Chat-Assessment-Fine. Had 11 mins to spare. Was surprised I could not go back and check my answers though. I guess this makes sense as the chat is instant.

Numerical reasoning-time pressuring to say the least. Very difficult when you have to memorise/scribble down the question as the tabs cover over the question. Got a technical error message at the end of numerical reasoning but then had a tick beside it once I went back in and a message saying I have completed all tasks. Anyone else had this issue? Contacted the AON PAS email, hope they get back to me before the deadline Tuesday and say whether it was submitted or not. Hope I don't have to resit it (wonder if that's even an option?)

Verbal reasoning-found the toughest. Couldn't get to grips with not having question in front of me while reading the tabs. Answered below 30 I think which is disheartening. Anybody know if this is marked together with the deductive logical part?

Overall tougher than expected but all I can say is I did my best and the rest is up to fate

exitstageleft

PurpleRainx wrote: »

Just finished the tests:

Logical reasoning-ok except seeing the answers I got wrong put me off. Also couldn't see how many questions there were unless I was just missing that so have no idea how many I completed.

Chat-Assessment-Fine. Had 11 mins to spare. Was surprised I could not go back and check my answers though. I guess this makes sense as the chat is instant.

Numerical reasoning-time pressuring to say the least. Very difficult when you have to memorise/scribble down the question as the tabs cover over the question. Got a technical error message at the end of numerical reasoning but then had a tick beside it once I went back in and a message saying I have completed all tasks. Anyone else had this issue? Contacted the AON PAS email, hope they get back to me before the deadline Tuesday and say whether it was submitted or not. Hope I don't have to resit it (wonder if that's even an option?)

Verbal reasoning-found the toughest. Couldn't get to grips with not having question in front of me while reading the tabs. Answered below 30 I think which is disheartening. Anybody know if this is marked together with the deductive logical part?

Overall tougher than expected but all I can say is I did my best and the rest is up to fate

Wow, I could've nearly written the same post. Hopefully most of us found the levels similarly tricky.

Did anyone get 30 or more questions answered confidently? (I did not!)

mulligja

PurpleRainx wrote: »

Just finished the tests:

Logical reasoning-ok except seeing the answers I got wrong put me off. Also couldn't see how many questions there were unless I was just missing that so have no idea how many I completed.

Chat-Assessment-Fine. Had 11 mins to spare. Was surprised I could not go back and check my answers though. I guess this makes sense as the chat is instant.

Numerical reasoning-time pressuring to say the least. Very difficult when you have to memorise/scribble down the question as the tabs cover over the question. Got a technical error message at the end of numerical reasoning but then had a tick beside it once I went back in and a message saying I have completed all tasks. Anyone else had this issue? Contacted the AON PAS email, hope they get back to me before the deadline Tuesday and say whether it was submitted or not. Hope I don't have to resit it (wonder if that's even an option?)

Verbal reasoning-found the toughest. Couldn't get to grips with not having question in front of me while reading the tabs. Answered below 30 I think which is disheartening. Anybody know if this is marked together with the deductive logical part?

Overall tougher than expected but all I can say is I did my best and the rest is up to fate

Had the error you had on numerical on verbal, got message back this morning to confirm that it's grand as long as you had "Completed and Saved" on your end screen. Think you did fine on verbal, i got through about 20 and even skipped through a few.

Aleece2020

ticklemonster wrote: »

Just finished the tests. Found them all confusing tbh. At the beginning in the numerical I def got a few wrong as I couldnt tell if the information was related to the company in the question so put 'cannot tell'. Pretty sure I screwed that one up. Logical and verbal were ok though so hopefully that counts for me!

I don’t think anyone can finish the entire test And get everything right, that’s less than 30 seconds per question - I reckon you’ll be okay.

ddpas

exitstageleft wrote: »

Wow, I could've nearly written the same post. Hopefully most of us found the levels similarly tricky.

Did anyone get 30 or more questions answered confidently? (I did not!)

Think I got about 33 of the verbal ones done in the end.. the test seemed to be more of a time management assessment than anything else!

belgowho

Completed all tests bar the ChatAssess which plan to to do today. Quite happy with how I did( even with only getting over 30 questions answered in verbal).

My feeling on the verbal is based on how I practiced on JobTestPrep.
Each time I did the same practice test again, I followed my process of scanning/key words etc. I would have memory from previous time of doing test which would undeniably give me an advantage, but i still kept to my process. After doing a test maybe the 3rd time, I still couldnt get to the circa 40-49th question or get them all right.

Naturally, some people would have better reading comprehension and memory, but I would be shocked if high numbers got to the 40+ question and got everyone of them right. Considering how much time it takes you to read the question, open up each tab, scan, understand the relevant section etc, it would be very very difficult to do it all accurately in 12 minutes.

PeachL00pies

Just completed the tests. Much prefered the format used to the EO which took place a few weeks ago. Thought the ChatAssess was reasonable also.

This would be my third time applying for Third Sec after two unsuccessful attempts, so I don't hold out much hope.

Best of luck to everyone - working in DFA offers up some amazing opportunities!

blithe

PeachL00pies wrote: »

Just completed the tests. Much prefered the format used to the EO which took place a few weeks ago. Thought the ChatAssess was reasonable also.

This would be my third time applying for Third Sec after two unsuccessful attempts, so I don't hold out much hope.

Best of luck to everyone - working in DFA offers up some amazing opportunities!

Best of luck to you too! Here's hoping third time's the charm

onthemaas

Well that was more stressful than I had anticipated. I definitely feel like I rushed through the chat assess test which was probably not the best idea.

CrouchTiger

Puguchung wrote: »

If you didn’t get a TS/DSO role, which other department(s) would you want to work in? Are any other departments similar either in terms of scope of work, or autonomy, or environment, something else? Are there other departments where experience there stands you in good stead for one day moving into a TS//DSO role?

My experience on joining as a TS is that those with previous civil service experience tend to land on top of the panels. Having held a previous AO position in Finance or Justice tends to be a really excellent asset for getting in.

CrouchTiger

newbie18892 wrote: »

I thought the booklet said 1-2 years in HQ in Dublin. I do feel bad for anyone moving here to rent. It's woeful.

A lot of current TS are looking at 3 years in Dublin BTW given the size of the queue. Be prepared to wait that length.

emhds

onthemaas wrote: »

I would also be interested in knowing this as I have little to no idea of what to expect.

I've just joined this thread so this might come very very late, but I bought a test prep pack on www(dot)jobtestprep(dot)co(dot)uk where they have a specific pack for TS.

I would really recommend this to anyone who hasn't taken the tests yet; I took the time to practice them all and get used to the format, and managed to answer all the questions after getting my formula down (speed read, scan for key words, remembering info from previous questions).

Best of luck to everyone!

PurpleRainx

I can't believe you managed to answer all qs-well done!

I'm only after seeing the specific TS pack now on jobtestprep. Is it the exact same layout of the test i.e. you can't see the question as it covered by the tabs?

emhds

No you were able to see the questions on jobtestprep; that did throw me quite a bit. I managed to answer all, not entirely sure if they were all accurate. I know I had more or less 15 seconds per question so when I couldn't find an answer within that time I just guessed and moved on.

Totally aware that none of this is helpful for the majority who have already taken these tests, but if anyone is still planning on taking them this morning then maybe these comments could be of use!

emhds

Also the specific TS pack wasn't particularly useful; it didn't come with any extra cut-e style questions to the basic pack, and the deductive logic were much easier than in the TS. Also the SJT were entirely different.

completedit

Eventually finished it.

SJ was weird but no complaints really with it. You just have to answer honestly. I finished it a bit too quickly though. I should have taken more time. Tbh, their positions barely factored into my answers.

Abstract reasoning was nice. Or at least better than expected. Numeracy was also fine but I should have been better prepared.

heffo1

Hi all, I have applied for all three positions, third secretary, administrative officer and development specialist officer. So if I fail the tests I am out for all three posts? Has this happened before in other competitions? Just curious as I was not expecting administrative officer to be included in the same tests as third secretary and DSO, would anyone know if the pass mark will be the same for all three? Thanks

exitstageleft

heffo1 wrote: »

Hi all, I have applied for all three positions, third secretary, administrative officer and development specialist officer. So if I fail the tests I am out for all three posts? Has this happened before in other competitions? Just curious as I was not expecting administrative officer to be included in the same tests as third secretary and DSO, would anyone know if the pass mark will be the same for all three? Thanks

I'd also like to know the answer to this.
And if we do pass, do we receive different order of merit positions for each application? Also, are there different streams for Limerick and Dublin?

Daisies

On the above, I am by no means an expert but I would expect the pass mark to be the same for all streams as they are all of equal level.
As for OOM, I would imagine that will differ depending on how many people have applied for that stream and who have placed higher than you in the tests.

Just my thinking.

emhds

Does anyone, from experience, have any idea when we should get the results? Do we actually find out the results of the exams or are we just invited (or not) to stage 2?

KRedzer

emhds wrote: »

Does anyone, from experience, have any idea when we should get the results? Do we actually find out the results of the exams or are we just invited (or not) to stage 2?

They give you your scores, and your order of merit.

Aleece2020

KRedzer wrote: »

They give you your scores, and your order of merit.

I applied for at least four of the graduate campaigns this year, so assuming that I can reach the passing grade, the OOMs I get will likely give us some idea of how many are in each campaign.

exitstageleft

Any chance we'll be getting results this week?

completedit

exitstageleft wrote: »

Any chance we'll be getting results this week?

I know somebody who got results today. Didn't go well but don't know if there's anything to be read into on that.

Daisies

Mine just came through there and delighted.

DFA123

I received my results and order of merit for the Development Specialist stream. Email said I would receive order of merit from the other streams in separate emails.

Qualifying score is 39, except for deductive which is 36.

HayleyOD95

Hey All, I am a little confused by the message,
if it says we reached the qualifying standard are we through to the next stage ?

Daisies

HayleyOD95 wrote: »

Hey All, I am a little confused by the message,
if it says we reached the qualifying standard are we through to the next stage ?

I think they will call batches depending on your OOM to the next stage. Based on the mail saying "Further information on the next stage will issue in due course, should we reach your order of merit."

blithe

Just got my results there. Happy enough with them. I've never done this before so not sure how good my order of merit place is but anyway! Guess we just wait and see. Best of luck everyone

emhds

Anyone know roughly how many people take the exams? Like what does our order of merit actually mean, presuming we passed?

Paladin_

Also got results today with my place on the order of merit. Looks like there's a bit of a wait now for more info on the next stage.

blackkeyes

I wonder how many people move to the next stage?

blackkeyes

I'm a bit pessimistic about my oom... It's in the 600s. Might have to wait until the next competition! Best of luck everyone.

Got mine as well positioned in OOM 900+ .. Going off the last few years seems I’m out of the running. Best of luck to everyone else though ðŸ‘

EMD1990

I remember before, I passed but was way down in the order of merit. I believe then it was those placed 477 and above that progressed.
Between 450 and 430 now so fingers crossed.

completedit

Seem to be too far down but least I got it. Kinda sad but I'm happy to have got by. My results were even decent so I don't know how I am that far down but just saw its based off verbal and situational.

hamtaro

Have they even indicated how many will be in the batch that will progress?

HayleyOD95

So is it better to get a lower number in the 100s per say ?

blackkeyes

Jolene Agreeable Gunboat wrote: »

Got mine as well positioned in OOM 900+ .. Going off the last few years seems I’m out of the running. Best of luck to everyone else though ðŸ‘

Do you happen to know what OOM they reached in previous competitions?

Ramnavk2

Got between 270-300 so am hopeful enough but the email was vague enough that I'm a little bit worried about not be called to the next stage. Hope there's some clarification soon enough

mulligja

781 for TS, 373 for Development Specialist

Made a balls of the Verbal Reasoning and got 39 so just scraped a pass. Bit disappointed am hoping I can at least get 1000 in the AO stream based off these results. Congrats to everyone on getting results, is good to know even if not terrific news.