What is the actual rationale for keeping people inside their counties?

Mules

I live in one county and work in another. Does that mean I dont have to go to work?

Parabellum9

completedit wrote: »

I think these restrictions are always to hopefully get the highest number of people on board. Like the way some people were happy to go abroad while others complied fully. In your scenario, nobody is going to do anything to the person circumventing the rules. They just want to create a stigma to doing it and hope people comply

They are not getting anybody onboard, and there is no stigma to if. A lot of people bought in to this stuff back in March and April to help “flatten the curve” - 6/7 months later the same people are apathetic. The “we’re all in this together” nonsense has been outed as bull**** with the golfgate scandal so why would they expect people to just roll over and accept the status quo again?

Uncle Pierre

Uncle Pierre wrote: »

Am not the OP but would suggest myself that a better way would be to put an overall limit on the distance you can travel from home. Would hazard a guess that in even the most remote part of the country, something like a 40km limit would still allow you access to all essentials such as a supermarket, doctor, etc.

Doing it purely by county boundaries is far too inconsistent. Driving from the end of West Cork to somewhere like Youghal in East Cork is something like 175km.

Even in my own county of Wexford, a trip like Duncannon to Gorey is about 85km, and that's perfectly permissible too.

But next door to us in County Carlow, it's only about 25km to go the full length of the county from Kildavin at one end to Carlow town at the other.

So, you could start in Kildavin, drive just 30km, and be breaking the rules. Yet if you started from somewhere else in a larger county, you could drive up to six times that distance, and be doing nothing wrong. That makes no sense.

Your idea doesn’t make sense. If everyone had a 40km limit, the virus could Still travel quickly across the country.

The idea behind being restricted to your county is to stop the virus travelling across the country, from one county to the next, and so on . It’s not a perfect system but it’s better than nothing.

It’s the same with all the different rules, they are not perfect, but the idea is to limit transmission as much as possible without us all confined to our houses.

Mules

Mules wrote: »

I live in one county and work in another. Does that mean I dont have to go to work?

If you have to physically be in your workplace you can go.

LAZYIRISH

LAZYIRISH wrote: »

Does it not worry anyone how money is wasted on this pandemic or on these pointless checkpoints. Can anyone explain to me What is the actual point of these checkpoints and why only in Dublin?

The point is that we simply can’t be trusted.
Why Dublin, highest concentration of people I would imagine and a lot of positive cases. Can’t police everywhere so may as well police the most liable county. Also Dublin airport/port

a148pro

Deleted User wrote: »

Your idea doesn’t make sense. If everyone had a 40km limit, the virus could Still travel quickly across the country.

The idea behind being restricted to your county is to stop the virus travelling across the country, from one county to the next, and so on . It’s not a perfect system but it’s better than nothing.

It’s the same with all the different rules, they are not perfect, but the idea is to limit transmission as much as possible without us all confined to our houses.

I'm sorry, but what are you talking about? The virus is already across the country. This isn't a situation where its only in Dublin or Galway or something. It isn't travelling "from one county to the next" its travelling from one person to the next, within counties. Its already out of the box.

I think I heard this week that Kerry has low numbers. Incidentally, that should really be telling us something because its probably the busiest staycation county in Ireland, and yet the numbers are low. But if the restrictions were protecting Kerry, or another county with low numbers then that's fine, I'd support them, as I'm sure would the people of Kerry. But they're not.

If you have two population groups with roughly equivalent levels of the virus in each then there is no argument for preventing someone travelling from one to the other. None.

a148pro

a148pro wrote: »

I'm sorry, but what are you talking about? The virus is already across the country. This isn't a situation where its only in Dublin or Galway or something. It isn't travelling "from one county to the next" its travelling from one person to the next, within counties. Its already out of the box.

I think I heard this week that Kerry has low numbers. Incidentally, that should really be telling us something because its probably the busiest staycation county in Ireland, and yet the numbers are low. But if the restrictions were protecting Kerry, or another county with low numbers then that's fine, I'd support them, as I'm sure would the people of Kerry. But they're not.

If you have two population groups with roughly equivalent levels of the virus in each then there is no argument for preventing someone travelling from one to the other. None.

Of course it’s already out of the box, that why we are trying to contain it. So easier for each county and their population to try and deal with containment locally, as opposed to a free for all with people from different counties travelling all around he country.

Huge amount of cases in Dublin. Should we still be allowed travel all around Ireland. Do you not see the danger, or does it not matter as there are already cases around the country. Of course it matters

a148pro

a148pro wrote: »

I'm sorry, but what are you talking about? The virus is already across the country. This isn't a situation where its only in Dublin or Galway or something. It isn't travelling "from one county to the next" its travelling from one person to the next, within counties. Its already out of the box.

I think I heard this week that Kerry has low numbers. Incidentally, that should really be telling us something because its probably the busiest staycation county in Ireland, and yet the numbers are low. But if the restrictions were protecting Kerry, or another county with low numbers then that's fine, I'd support them, as I'm sure would the people of Kerry. But they're not.

If you have two population groups with roughly equivalent levels of the virus in each then there is no argument for preventing someone travelling from one to the other. None.

Which is why they are now trying to restrict movement. It's not rocket science!
The biggest issue is the border with northern Ireland, they need to restrict that, quickly, lockdown the.crossings now!

Multipass

There is no rationale. Everything they are doing now - everything - is to distract from the incompetents running the hospitals.

Multipass

Multipass wrote: »

There is no rationale. Everything they are doing now - everything - is to distract from the incompetents running the hospitals.

You’re right , there is no rationale in your post

NewRed2

a148pro wrote: »

I mean this was implicit in the Garda approach this week. It wasn't you are going to be caught breaching the guidelines. It was we are going to make it so inconvenient you won't want to.

I actually thought it was astonishing. A public servant saying that they were going to block the roads to make people's lives difficult.

Disgrace what happened this week. Theres not much that surprises me anymore in this country but the Gardaí this week deliberately preventing people getting to work on time was something truly special.
How on earth was this allowed to happen?
Who decided this was ok?

There were tailbacks Monday morning that lasted hours and hours. Trucks, vans, etc all just trying to go to work.

The damage they did cost companies tens of thousands.

Why was this allowed to happen? And what was the upside of it? Who did it help?

An utter disgrace.

The government decided that was to happen.
It was disgraceful, putting gardai out on the roads, disrupting decent.people.going to and from work.
Terrible.
I would advise complaints to your local, TDs, Superintendents and Chief Superintendents.
No point complaining to the guard on the road, he has no say and no-one listens to his complaints.

amadangomor

I agree totally with sensible restrictions but where I live restricting crossing county boundaries does not make sense at all.

The other side of my town where all the shops are located are in another county.

Where I go for exercise in nature which is essential for having good mental health is about 7km away. I have to cross a dogleg of one county and then cross barely into another county. I have no problem doing this as I'm not increasing the risk of spread of Covid 19 by doing this.

It is my hinterland and makes sense to do things in my locality even though I am crossing county boundaries. Strange that I am breaching regulations twice going 7km when I could go 70km to the other side of the county and not be breaching them at all.

NewRed2

bubblypop wrote: »

The government decided that was to happen.
It was disgraceful, putting gardai out on the roads, disrupting decent.people.going to and from work.
Terrible.
I would advise complaints to your local, TDs, Superintendents and Chief Superintendents.
No point complaining to the guard on the road, he has no say and no-one listens to his complaints.

So the government who keep saying they want to help businesses stay afloat and cannot go to level-5 because of businesses told the guards to cripple the same businesses by preventing everyone going to work?
The same government who said they had to reduce subsidies and PUP thought it would be a good idea to make the Gardaí strangle the N7 into and out of Dublin during rush hour?
The government who said all along that schools were top priority and now about to ask schools to stay shut for an extra week over mid term?
Wow, we're in safe hands here aren't we?

The damage caused by the guard checkpoints over the last few days alone must be in the millions.
Genius stuff. And all for what? What did it achieve? Aside from hurting the very businesses they pretend to protect.

One haulage form alone said they lost 100k for late deliveries. Why? Guards waving sticks. We're borderline old soviet state now.

NewRed2

NewRed2 wrote: »

So the government who keep saying they want to help businesses stay afloat and cannot go to level-5 because of businesses told the guards to cripple the same businesses by preventing everyone going to work?
The same government who said they had to reduce subsidies and PUP thought it would be a good idea to make the Gardaí strangle the N7 into and out of Dublin during rush hour?
The government who said all along that schools were top priority and now about to ask schools to stay shut for an extra week over mid term?
Wow, we're in safe hands here aren't we?

The damage caused by the guard checkpoints over the last few days alone must be in the millions.
Genius stuff. And all for what? What did it achieve? Aside from hurting the very businesses they pretend to protect.

One haulage form alone said they lost 100k for late deliveries. Why? Guards waving sticks. We're borderline old soviet state now.

Yep.
I agree

amadangomor

Mules wrote: »

I live in one county and work in another. Does that mean I dont have to go to work?

March 2020 called and wants it's question back :pac:

Irish Aris

amadangomor wrote: »

I agree totally with sensible restrictions but where I live restricting crossing county boundaries does not make sense at all.

The other side of my town where all the shops are located are in another county.

Where I go for exercise in nature which is essential for having good mental health is about 7km away. I have to cross a dogleg of one county and then cross barely into another county. I have no problem doing this as I'm not increasing the risk of spread of Covid 19 by doing this.

It is my hinterland and makes sense to do things in my locality even though I am crossing county boundaries. Strange that I am breaching regulations twice going 7km when I could go 70km to the other side of the county and not be breaching them at all.

It is the same for me, 50 meters from the county border, I can actually see the fence that works as the border between the counties. Most of the shops are on the other side. There have never been any guards in the border.
I think I will exercise common sense. In any case I think essential shopping and medical appointments are exempt from the restrictions.

amadangomor

Irish Aris wrote: »

It is the same for me, 50 meters from the county border, I can actually see the fence that works as the border between the counties. Most of the shops are on the other side. There have never been any guards in the border.
I think I will exercise common sense. In any case I think essential shopping and medical appointments are exempt from the restrictions.

My workplace is 40km away but in the same county where I go for outdoor exercise 7km away.

So my attitude is that I'm expected to go to work in that county to be surrounded by 5000 other people in my workplace ( with a few outbreaks).

So feck it I should be allowed in that county in my down time to be in the open for an hour or two.

440Hertz

There’s only so much granularity we can have in Ireland or anywhere. Counties are the only subdivision we have and the boundaries are locally known and on many roads they’ve also signposted.

It’s not ideal, for example Cork should probably have a restriction preventing flow in and out of the city as the county is half the size of Northern Ireland, while the opposite is the case in say Louth which is tiny. It probably makes little sense in Leitrim due to the strange elongated shape of the place and there are two cities : Limerick and Waterford located on county lines, as well as towns like Athlone.

So it’s not perfect but it’s the best we can do and I assume it will be enforced with some degree of cop on.

auspicious

It's like scrabbling around in the dark for a lost contact lens.
Boundaries were drawn up 500 years ago. We have to adhere to the old ways. Don't we?

amadangomor

amadangomor wrote: »

March 2020 called and wants it's question back :pac:

This is the first thing I have laughed at today. I sincerely thank you :-)

auspicious

auspicious wrote: »

It's like scrabbling around in the dark for a lost contact lens.
Boundaries were drawn up 500 years ago. We have to adhere to the old ways. Don't we?

It’s the simplest rule to have. Most idiots should be able to understand what staying in your county means.
It’s also the simplest rule to police.
How else should the government try and restrict people’s movement while still letting us out of our houses

What is hard to grasp about this

Mules

amadangomor wrote: »

March 2020 called and wants it's question back :pac:

Tbh I've never followed the news on covid. I know it sounds odd but I'm not really interested. There is a lot of hysteria about it. I saw a programme on rte the other night about kids going back to school and the mother was in floods of tears in case her kids were going to die. It seems ridiculous. That attitude is terrible for the kids too.

Remember back when ebola was in west Africa
and the death rate was up to 80%, the poor people there had nothing like the precautions we have for covid. I think the big reaction to covid is because it is affecting people in first world countries. In saying that I enjoyed the lockdown as I have a bit of land and was allowed drive to feed animals and the weather was good so I got lots of jobs done.. I had also finished up a very stressful job so enjoyed the peace and quiet.

a148pro

[Deleted User] wrote: »

It’s the simplest rule to have. Most idiots should be able to understand what staying in your county means.

But do most idiots understand why it makes sense to keep people in their counties? Because I still don't.

Hoboo

a148pro wrote: »

But do most idiots understand why it makes sense to keep people in their counties? Because I still don't.

Probably just best to let it go then me oul flower, not everyone can understand everything, but that's ok, we are all special.

BrianD3

It is typical of our inept and dishonest authorities to impose something like this. I don't know if Simon Harris said what he has been quoted as saying in this thread, if he did that shows the mentality.

Stay in county restriction is a half arsed yet disruptive measure to make it look like something is being done. It also takes advantage of many people's parochial nature "it's not us spreading the virus it's THOSE OTHER PEOPLE in that county/townland/parish". Another scapegoat to add to the list.

There may also be an element of people living in counties with large urban areas not having any need to leave their counties due to the facilities available to them and thinking everywhere is the same.

Where is the evidence that crossing arbitrary county boundaries in a situation where, as we keep being told, every county has a problem, is a significant factor in spreading the virus. Now if someone crosses a county boundary and attends, say, a wedding with poor physical distancing and the result is a super spreader outbreak, the issue is the wedding not the crossing of the county boundary. But of course it is easier to plonk a checkpoint at a county boundary than identify and tackle an actual issue.

Multipass

BrianD3 wrote: »

It is typical of our inept and dishonest authorities to impose something like this. I don't know if Simon Harris said what he has been quoted as saying in this thread, if he did that shows the mentality.

Stay in county restriction is a half arsed yet disruptive measure to make it look like something is being done. It also takes advantage of many people's parochial nature "it's not us spreading the virus it's THOSE OTHER PEOPLE in that county/townland/parish". Another scapegoat to add to the list.

There may also be an element of people living in counties with large urban areas not having any need to leave their counties due to the facilities available to them and thinking everywhere is the same.

Where is the evidence that crossing arbitrary county boundaries in a situation where, as we keep being told, every county has a problem, is a significant factor in spreading the virus. Now if someone crosses a county boundary and attends, say, a wedding with poor physical distancing and the result is a super spreader outbreak, the issue is the wedding not the crossing of the county boundary. But of course it is easier to plonk a checkpoint at a county boundary than identify and tackle an actual issue.

Agreed, they already have limits on the numbers gathering - where they come from is irrelevant since Covid is already nationwide. Most people I know who are crossing county boundaries are doing so to be out in nature - to get to the hills, lakes, woods. Exactly what people need to do for their health. I obeyed in March, not this time around.

Gods Gift

Crossing county borders is ok as long as you don’t get out and start licking people, get into the car and drive home again. Drive by lickings= bad.

a148pro

Gods Gift wrote: »

Crossing county borders is ok as long as you don’t get out and start licking people, get into the car and drive home again. Drive by lickings= bad.

Absolutely superb. You're in charge from now on.

Downlinz

The problem is that our boundaries don't make much sense to the way we live and work.

Ennis, Shannon and Nenagh are satellite towns of Limerick, people commonly travel between the areas for work, shopping and leisure, they even by the previous government began to share the shame emergency ward facilities as both Ennis and Nenagh hospitals were downgraded and funneled into Limerick.

It's not practical to tell someone living in Shannon that they can't travel to Limerick down the road but can travel across the county to Lisdoonvarna, a place they likely have little connection with. It's actually counter intuitive to managing spread since if followed it would divert people from their normal behaviour into mixing with communities they wouldn't otherwise.