Asti strike action

Dav010

Treppen wrote: »

https://www.thejournal.ie/over-20000-people-contact-hse-in-response-to-government-call-out-for-health-care-workers-5050181-Mar2020/

Similarly, even before covid it was put out there that Ireland want teachers to come back and throw on the green jersey. If you ever heard of the teaching council then you'll know how irish teachers abroad have battled with them to get into an irish classroom, never mind the temporary contract merrygoround.

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/education/minister-urged-to-act-quickly-to-stop-flow-of-teachers-to-the-uae-38211039.html



Ok, I can see you are aiming high for the kids, and happy enough with that.

The article you linked to and quoted from relates to a call for healthcare workers at the beginning of the pandemic, to help during the crisis. As far as I can see it did not promise employment beyond the period when they would be necessary.

In relation to aiming high, a sub teacher is better than no teacher. Most parents want their kids to do well in school, most I suspect therefore do not want them sitting at home again.

Bobtheman

Supply and demand seems to have been missed by our senior civil servants in college. We can't match it in housing or health.
It's always difficult to get it right in teaching.
It can depend a lot on subjects and area and the year.
It's always hard to get a job teaching English but easy enough in maths and Irish
You want a job in mayo? Probably harder than Dublin
Then if that was not bad enough throw into the mix a housing crisis.
A few years back by giving every teacher less class time to plan for the JC- a couple of hundred jobs created but a lot of culchies went home and vacancies popped up in Dublin.
Most schools would shudder at a centrally planned system because it would mean you'd be sent somebody and thus have no idea who you would get.
The general public don't know or care about the fact that most teachers are on temp contracts that make tesco workers look lavishly paid for on avg five or more years at the start of their careers .

Jerry Atrick

Bobtheman wrote: »

Supply and demand seems to have been missed by our senior civil servants in college. We can't match it in housing or health.
It's always difficult to get it right in teaching.
It can depend a lot on subjects and area and the year.
It's always hard to get a job teaching English but easy enough in maths and Irish
You want a job in mayo? Probably harder than Dublin
Then if that was not bad enough throw into the mix a housing crisis.
A few years back by giving every teacher less class time to plan for the JC- a couple of hundred jobs created but a lot of culchies went home and vacancies popped up in Dublin.
Most schools would shudder at a centrally planned system because it would mean you'd be sent somebody and thus have no idea who you would get.
The general public don't know or care about the fact that most teachers are on temp contracts that make tesco workers look lavishly paid for on avg five or more years at the start of their careers .

Spoken like a true ASTI disciple. Take off the blinkers pal.

Treppen

Jerry Atrick wrote: »

Spoken like a true ASTI disciple. Take off the blinkers pal.

If that's your only engagement in the conversation your position just be very weak.

Jerry Atrick

Treppen wrote: »

If that's your only engagement in the conversation your position just be very weak.

Must

Treppen

Jerry Atrick wrote: »

Must

Indeed

Jerry Atrick

Colm O'Rourke shut down last night on Primetime for speaking a few home truths about the ASTI...scandalous really.

acequion

Jerry Atrick wrote: »

Colm O'Rourke shut down last night on Primetime for speaking a few home truths about the ASTI...scandalous really.

I didn't hear it. But Colm O Rourke hates the ASTI for his own personal reasons as is obvious every time he opens his mouth about them. So I'm glad to hear that the presenter wasn't having one of these bitter rants on a day when public morale was already at an all time low.

And maybe the same might apply to you judging by your previous barbed references to what is basically a trade union doing what you'd expect trade unions to do, fight for their members. People with a grudge don't make good arguments.

Jerry Atrick

Why does he hate the ASTI? Is it the same reason why most people are reticent to support their militant, out of touch stance on things?

Benicetomonty

Jerry Atrick wrote: »

Why does he hate the ASTI? Is it the same reason why most people are reticent to support their militant, out of touch stance on things?

Yeah, whereas the general public just adore the TUI and the INTO.

wirelessdude01

Jerry Atrick wrote: »

Colm O'Rourke shut down last night on Primetime for speaking a few home truths about the ASTI...scandalous really.

Wasn't the time, place or discussion. I'm primary level but his hatred for the ASTI is very personal and clouds everything he utters with regards to them.

Treppen

Jerry Atrick wrote: »

Why does he hate the ASTI? Is it the same reason why most people are reticent to support their militant, out of touch stance on things?

Has something to do with him wanting to go to Australia and play footie while teaching but the department/school wouldn't grant him leave and he got the hump as the Union wouldn't take his case.

Allegedly.
I'm open to correction.

He went into property development during the boom too but that's another angry Colm o Roorkee story. Allegedly.
I'm open to correction.

I think the stories have been scrubbed from d'internet as I can't find them anymore.

Treppen

Jerry Atrick wrote: »

Why does he hate the ASTI? Is it the same reason why most people are reticent to support their militant, out of touch stance on things?

Well here we go then.

Which motion would you oppose on the ballot?

Jerry Atrick

Treppen wrote: »

Has something to do with him wanting to go to Australia and play footie while teaching but the department/school wouldn't grant him leave and he got the hump as the Union wouldn't take his case.

Allegedly.
I'm open to correction.

He went into property development during the boom too but that's another angry Colm o Roorkee story. Allegedly.
I'm open to correction.

I think the stories have been scrubbed from d'internet as I can't find them anymore.

That must be it...scrubbed from tinternet so never happened.

acequion

Jerry Atrick wrote: »

That must be it...scrubbed from tinternet so never happened.

Why don't you stop being a dog with a bone or are you Colm O Rourke? Because sorry but you're coming across as just as pig headed. Not every cock fight makes it to the Internet but that doesn't make it less true. It is widely known that Colm O Rourke had some big bitter row with the ASTI that he's never got over and that's his problem. But because the man clearly hasn't the good sense or the maturity to realise that people aren't interested in his personal vendettas he goes on a cringe inducing rant about the ASTI given the tiniest opportunity. It's beyond tiresome at this stage.

Dav010

acequion wrote: »

Why don't you stop being a dog with a bone or are you Colm O Rourke? Because sorry but you're coming across as just as pig headed. Not every cock fight makes it to the Internet but that doesn't make it less true. It is widely known that Colm O Rourke had some big bitter row with the ASTI that he's never got over and that's his problem. But because the man clearly hasn't the good sense or the maturity to realise that people aren't interested in his personal vendettas he goes on a cringe inducing rant about the ASTI given the tiniest opportunity. It's beyond tiresome at this stage.

What makes you think the public aren’t interested in what he has to say?

Jerry Atrick

I actually think Colm O'Rourke is one of the most unaffected teachers out there. He gets on with the job at hand and speaks a lot of sense. It's refreshing to hear someone in the education sector taking a step back and rationally looking at the obstacles they face and how they deal with and overcome them. He's not out there cap in hand at every opportunity like the ASTI mafia.

khalessi

Jerry Atrick wrote: »

I actually think Colm O'Rourke is one of the most unaffected teachers out there. He gets on with the job at hand and speaks a lot of sense. It's refreshing to hear someone in the education sector taking a step back and rationally looking at the obstacles they face and how they deal with and overcome them. He's not out there cap in hand at every opportunity like the ASTI mafia.

Interesting observation.

Considering that teachers and school staff around the country, were given bad guidelines and funds 3 weeks before reopening and managed to reopen on time as per starting date and have been getting on with it ever since, to the extent that the government are patting us on the head in speeches.

Mind you, the patting in my eyes is just tenderising us for the next reveal

SligoBrewer

Jerry Atrick wrote: »

I actually think Colm O'Rourke is one of the most unaffected teachers out there. He gets on with the job at hand and speaks a lot of sense. It's refreshing to hear someone in the education sector taking a step back and rationally looking at the obstacles they face and how they deal with and overcome them. He's not out there cap in hand at every opportunity like the ASTI mafia.

He's a principal with a nice side gig who is solely interested in pulling the ladder up after him.

I'd rather my union was out there fighting for my pay and conditions than plamasing the Government.

Treppen

Jerry Atrick wrote: »

I actually think Colm O'Rourke is one of the most unaffected teachers out there. He gets on with the job at hand and speaks a lot of sense. It's refreshing to hear someone in the education sector taking a step back and rationally looking at the obstacles they face and how they deal with and overcome them. He's not out there cap in hand at every opportunity like the ASTI mafia.

You actually think he's a teacher?

TheValeyard

Treppen wrote: »

You actually think he's a teacher?

Oh I could say other things I think he is, but Spurious would slap me down pretty quickly

Dav010

Treppen wrote: »

You actually think he's a teacher?

Is he not a school Principal and teacher?

wirelessdude01

Dav010 wrote: »

Is he not a school Principal and teacher?

Point being it's a hell of a long time since he was in a classroom and dealing with those day to day thinga. Being a principal requires a total different mindset. I see it with my own fri D's who are now principals and their opinions on things totally changed when their position changed.

Dav010

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Point being it's a hell of a long time since he was in a classroom and dealing with those day to day thinga. Being a principal requires a total different mindset. I see it with my own fri D's who are now principals and their opinions on things totally changed when their position changed.

Their opinions changed when they had to manage and consider other people apart from themselves?

History Queen

It is very hard to understand why schools are not being opened in a more limited way. At secondary week in- week out could work well. Spend week out working on projects/homework/ practical tasks where possible or working online. Teachers would be in school full time but only seeing (in person) half the school population each week. Obviously not ideal but surely a compromise worth considering.

spurious

For all our visitors, this is a forum where teachers and lecturers can discuss teaching matters in a 'safe space'.
I make no excuse for deleting any and all inflammatory anti-teacher posts.

There are a number of other fora here on boards where teacher bashing is tolerated. Go rant there.

As always, thanks to those who report the posts against the charter.

byhookorbycrook

Colm is safe in his office and small mindedness . He is a principal in name only , content to draw his DES cheque hang his staff out to dry . He sold his soul to become a media lackey .

Mardy Bum

byhookorbycrook wrote: »

Colm is safe in his office and small mindedness . He is a principal in name only , content to draw his DES cheque hang his staff out to dry . He sold his soul to become a media lackey .

Sometimes second jobs and controversial opinions are needed when the banks come calling.

heldel00

Treppen wrote: »

Has something to do with him wanting to go to Australia and play footie while teaching but the department/school wouldn't grant him leave and he got the hump as the Union wouldn't take his case.

Allegedly.
I'm open to correction.

He went into property development during the boom too but that's another angry Colm o Roorkee story. Allegedly.
I'm open to correction.

I think the stories have been scrubbed from d'internet as I can't find them anymore.

And he was also photographed at Cheltenham (or some other racing festival in England) while he was on sick leave from school and got into a bit of bother about that.

MacGyver007

The results are out:
https://asti.ie/news/key-covid-issues-in-schools-must-be-addressed-asti-secures-m/

It appears that some are having trouble accessing the page, so here it is below. I have added in the percentages for YES and NO.


"Ballot Paper - 1

Do you vote in favour of authorising ASTI Standing Committee to direct ASTI members not to co-operate with any changes to work practices unless a consensus on the proposed changes is achieved at a staff meeting?

YES 5359 (79.3%)
NO 1400 (20.7%)
Turnout 42%

Ballot Paper – 2

Do you vote in favour of authorising ASTI Standing Committee to direct ASTI members not to engage in any changes to work practices unless such changes are time-neutral?

YES 5274 (77.7%)
NO 1514 (22.3%)
Turnout 42.2%

Ballot Paper - 3

Are you willing to take industrial action up to and including strike action, as directed by ASTI Standing Committee, in the event that the DES either directly — or indirectly through the HSE or its agencies — fails, by 30th October 2020, to put in place the following measures?

a) Physical distancing of two metres in every classroom;
YES 2579 (39.6%)
NO 3940 (60.4%)

b) Free provision of N95 masks to all students and teachers;
YES 2995 (45.1%)
NO 3646 (54.9%)

c) Redefinition of a close contact as any person who has spent more than 15 minutes in a classroom with a positive Covid-19 case;
YES 4210 (63.3%)
NO 2443 (36.7%)

d) A serial testing programme for schools;
YES 3863 (56.9%)
NO 2924 (43.1%)

e) Guaranteed test turnaround times of 24 hours;
YES 3767 (56.0%)
NO 2962 (44.0%)

f) Equal pay for post-2010 teachers;
YES 4158 (62.9%)
NO 2453 (37.1%)

g) Guaranteed offer of a permanent contract, on full hours, for any teacher who returns to the system, either from Ireland or abroad;
YES 2292 (34.7%)
NO 4304 (65.3%)

h) Provision for any teacher in the high-risk category to either teach from home or have guaranteed reasonable accommodations made in school;
YES 4570 (68.2%)
NO 2134 (31.8%)

i) Free provision of laptops, procured centrally rather than by means of grants to schools, for students and teachers to ensure that learning can continue as much as possible if classes are required to self-isolate, or schools required to close due to Covid-19.
YES 3685 (55.4%)
NO 2973 (44.6%)

Turnout 42.3%

Ballot Paper - 4

Are you willing to take industrial action, up to and including strike action, for equal pay for equal work, to be taken in conjunction with one or both of the other teacher unions and as directed by ASTI Standing Committee?
YES 4122 (61.5%)
NO 2586 (38.5%)

Turnout 41.6%"