Trump vs Biden 2020, Ultimate battle for the fate of our universe (pt 3)Read OP 01/11

Overheal

thebestwords wrote: »

In my opinion, the first real crisis was the dossier being published right before he got into office which was no fault of his own.

Your definition of a crisis varies wildly from mine. The dossier is a political beltway story, a crisis is a natural disaster, a pandemic, a military altercation, life and death, etc.

What's the difference?

You're aware.

Material was handed over and a news report was based on it citing the key details down to the cent on how much tax he paid.

Was the material hacked?

The emails shown in the NYP aren't the originals either.

That's been well established, with the authenticity of them being acutely in doubt.

Overheal

Something a bit more real now,

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pMEZzNZgDZQ

This is a recorded phonecall from Senator Ben Sasse to to constituent(s)

“The way he kisses dictators’ butts. I mean, the way he ignores the Uighurs, our literal concentration camps in Xinjiang. Right now, he hasn’t lifted a finger on behalf of the Hong-Kongers,” Sasse said.

“The United States now regularly sells out our allies under his leadership, the way he treats women, spends like a drunken sailor. The ways I criticize President Obama for that kind of spending; I’ve criticized President Trump for as well. He mocks evangelicals behind closed doors. His family has treated the presidency like a business opportunity. He’s flirted with white supremacists.”

In the call with voters, Sasse also bashed the president’s coronavirus response, claiming that Trump refused to take the pandemic seriously, and instead treated it like a public relations issue.

“In his partial defense here, I think that lots of the news media has pretended that COVID is literally the first public health crisis ever. And somehow, it’s Donald Trump’s fault. That’s not true. They just wanted to use it against him,” Sasse said in the call. “But the reality is that he careened from curb to curb. First, he ignored COVID. And then he went into full economic shutdown mode. He was the one who said 10 to 14 days of shutdown would fix this. And that was always wrong. I mean, and so I don’t think the way he’s lead through COVID has been reasonable or responsible, or right.”

The senator also reportedly told his constituents that he’s worried the president’s actions could push the Senate to a Democratic majority and lead to permanent damage to the Republican party.

“I don’t know how many more times we can shout this: Even though the Beltway is obsessing exclusively about the presidential race, control of the Senate is ten times more important,” Sasse spokesman James Wegmann said in a statement to the Washington Examiner. “The fragile Senate seats that will determine whether Democrats nuke the Senate are the races Ben cares about, the races he’s working on, and the only races he’s talking about.”

https://www.mediaite.com/trump/listen-gop-sen-ben-sasse-absolutely-torches-trump-on-call-with-voters-says-he-kisses-dictators-butts-and-flirted-with-white-supremacists/https://www.mediaite.com/trump/listen-gop-sen-ben-sasse-absolutely-torches-trump-on-call-with-voters-says-he-kisses-dictators-butts-and-flirted-with-white-supremacists/

thebestwords

Overheal wrote: »

You're aware.

Moot point - I don't argue in semantics. They already published entire filings from previous years, just because they omit the actual document itself and write down what it contains in text doesn't matter a dickybird.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2016/10/01/us/politics/donald-trump-taxes.html

Tell me how

Gretas Gonna Get Ya! wrote: »

Fake news!

It's in the bag for the Donald.

Very few Americans actually believe a Biden administration is going to do a better job bringing the economy back than Trump.

Wasn't there a poll recently, saying that 56% of Americans thought they were better off now economically (in a pandemic & recession) than under the Obama/Biden admin...!?

I don't put much stock in polls, but many people do... and that's quite a stark opinion tbh.

'Some say'
'I've heard'
'I'm told'
'They're telling me'

All disclaimers to allow Trump to deny that he was lying. We can definitely see how his rhetoric is being echoed by many arguing his cause.

thebestwords

Second debate moderator, former intern to Joe Biden, suspended from C-SPAN for lying. He's claimed he was hacked multiple times in the past too.

https://twitter.com/brianstelter/status/1316836910833324032

C-SPAN said Thursday that Steve Scully, the network's senior executive producer and political editor, has been placed on "administrative leave" for lying about being hacked earlier this month.

Scully admitted to "errors in judgement" and apologized in a statement.

Overheal

thebestwords wrote: »

Second debate moderator, former intern to Joe Biden, suspended from C-SPAN for lying. He's claimed he was hacked multiple times in the past too.

https://twitter.com/brianstelter/status/1316836910833324032

C-SPAN said Thursday that Steve Scully, the network's senior executive producer and political editor, has been placed on "administrative leave" for lying about being hacked earlier this month.

Scully admitted to "errors in judgement" and apologized in a statement.

A fall from grace for The Most Patient Man on Television.

mcmoustache

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

he second debate was cancelled because trump pulled out.

That someone needs to be corrected on that basic fact demonstrates the stark difference between the pro-trump disinformation bubble and reality.

francois

thebestwords wrote: »

Second debate moderator, former intern to Joe Biden, suspended from C-SPAN for lying. He's claimed he was hacked multiple times in the past too.

https://twitter.com/brianstelter/status/1316836910833324032

C-SPAN said Thursday that Steve Scully, the network's senior executive producer and political editor, has been placed on "administrative leave" for lying about being hacked earlier this month.

Scully admitted to "errors in judgement" and apologized in a statement.

***nobody cares klaxon***

mcmoustache

francois wrote: »

***nobody cares klaxon***

Yeah but this could be the end of his presidential campaign.

Gretas Gonna Get Ya!

Tell me how wrote: »

'Some say'
'I've heard'
'I'm told'
'They're telling me'

All disclaimers to allow Trump to deny that he was lying. We can definitely see how his rhetoric is being echoed by many arguing his cause.

Riiiiight... you win the internet for tonight, kiddo!

Anywho, what's your stance on opinion polls?

Do you think 56% of Americans think they're better off right now economically?

Overheal

Gretas Gonna Get Ya! wrote: »

Riiiiight... you win the internet for tonight, kiddo!

Anywho, what's your stance on opinion polls?

Do you think 56% of Americans think they're better off right now economically?

Do you have a link to this poll or is this you “just asking questions”

eagle eye

Overheal wrote:

How is THAT an answer to the question YOU quoted?

Well I'm not doing the 'he hit me first' thing like a child does.

Gretas Gonna Get Ya!

Overheal wrote: »

Do you have a link to this poll or is this you “just asking questions”

Can't be arsed looking for it tbh. Think it's called gallup poll or something, trump tweeted it a few days ago.

You can google it if you want.

But I'm sure you'll pick out some irrelevant nonsense that disqualifies it in your own mind... such is the nature of this thread.

Like I said, pretty much no-one on this thread is here to have their minds changed on anything. That's clearly not what any of these "discussions" are about. I think you mentioned it yourself "d!ck measuring"... that's basically all this thread amounts to for the most part.

Still a fun read all the same! :pac:

Chris_Heilong

thebestwords wrote: »

I care about censorship - I'm sure people in countries like China controlled by the CCP do too.

Propaganda, nationalism and a content life keeps most of the Chinese people from realizing that censorship exists at all until someone crosses a line then it is instant regret.

Overheal

Gretas Gonna Get Ya! wrote: »

Can't be arsed looking for it tbh. Think it's called gallup poll or something, trump tweeted it a few days ago.

You can google it if you want.

So this one that didn't ask them if they were better off economically?



It just asks the respondent if they are "better off."

I am better off than I was 4 years ago, all for reasons that have nothing to do with policy changes in government, like having adopted more cats, or having additively more work experience.

So it doesn't really say way you appear to have thought it said, though since you aren't convinced anyone here is able to change their mind I presume you will still argue this question somehow specified their view on the economy.

Gretas Gonna Get Ya!

Overheal wrote: »

It just asks the respondent if they are "better off."

I am better off than I was 4 years ago, all for reasons that have nothing to do with policy changes in government, like having adopted more cats, or having additively more work experience.

So it doesn't really say way you appear to have thought it said, though since you aren't convinced anyone here is able to change their mind I presume you will still argue this question somehow specified their view on the economy.

I was pretty sure the one I read said economically... but anyway.

Yeah, I'm sure people are talking about their cats! :rolleyes:

Be honest with yourself Overheal... you're not here to have your mind changed. Like most people, you're here to try and score silly points off people you consider to be on the wrong side of the fence on this thing. "Gotcha" moments!

Two sides firmly stuck in their trenches, just lobbing grenades at each other... in a stalemate. No ground gained or given by practically anyone from what I can see.

Of course when people get likes on their posts, they think they're gaining ground... but it's the same small group of people liking each other's posts. What use is that? Just preaching to the converted.

the immortals

Overheal wrote: »

So this one that didn't ask them if they were better off economically?



It just asks the respondent if they are "better off."

I am better off than I was 4 years ago, all for reasons that have nothing to do with policy changes in government, like having adopted more cats, or having additively more work experience.

So it doesn't really say way you appear to have thought it said, though since you aren't convinced anyone here is able to change their mind I presume you will still argue this question somehow specified their view on the economy.

What a ridiculous reply, if you're asked by anyone "are you better off than you were 4 years ago" any normal person would answer referring to their financial situation

thebestwords

https://twitter.com/TheBabylonBee/status/1316830275389861888

osarusan

Overheal wrote: »

Covid, wildfires, saving lives >> 5% better returns on my 401k

There is a cohort of voters for whom this is the case though. Yeah sure, that other stuff is important, but their bank account is more important. They may hold their nose as they vote Trump, but they will vote Trump. We all know this.

There's also the cohort who think he is some kind of messianistic bastion against liberalism/socialism/eradication of the straight white male. There's also the cohort who just vote Republican no matter what, or no matter who the candidate is.

He has certain types of votes in the bag, just as all candidates do.

The problem is that there's very unlikely to be anybody else. There is a cohort of voters who gave him a chance 4 years ago, thought he might be something different, or whatever motivation they had. Of those people who gave him a chance, how many will do so again? How many wil think 'yeah, over the last 4 years, he has delivered what i was looking for?'

I think it will only be a small percentage. And I don't buy into the argument that Republican voters are a bunch of unthinking neanderthals - there will be Republican-leaning voters who are disgusted by him and his actions, and will either vote for Biden or not vote at all.

Overheal

the immortals wrote: »

What a ridiculous reply, if you're asked by anyone "are you better off than you were 4 years ago" any normal person would answer referring to their financial situation

What's your proof for that statement?

Family member meets you at the holiday gathering. Hey Immortals how are you doing these days? "Oh yeah I'm great, nothing to do with getting engaged to my fiance and we're having a boy etc. but my tech portfolio KILLED it on the stock market."

Some random person asks polling questions on the phone, there's no room for nuance. The question is what it is: are you better off than you were 4 years ago?

hetuzozaho

thebestwords wrote: »

Its behind a pay wall but the key details were yes

Do you have a link to the paywalled documents?

thebestwords

hetuzozaho wrote: »

Do you have a link to the paywalled documents?

Can you get to the point you're trying to make?

Just because they didn't provide direct access to the filings it's somehow different? The story itself says they obtained a decades worth of his tax filings and they published all the key details and they've published direct links to previous tax returns of Trumps in the past.

This is the title of the piece. "The Times obtained Donald Trump’s tax information extending over more than two decades, revealing struggling properties, vast write-offs, an audit battle and hundreds of millions in debt coming due."

Semantics man.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2016/10/01/us/politics/donald-trump-taxes.html

Gretas Gonna Get Ya!

Overheal wrote: »

What's your proof for that statement?

Family member meets you at the holiday gathering. Hey Immortals how are you doing these days? "Oh yeah I'm great, nothing to do with getting engaged to my fiance and we're having a boy etc. but my tech portfolio KILLED it on the stock market."

Some random person asks polling questions on the phone, there's no room for nuance. The question is what it is: are you better off than you were 4 years ago?

Translation: "Trump is bad for America - therefore the only factors I will entertain with regards to positive results in this poll, are anything and everything that doesn't include praise for Trump!"

Even adopting cats! :pac:

Overheal

Gretas Gonna Get Ya! wrote: »

:pac:

You're talking gibberish at this stage, because your argument is indefensible.

Fact is there is no resolution from the poll as to why those asked said they were better off, whether they were for economic reasons, lifestyle reasons, personal life events like getting married or having a child, moving to a different home address, leaving a toxic relationship, earning a degree, etc.

All we know is, that when asked, 56% of people asked said they were better off. No specifics were asked, no specifics were given.

hetuzozaho

thebestwords wrote: »

Can you get to the point you're trying to make?

Well I was interested in seeing the documents you brought up. I didn't think they had been published but assumed I'd missed them.

thebestwords wrote: »

Just because they didn't provide direct access to the filings it's somehow different? [/url]

I'm thinking maybe yeah? I dunno, just chatting! Why so defensive?

Maybe Twitter are taking some new stance on it. Like if they discussed an illegally obtained copy of an upcoming Radiohead album or if they discussed and linked to an illegally obtained copy of an upcoming Radiohead album

Also you can't just say stuff and not expect to be questioned on it! You said they were published, why say that if they didn't?

thebestwords

hetuzozaho wrote: »

Also you can't just say stuff and not expect to be questioned on it! You said they were published, why say that if they didn't?

Because it's dealing in semantics, they published the key findings or bottom line of what he paid in tax down to the cent. In my mind I can't differentiate between the two, the source material was still obtained somewhere down the line illegally.

Sorry if I come across defensive - to me it's just the classic debating stance of clinging to some benign point trying to discredit the overall comparison.

drunkmonkey

Overheal wrote: »

Do you have a link to this poll or is this you “just asking questions”

Surprised you missed it...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XLRspfP_t9Y

Kidchameleon

I think today above all else has highlighted the hypocrisy and double standards of much of the mainstream media and some of those on the left. If it were Trump in Bidens shoes the situation would be getting wall to wall coverage the world over. I have not seen a peep about this in any news outlet or paper despite there being very strong evidence. There was infinity more coverage of the 'losers' comment despite there being no hard evidence. Anyone who does not question weather they have been brainwashed to some extent about Trump after today's revelations needs to take a good hard look at themselves. The media are in the democrats pocket, it is blatantly obvious and to deny it is disingenuous. It has been hilarious to see some of the squirming going on today, its just a small preview of what is to come when Trump gets his second term, I cannot wait, its going to be EPIC! And believe me, Biden is toast, there is more to this story to come (not that I ever thought he had any chance anyway) He is nothing more than a corrupt old man. Bye bye Joey or should I say "the big guy"!

hetuzozaho

thebestwords wrote: »

Because it's dealing in semantics, they published the key findings or bottom line of what he paid in tax down to the cent. In my mind I can't differentiate between the two, the source material was still obtained somewhere down the line illegally.

Sorry if I come across defensive - to me it's just the classic debating stance of clinging to some benign point trying to discredit the comparison.

I wasn't even trying to debate though. I'm not trying to stick up for Twitter or say they are not bias or whatever. No doubt Twitter is bias, we all are. I'd also imagine they dislike Trump, and I do too. So maybe no point in my opinion!

But you stated the documents were published and that interested me, as that comparison you made genuinely interested me. However I personally feel there is a difference in linking to say hacked photos, as opposed to discussing them to a the detail of what is in the photo. I don't think it's semantics.

You often see it with photos hacked over the years, sites may discuss the hacking but not link to the images.

Twitter saying they don't want to link to these hacked Biden images. Kinda gives them an excuse for me, until they trip up again ha

timsey tiger

drunkmonkey wrote: »

Surprised you missed it...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XLRspfP_t9Y

Some indictment of Trump there. Dispite 56% of Americans being better off, even with the pandemic, he's still 10% behind in the polls to a guy who can't even make it past noon most days. He must have really pissed them off somehow :rolleyes: