Viable CX /gravel trails

a148pro

cletus wrote: »

I'm really tempted by this, but given all the greeenways that have been given the go ahead just this year, how soon will it be out of date?

Possibly, but the reality is the majority of those greenways are of very marginal interest to regular cyclists (unless you're cycling with kids), they're often short (the new ones anyway) and often have nicer bothareens nearby. If you're after proper pleasure cycling leave the greenways behind.

the more interesting q is how many of the long distance walking routes / pilgrim paths are cycleable on an off road bike. I've tried a few with mixed success. But a good resource for gravel cyclists. The starting point of an off road route is that there is a route, off road. The next question, often unanswerable until you try it, is is it cycleable.

CramCycle

a148pro wrote: »

The next question, often unanswerable until you try it, is is it cycleable.

Almost everything is cyclable if you have patience. I have come down routes (covered in roots) that MTBers said I can't, it is just very slow and, no word of a lie, nerve wrecking, but doable. The Greenways are great but I'd be unlikely to go out on them on my own, lovely for a family or a casual social spin

a148pro

Unfortunately I don't have a MTB, and don't have bike skills, so I've come to dislike hike a bike. Anything other than a short section to be rewarded with a great path either side just isn't worth it to me. But as DF said above a good mountain bike and rider could do a whole amount more.

Like I did the Howth cliff path once. The bit from Howth village to say the lighthouse was brilliant, very little carrying the bike and a stunning path, cycling along the edge of a proper sea cliff. But from the Lighthouse on to Sutton was just a pain in the hole. People were saying fair play to you but really I was just carrying the bike around the walk like Jesus with the cross.

Alek

You surely need a portage strap




It comes down to whatever floats your boat I guess, I've done routes where ~60% was technically off the bike (either walking or carrying) and I have never ever regretted it... not that I would do them again, though

Large bottle small glass

Greenways can work really well mixed with off road/boreens.

Just did a 80km spin this morning almost entirely very lumpy boreens and a few gravel sections. Finished with a 5km spin from Ballyvoile to Clonea on Greenway.

Have frequently used Suir Blueway while riding very lumpy gravel south of Suir around Kilsheelan/Ticincor and also to North gravel raods on southern side of Slievenamon down towards Aheny.

A map is always a snap shot of time.

Now to grow a pair and go swimming

smacl

CramCycle wrote: »

Almost everything is cyclable if you have patience. I have come down routes (covered in roots) that MTBers said I can't, it is just very slow and, no word of a lie, nerve wrecking, but doable. The Greenways are great but I'd be unlikely to go out on them on my own, lovely for a family or a casual social spin

Not coming from a CX or MTB background, I just end up getting off and pushing when it gets too gnarly. Not really an issue in that the cycle ends up becoming a bit of a bike&hike by times. Only downside is limited daylight hours in the Winter, so I tend to leave my exploratory spins to times of year with longer days. Seriously tempted to get a lightweight full MTB, expensive though it would be, but the concern then becomes range and speed on the roads. There are a few routes I can get through on the CX that are so nerve wracking and uncomfortable that it sucks the joy out of them.

CramCycle

smacl wrote: »

Not coming from a CX or MTB background, I just end up getting off and pushing when it gets too gnarly. Not really an issue in that the cycle ends up becoming a bit of a bike&hike by times. Only downside is limited daylight hours in the Winter, so I tend to leave my exploratory spins to times of year with longer days. Seriously tempted to get a lightweight full MTB, expensive though it would be, but the concern then becomes range and speed on the roads. There are a few routes I can get through on the CX that are so nerve wracking and uncomfortable that it sucks the joy out of them.

I don't think the range on the road is that big of an issue, use lockouts and if you have a pump or CO2 cartridge, inflate the tyres if its a long spin and let them down when you are there.

I agree, my old MTB was fully rigid so I got used to the abuse but I haven't the heart to pay for a full sus, as I am in two minds, lots of the common MTB trails are more than doable on a CX bike, at a reasonable speed as well, it is when you get to the more "unknown" routes that it becomes a chore. There are a small number I have went down and fully expected to be leaving by air ambulance, but always manage to get down them. There is a short descent near me, on a full sus, I would imagine I could get through it in 2 minutes, on my CX bike its a 10 minute slog, easier in the summer but at this time of year your arms ache from tensing to try and avoid losing the wheel from under you. This said, with a few exceptions, you are nearly always quicker uphill on a descent CX bike, although a few would be the same on a hardtail MTB, the truth is, you find plenty of MTBers walking up climbs around Wicklow as that's the pace they would be cycling at.

Tombo2001

What would be a great resource, if there was one (and maybe there is), is a route map of the aforementioned 'Bothareens'.

My folks live out in Meath, I sometime (not too often) cycle out and back from Dublin. Its remarkable that on a Sunday evening in summer you can spend 20 minutes on a road without a car passing you, and maybe just ten miles from Dublin.

But you have to know the roads.

I remember once going out for the day cycling in Kilkenny; maybe 5 or 6 cars passing me in the space of the day. But then I get back to the main dublin kilkenny road (pre motorway) and it takes me 10 minutes to get to the other side of it with all the traffic.

Some routes are arteries, some arent - its the ones that arent that you want to cycle on.

And the really old bothareens are essentially gravel paths, with grass growing in the middle.

Rocketpocket

Any one know of any gravel bike trails in south wexford?

Large bottle small glass

Talking of Greenways and gravel this "should" be a nice route from Clonmel to Clonea via Blueway and Greenway. I've done a couple of mtb spin in Portlaw woods but the lads bringing me out asked not to use Strava/record it while there so it'll be a nice bit of guesswork.

https://ridewithgps.com/routes/34872415
https://ridewithgps.com/routes/34872406 (route one joins this route at 5km)

Point of order. Bóithrín or boreen (bóithríní or boreens).

If it has plenty bó sh1t and/or grass up the middle it's a bóithrín

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=529401&d=1602774449

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=110690478&postcount=5655

a148pro

Tombo2001 wrote: »

What would be a great resource, if there was one (and maybe there is), is a route map of the aforementioned 'Bothareens'.

Komoot is pretty good for this, will plot a route for you between two or more points and choose the quiet roads. I've found it excellent.

There are also marked cycle trails in many areas, leading from cycle hubs and usually they take quiet routes.

Then you go for local knowledge, if you can get a gpx from a local cycling club or something. There's a superb route put in around tipp called the grass routes gran fondo, bothareen after bothareen with grass down the middle.

I actually thought during the lockdown with emphasis on domestic travel they should give out grants to local clubs to come up with routes for visitors.

a148pro

Large bottle small glass wrote: »

Talking of Greenways and gravel this "should" be a nice route from Clonmel to Clonea via Blueway and Greenway. I've done a couple of mtb spin in Portlaw woods but the lads bringing me out asked not to use Strava/record it while there so it'll be a nice bit of guesswork.

https://ridewithgps.com/routes/34872415
https://ridewithgps.com/routes/34872406 (route one joins this route at 5km)

Point of order. Bóithrín or boreen (bóithríní or boreens).

If it has plenty bó sh1t and/or grass up the middle it's a bóithrín

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/attachment.php?attachmentid=529401&d=1602774449

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=110690478&postcount=5655

God that picture of the road in beara, that is on the list for sure. Is there a good gravel alternative to the main cycle routes down there? Could you cycle the beara way for instance?

I loved the carrick / clonmel blueway, did it on a day trip on train from dublin. Watched an otter right under my nose for about 15 minutes. The little information signs along the way are great too. But surface is super smooth. Is there not gravel routes in the woods on the other side of the river? I thought you linked to a route there before? And more in the comeraghs?

cletus

Tombo2001 wrote: »

What would be a great resource, if there was one (and maybe there is), is a route map of the aforementioned 'Bothareens'

I use a combination of komoot, Open Street Maps, cycle.travel and Google maps. Google maps street view is great when you find what looks like a good route on one of the other maps.

I like looking at maps, though...

smacl

Tombo2001 wrote: »

What would be a great resource, if there was one (and maybe there is), is a route map of the aforementioned 'Bothareens'.

My folks live out in Meath, I sometime (not too often) cycle out and back from Dublin. Its remarkable that on a Sunday evening in summer you can spend 20 minutes on a road without a car passing you, and maybe just ten miles from Dublin.

But you have to know the roads.

I really enjoy finding my own routes. The cycle layer on open street maps is brilliant for this.



The borhereens are the L-roads straddling R and N roads and often have bits of dirt roads in between. One of the things I really enjoy before an Irish holiday is plotting these out and chucking them on the Garmin on the evenings before heading off. I've also had routes recommended by other boardsies where they've PMed over GPX files which have worked well (thanks ford2600!). If you've got an upload address, I'll upload all my old GPX files at some point because they're mostly l-roads with the odd bit of gravel. I'm all about quiet l-roads, nice scenery and traffic avoidance.

CramCycle

Rocketpocket wrote: »

Any one know of any gravel bike trails in south wexford?

Depends what distance you want to do, for short trails Skeeter Park over to Three Rock has off road paths, probably 10km in total.
The Norman way is adventurous in parts, with some of the laneways in worse condition than a warzone undergoing shelling. Finally, you can head over from Carne Beach to Kilmore Quay along the coast line, there is a hiking path and beach most of the way, if you have a Strava account you can use the heatmaps on create a route to see it.

Large bottle small glass

a148pro wrote: »

I loved the carrick / clonmel blueway, did it on a day trip on train from dublin. Watched an otter right under my nose for about 15 minutes. The little information signs along the way are great too. But surface is super smooth. Is there not gravel routes in the woods on the other side of the river? I thought you linked to a route there before? And more in the comeraghs?

Carrick Clonmel Blueway is lovely and works well with gravel across river(mainly between Ticincor and Kilsheelan) of which there is a lot of options.

In terms of the Comeraghs there is plenty in
*northern side of Nire Valley
*some around the Mauma road
*there may be some around Rathgormack/Lemybrien side but I haven't looked

Knockmealdowns is a much better range with forestry on both side, Mount Mellary and a couple of river trails.

On a side note WTB riddler seem a lovely lively tyre on byroads and seem decent in light mud and mixed off road; although I've only had on front so far

Large bottle small glass

a148pro wrote: »

Love the surface you linked to in your pic - Grass Routes Gran Fondo has about a 100k of mostly those roads out of Tipp town which is an absolute gem to cycle

Your route that spins near Clonmel looks amazing and Clonmel very doable by train down and back in a day so will try that some time, thanks

Moved from the 1x or 2x gravel thread

I haven't ridden up much in the part of west Tipp/East Limerick. I'm sure route is lovely but I'm not sure there is anything unique about it.

I've ridden back roads in a few pockets of Cork, south Tipp, Waterford primarily but also on holidays in Kerry, Mayo, Sligo and Donegal. The odd nice audax event in Cavan, Meath, Westmeath etc. The country is full of roads like you describe.

https://ridewithgps.com/routes/35249459?beta=false

While I'd be familiar with some of it I mapped the above route in about 10 mins. from memory I had to walk about 500m, corrected map after riding it and it's done. I'll probably never again ride as close to perfect and all as it was, as there is so much more I haven't ridden. About 15km of off road from memory. Not sure what the perfect ratio is; I do know 2hrs in a Sitka/Norway wood is enough for me!

Just look to south of my route; byroads mixed with pockets of forestry the perfect ground for rooting around for bits of gravel.

The area is question is great to ride in as Knockmealdowns are always visible to south, Galtees to North, Comeraghs to the east and Women's Hill to the north east while it never goes over 170m ish

a148pro

Needs coffee stop. Decent place in Mitchelstown I think?

Where does the other data on that map come from, i.e., the other routes on it? Would love a one stop shop where you can browse routes with a description and photos, ask the site to plot a route for you within certain parameters. Not sure Komoot offers that without clicking on highlights then the users who posted and what they did. Don't pay for strava so don't know if that offers it.

Large bottle small glass

Irish trails have been suggested in discussions on suitable gravel trails.

I've looked at Tipp heritage Way, East Munster Way and St Declan's Way in a nice bit of detail, on maps and on ground.

They imo and ime are suitable as a guide, being part used and as an inspiration.

St Declan's Way is a walking route from Cashel to Ardmore, the "route" is mapped here
https://my.viewranger.com/route/details/MjAwNDA=

Route isn't 100% accurate to what is on ground and differs in some places to what is signposted on the ground.

The main problem with route for gravel bikes is where it crosses the knockmealdowns, which is open exposed mountain and crosses it at 520m plus I think.

With that in mind I worked out 2 workarounds both starting in Ardfinnan; Cashel to Ardfinnan is nearly entirely back roads really nice back roads mind.
1. Follows the signed route to a pedestrian bridge over Tar about 1km west of Goatenbridge and then heads south into the woods and up by Liam Lynch monument and across on to the Knockboy road pass. Then is descends, enters wood and trespasses into Mount Mellary Monastery.
2. Takes different and really nice back roads across to Vee which using about 1.5km of off road climbs to about 200m before using road climb to top. Descent is via a really nice forest road and a forded river crossing and across to marked route.

I haven't gone south of Aglish but pretty sure it's bikeable.

https://ridewithgps.com/routes/35429580
Cashel to Ardfinnan

https://ridewithgps.com/routes/35433859
15km on is Ardfinnan to Aglish via the Vee

https://ridewithgps.com/routes/35433686
is alternative to using Vee

Someone else can stitch it together!

Large bottle small glass

Some views on the St Declan's Way

cletus

Looks great. Throw up the Strava thingy, if you have it