Tesla Model 3 - V3.0

kcf1

Hello. Thanks for comments. So what is expected range for this time of year with current weather. Below is my data for last few days, and i am assuming I calculated 'Theoretical max if 100% charged' correctly; (driven in some very wet and windy weather, mix of motorway, national and local roads).

So, we could drive 550 km from 100% to 0% if needed?

And hopefully in the summer, this will be near to 620 km?

Does it make any difference to park car in garage in colder weather?

Thanks.

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121283200#Comment_121283200

Be more efficient to pre heat the battery before driving from the mains.

rodneytrotter15

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121283414#Comment_121283414

@Gumbo how do you kick this off ? Is it just heating the car ? I often leave from work with a fully charged car that is still plugged in ?

Dozz

I see there are some good deals on inventory Model Y's that I am considering.

My question is what would a fair price for a private sale on a grey 211 Model 3 SR+ with 35000km on the clock?

Cheers

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121283575#Comment_121283575

Set the departure time and the car will start pre heating the cabin while plugged in so in theory it doesn’t pull from the HV battery when driving to heat the cabin. It delays the charging also to keep the battery warm for departure time too.

poker--addict

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121283693#Comment_121283693

Smidge under 30

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121284706#Comment_121284706

€29,999.99

For Sale 😁

sk8board

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121283200#Comment_121283200

Your figures are based on what the car said each morning at 90% charge I’m guessing?

In reality I’ve never seen 550 personally (in a normal LR), but it would be possible with only urban hypermiling in mild weather for sure.

if you get above 450 in winter mixed driving you’d be doing well. I do mostly motorway, so 350/375k on winter motorway driving is about right for the LR

Kagawa

I have been looking at the best way to finance my M3 LR order and I'm a bit confused by the PCP finance that's offered by Tesla.

In all my previous PCP agreements with VW, the interest was only charged on the amount I financed over the 3 years, excluding the optional final payment. When I look at the below I can't make out how they are calculating the repayment amount.

Can anyone shed any light on this for me please?

Conar

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121288122#Comment_121288122

From a quick look at the payments/interest it looks to me like the loan interest is calculated on the total (after deposit) of €34,321. After 3 years the balance of the loan, having made payments of €610, will be €17789.

At that point you clear the loan, or go again.

It is definitely not as you describe with the VW loan where you only paid interest on the amount financed over the 3 years assuming you mean....Car 50k, deposit 15k, GFMV 20k....Interest paid on the 15k loan (Cost of car minus the deposit and GFMV)

EDIT

The pic sort of shows what I mean....look at the number left after 3 years

Kagawa

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121288208#Comment_121288208

Thanks Conar, that's what I was thinking too, but that makes no sense to me, they are charging me interest on an amount of money I am not borrowing from them. If they are going to charge me interest on the full amount minus my deposit I may as well just get a car loan for the full amount all together.

mamba101

You gotta understand that PCP is just HP with a wrapper.

The final ‘balloon’ payment is technically just the last of the 36 payments, you ARE getting a loan for the full amount.

think of it more like HP over 36 payments but the last payment is huge, making all others a lot less.

edit; and because most of the finance is at the end it means interest paid is more than if the payment were spread evenly like HP over the same period.

So long as you understand how it really works then you can decide what best suits you.

JOL1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121288122#Comment_121288122

You are just being charged interest on the amount financed (34321) over the 36 month term (35 really as 1st month is paid in advance) and then loan will be repaid down to a level of 17789. The figures you quote seem accurate. You can use this calculator to play with and it gives similar results to what you have been quoted. The calculator also shows what amount the loan reduces by over every month for each of the 36 months. This is a standard approach and would have been the same for VW.

https://www.pcp-calculator.com/PCP-loan-calculator.html

Conar

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121288273#Comment_121288273

As the lads mentioned after me it does make sense from a financial perspective, but you'll have to decide whether it makes any sense for you.

I looked at it and thought it made much more sense to get an unsecured loan from the credit union at 5.9% over a longer term. You're probably thinking the same thing.

Just to correct you though when you say "they are charging me interest on money I am not borrowing from them"....you definitely are. At the end of the day you're paying a deposit of 18k on a 52k car. You owe them 34k no matter what way they package the finance.

poker--addict

Short version; pcp is a marketing con.

I am yet to see a pcp arrangement which has turned out to be a good deal, but I have met countless people who think they have a bargain. Proudly driving a flash car with a "small repayment" but can barely afford a pint.

wassie

There's definite marketing spin when the balloon payment at the end is termed 'guaranteed future value' which implies some kind of benefit for the consumer.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121288524#Comment_121288524

I looked at it and thought it made much more sense to get an unsecured loan from the credit union at 5.9% over a longer term. You're probably thinking the same thing.

A small point of difference also is that with an unsecured loan, you actually own the vehicle at the point of purchase. With a PCP or HP, the finance company owns the vehicle until financed is paid off. PCPs also often have restrictions around mileage, modifications, servicing, insurance etc

sk8board

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121288581#Comment_121288581

0% PCPs meant that people never had to think about financing costs.

I wasn’t aware of this difference in total finance costs between VW and other PCPs, albeit Ive only had 0% PCPs from vw and will pay off the (small) balloon when the current one ends shortly - getting off the merry go round while the market settles down post covid market madness

JOL1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121289126#Comment_121289126

As with any financial product it is important to understand the features.. PCP can be attractive to some people as it allows them get into a car that they may otherwise not be able to as their monthly payments are much less than a regular loan (yes with a bullet payment at the end!) and the Guaranteed Future Buyback provides a degree of certainty that some, not all, will value. I am sure anyone who availed of PCP 3 years ago will be more than happy with the Guaranteed Future Buyback given the massive price drops over the period with consequential impact on the value of their car in the secondhand market, For anyone comparing options the APR figure is the only figure that will give the true cost of finance and can be used for simple, yet effective comparisons. (Currently Tesla offer PCP at different APR's from 0%, to 3.9% to 6..9% depending on the model so buyer beware)

As an aside all PCP plans operate on this basis and VW is no different.

poker--addict

The "guaranteed value" are usually abysmal are they not? Confess i don't know the detail on VW scheme, and volatility post covid may have created anomalies- but broadly cars depreciate on a fairly predictable curve.

"Pcp can be attractive to some people as it allows them to get into a car they otherwise not be able" due to smaller monthly payments - this is correct, and why I regard PCP as a marketing con. Even if the APR is 0% people are buying cars they can not truly afford - sooner or later they have to pay the price, and that will ultimately hurt their ability to manage other large costs, like accommodation or retirement savings.

It is a minefield, I got caught out myself earlier in the year misreading small print on a car loan and paid far more interest on the short duration I had it than I had expected. I can only imagine the number who make zero effort to understand this stuff and just see their tesla or BMW or whatever for a few hundred a month.

JOL1

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121291857#Comment_121291857

By all means people should understand the features (and small print) but then it is personal choice for everyone to make be that car pension or accommodation to use your examples.

In terms of predictability of the depreciation curve...I think Tesla and its price volatility is a prime example of debunking that theory. People buying now understandably regard themselves as winners but those that bought prior to 2022 will have seen massive deprecation, impacting the value of their cars second hand value (hence earlier comment about early PCP guaranteed value being a positive feature which essentially has transferred the risk of falling value of their cars to the financer. Just example of why things are not always black or white.

traco

I think some manufacturers are using PCP to faciltate major price increases on models. Some ICEs giving very high residuals and then the equivalent replacement three years later has a massive uptick in price. VW Tiguan is now best part of 60k and in 2021 was high 40's. The PCP model seems to be a bit of a runaway train to me.

listermint

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121293512#Comment_121293512

Tbh 2021 and 2023 are complete worlds apart in terms of inflation and parts and delays and covid. Pointing to pcp solely is not accurate

evankelly__

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121282503#Comment_121282503

Thanks for this!

Actually picking my black one up on Tuesday and can't wait for it! Charger is installed and the Diesel I had was sold last night so it's going to be a really long weekend ahead!

sk8board

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121293512#Comment_121293512

This is the reason we’re paying down the pcp balloon - it’s €12k, and have €325 pm repayments on 0%.

if we change to a €62k ID4, the repayments almost double to over €600, with 3-5% interest rate, and the balloon becomes €30k in 3 yeasts time - that’s suddenly a material amount of money to just pay off if you need to.

the recent uptick in car prices is definitely creating a pcp balloon time bomb; or what will more than likely happen - people handing back the keys and the market is flooded with cars selling for their GMV

mfceiling

The sad reality of moving to a house with no driveway.

I'm now sitting on 20% battery and I've to collect my daughters from Halloween parties shortly. By the time I get home I'll be on around 14%.

Wife wants to move lots more stuff tomorrow afternoon after the marathon is over. I might let her have the car and then the realisation that the battery is almost empty might trigger something in her brain.

I haven't really got time to drive to Sandyford a couple of times a week for a charge and I'm not paying the extortionate rates ESB are charging.

I'm definitely not changing to petrol or diesel now. That would be like moving from an iPhone to a Nokia 6310.

Redfox25

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121296293#Comment_121296293

Granny charger out the window for a slow top up or is it too far away?

mfceiling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121296321#Comment_121296321

It's pay parking outside so no guarantee you'd ever get the spot. Plus the footpath is a public one and is almost 3 metres wide.

Gumbo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121296432#Comment_121296432

Anything else close by?

Lidl, easygo etc?

mfceiling

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/121296499#Comment_121296499

Tesco in Rathmines has an ESB 22,kw charger but you've to pay for the parking (and the carpark is heavily monitored) so it's a double hit!!

mailforkev

My Mrs’ 5 year plan of us moving to a gaff in Ranelagh got totally scuppered by the move to electric. As of next week we’re a two EV household so a driveway is a complete necessity. I’m not giving one up to move a few KMs down the road for the sake of it so we’ll be in our current house for a good while more.