FF/FG/Green Government - part 2

Floppybits

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

Pointless semantic quibbling. Even if SF had been a few seats clear of FF and FG it wouldn't have changed the fundamental Dail arithmetic: in practice, a government could only be formed through some form of agreement between two out of three from SF, FF and FG, and both FF and FG (the former after a bit of wavering, admittedly) ruled out dealing with SF. So there was nothing SF could do about forming a government.

This does not matter as it doesn't play into the narrative that SF didn't want to govern. Some folk will try use the argument they could have formed a government out of every single smaller party and independent in the Dail but we all know that a government made up of that many fragmentEd pieces wouldn't have last a week. This is probably what FF and FG wanted so they could climb back up on their high horse and say see we are the only party's that can form a government.

Floppybits

blanch152 wrote: »

You don't like the facts so you accuse those of telling them of arrogance.

Sinn Fein failed after the election to turn a winning hand into a win. It was pathetic. Do a deal with PBP, Greens, Labour and SDs, forcing FF into another confidence and supply was a clear path to government that they were unable to take. Whether that is because they were scared or incompetent is the only question.

Me not liking facts, that's a laugh coming from you. The person who has argued since day 1 that Varadkar didn't leak a confidential document even though he has admitted it himself, the person who has argued that a confidential document is not really confidential and then tried to be a smart ass by sticking confidential on a post like and yet you say I don't like facts. Get away outta that.

Cluedo Monopoly

blanch152 wrote: »

Sinn Fein failed after the election to turn a winning hand into a win.

We both know that the last 9 months of the FFGG coalition of chaos has been a big win for all the opposition parties. They have performed abysmally.

blanch152

Cluedo Monopoly wrote: »

We both know that the last 9 months of the FFGG coalition of chaos has been a big win for all the opposition parties. They have performed abysmally.

Government parties still have a majority in the polls, FG are up 7 or 8 on the general election. Coalition likely to be re-elected if there was an election tomorrow.

Some big win for the opposition.

Cluedo Monopoly

blanch152 wrote: »

Government parties still have a majority in the polls, FG are up 7 or 8 on the general election. Coalition likely to be re-elected if there was an election tomorrow.

Some big win for the opposition.

We'll see.

My own 5 seater constituency of Galway West had never elected a Sinn Fein TD to my knowledge. It was never a possibility in my living memory. A friend of mine before the last election told me that Mairead Farrell had a chance and I laughed out loud. I said her chances of winning a seat were less than zero. She was a complete no-hoper, a complete unknown. I even believed the local Sinn Fein organisation weren't entirely happy with her selection. I would have put my mortgage on her not winning a seat.

But somehow she almost topped the poll. O'Cuiv beat her by 50 first preference votes. I am still not sure how. 14% FPV. I went to the count and I still did not believe.

If SF had put more candidates in the field during GE20, they would have many more TDs.

I know you fear SF even though your rhetoric pushes more people towards SF but I cannot see them losing votes at the next election. Can you? If they manage the vote better they will be comfortably the largest party in the Dail. All they have to do is sit back and watch FFG implode every other week.

I wont vote for SF, I will vote for Social Democrats and Catherine Connolly but I do hope and expect the SF transfers to help my choices.

Sorry if this post ruins the sleep of some posters...

Finty Lemon

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

Pointless semantic quibbling. Even if SF had been a few seats clear of FF and FG it wouldn't have changed the fundamental Dail arithmetic: in practice, a government could only be formed through some form of agreement between two out of three from SF, FF and FG, and both FF and FG (the former after a bit of wavering, admittedly) ruled out dealing with SF. So there was nothing SF could do about forming a government.

Pointless semantic quibbling? You perfectly described MLM in the days after the election.

FrancieBrady

blanch152 wrote: »

Government parties still have a majority in the polls, FG are up 7 or 8 on the general election. Coalition likely to be re-elected if there was an election tomorrow.

Some big win for the opposition.

If FF and FG are going to all but merge I think the electorate will respond to that.

Vote FF, get FG or vice versa? Unsustainable IMO.

Can see their vote share continuing to fall from the heady heights of 86%

Cluedo Monopoly

FrancieBrady wrote: »

If FF and FG are going to all but merge I think the electorate will respond to that.

Vote FF, get FG or vice versa? Unsustainable IMO.

Can see their vote share continuing to fall from the heady heights of 86%

When you think that FG and Labour romped home with 113 seats in 2011. 113!

In GE20, they both got just 41.

Thats some fall from grace. 72 seats lost from the New Politics government.

FrancieBrady

Cluedo Monopoly wrote: »

When you think that FG and Labour romped home with 113 seats in 2011. 113!

In GE20, they both got just 41.

Thats some fall from grace. 72 seats lost from the New Politics government.

This coalition/merger doesn't have the imprimatur of the electorate. Both main parties rubbished the idea of coalescing before the election and one of them promised never to go into government with FG. Yet that is what we got.
The electorate will judge that next time out and FG and FF will again be asked what their intentions are.

blanch152

Cluedo Monopoly wrote: »

We'll see.

My own 5 seater constituency of Galway West had never elected a Sinn Fein TD to my knowledge. It was never a possibility in my living memory. A friend of mine before the last election told me that Mairead Farrell had a chance and I laughed out loud. I said her chances of winning a seat were less than zero. She was a complete no-hoper, a complete unknown. I even believed the local Sinn Fein organisation weren't entirely happy with her selection. I would have put my mortgage on her not winning a seat.

But somehow she almost topped the poll. O'Cuiv beat her by 50 first preference votes. I am still not sure how. 14% FPV. I went to the count and I still did not believe.

If SF had put more candidates in the field during GE20, they would have many more TDs.

I know you fear SF even though your rhetoric pushes more people towards SF but I cannot see them losing votes at the next election. Can you? If they manage the vote better they will be comfortably the largest party in the Dail. All they have to do is sit back and watch FFG implode every other week.

I wont vote for SF, I will vote for Social Democrats and Catherine Connolly but I do hope and expect the SF transfers to help my choices.

Sorry if this post ruins the sleep of some posters...

It is amazing the number of posters who defend Sinn Fein but vote Social Democrats.

Don't really care what my rhetoric pushes people towards, I am not on here to win votes for any political party, just to express my views.

Brendan Bendar

FrancieBrady wrote: »

This coalition/merger doesn't have the imprimatur of the electorate. Both main parties rubbished the idea of coalescing before the election and one of them promised never to go into government with FG. Yet that is what we got.
The electorate will judge that next time out and FG and FF will again be asked what their intentions are.

They kept SF out of power for another few years, that’s a plus for the country.

Brendan Bendar

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

They kept SF out of power for another few years, that’s a plus for the country.

It is? Look at the shambles it's been. The worst idiots ever in power, not a clue what they're at

FrancieBrady

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

They kept SF out of power for another few years, that’s a plus for the country.

We know that was the goal Brendi. Not the most democratic approach, and we'll see what the electorate thinks next time out.

Cluedo Monopoly

blanch152 wrote: »

It is amazing the number of posters who defend Sinn Fein but vote Social Democrats.

Don't really care what my rhetoric pushes people towards, I am not on here to win votes for any political party, just to express my views.

Aragh me bollix Blanch, I did not defend SF. I actually hate when you lot drag SF into this thread. I think this was my first time! Read the post and learn something. It was a political analysis post. You pretend to be a Green voter, it doesn't mean we all pretend. You know it's true when I say I voted SD and Connolly in GE20.

You guys are so paranoid. Gas really.

Finty Lemon

Deleted User wrote: »

It is? Look at the shambles it's been. The worst idiots ever in power, not a clue what they're at

Leaving Cert delivered with relative success.
Schools back and the tantrum from teachers union quelled.
Covid mortality rates among the lowest in Europe
Vaccination rate in the top group in EU
Housing plan on the way with multiple elements
Minister for Ag Mark III (!) doing a good job
Calm assuredness on Brexit in the face of frothing extremists
Not too bad really. Glad to have grown ups in charge just now

A squealing opposition on the run too.

Loafing Oaf

FrancieBrady wrote: »

If FF and FG are going to all but merge I think the electorate will respond to that.

Vote FF, get FG or vice versa? Unsustainable IMO.

Can see their vote share continuing to fall from the heady heights of 86%

FF have signalled they are up for a deal with SF so I don't think things will evolve this way. I believe FG will monopolize the centrist, anti-SF vote and FF will be pushed to the margins.

RandomViewer

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

FF have signalled they are up for a deal with SF so I don't think things will evolve this way. I believe FG will monopolize the centrist, anti-SF vote and FF will be pushed to the margins.

FG have made it clear that they are heading for the Right anyone earning less than €60k need not apply

RandomViewer

Cluedo Monopoly wrote: »

Aragh me bollix Blanch, I did not defend SF. I actually hate when you lot drag SF into this thread. I think this was my first time! Read the post and learn something. It was a political analysis post. You pretend to be a Green voter, it doesn't mean we all pretend. You know it's true when I say I voted SD and Connolly in GE20.

You guys are so paranoid. Gas really.

Doubt if he has a vote,

Ha Long Bay

RandomViewer wrote: »

FG have made it clear that they are heading for the Right anyone earning less than €60k need not apply

Why do you link these two things? Do you think political leanings change based on a salary increase?

RandomViewer

john4321 wrote: »

Why do you link these two things? Do you think political leanings change based on a salary increase?

FG have the notion that anyone on lower incomes arent their "people", if they keep going the way their going they won't have a seat outside Dublin.
You are less likely to be canvassed for your vote by FG or Labour if you live in a less affluent area. Political leanings change by age rather than money when your young you'll likely be more socially aware, into 30s and 40s more finance orientated and then swing either left
or right in your 50s, but political parties don't seem to have figured that

Finty Lemon

As of 16th March Ireland is 4th in EU in terms of cumulative vaccine rollout rate.

Equivalent of 28,000 people behind Denmark.
Malta and Hungary (who are using Russian vaccine) are ahead also.

Not too bad overall.

UDAWINNER

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/td-told-young-man-with-congenital-heart-disease-to-ask-gp-for-spare-jab-40205915.html
Great advice, I bet the young man is glad of her influence:)

Finty Lemon

UDAWINNER wrote: »

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/td-told-young-man-with-congenital-heart-disease-to-ask-gp-for-spare-jab-40205915.html
Great advice, I bet the young man is glad of her influence:)

Non story.

Cluedo Monopoly

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40246190.html

Housing Minister Darragh O’Brien signed off on a proposal to ensure councillors would not lose expenses for non-attendance at meetings during the pandemic.

The minister was told councillors were obliged to attend 80% of meetings during a year to receive full payment of their expenses allowance.

The minister subsequently signed an order giving remote meetings the same status in law as those that take place in a physical space.

Well that seems utterly logical. Our politicians have a one-track mind. Well done FFG.

Cluedo Monopoly

https://www.rte.ie/news/health/2021/0316/1204239-national-childrens-hospital/

Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform Michael McGrath has expressed concern over the progress of the National Children's Hospital project to Minister for Health Stephen Donnelly.

n a letter to Mr Donnelly last month, obtained by RTÉ's Morning Ireland under Freedom of Information, Mr McGrath points out that since July of last year the Government has been waiting for a definitive update on the project from the Department of Health and the National Paediatric Hospital Development Board (NPHDB).

Mr McGrath said the lack of an update "gives cause for concern", adding that an 'options paper' that "has been in development by the NPHDB for some time" has not materialised and clarification is "urgently required".

When your FF and Cabinet colleague is expressing concern, you know you are dealing with another disaster. Are they preparing us for even more ineptness and waste?

Bubbaclaus

Don't recall a joint statement being issued before by the Taoiseach and US President, at least not in recent years at least. I'd say it was Biden that got the last point on the statement - obsessed with his poetry

https://twitter.com/gavreilly/status/1372301104533409795?s=19

James Brown

blanch152 wrote: »

It is amazing the number of posters who defend Sinn Fein but vote Social Democrats.

Don't really care what my rhetoric pushes people towards, I am not on here to win votes for any political party, just to express my views.

Like who? I don't know any. You've lots of this kind of "info"
I know plenty on here claimed x, now thats it's Y they won't discuss it :rolleyes:

James Brown

Cluedo Monopoly wrote: »

https://www.rte.ie/news/health/2021/0316/1204239-national-childrens-hospital/



When your FF and Cabinet colleague is expressing concern, you know you are dealing with another disaster. Are they preparing us for even more ineptness and waste?

Blind eye turned to Ireland's millennium dome.
Try do something for the tax payer you hear about no magic money trees.
Maybe the NCH have them all.

McMurphy

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

Don't recall a joint statement being issued before by the Taoiseach and US President, at least not in recent years at least. I'd say it was Biden that got the last point on the statement - obsessed with his poetry

https://twitter.com/gavreilly/status/1372301104533409795?s=19

Was it a.joint Taoiseach/Tanaiste virtual meeting too?

https://twitter.com/DrHaroldNews/status/1372239900364447744?s=09

Floppybits

Just been listening to newstalk and the spokesperson for the AGSI was on and was saying that the minster for justice could not them what group Gardai were in to get vaccinated. Which I thought was a but unbelievable, surely gardai would be prioritised. This then led to a text to say that prisoners would be vaccinated before prison officers. Fair play to Newstalk they for some representative for prisons officers and they confirmed that prisoners would be vaccinated in group 9 but when asked for prison officers they couldn't say, similar to the gardai.

Seems this vaccination roll out is a bit of mess and frontline are being ignored.