FF/FG/Green Government - part 2

Whatisthisnow

Bishop of hope wrote: »

Yeah, Cavan and Monaghan have a beautiful coastline.

Loads of counties have no coastlines

Finty Lemon

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Now can you answer the question:

What has the current government done within the international agreements pertaining to these islands about securing the 'whole' island?

If you can lay it out in bullet points in your answer that would be good.

That's Article 2 you copied there, read Article 3 as I suggested.

In relation to your question, the Dept of the Taoiseach understands that the prospect of an All Island lockdown will not be entertained by the DUP. There has been contact on numerous occasions in this regard, including meetings with First Minister Foster and the Deputy First Minister O’Neill on eight occasions in the latter half of 2020.
Since the North-South Ministerial Council meeting in December there has been a call with both on December 13th and separate calls to the two women last on January 25th. Mr Martin also keeps a private channel of communication open to Mrs Foster.

But there are no substantive discussions on an agreed approach that would devise a single Covid policy for the island. The most that can or will be achieved is some degree of alignment, in which the two administrations adopt similar approaches to lockdown, etc. But a one-island approach is not on the cards, according to people with knowledge of the policy.

Finty Lemon

Bishop of hope wrote: »

Yeah, Cavan and Monaghan have a beautiful coastline.

They don't have a coastline. But they do have a border to a separate jurisdiction on the island, rendering the ROI not technically an island but of course on an island.

A shared island, by consent of the majority of the residents of said island

James Brown

Whatisthisnow wrote: »

Loads of counties have no coastlines

West Meath must be part of the Prussian Empire or an illusion.
If I renounce my Irish citizenship and become Spanish, does that make my house a casa?

Confused Irish people pining for the British Empire days who don't like the Irish language nor recognise the island or Ireland, defend and commemorate foreign criminal groups want your vote next election so they can govern... :rolleyes:

James Brown

Finty Lemon wrote: »

They don't have a coastline. But they do have a border to a separate jurisdiction on the island, rendering the ROI not technically an island but of course on an island.

A shared island, by consent of the majority of the residents of said island

Where is the province of Ulster?

What consent?

Bishop of hope

James Brown wrote: »

Where is the province of Ulster?

What consent?

GFA.
Now, if we could seal off Dublin!

FrancieBrady

Finty Lemon wrote: »

That's Article 2 you copied there, read Article 3 as I suggested.

In relation to your question, the Dept of the Taoiseach understands that the prospect of an All Island lockdown will not be entertained by the DUP. There has been contact on numerous occasions in this regard, including meetings with First Minister Foster and the Deputy First Minister O’Neill on eight occasions in the latter half of 2020.
Since the North-South Ministerial Council meeting in December there has been a call with both on December 13th and separate calls to the two women last on January 25th. Mr Martin also keeps a private channel of communication open to Mrs Foster.

But there are no substantive discussions on an agreed approach that would devise a single Covid policy for the island. The most that can or will be achieved is some degree of alignment, in which the two administrations adopt similar approaches to lockdown, etc. But a one-island approach is not on the cards, according to people with knowledge of the policy.

There was no mention of an 'all island approach at the Dec meeting.

https://www.northsouthministerialcouncil.org/sites/northsouthministerialcouncil.org/files/publications/Twenty%20Fifth%20Plenary%20Meeting%20-%20Armagh%2018%20December%202020.pdf

Can you link to any conversations held on the matter or not. We know they have had contact.

Any links to public calls from the government would be appropriate here too to back up what you are saying.

James Brown

Bishop of hope wrote: »

GFA.
Now, if we could seal off Dublin!

The GFA says we aren't technically an Island?

Finty Lemon

FrancieBrady wrote: »

There was no mention of an 'all island approach at the Dec meeting.

https://www.northsouthministerialcouncil.org/sites/northsouthministerialcouncil.org/files/publications/Twenty%20Fifth%20Plenary%20Meeting%20-%20Armagh%2018%20December%202020.pdf

Can you link to any conversations held on the matter or not. We know they have had contact.

Any links to public calls from the government would be appropriate here too to back up what you are saying.

RESPONSE TO COVID-19
2. The Council renewed its expression of appreciation to all those who have played a
part in the response to the Covid-19 pandemic, in particular the health and social care
workers who have led the front-line response.
3. Ministers welcomed the close and productive cooperation that has taken place
between Health Ministers, Chief Medical Officers and health administrations, North
and South, to deliver an effective public health response.
4. The Council noted that since the meeting of senior representatives of the Northern
Ireland Executive and the Irish Government, and their Chief Medical Officers, at the
NSMC Secretariat offices in Armagh on 14 March to review the situation regarding the
Covid-19 pandemic and senior representatives from both Administrations have
continued to meet regularly to discuss the ongoing Covid-19 response.
5. Ministers noted that the twenty-fourth Plenary meeting of the North South Ministerial
Council (NSMC), held at Dublin Castle on 31 July 2020, was briefed by the Chief
Medical Officers on the public health situation and on ongoing cooperation in the
response to the Covid-19 pandemic.
6. The Council noted that Chief Medical Officers met on 25 September to review the
ongoing response to the pandemic, including the particular challenges being faced in
the North West region and the joint statement issued following that meeting.
7. Ministers recalled the Memorandum of Understanding on Public Health Cooperation
on Covid-19 Response agreed between Departments of Health, North and South, on
7 April.
8. The Council noted the further Memorandum of Understanding for the sharing of
anonymous ‘diagnosis keys’ generated by each jurisdiction’s covid-19 Proximity Apps
agreed between Departments of Health, North and South, on 30 July.
9. Ministers welcomed the achievement of interoperability, on an all-island basis, of the
apps deployed in each jurisdiction.
10. The Council noted that Health Ministers will continue to meet, both within the NSMC
and outside the structures of the Council, to discuss the response to the pandemic.
11. Ministers agreed that officials from both jurisdictions are committed to building on the
experience and the relevant learnings from the first phases of the pandemic and will
continue to exchange views to foster commonality in their approach, where possible,
and provide a progress update at a future NSMC Health Meeting.

FrancieBrady

Finty Lemon wrote: »

RESPONSE TO COVID-19
2. The Council renewed its expression of appreciation to all those who have played a
part in the response to the Covid-19 pandemic, in particular the health and social care
workers who have led the front-line response.
3. Ministers welcomed the close and productive cooperation that has taken place
between Health Ministers, Chief Medical Officers and health administrations, North
and South, to deliver an effective public health response.
4. The Council noted that since the meeting of senior representatives of the Northern
Ireland Executive and the Irish Government, and their Chief Medical Officers, at the
NSMC Secretariat offices in Armagh on 14 March to review the situation regarding the
Covid-19 pandemic and senior representatives from both Administrations have
continued to meet regularly to discuss the ongoing Covid-19 response.
5. Ministers noted that the twenty-fourth Plenary meeting of the North South Ministerial
Council (NSMC), held at Dublin Castle on 31 July 2020, was briefed by the Chief
Medical Officers on the public health situation and on ongoing cooperation in the
response to the Covid-19 pandemic.
6. The Council noted that Chief Medical Officers met on 25 September to review the
ongoing response to the pandemic, including the particular challenges being faced in
the North West region and the joint statement issued following that meeting.
7. Ministers recalled the Memorandum of Understanding on Public Health Cooperation
on Covid-19 Response agreed between Departments of Health, North and South, on
7 April.
8. The Council noted the further Memorandum of Understanding for the sharing of
anonymous ‘diagnosis keys’ generated by each jurisdiction’s covid-19 Proximity Apps
agreed between Departments of Health, North and South, on 30 July.
9. Ministers welcomed the achievement of interoperability, on an all-island basis, of the
apps deployed in each jurisdiction.
10. The Council noted that Health Ministers will continue to meet, both within the NSMC
and outside the structures of the Council, to discuss the response to the pandemic.
11. Ministers agreed that officials from both jurisdictions are committed to building on the
experience and the relevant learnings from the first phases of the pandemic and will
continue to exchange views to foster commonality in their approach, where possible,
and provide a progress update at a future NSMC Health Meeting.

So no calls for an all island approach. No support for those calling for it and no criticism of those blocking it.

Exactly as claimed.

Finty Lemon

James Brown wrote: »

The GFA says we aren't technically an Island?

It recognises that there are two jurisdictions on the island of Ireland. The people consented to this. Therefore, ROI is not an island, but a country on an island.

Complicated, isn't it?

Finty Lemon

FrancieBrady wrote: »

So no calls for an all island approach. No support for those calling for it and no criticism of those blocking it.

Exactly as claimed.

As per the reasons explained before. The correct, pragmatic call by the government.

FrancieBrady

Finty Lemon wrote: »

As per the reasons explained before. The correct, pragmatic call by the government.

'Pragmatic' for who exactly?

They are vociferous in their criticisms of other parties in NI, yet say nothing about the DUP who are endangering their own citizens, firstly economically (Brexit) and secondly in health (Covid).

I believe it is because they want to link with Unionism against the party that they criticise.

They are playing with peoples lives for pragmatic political purposes. You are correct there.

blanch152

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Constitutionally we believe we are an island. What has the current government done within the international agreements pertaining to these islands about securing the 'whole' island.

If you can lay it out in bullet points in your answer that would be good.

Oh no, are we back to the old idea that we should just invade and take over the North? Or was that only a 1969 thing?

Because, apart from tearing up every international agreement we have signed, there is nothing else the government can do.

Perhaps you would enlighten us with the answer to the question as to what the government could have done.

James Brown

Finty Lemon wrote: »

It recognises that there are two jurisdictions on the island of Ireland. The people consented to this. Therefore, ROI is not an island, but a country on an island.

Complicated, isn't it?

So do I.

People living on an island don't live on an island

Where is the province of Ulster?

Finty Lemon

FrancieBrady wrote: »

'Pragmatic' for who exactly?

They are vociferous in their criticisms of other parties in NI, yet say nothing about the DUP who are endangering their own citizens, firstly economically (Brexit) and secondly in health (Covid).

I believe it is because they want to link with Unionism against the party that they criticise.

They are playing with peoples lives for pragmatic political purposes. You are correct there.

It is good that such a charge cannot not applied to yourself, i.e. politicizing a public health emergency. That would be grotesque as you point out.

Finty Lemon

James Brown wrote: »

So do I.

Where is the province of Ulster?

Some of it is in the UK,
Some of it (including the best part of it IMHO) is the Republic of Ireland.

As agreed.

James Brown

blanch152 wrote: »

Oh no, are we back to the old idea that we should just invade and take over the North? Or was that only a 1969 thing?

Because, apart from tearing up every international agreement we have signed, there is nothing else the government can do.

Perhaps you would enlighten us with the answer to the question as to what the government could have done.

Stop apologising for and excusing British murderers and their Irish affiliates would be a start.

RandomViewer

When the DUP are using the 1800 Act of Union as basis for their lawsuit it is Quixotic at best

James Brown

Finty Lemon wrote: »

Some of it is in the UK,
Some of it (including the best part of it IMHO) is the Republic of Ireland.

As agreed.

Some of the Irish province of Ulster contained on the island of Ireland, is not on the island? Cool...

You know it's not physically though right? You know a referendum could change all that? Is Jersey not an Island?

Cluedo Monopoly

The UK have a plan

https://news.sky.com/story/covid-19-when-every-lockdown-rule-is-set-to-lift-in-england-12225770

FrancieBrady

Finty Lemon wrote: »

It is good that such a charge cannot not applied to yourself, i.e. politicizing a public health emergency. That would be grotesque as you point out.

And the predictable cop out from the discussion comes right on cue.

Floppybits

Cluedo Monopoly wrote: »

The UK have a plan

https://news.sky.com/story/covid-19-when-every-lockdown-rule-is-set-to-lift-in-england-12225770

We do have a plan its just that no one knows what that plan is but Micheal Martin has assured us there is a plan.

Bishop of hope

Cluedo Monopoly wrote: »

The UK have a plan

https://news.sky.com/story/covid-19-when-every-lockdown-rule-is-set-to-lift-in-england-12225770

Like everyone else, dependent on.......

Floppybits

FrancieBrady wrote: »

And the predictable cop out from the discussion comes right on cue.

I'm telling you there was an FG training/refresher course over the weekend and we are getting the full works of the FG excuses social media handbook. You know the one that contains

Nothing to see here
You're all shinners
It's SF/A N Others fault
Or how to deflect the argument to something like compulsory vs Mandatory or as we seen last week severe vs significant.

I know I forgot a few but you see it on here time and time again, all of the so called pro government supporters say the exact same thing or behave in the exact same manner.

FrancieBrady

Floppybits wrote: »

I'm telling you there was an FG training/refresher course over the weekend and we are getting the full works of the FG excuses social media handbook. You know the one that contains

Nothing to see here
You're all shinners
It's SF/A N Others fault
Or how to deflect the argument to something like compulsory vs Mandatory or as we seen last week severe vs significant.

I know I forgot a few but you see it on here time and time again, all of the so called pro government supporters say the exact same thing or behave in the exact same manner.

When in a corner it always becomes about the other poster...always. Finty's last comment above being a perfect example.

Fann Linn

Bishop of hope wrote: »

Like everyone else, dependent on.......

20,000,000 v 325,000 as of today.

I know which plan appears to be working.

Cluedo Monopoly

Floppybits wrote: »

We do have a plan its just that no one knows what that plan is but Micheal Martin has assured us there is a plan.

Does anyone know what date Martin meant when he said "middle of the summer" for hospitality sector? What date is that? June/July? Meteorological summer?

I can never understand why some Irish people accept the mediocre so readily.

Floppybits

Cluedo Monopoly wrote: »

Does anyone know what date Martin meant when he said "middle of the summer" for hospitality sector? What date is that? June/July? Meteorological summer?

I can never understand why some Irish people accept the mediocre so readily.

I wonder what catchy name this plan will have? Can't see it being called living with covid 2.0

Fann Linn

Floppybits wrote: »

I wonder what catchy name this plan will have? Can't see it being called living with covid 2.0

Covid for Dummies.