Schools closed until February? (part 3)

Blondini

Glurrl wrote: »

Goodness, that must be a deprived area you work in


There was 19 cases in schools and 20 cases in workplaces. Schools are safer than workplaces.

19 cases in schools?

Crazy, considering there were 17 cases in just one school in Glanmire...

These magical schools just keep getting magicier!

Boggles

Blondini wrote: »

19 cases in schools?

Crazy, considering there were 17 cases in just one school in Glanmire...

These magical schools just keep getting magicier!

So far. The entire school is getting tested apparently.

Will be interesting to see the results, I imagine we won't though.

Messi19

Glurrl wrote: »

Goodness, that must be a deprived area you work in


There was 19 cases in schools and 20 cases in workplaces. Schools are safer than workplaces.

So deprived that it's essential but don't let that dissuade your delusions

Glurrl

Blondini wrote: »

19 cases in schools?

Crazy, considering there were 17 cases in just one school in Glanmire...

These magical schools just keep getting magicier!

A cluster or outbreak is defined as the discovery of two or more cases in a setting.

17 in one school is probably one cluster. No magic involved. When did that happen?

ShamoBuc

Glurrl wrote: »

A cluster or outbreak is defined as the discovery of two or more cases in a setting.

17 in one school is probably one cluster. No magic involved. When did that happen?

School closed yesterday for 2 weeks. 17 cases spread between 4 or 5 classes at least.

Over 450 students and teachers now classified as close contacts and have started their first of at least 2 tests today and will continue tomorrow.

Glurrl

Boggles wrote: »

It seems Glanmire national school was forced to close because the community got wind it was riddled and started yanking their kids out en masse.

They didn't seem too keen on the lets pretend nothing is happening method.

Good job they did, God only knows how many more "unknown" household clusters would have developed.

The community got wind the place was riddled

Boggles wrote: »

So far. The entire school is getting tested apparently.

Will be interesting to see the results, I imagine we won't though.

How many cases were identified before mass testing. When was that done?

wirelessdude01

I see contact tracing now being expanded to the previous seven days rather than the previous two. Womder will schools be kept at the two days?

Boggles

Glurrl wrote: »

How many cases were identified before mass testing. When was that done?

Mass testing hasn't been done, I thought that was obvious from my post.

The HSE still haven't contacted parents according to the Examiner.

Again, The HSE kept the school open, it was the parents who insisted on it closing by yanking their kids.

JimmyVik

Boggles wrote: »

Mass testing hasn't been done, I thought that was obvious from my post.

The HSE still haven't contacted parents according to the Examiner.

Again, The HSE kept the school open, it was the parents who insisted on it closing by yanking their kids.

I heard a lot of those positive tests coming out now were parents going to their own GP and explaining that there was covid in the class and would they refer the child to a test as the HSE were not testing them. Is this true?


That whole situation seems to be totally backwards as to how they should manage cases in schools. Im sure mirrored in many, many more schools across the country.

SusanC10

JimmyVik wrote: »

I heard a lot of those positive tests coming out now were parents going to their own GP and explaining that there was covid in the class and would they refer the child to a test as the HSE were not testing them. Is this true?

This is how my friend's son got his Positive. Case was sitting 2 seats from him at school. HSE deemed no close contacts. My friend and her husband weren't happy as they have vulnerable family members. GP agreed to refer for a Test and it came back Positive.

khalessi

Samsonsmasher wrote: »

The death rate nationally is 0.03%
Deaths between 0 and 70 are practically nil.
We were told 100000 would die back in March.
2000 have died whoch means the projected death toll was wrong by 98%
We should never have locked down and we should lift all restrictions immediately.
The dead most likely died with Covid not from it.
They died of old age, heart disease, cancer etc but we were listed as Covid deaths by the HSE.

My dad has cancer and it is being managed well, if he got covid and died I would prefer his death cert said Covid as the cancer is not killing him due to good management. Deaths are attributed to the cause of death not flights of imagination.

ShamoBuc

Boggles wrote: »

Mass testing hasn't been done, I thought that was obvious from my post.

The HSE still haven't contacted parents according to the Examiner.

Again, The HSE kept the school open, it was the parents who insisted on it closing by yanking their kids.

The HSE closed the school, that's a fact. The vast majority of students were in attendance and thinking it was the parents that got the school to close is absolutely ridiculous in the extreme. That simply did not happen.

Don't believe everything you read in the Examiner. Afterall, they said there was 200 students in the school. There is in actual fact 435 students, and nearly 30 staff.

All students and staff are classified as close contacts and are currently being tested.

The principal was on RTE earlier.

expectationlost

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2020/1126/1180714-cork-school-covid-19/

However, the school was unaware of a number of other positive cases within the school community, which had been identified by public health prior to 15 November.

whats the principal getting at?

wirelessdude01

Glanmire school fairly giving both barrels to the HSE over their approach and how it led to the current situation which could and should have been avoided.

lulublue22

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Glanmire school fairly giving both barrels to the HSE over their approach and how it led to the current situation which could and should have been avoided.

From my perspective I’m happy to see the issue being highlighted by the school. The inconsistencies in approaches on the ground to identifying close contacts is mind boggling. It was only a matter of time before this happened. Good too to read that parents are happy with the schools procedures around covid 19 and an acknowledgement from parents that the school was doing everything it could to minimise the spread of covid in the school setting.

ShamoBuc

expectationlost wrote: »

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2020/1126/1180714-cork-school-covid-19/ whats the principal getting at?

Students tested positive but the school not informed. Close contacts, contact tracing, Pods information etc not done in school and students that may have needed to self isolate or get tested, mixed freely in classes, yards etc and at home with their family and even extended family!

Then, all of a sudden, the school has 17 positive cases and the HSE wonder why!

Also, if the school were not told by the HSE, they were also clearly not told by the parents!!

lulublue22

ShamoBuc wrote: »

Students tested positive but the school not informed. Close contacts, contact tracing, Pods information etc not done in school and students that may have needed to self isolate, mixed freely in classes and at home .

Then, all of a sudden, the school has 17 positive cases and the HSE wonder why!

Also, if the school were not told by the HSE, they were also clearly not told by the parents!!

Whatever about the parents - It’s a serious fail on the behalf of public health and will hopefully lead to a review of how cases are dealt with in schools including focusing on the issue of close contacts. Having said that I read that a parent was unhappy as one of the siblings was deemed a close contact but the other wasn’t. Mum was concerned as to how this could be so and the second sibling was ok to go to school - presumably secondary but not stated.

Boggles

ShamoBuc wrote: »

Also, if the school were not told by the HSE, they were also clearly not told by the parents!!

HSE is supposed to contact the school not the parents.

How many principles have we heard from at this stage saying they have heard from parents but can't do anything until the HSE contact them.

Remember the school in Kerry that took the decision to close and was ordered to reopen.

When the sole focus is under the carpet brushing exercise from governance, confusion will reign.

expectationlost

ShamoBuc wrote: »

Students tested positive but the school not informed. Close contacts, contact tracing, Pods information etc not done in school and students that may have needed to self isolate or get tested, mixed freely in classes, yards etc and at home with their family and even extended family!

Then, all of a sudden, the school has 17 positive cases and the HSE wonder why!

Also, if the school were not told by the HSE, they were also clearly not told by the parents!!

school should sue parents

wirelessdude01

School in Kilkenny with 12 active cases as we speak and growing.

Blondini

Seems to be a strong burst of school cases coming in this afternoon and evening ..

wirelessdude01

expectationlost wrote: »

school should sue parents

Why? The HSE are the ones at fault as not following the system put in place.

ShamoBuc

Boggles wrote: »

HSE is supposed to contact the school not the parents.

How many principles have we heard from at this stage saying they have heard from parents but can't do anything until the HSE contact them.

Remember the school in Kerry that took the decision to close and was ordered to reopen.

When the sole focus is under the carpet brushing exercise from governance, confusion will reign.

Incorrect.

If a parent tells a principal that their child is positive, which is the prerogative of a parent- not an obligation, the principal Can contact the HSE.
The principal cannot contact any other parent Until the HSE allow them to do so following a detailed examination by the HSE that is done over the phone. This includes speaking to the teacher, pod information etc. The HSE then decide who can be contacted and the letter is then sent out. This is where the Kerry school got into trouble and were told to reopen as they didn't liaise with the HSE or rather were unhappy with the delay in communications with the HSE- which I can agree is shambolic at times.

If a principal knows a student has tested positive then you can be 100% certsin they would not have siblings of that student enter the school!

Glurrl

expectationlost wrote: »

https://www.rte.ie/news/coronavirus/2020/1126/1180714-cork-school-covid-19/ whats the principal getting at?

The school believes the spread of the virus was related to a number of cases identified in the wider community involving people connected with the school




Some parents where positive and still sent their children to school.

expectationlost

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Why? The HSE are the ones at fault as not following the system put in place.

if the parent put a positive child or close contact into school, there the ones that did it.

frank8211

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

School in Kilkenny with 12 active cases as we speak and growing.

And 6 more in a single school in Thurles, 15 minutes from the one in north Kilkenny,

expectationlost

how many students vs staff?

combat14

finally talk of publishing school numbers after vaccines announced


31 school students and staff test positive for Covid-19 in past week

https://www.rte.ie/news/education/2020/1127/1180776-coronavirus-schools/


A total of 8,439 children have tested positive for the virus since schools reopened, which brought the total number of recorded positive cases among children to 9,670



so this means that 1,241 (13%) children tested positive between march and august (about 5.5 months) when schools were closed and 8,439 (87%) children tested positive in the last 3 months when schools reopened - with all the consequent spread in the community and of course who knows how many asymptomatic cases as well.....


at last the department and Norma have left the truth out as to how extremely safe schools really are !!!

meeeeh

combat14 wrote: »

finally talk of publishing school numbers after vaccines announced


31 school students and staff test positive for Covid-19 in past week

https://www.rte.ie/news/education/2020/1127/1180776-coronavirus-schools/


A total of 8,439 children have tested positive for the virus since schools reopened, which brought the total number of recorded positive cases among children to 9,670



so this means that 1,241 (13%) children tested positive between march and august (about 5.5 months) when schools were closed and 8,439 (87%) children tested positive in the last 3 months when schools reopened - with all the consequent spread in the community and of course who knows how many asymptomatic cases as well.....


at last the department and Norma have left the truth out as to how extremely safe schools really are !!!

Did you check how many kids were tested when schools were closed and what was positivity rate? Or is that irrelevant nonsense and we can make conclusions comparing numbers when less people and less kids were tested because they weren't sick enough?

combat14

meeeeh wrote: »

Did you check how many kids were tested when schools were closed and what was positivity rate? Or is that irrelevant nonsense and we can make conclusions comparing numbers when less people and less kids were tested because they weren't sick enough?

these numbers refer to children who actually tested positive for this virus i.e. they were "sick enough" to test positive

a fairer comparison would be to also look at the total number of people who tested positive over the first 5.5 months when schools were closed vs the last 3 months when schools were open and compare the children stats against this data to see if there any differences or not when schools closed i.e. did 87% of all irish covid positive tests occur in the last 3 months or not .. if yes, schools being opened possibly made no difference to children safety

obviously there are more tests being conducted now, it is positive in one way and unfortunate that we need to test at all we should have went for a zero covid policy last summer when we had the chance...

Boggles

ShamoBuc wrote: »

Incorrect.

If a parent tells a principal that their child is positive, which is the prerogative of a parent- not an obligation, the principal Can contact the HSE.

Incorrect

We are notified of every case of Covid-19 including those who attend or work in schools. Our infection investigation and control teams then contact the school to carry out a Public Health Risk Assessment (PHRA) which will determine what actions are needed at that point to protect all. We review our PHRA as new information comes in

Public health advice comes solely from public health.

Or do you think the principals are being contrary about being in kept in the dark for the craic?

combat14

combat14 wrote: »

finally talk of publishing school numbers after vaccines announced


31 school students and staff test positive for Covid-19 in past week

https://www.rte.ie/news/education/2020/1127/1180776-coronavirus-schools/


A total of 8,439 children have tested positive for the virus since schools reopened, which brought the total number of recorded positive cases among children to 9,670



so this means that 1,241 (13%) children tested positive between march and august (about 5.5 months) when schools were closed and 8,439 (87%) children tested positive in the last 3 months when schools reopened - with all the consequent spread in the community and of course who knows how many asymptomatic cases as well.....


at last the department and Norma have left the truth out as to how extremely safe schools really are !!!

Its almost as if there was a relaxing in test criteria in August, especially for kids, which resulted in a massive sustained increase in testing in under 18's

c68zapdsm5i1ru

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Why? The HSE are the ones at fault as not following the system put in place.

It would appear they were misinformed as to whether the child was in school during the time they contracted Covid. A friend of mine is a teacher and they have been having problems with parents not being fully candid and open about things eg sending a child into school when another member of the household is awaiting results of a covid test.

Boggles

Joy Big Tailgate wrote: »

It would appear they were misinformed as to whether the child was in school during the time they contracted Covid. A friend of mine is a teacher and they have been having problems with parents not being fully candid and open about things eg sending a child into school when another member of the household is awaiting results of a covid test.

HSE advice is to send the child / children of siblings in.

meeeeh

Boggles wrote: »

HSE advice is to send the child / children of siblings in.

No it's not. We were advised to keep both home. When the result was negative one could go back and the other one had to stay home until symptoms were gone.

Unless there is something I missed all advice to us was for family members to self isolate.

Boggles

meeeeh wrote: »

No it's not. We were advised to keep both home. When the result was negative one could go back and the other one had to stay home until symptoms were gone.

Unless there is something I missed all advice to us was for family members to self isolate.

Not what they told in Glanmire.

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/munster/arid-40089473.html

The current advice around siblings is a matter of concern for a lot of parents, she added. “One of my children was deemed a close contact. As far as the HSE guidelines are concerned, my other children could go to school as normal.

“I was worried that my son who was a close contact could pass something on to the other children and they could bring it into school so I kept them home. Even though they don’t mix in school, they are mixing at home.

“I just don’t understand how one child could be a close contact, and the other siblings aren’t because they are together constantly.”

wirelessdude01

Boggles wrote: »

HSE advice is to send the child / children of siblings in.

Not exactly true. If the family member is being tested due to being a close contact then they can still be sent to school.

If the family member is being tested due to symptoms then they should be kept at home.

Issue we are seeing in some schools is where kids have been tested and still being sent to school while awaiting the result.

jrosen

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Not exactly true. If the family member is being tested due to being a close contact then they can still be sent to school.

If the family member is being tested due to symptoms then they should be kept at home.

Issue we are seeing in some schools is where kids have been tested and still being sent to school while awaiting the result.

It’s really disgraceful behavior from the parents

meeeeh

combat14 wrote: »

these numbers refer to children who actually tested positive for this virus i.e. they were "sick enough" to test positive

a fairer comparison would be to also look at the total number of people who tested positive over the first 5.5 months when schools were closed vs the last 3 months when schools were open and compare the children stats against this data to see if there any differences or not when schools closed i.e. did 87% of all irish covid positive tests occur in the last 3 months or not .. if yes, schools being opened possibly made no difference to children safety

obviously there are more tests being conducted now, it is positive in one way and unfortunate that we need to test at all we should have went for a zero covid policy last summer when we had the chance...

I didn't say there is no difference. Children in spring were almost imprisoned, no playgrounds were open and no sports activities. They mingle much more now so transmissions will be higher just not high enough to worry about schools.

However at the end of April 40k tests per week were done and criteria for testing was different. I think it's clear first wave was much worse here than second wave (unlike in big parts of Central Europe which dealt with first wave well and got cocky) and less testing was done. I dislike comparisons which don't take test rate and criteria into account. Health minister was guilty of that too when he announced that deaths among those testing positive is 90% down in comparisons to spring and forgot to mention that asymptomatic people are tested now and in spring only people with whole plethora of symptoms were tested.

Boggles

wirelessdude01 wrote: »

Not exactly true. If the family member is being tested due to being a close contact then they can still be sent to school.

If the family member is being tested due to symptoms then they should be kept at home.

Issue we are seeing in some schools is where kids have been tested and still being sent to school while awaiting the result.

Yes you are 100% correct if someone is symptomatic, family have to restrict movements, I was thinking in terms of close contacts identification in schools, siblings still attend.

AFAIK most of the positive cases in Glanmire have been asymptomatic.

As for kids being sent in awaiting a test, the parents should be shot out of a cannon.

JimmyVik

More and more parents going to their own GPs when they hear of a positive case in their childs school.
HSE wont test them so they are going to their local GPs.
I know a good few personally who have done this now.

Am I getting this wrong here?
Over 11% of all known positive covid cases since the virus began in Ireland in March are from children since September?

wirelessdude01

jrosen wrote: »

It’s really disgraceful behavior from the parents

A principal I know told me the other day about how they got a call around lunch to say that a child(who was in school at the time) had just received a positive case. Parent wanted to leave them in school and collect them as usual at the end of the day. Some people just haven't a clue and/or don't care at all.

Said child was quickly dispatched to the isolation area but because of the actions of that parent 28 students and 3 members of staff all had to be tested. Haven't heard the results yet as this only happened a day or so ago.

Boggles

Boggles wrote: »

Yes you are 100% correct if someone is symptomatic, family have to restrict movements, I was thinking in terms of close contacts identification in schools, siblings still attend.

AFAIK most of the positive cases in Glanmire have been asymptomatic.

As for kids being sent in awaiting a test, the parents should be shot out of a cannon.

Secondary contacts - you have at least 7 to 10 days from when the primary contact is made with the index case until the secondary contacts would become infectious so in general the Primary contact should have been tested before it becomes an issue

Boggles

Deleted User wrote: »

Secondary contacts - you have at least 7 to 10 days from when the primary contact is made with the index case until the secondary contacts would become infectious so in general the Primary contact should have been tested before it becomes an issue

Obviously didn't happen in this glaring example, did it?

Boggles

A total of 2,384 students and staff underwent testing for Covid-19 at 147 schools around the country last week, with 31 people, or 1.3% of the total, found to have the virus.

With regard to children in general, 625 people under the age of 18 tested positive for the virus last week.

I'm not going to say doorbells, because I will be accused of being aligned with Trump or Mary Lou.

But where in the name of fúck are all those kids picking it up from?

Mummy / Daddy / Guardians no longer can go to the pub / restaurant / gym / hair dresser, etc.

Everywhere else they wear a mask.

It's a very curious situation that would at least warrant even the most courtesy of investigation by public health.

meeeeh

Boggles wrote: »

I'm not going to say doorbells, because I will be accused of being aligned with Trump or Mary Lou.

But where in the name of fúck are all those kids picking it up from?

Mummy / Daddy / Guardians no longer can go to the pub / restaurant / gym / hair dresser, etc.

Everywhere else they wear a mask.

It's a very curious situation that would at least warrant even the most courtesy of investigation by public health.

The two adult cases I know - one was picked up at a party and the other one was picked visiting someone who was waiting for a test. Both during level 5. Another one I know of was at GAA training.

People still go to work and people clearly ignore the restrictions. There are two of the sources that you can research.

Unless you think parents of school going kids somehow magically don't break the rules or work.

jrosen

I know from my area I see people mingle all the time. Cars regularly popping up visiting, kids are out. Sleep overs are happening, car pooling still going on. I see kids (well early teens) all the time at my local tesco just hanging out. Playground are open, sports are back.

This level 5 is nothing like previous.

I know friends who are having dinner parties, birthday parties. I think for some people they are living their life

Boggles

meeeeh wrote: »

Another one I know of was at GAA training.

Outside with strict pods?

Curiouser and Curiouser.

meeeeh

Boggles wrote: »

Outside with strict pods?

Curiouser and Curiouser.

I don't know some county stuff or something (I'm not sure it was training but it was team mates). If you want to ban GAA because of that you are welcome.

HerrKuehn

Boggles wrote: »

Outside with strict pods?

Curiouser and Curiouser.

The parent was a health care worker in the case I know of.