Schools closed until February? (part 3)

Bananaleaf

harr wrote: »

LC to return as normal next week , education minister to seek approval from government.

Where did you hear this?

harr

harr wrote: »

LC to return as normal next week , education minister to seek approval from government.

How many will go back though?

Does this government not realise a lot of Children are scared too?

deiseindublin

RTE notification just had same for me, NF looking for approval to bring in 6th years.

Can't see how that would work, surely the point of a lockdown is not to have movement of people? Add in every LC teacher and student in the country, along with creches, essential workers and teachers in Special classes/schools? That's huge movement of people.

Also, I thought 18 yo's would be more vulnerable to catching the virus?

Icyseanfitz

So they will have to get busses up and running again, id imagine most staff will have to come in daily, many from other counties.

Sammy2012

My sister is doing her LC this year and she'd much rather do the work online than go into school. She doesn't mind the online work and is motivated and already missed the last week of school before Christmas due to being a close contact of a confirmed case in school. I know this doesn't suit everyone but its very unfair on students as if they come into contact with covid now there will be no obligation on teachers to provide any additional help.

harr

Bananaleaf wrote: »

Where did you hear this?[/quote

From the independent..

km79

Sammy2012 wrote: »

My sister is doing her LC this year and she'd much rather do the work online than go into school. She doesn't mind the online work and is motivated and already missed the last week of school before Christmas due to being a close contact of a confirmed case in school. I know this doesn't suit everyone but its very unfair on students as if they come into contact with covid now there will be no obligation on teachers to provide any additional help.

If this goes ahead you will have half that want to stay at home due to safety concerns
What then ?
I knew they would make an absolute mess of this
Like everything else

JimmyVik

Icyseanfitz wrote: »

I think its entirely down to the severity of this new uk strain, its so much more easily transmitted that if there's any groups of people numbers go bang. That combined with Christmas has really made for a bad situation.

I dont think it has anything to do with the new strain at all.
Many weeks it was building, totally invisible in schools with children being asymptomatic.
The whole country beong told repeatedly that it doesnt spread in schools where children are on top of each other. Sure children mustnt get the virus.
So coming up to Christmas a fair few people decided, you know what, the kids cant get it, lets take them shopping and to visit the in laws, grandparents, cousins in Dublin etc.


Pretending it does not spread in schools has got us where we are.
A bit of honesty from nphet and the govt would have gone a log way.


Put kids back to school again now and they are basically saying, ah sure the kids cant spread it.

Leftwaffe

Icyseanfitz wrote: »

So they will have to get busses up and running again, id imagine most staff will have to come in daily, many from other counties.

Basically all staff will be back in our school. Cleaners, teachers, SNAs, building management, etc. That’s not really an issue though.

I’ll be back five days a week if LCs are back but will I have to stream classes to those LCs at home as well is the question. That’s difficult.

km79

Redordeadqwwer wrote: »

Basically all staff will be back in our school. Cleaners, teachers, SNAs, building management, etc. That’s not really an issue though.

I’ll be back five days a week if LCs are back but will I have to stream classes to those LCs at home as well is the question. That’s difficult.

It gets better
She is proposing they only come in 3 days a week
I wonder will she decide which 3 days are safer
Or
Will schools have to rearrange all timetables ......
And I mean all. If L C timetables are rearranged then that affects all other year groups

E36Ross

Again half arsed leaked reports regards leaving certs....

I can't understand why they couldn't call a meeting last week, iron out the issues make a grown up decision and give people a week to get in order.

I drive a bus for special needs and don't know if I have a job Monday or not. (And if I do, Is it really that safe?)

vid36

The proposal is for Leaving Certs to be back 3 days.

Icyseanfitz

km79 wrote: »

It gets better
She is proposing they only come in 3 days a week
I wonder will she decide which 3 days are safer
Or
Will schools have to rearrange all timetables ......
And I mean all. If L C timetables are rearranged then that affects all other year groups

Oh ffs

Stateofyou

RTE still pushing the angle that LC students considered to return to school on Monday.

The Unions should squash that nonsense from a H&S standpoint.

No testing and tracing (I think this is where we're at?) cases rampant and 25% said to be the new more contagious strain, hospitals nearing capacity, many with small and overcrowded classrooms, some under ventilated and even if so it's baltic out...

Honestly if I were a teacher ordered to go back Monday I'd get a doctor to write me off sick with stress. F@ck that.

The DES should move to change the game for LC once and for all. As pointed out, seems to be always under review. No time like the present.

Knine

E36Ross wrote: »

Again half arsed leaked reports regards leaving certs....

I can't understand why they couldn't call a meeting last week, iron out the issues make a grown up decision and give people a week to get in order.

I drive a bus for special needs and don't know if I have a job Monday or not. (And if I do, Is it really that safe?)

I think even if open, my daughter with Special Needs will be staying at home!

Leftwaffe

Is this being leaked to gather public opinion?

I feel like Norma is pushing for this because if schools close fully her position is borderline untenable considering she was telling us they are entirely safe just days ago. Madigan clinging for it too I’d imagine, embarrassed herself two days ago.

Benimar

vid36 wrote: »

The proposal is for Leaving Certs to be back 3 days.

Will someone just put a random Junior Infant in charge. They would have a more coherent plan than Norma!

Icyseanfitz

Its either safe for us to be back or not, stop the ****ing half measures at this stage, things are too dire

The Wordress

Stateofyou wrote: »

RTE still pushing the angle that LC students considered to return to school on Monday.

The Unions should squash that nonsense from a H&S standpoint.

No testing and tracing (I think this is where we're at?) cases rampant and 25% said to be the new more contagious strain, hospitals nearing capacity, many with small and overcrowded classrooms, some under ventilated and even if so it's baltic out...

Honestly if I were a teacher ordered to go back Monday I'd get a doctor to write me off sick with stress. F@ck that.

The DES should move to change the game for LC once and for all. As pointed out, seems to be always under review. No time like the present.

That is one issue that is annoying me. The leave aspect of it.

If I were in mainstream, I could work at home and probably not have to take any leave.

Now, I may be forced into a situation to take leave if I have no childcare and feel deeply uncomfortable to go into school everyday.

So basically I use up a huge amount of leave because I am being forced into a very uncomfortable situation and other are not. Not fair at all.

Bananaleaf

Wording of RTE article suggests SEN schools only but that they are working on something for LCs. Doesn't sound like the plan at the moment is to have the schools open to them, at least not fully

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2021/0106/1187920-cabinet-covid-restrictions/

cursai

Is nobody asking the virus what it plans to do? Surely he can produce an itinerary .

Bananaleaf

The Wordress wrote: »

That is one issue that is annoying me. The leave aspect of it.

If I were in mainstream, I could work at home and probably not have to take any leave.

Now, I may be forced into a situation to take leave if I have no childcare and feel deeply uncomfortable to go into school everyday.

So basically I use up a huge amount of leave because I am being forced into a very uncomfortable situation and other are not. Not fair at all.

Please don't resent your colleagues over this though. It is likely that they feel the unfairness of it too.

We have an ASD unit attached to our mainstream school. If it turns out they are in and the rest of us are not, I will (a) not be happy about it either and (b) will be doing whatever is allowed to help them out

wirelessdude01

Exams gone this year in NI.

lulublue22

There is really no coherence or joined up thinking among this gov - stephan Donnelly on twitter highlighting the seriousness of the new strain ( which is linked to greater transmission rates in children) and how we must all stay at home and stay safe and Norma Foley - schools are safe - closing schools to reduce movement except for special schools , special classes and LC.

Talk about talking out of both sides of your mouth!

Leftwaffe

Can’t even click and collect now yet Norma is thinking of sending kids back. The whole schools are safe thing seems to be the hill she is willing to die on.

JDD

I can see how opening school for LCs would be a bit of a logistical nightmare. That being said, it is 55,000 pupils out of 1,000,000 school going children. It's not going to make a massive difference on the spread of the virus, but I'd imagine will be a massive headache for the schools to organise, while also trying to teach 1-5th years remotely.

Sammy2012

Redordeadqwwer wrote: »

Is this being leaked to gather public opinion?

I feel like Norma is pushing for this because if schools close fully her position is borderline untenable considering she was telling us they are entirely safe just days ago. Madigan clinging for it too I’d imagine, embarrassed herself two days ago.

Both are useless and should be sacked or step down.

deiseindublin

Stateofyou wrote: »

RTE still pushing the angle that LC students considered to return to school on Monday.

The Unions should squash that nonsense from a H&S standpoint.

That's probably the plan.

NF tried to sort it out but the big bad unions said NO.

Bananaleaf

lulublue22 wrote: »

There is really no coherence or joined up thinking among this gov - stephan Donnelly on twitter highlighting the seriousness of the new strain ( which is linked to greater transmission rates in children) and how we must all stay at home and stay safe and Norma Foley - schools are safe - closing schools to reduce movement except for special schools , special classes and LC.

Talk about talking out of both sides of your mouth!

The higher transmission rates among children is way more problematic to the country as a whole than people seem to understand too

Listening to Tomas Ryan on The Stand it could potentially be responsible for that new strain becoming the dominant variant of C19 in Ireland and if that happens, nothing less than level 5 restrictions will EVER work. It could also raise cases so high that by the time the vaccines roll around for all, for many of us it may no longer work

eviltwin

I can't see how its going to work for LC students if everyone else has to stay at home. How are teachers going to work that? Do they have to travel into the school to teach their LC classes face to face and then go back home to work with everyone else remotely? Seems completely unworkable. I do agree LC students should be prioritised as much as possible if traditional exams are to happen.

lulublue22

Bananaleaf wrote: »

Please don't resent your colleagues over this though. It is likely that they feel the unfairness of it too.

We have an ASD unit attached to our mainstream school. If it turns out they are in and the rest of us are not, I will (a) not be happy about it either and (b) will be doing whatever is allowed to help them out

Special schools won’t have anyone to help out though - John Boyle on Ireland am indicated transmission rates ( not surprisingly ) in special schools slightly higher than in national schools. Yet all good to open with such high levels of community transmission not to mention the school transport issue.

Leftwaffe

eviltwin wrote: »

I can't see how its going to work for LC students if everyone else has to stay at home. How are teachers going to work that? Do they have to travel into the school to teach their LC classes face to face and then go back home to work with everyone else remotely? Seems completely unworkable. I do agree LC students should be prioritised as much as possible if traditional exams are to happen.

It would be a bit of a logistical nightmare timetable wise. I’m assuming all LC timetables would have to be redone temporarily. This would lead to a knock on effect trying to teach other year groups online according to the regular timetable. Teachers would likely have to livestream classes as well as face to face as attendance will likely be very low for 6th years. I’m sure there are other aspects I’m not thinking of.

Today is Wednesday too.

Stateofyou

Bananaleaf wrote: »

Please don't resent your colleagues over this though. It is likely that they feel the unfairness of it too.

We have an ASD unit attached to our mainstream school. If it turns out they are in and the rest of us are not, I will (a) not be happy about it either and (b) will be doing whatever is allowed to help them out

In fairness I think that poster resents the situation it would put them in, not their colleagues. I would feel exactly the same way.

deiseindublin wrote: »

That's probably the plan.

NF tried to sort it out but the big bad unions said NO.

Too right.

I have premium Independent subscription, and just after reading an article that made my blood boil, entitled "Homeschooling 2.0: Eleven ways to make learning at home easier this time round"

It's eleven ways parents can be better organised essentially. It acknowledges the challenges, multiple kids, unfamiliar curriculum, lack of devices, but if the parents can just be better organised, it will all work out.
Nothing about the DES failures. Nothing about how principles should now direct teachers to take charge of the actual teaching of the curriculum. No mention of a lack of a standard remote learning plan including supports from the DES. We should just remain calm, work it out with our spouses, take breaks and teach our children how to be independent. "Every day is a school day." Not joking that's a direct quote.

Like FFS, honestly. Media seems to cover for the DES inadequacies. I may have to have a drink with my lunch I'm so p'd off.

mirrorwall14

JDD wrote: »

I can see how opening school for LCs would be a bit of a logistical nightmare. That being said, it is 55,000 pupils out of 1,000,000 school going children. It's not going to make a massive difference on the spread of the virus, but I'd imagine will be a massive headache for the schools to organise, while also trying to teach 1-5th years remotely.

Almost all teachers in my school have a LC group. That means that the LC students, most of the teachers and the ancillary staff all have to be on site. You are talking about 1/4 of the school being in even though its only one year group. Then they have to get to school.

Then from the 3 day idea being floated they'd have to change their timetables which has a knock on affect for all the students at home. And we have two days notice.

How will it work? Do I still (if I wasn't very high risk) teach my 24 music students in one room? Do we need to split the class up, which presumably we should? Then who gets to be with me the class teacher? And if the proposal is to stream to the others in another room wouldn't they be safer at home

Then there's the students who simply won't want to come in due to safety concerns.

Its populist kite flying and Norma Foley should be fired.

If this was EVER a possibility then there should have been a plan in place. Which is what parents, teachers and schools have been asking for since the start. There should have been a set of levels ready to go for schools with Level 5 the nuclear fully online, level 4 special schools open etc.

But no. The minister and the Department have done NOTHING. Argh. :mad::mad:

jrosen

I see why there would be a desire to bring LC students back in. But I dont see how it would work for the remaining years. You cant expect a teacher to teach on site and then also teach from home. It would be really difficult to manage from a staffing point.

Im afraid its all or nothing

jimmytwotimes 2013

They've left this so late, yet again, it's criminal.

What am I doing on Monday and how do we prepare work for totally unknown scenarios.

It's really disappointing, the lack of contingency planning, my god.

Edit: I wud assume if you're on site to teach LCs you'd just stay in building for the day and remote teach the rest.

If you have no LC class, you teach from home.

Some principals won't like the loss of control on that one

Endintheclowns

This idea about bringing in LC students has to be a wind up? Does the minister not have any idea about how the education system works at all.

Benimar

jrosen wrote: »

I see why there would be a desire to bring LC students back in. But I dont see how it would work for the remaining years. You cant expect a teacher to teach on site and then also teach from home. It would be really difficult to manage from a staffing point.

Im afraid its all or nothing

Before we went fully online for the year we looked at the possibility of bringing in all 1st Years. Logistically, it just wouldn't have worked. In fact, it would have been a disaster.

It's the same here. It needs to be all in (no chance of that at present) or all online.

mirrorwall14

Endintheclowns wrote: »

This idea about bringing in LC students has to be a wind up? Does the minister not have any idea about how the education system works at all.

She's an actual teacher. I'm honestly flabbergasted. WTF is wrong with her?

km79

jrosen wrote: »

I see why there would be a desire to bring LC students back in. But I dont see how it would work for the remaining years. You cant expect a teacher to teach on site and then also teach from home. It would be really difficult to manage from a staffing point.

Im afraid its all or nothing

Teachers would have to travel to work every day as normal and teach all their classes remotely from the school building
No other way around it

combat14

JDD wrote: »

I can see how opening school for LCs would be a bit of a logistical nightmare. That being said, it is 55,000 pupils out of 1,000,000 school going children. It's not going to make a massive difference on the spread of the virus, but I'd imagine will be a massive headache for the schools to organise, while also trying to teach 1-5th years remotely.

could always stop remote teaching for years 1-5

Bananaleaf

mirrorwall14 wrote: »

She's an actual teacher. I'm honestly flabbergasted. WTF is wrong with her?

And it seems it's her who is pushing for it too.

Wants them in 3 days a week:

https://www.rte.ie/news/2021/0106/1188012-schools-leaving-cert-education/

combat14

Uk take on opening schools from the gaurdian:


Johnson says people should be 'extremely cautious' about chances of schools reopening in February

Johnson lists a series of phone companies that have agreed to offer free data or internet access to some children who will be doing classes from home.

He says pupils may be able to go back to school after the February half-term.

But people should be “extremely cautious” about that timetable, he says.

He confirms that the regulations being passed today will last until 31 March.

The emergence from this lockdown will be “gradual”, he says

jimmytwotimes 2013

combat14 wrote: »

could always stop remote teaching for years 1-5

Then next years LC is compromised

JimmyVik

Redordeadqwwer wrote: »

Can’t even click and collect now yet Norma is thinking of sending kids back. The whole schools are safe thing seems to be the hill she is willing to die on.

She will have the highest bodycount of any minister in the history of the state.

Bananaleaf

Stateofyou wrote: »

In fairness I think that poster resents the situation it would put them in, not their colleagues. I would feel exactly the same way.

Oh no, I totally understand that, I'm sorry Wordess, I didn't mean to suggest otherwise. I meant it as more of a 'please remember not to be mad at your colleagues' It is easy - as has been shown many times on this and other threads - to lose focus on who is really at fault here. Not parents, not colleagues, not ourselves, not principals, not students

Stateofyou

combat14 wrote: »

Johnson lists a series of phone companies that have agreed to offer free data or internet access to some children who will be doing classes from home.

Crickets from ours of course.

touts

Twitter is exploding with outraged students who suddenly realize they might have to do some work for the next 6 months.

Endintheclowns

lulublue22 wrote: »

Special schools won’t have anyone to help out though - John Boyle on Ireland am indicated transmission rates ( not surprisingly ) in special schools slightly higher than in national schools. Yet all good to open with such high levels of community transmission not to mention the school transport issue.

Special needs kids are usually transported to school by contractors working for Dublin bus usually in mini buses. Are the drivers and SNA's on the buses going to be vaccinated before the kids return because i wouldn't want to be driving a minibus with 7-8 kids onboard with the virus so rampant at the minute.

Benimar

combat14 wrote: »

could always stop remote teaching for years 1-5

Jaysus! Can you imagine the vitriol out of some posters?!

Teachers only doing 17% of their work, put them on the PUP now, and make them work every holiday between now and 2040!!