FF/FG/Green Government - part 2

McMurphy

Finty Lemon wrote: »

Context.
The HSE spent 0.05% of its annual budget to procure emergency supplies of equipment that were extremely difficult to source given the fact that a global pandemic was underway. You know, the biggest challenge ever to face public medicine in this country.

This was in the face of reports emerging from our EU neighbours of emergency rooms being overwhelmed by the numbers of patients requiring assisted respiration. Thankfully, due to the imposition of lockdown and the adherence of the public to it, most of the capacity was not used. 14 million quid was well worth the punt.

Wonder if that's the line of defence Quirkes "political contact" well use when identified?

I wouldn't think so too be honest though.

Finty Lemon

_Kaiser_ wrote: »

I fully expect a lot more of this kind of defence when we do finally get past covid and the inquires begin into the decisions made and the huge sums spent during the pandemic.

I also expect most of the current Government to retire with their pension at the next outing. They won't want to be around for the inevitable austerity measures, and certainly not to be asked questions about their roles in the above.

Which part of the expenditure response would you have cut? 11bn of the 16bn in direct measures were allocated as direct supports to peoples income.
How much less should that have been? I do seem to recall that the opposition parties were calling for increased support, now it seems they want the supports cut. Very confusing.

Finty Lemon

Cluedo Monopoly wrote: »

The punt?

Such professionalism!

Ever dealt with the OGP in relation to public procurement processes? Thought not.

Finty Lemon

Goodnight kids.

This weekend we learned that our outraged opposition friends want to slash covid supports to working people, think it was a bad idea to spend contingency money on medical equipment, have no clue that there even is a public procurement process, and want to set public health policy on the basis of a tabloid opinion poll. Glad to have the grown-ups in charge.

Tune in next week when we look at the pros and cons of the proposed housing bill, and expose the flawed opportunist opposition of West Ham Polytechnic's favourite public intellectual.

markodaly

McMurphy wrote: »

The ventilator story keeps getting better and better tbh.

https://twitter.com/olivercallan/status/1373611643167444995?s=19

Just on Oliver Callan, I don't think we should be taking much head from his likes or people on Twitter mouthing off every minute of the day and making much-vaunted predictions...



Didnt age well, did it Oliver.

McMurphy

markodaly wrote: »

Just on Oliver Callan, I don't think we should be taking much head from his likes or people on Twitter mouthing off every minute of the day and making much-vaunted predictions...



Didnt age well, did it Oliver.[/QUOTE
Silly Challan, it's just as well he wasn't running the country at the time, isn't it.

https://www.newstalk.com/news/st-patricks-day-covid-19-978819

Brendan Bendar

Only thing worrying Callan is his ‘gigs’ are off the road.

In keeping with a large wedge of the ‘ media’ he applies a lot of energies trying to
pull down the govt and target The Táiniste in particular.

Anyone who heeds these self appointed know all’s need to take a look at themselves.

McMurphy

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

Only thing worrying Callan is his ‘gigs’ are off the road.

In keeping with a large wedge of the ‘ media’ he applies a lot of energies trying to
pull down the govt and target The Táiniste in particular.

Anyone who heeds these self appointed know all’s need to take a look at themselves.

He's a comedian on the radio brenner, don't think we're meant to literally "heed him" tbh.

His last leaky Leo sketch was epic in fairness. Has Leo's smugness down to a Tee.

Brendan Bendar

McMurphy wrote: »

He's a comedian on the radio brenner, don't think we're meant to literally "heed him" tbh.

His last leaky Leo sketch was epic in fairness. Has Leo's smugness down to a Tee.

I will not comment on Callan on this thread again, but I’m afraid your suggestion that he is just “a comedian on the radio” would not fit with his impression of himself.

He is prolific on Twitter, has a newspaper colum,does general programmes on National Radio and these platforms are liberally marbled with ascerbic govt criticism and particular focus on the Táiniste.


It would not surprise me at all if he looked for an SF ticket in the next election. Almost guaranteed seat there for him.

To those of us who can see through his veiled anti govt stance he is more than “a radio comedian”.

FrancieBrady

Political satirist criticises government shocker!

Cluedo Monopoly

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Political satirist criticises government shocker!

I love how they completely abandon anyone that dares criticise or even facilitate a criticism of the FFG institution. The even have previous dirt ready to muddy the waters. The message is always ignored. It's actually fascinating to watch. Such blind loyalty. It was actually an Irish Examiner article

14,000,000 Taxpayers money like...irrelevant

blanch152

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Political satirist criticises government shocker!

Political satirists and cartooners are great until they target Mary-Lou, isn't that right?

Cluedo Monopoly

blanch152 wrote: »

Political satirists and cartooners are great until they target Mary-Lou, isn't that right?

Immediate diversion to SF and 2 automatic likes. Priceless

Nothing about the 14,000,000....

FrancieBrady

blanch152 wrote: »

Political satirists and cartooners are great until they target Mary-Lou, isn't that right?

Head on over to the radio forum and my comments on Callan's last show blanch.

I don't and never have defended or diluted misogynistic attacks on anybody.

McMurphy

Brendan Bendar wrote: »

I will not comment on Callan on this thread again, but I’m afraid your suggestion that he is just “a comedian on the radio” would not fit with his impression of himself.

He is prolific on Twitter, has a newspaper colum,does general programmes on National Radio and these platforms are liberally marbled with ascerbic govt criticism and particular focus on the Táiniste.


It would not surprise me at all if he looked for an SF ticket in the next election. Almost guaranteed seat there for him.

To those of us who can see through his veiled anti govt stance he is more than “a radio comedian”.

You think callans a closet shinner is it

Cmon Brenner, get real here the man makes his living doing comedic impressions of personalities, yes many of which are politicians, and he takes the piss out of them all.

Scripting satirical sketches about Leo and Michaél (and Mary Lou) does not a shinner make.

Finty Lemon

blanch152 wrote: »

Political satirists and cartooners are great until they target Mary-Lou, isn't that right?

Say what you like about Callan but he is 100% not a SF apologist. Has no truck with them and thats a fact. Remember his sketch on Adams cleaning his house? On the money.
Varadkar is clearly a target for satire given his starchy demeanour and penchant for social media. Its a bit of craic that he takes quite well.
The problem with MLM is she doesn't lend herself to ridicule that could pass for entertainment. Says nothing of substance, at snails pace, hasn't achieved anything of note, and is carefully scripted at all times. Bore the arse of ya. The lost Walrus has more comedic value.

Brendan Bendar

McMurphy wrote: »

You think callans a closet shinner is it

Cmon Brenner, get real here the man makes his living doing comedic impressions of personalities, yes many of which are politicians, and he takes the piss out of them all.

Scripting satirical sketches about Leo and Michaél (and Mary Lou) does not a shinner make.

I said I wouldn’t comment on Callan again as the thread is not about him.

Soz Randle.

Melanchthon

Here's a question, what do posters here think FF can do to increase their popularity.
I think one thing they could do would be too not defend Varadkar if the Leak issue goes further but that risks a collapse of government when support is low, this then begs the question if that's not an option, what can they do to raise support levels because at the minute it seems like FG are in a much better place and could collapse the government over some pretext and survive it so that Irish politics becomes a FG Vs SF dynamic with FF in a distant 3rd.

They could announce stuff about tackling the legal, insurance and housing sectors but I don't think the electorate will believe them unless something is actually quickly delivered.

James Brown

McMurphy wrote: »

The ventilator story keeps getting better and better tbh.

https://twitter.com/olivercallan/status/1373611643167444995?s=19

I can see this lad taking over from Uncle Dinny in a few years and people on here shrugging off him being awarded state contracts at a loss to the tax payer.
Great little country to do business.

James Brown

Finty Lemon wrote: »

Context.
The HSE spent 0.05% of its annual budget to procure emergency supplies of equipment that were extremely difficult to source given the fact that a global pandemic was underway. You know, the biggest challenge ever to face public medicine in this country.

This was in the face of reports emerging from our EU neighbours of emergency rooms being overwhelmed by the numbers of patients requiring assisted respiration. Thankfully, due to the imposition of lockdown and the adherence of the public to it, most of the capacity was not used. 14 million quid was well worth the punt.

A fella, the only employee in his company, who organised music gigs in the middle east, got 14m up front to supply us with not fit for purpose ventilators.
That's your context.

Are we shrugging off wasting 14 mill now?
The punt? We have reputable companies with a record for importing. We have companies who deal with medical imports and have legitimate contacts throughout the world.

We gave 14mill up front to a lad promotes gigs in the middle east. "Well worth the punt.." ffs..

Brendan Bendar

James Brown wrote: »

I can see this lad taking over from Uncle Dinny in a few years and people on here shrugging off him being awarded state contracts at a loss to the tax payer.
Great little country to do business.

Great... you come up with a purely hypothetical load of codswallop and then you have the nerve to extrapolate that the country will be taken in by it.

Fann Linn

James Brown wrote: »

A fella, the only employee in his company, who organised music gigs in the middle east, got 14m up front to supply us with not fit for purpose ventilators.
That's your context.

Are we shrugging off wasting 14 mill now?
The punt? We have reputable companies with a record for importing. We have companies who deal with medical imports and have legitimate contacts throughout the world.

We gave 14mill up front to a lad promotes gigs in the middle east. "Well worth the punt.." ffs..

Has this lad any 'friends, not friends, in FG? ' You know, the type that always delivers?

Loafing Oaf

Melanchthon wrote: »

Here's a question, what do posters here think FF can do to increase their popularity.
I think one thing they could do would be too not defend Varadkar if the Leak issue goes further but that risks a collapse of government when support is low,.

If the leak issue goes further, there will be pressure within FG as well as from FF for Varadkar to step aside/down. I don't think that will be the breaking point for the government unless one of the parties wants it to be.

McMurphy

Fann Linn wrote: »

Has this lad any 'friends, not friends, in FG? ' You know, the type that always delivers?

A question Roisin Shorthall is trying to get an answer to Fann. Leo must still be checking his records.

James Brown

McMurphy wrote: »

A question Roisin Shorthall is trying to get an answer to Fann. Leo must still be checking his records.

This is why the Irish public need an opposition. FF/FG/Green well wishers willing to let it slide are the same ones give out about 'foreva homes'.

Finty Lemon

James Brown wrote: »

A fella, the only employee in his company, who organised music gigs in the middle east, got 14m up front to supply us with not fit for purpose ventilators.
That's your context.

Are we shrugging off wasting 14 mill now?
The punt? We have reputable companies with a record for importing. We have companies who deal with medical imports and have legitimate contacts throughout the world.

We gave 14mill up front to a lad promotes gigs in the middle east. "Well worth the punt.." ffs..

You do realise that the procurement decision was apolitical, conducted by the administrative arm and not the political one? Jaysis that's basic stuff.
Anyway, the context was a global crisis in medical equipment supply. The staff in this case bypassed normal protocols of due diligence and tendering to try to do the right thing and get some equipment sorted. 14m is not a lot of money when faced with the situation as it was in March 2020.
Hindsight 20/20 in terms of this specific supplier but the same approach was used on PPE etc to get hands on the absolutely required material.
Wad it a hanging offence to go outside the norm in this case? If done in good faith I would say not. Painting this as some insider deal without evidence to the contrary, and falsley linking it to a political party decision is just more of the usual nonsense.

Cluedo Monopoly

Finty Lemon wrote: »

You do realise that the procurement decision was apolitical, conducted by the administrative arm and not the political one? Jaysis that's basic stuff.
Anyway, the context was a global crisis in medical equipment supply. The staff in this case bypassed normal protocols of due diligence and tendering to try to do the right thing and get some equipment sorted. 14m is not a lot of money when faced with the situation as it was in March 2020.
Hindsight 20/20 in terms of this specific supplier but the same approach was used on PPE etc to get hands on the absolutely required material.
Wad it a hanging offence to go outside the norm in this case? If done in good faith I would say not. Painting this as some insider deal without evidence to the contrary, and falsley linking it to a political party decision is just more of the usual nonsense.

Ever hear of the term 'refund' or 'breach of contract'?

Finty Lemon

Cluedo Monopoly wrote: »

Ever hear of the term 'refund' or 'breach of contract'?

Yes.

James Brown

Finty Lemon wrote: »

You do realise that the procurement decision was apolitical, conducted by the administrative arm and not the political one? Jaysis that's basic stuff.
Anyway, the context was a global crisis in medical equipment supply. The staff in this case bypassed normal protocols of due diligence and tendering to try to do the right thing and get some equipment sorted. 14m is not a lot of money when faced with the situation as it was in March 2020.
Hindsight 20/20 in terms of this specific supplier but the same approach was used on PPE etc to get hands on the absolutely required material.
Wad it a hanging offence to go outside the norm in this case? If done in good faith I would say not. Painting this as some insider deal without evidence to the contrary, and falsley linking it to a political party decision is just more of the usual nonsense.

I don't believe due diligence was carried out. I do not believe 14 mill was allocated by one lone clerk taking a punt.

Look I could take the 14 mill isn't a big amount as a genuine sentiment if the folk silent on or dismissing this weren't first out the gate whinging about magic money trees and the like when there's money sought for other things. In short I don't believe anyone thinks that.

No hindsight needed. Everyone involved should be sacked and an actual criminal investigation sought on behalf of the tax payer. I can't believe any adult could be so incompetent quite frankly. That's why I suspect some cronyism.
Every crony deal involves supposed checks and balances, yet they still happen.
Based upon FF/FG's record I think dismissing the idea out of hand would get a rookie Garda in bother.

Finty Lemon

James Brown wrote: »

I don't believe due diligence was carried out. I do not believe 14 mill was allocated by one lone clerk taking a punt.

Look I could take the 14 mill isn't a big amount as a genuine sentiment if the folk silent on or dismissing this weren't first out the gate whinging about magic money trees and the like when there's money sought for other things. In short I don't believe anyone thinks that.

No hindsight needed. Everyone involved should be sacked and an actual criminal investigation sought on behalf of the tax payer. I can't believe any adult could be so incompetent quite frankly. That's why I suspect some cronyism.
Every crony deal involves supposed checks and balances, yet they still happen.
Based upon FF/FG's record I think dismissing the idea out of hand would get a rookie Garda in bother.

The HSE have said themselves that the normal checks and DD were bypassed to beat the rush. I am saying that I can accept that given the hugely pressurised circumstances. Other contracts were put through under the same conditions at the time and worked but this one clearly did not. That will have to be and is being pursued.

I would rather see the people making the call being proactive and taking some risks rather than hiding behind protocol. I know how long it takes for the state machine to get business done, and rightly so because there is tax payers money at stake. On this one the bigger disservice to the public would have been to do nothing however. As I said, people were making medical devices out of car parts at the time, such was the demand.

I trust that your primary interest here is the fate of a small amount of taxpayers money spent at gunpoint, and not another gleeful opportunity for cheap point scoring.