Covid 19 Part XXVI- 50,993 ROI (1,852 deaths) 28,040 NI (621 deaths) (19/10) Read OP

MerlinSouthDub

Stheno wrote: »

The posters point is that in the space of three days NPHET went from saying that there was no need to add to level three to then advocating level 5

It's an awful pity we didn't move to Level 3 nationwide a week earlier - I feel it would have made a huge difference. Level 3 was showing signs of working in Dublin but inevitably the surge in infections elsewhere then impacted Dublin. NPHET are not without blame in how we've ended up where we are now. Still, I'm optimistic that we still see improving figures this week, stabilisation I think is very possible.

is_that_so

Goldengirl wrote: »

Obviously you still believe it was NPHET who leaked?
Government are responsible , HSE are also and are accountable to the people .
NPHET are an advisory group and their advice is being ignored by the government , at their peril.
Schoolchildren have already brought legal action over their Leaving Certs , do you not think that when grieving families get through their grief they will be looking at who's to blame , and it won't be The Virus , Stephen Donnelly !

I really don't care who leaked it, because leaks happen all the time. They should be obliged to clearly explain that chain of events from 2-5, IMO.
A bit dramatic with the peril as Donnelly can dissolve them tomorrow if he chooses, he has that power.
If I were at LC I'd be bringing a case as well. My view was always to run the exams and have that graded mess as a backup for those who didn't want to. They did it in Spain in far worse conditions and with much larger numbers.

quartz1

I think a lockdown is necessary and not before time . I also feel sorry for the many people affected ......elderly, business owners and people losing jobs. ...let's hope most people can do their best to limit the spread and get this over with. .
Sadly even a vaccine won't be a quick fix...many won't take it and it may only be 50 or 60 per cent effective . Perhaps a curative drug will come along but it's all going to take time .. we can't.lockdown now then open up and enter immediately into a cycle taking us back to lockdown again .
It's all a mess

PsychoPete

I've no problem with going to level 4 or 5 or put in place whatever restrictions they want as long they are enforced correctly. If we've learnt anything it's that people can't be trusted so you need to take control out of their hands to control the situation

FintanMcluskey

Miike wrote: »

According to who?

According to the protocol it has to meet for approval from the information I can read online.

I am completely open to correction on that, however

Eod100

If people have to wear a mask when popping in to the shop and getting a lift with anyone outside their household, think they should be suggesting it in all indoor workplaces too. Obviously school staff and hospital staff likely are but needs to be recommended everywhere indoor at this stage.

Rrrrrr2

quartz1 wrote: »

I think a lockdown is necessary and not before time . I also feel sorry for the many people affected ......elderly, business owners and people losing jobs. ...let's hope most people can do their best to limit the spread and get this over with. .
Sadly even a vaccine won't be a quick fix...many won't take it and it may only be 50 or 60 per cent effective . Perhaps a curative drug will come along but it's all going to take time .. we can't.lockdown now then open up and enter immediately into a cycle taking us back to lockdown again .
It's all a mess

And let me see- youre not one of these people directly effected? Seen as you “feel sorry” for them I’m guessing not.

is_that_so

Eod100 wrote: »

If people have to wear a mask when popping in to the shop and getting a lift with anyone outside their household, think they should be suggesting it in all indoor workplaces too. Obviously school staff and hospital staff likely are but needs to be recommended everywhere indoor at this stage.

Where did that anyone outside your household rule come from? Does your indoors extend to people driving alone in cars?

Stheno

Miike wrote: »

https://assets.gov.ie/90993/73b45080-0fc5-44fb-9495-79ea63665e45.pdf

Not for you specifically Stheno, but incase anyone would like to read their rationale for the turn around and subsequent recommendation.

I've read that Mike

I do think it was just handled badly, maybe without Holohan NPHET didn't think they could advocate as they wanted to

Either way its water under the bridge, personally I think the handling of this by all (NPHET,HSE, Paul Reid in particular and the government) has been appalling

The lack of clear consistent messaging alone is appalling

It feels like we are just lurching along week to week with no clear direction, no enforcement or incentives for people to comply and people are confused tired and frustrated

Spanish Eyes

We are definitely being prepped for a big bang, well bigger than we suspected given the shenanigans of L3 and L5 and all that.

I do realise that businesses will be severely impacted if they close them, which they shouldn't if shops do what they did back in March and only allow a one in one out system and mandatory masks. I'm talking DIY and the likes. Not sure about nail bars, hairdressers and barbers, gyms etc. Very close contacts there. But then again who knows what the transmission is?

Get it over with. Sharp shock, CLEAR rules, good roadmap and financial supports and I think people will buy in for now anyway. It's the chopping and changing from 5 distinct levels to bits of the last, bits of the present and bits of the next one that is driving people mad.

Curfew should definitely be brought in for two weeks even. 9pm. That'll put manners on some of the pups congregating till all hours. And close the off licenses at 4pm.

Yes I know I will get a hammering for posting this, but am totally fed up now like lots of people, and it's better to just get on with it and try to cope.

theballz

Nation wide level 4.

octsol

How many positive swabs today

Cluedo Monopoly

I think it would help if there were defined metrics to show exactly when a level upgrade or downgrade was required. I think it would take the guesswork out of it and also avoid the needless kites and leaks and government dithering.

For example they could have said that we will automatically move from Level 3 to Level 4 when we hit 1000 daily cases or a 14 day incidence rate per 100k of 500 or some such metric.

SusanC10

theballz wrote: »

Nation wide level 4.

Source ?

Boggles

MerlinSouthDub wrote: »

I feel it would have made a huge difference. Level 3 was showing signs of working in Dublin but inevitably the surge in infections elsewhere then impacted Dublin.

How did the "surge" in infections in the West of Ireland or Donegal or wherever else impact Dublin?

Dublin was at level 3, you could only enter the county for work or medical reasons. Plenty left Dublin during that period as well by the way.

This nonsense that Dublin were doing so well on Level 3 and it was the rest of the country that ruined it for them is not based on anything resembling reality.

is_that_so

octsol wrote: »

How many positive swabs today

No reports on a Sunday, you'll have to wait till tomorrow for 48 hour totals but there will be a cases total at the usual time.

SusanC10

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

We are definitely being prepped for a big bang, well bigger than we suspected given the shenanigans of L3 and L5 and all that.

I do realise that businesses will be severely impacted if they close them, which they shouldn't if shops do what they did back in March and only allow a one in one out system and mandatory masks. I'm talking DIY and the likes. Not sure about nail bars, hairdressers and barbers, gyms etc. Very close contacts there. But then again who knows what the transmission is?

Get it over with. Sharp shock, CLEAR rules, good roadmap and financial supports and I think people will buy in for now anyway. It's the chopping and changing from 5 distinct levels to bits of the last, bits of the present and bits of the next one that is driving people mad.

Curfew should definitely be brought in for two weeks even. 9pm. That'll put manners on some of the pups congregating till all hours. And close the off licenses at 4pm.

Yes I know I will get a hammering for posting this, but am totally fed up now like lots of people, and it's better to just get on with it and try to cope.

I am exhausted from it all. But I agree with you.

Eod100

is_that_so wrote: »

Where did that anyone outside your household rule come from? Does your indoors extend to people driving alone in cars?

You can find info here. It's in place a few months afaik. Goes without saying it's not needed if you're in car alone
https://www.gov.ie/en/publication/1b697-covid-19-your-questions-answered/#masksface-coverings

frank8211

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

Remains to be seen if the inter-county championship will actually happen, even if it's technically 'allowed'.

yes and those superspreading events will continue as long as the matches con tinue. The same way as the communion parties continued as long as the churches stayed open. The sportsfield itself mightn't be bad - the churches were we ll controlled - but the carryon afterwards was said to be an issue and its the same with those matches.

Stheno

Cluedo Monopoly wrote: »

I think it would help if there were defined metrics to show exactly when a level upgrade or downgrade was required. I think it would take the guesswork out of it and also avoid the needless kites and leaks and government dithering.

For example they could have said that we will automatically move from Level 3 to Level 4 when we hit 1000 daily cases or a 14 day incidence rate of per 100k of 500 or some such metric.

Thats what Israel did they defined an acceptable R number and reduction of cases to move out of lockdown

Most people bar the ultra Orthodox community complied and they are now lifting restrictions

manniot2

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

We are definitely being prepped for a big bang, well bigger than we suspected given the shenanigans of L3 and L5 and all that.

I do realise that businesses will be severely impacted if they close them, which they shouldn't if shops do what they did back in March and only allow a one in one out system and mandatory masks. I'm talking DIY and the likes. Not sure about nail bars, hairdressers and barbers, gyms etc. Very close contacts there. But then again who knows what the transmission is?

Get it over with. Sharp shock, CLEAR rules, good roadmap and financial supports and I think people will buy in for now anyway. It's the chopping and changing from 5 distinct levels to bits of the last, bits of the present and bits of the next one that is driving people mad.

Curfew should definitely be brought in for two weeks even. 9pm. That'll put manners on some of the pups congregating till all hours. And close the off licenses at 4pm.

Yes I know I will get a hammering for posting this, but am totally fed up now like lots of people, and it's better to just get on with it and try to cope.

sledgehammer to kill a snail. but ok because youre fed up

nimrod86

Eod100 wrote: »

If people have to wear a mask when popping in to the shop and getting a lift with anyone outside their household, think they should be suggesting it in all indoor workplaces too. Obviously school staff and hospital staff likely are but needs to be recommended everywhere indoor at this stage.

My workplace has done this, mandatory face masks on site and they are providing single use ones at entrances if you don't want to use reusable ones.

Initially when they brought in the policy there were medical and religious exemptions, but this has since been scrapped. It's now mandatory with no exceptions to wear a mask on site, except in the canteen or if you are in a personal office.

Stheno

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

We are definitely being prepped for a big bang, well bigger than we suspected given the shenanigans of L3 and L5 and all that.

I do realise that businesses will be severely impacted if they close them, which they shouldn't if shops do what they did back in March and only allow a one in one out system and mandatory masks. I'm talking DIY and the likes. Not sure about nail bars, hairdressers and barbers, gyms etc. Very close contacts there. But then again who knows what the transmission is?

Get it over with. Sharp shock, CLEAR rules, good roadmap and financial supports and I think people will buy in for now anyway. It's the chopping and changing from 5 distinct levels to bits of the last, bits of the present and bits of the next one that is driving people mad.

Curfew should definitely be brought in for two weeks even. 9pm. That'll put manners on some of the pups congregating till all hours. And close the off licenses at 4pm.

Yes I know I will get a hammering for posting this, but am totally fed up now like lots of people, and it's better to just get on with it and try to cope.

If they do what you suggest it might get people on board

But out of four houses where I live two of them both people in their late 70s never complied first time around and publicly said they would not and one of them had lunch parties every single day

is_that_so

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

We are definitely being prepped for a big bang, well bigger than we suspected given the shenanigans of L3 and L5 and all that.

I do realise that businesses will be severely impacted if they close them, which they shouldn't if shops do what they did back in March and only allow a one in one out system and mandatory masks. I'm talking DIY and the likes. Not sure about nail bars, hairdressers and barbers, gyms etc. Very close contacts there. But then again who knows what the transmission is?

Get it over with. Sharp shock, CLEAR rules, good roadmap and financial supports and I think people will buy in for now anyway. It's the chopping and changing from 5 distinct levels to bits of the last, bits of the present and bits of the next one that is driving people mad.

Curfew should definitely be brought in for two weeks even. 9pm. That'll put manners on some of the pups congregating till all hours. And close the off licenses at 4pm.

Yes I know I will get a hammering for posting this, but am totally fed up now like lots of people, and it's better to just get on with it and try to cope.

Just as long as you're braced for the LONG sharp shock as it will not be 3 weeks nor even 6 weeks. This is till Christmas (and beyond).

Spanish Eyes

SusanC10 wrote: »

I am exhausted from it all. But I agree with you.

So are most people. Lance the boil and give us the worst case scenario and use some of the budget money to support people again. There should be no financial distress for workers obliged to stay at home because of a Government decision.

Anyway, am weary like yourself, but the next phase seems inevitable now.

Spanish Eyes

is_that_so wrote: »

Just as long as you're braced for the LONG sharp shock as it will not be 3 weeks nor even 6 week one. This is till Christmas.

Possibly, but we have to start tomorrow really. No more pussy footing around anymore it is helping no one.

mountgomery burns

Stheno wrote: »

The posters point is that in the space of three days NPHET went from saying that there was no need to add to level three to then advocating level 5

Agreed and bear in mind on the 30th of April the government released a 5 phase plan for opening Ireland.

The rationale behind the length of it, longest phasing out of restrictions in Europe, was to assess the impact of each relaxation to make the reopening more targeted and sustainable.

And yet, with two months to assess that and plan for the release of "Living with Covid", we end up with that farce you described. No clear targets and poor planning has played it's part as much as those that cannot follow the guidance.

Happy4all

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

So are most people. Lance the boil and give us the worst case scenario and use some of the budget money to support people again. There should be no financial distress for workers obliged to stay at home because of a Government decision.

Anyway, am weary like yourself, but the next phase seems inevitable now.

I think they will try level 4 rather than go to level 5

Spanish Eyes

manniot2 wrote: »

sledgehammer to kill a snail. but ok because youre fed up

What would YOU suggest so?

FintanMcluskey

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

We are definitely being prepped for a big bang, well bigger than we suspected given the shenanigans of L3 and L5 and all that.

I do realise that businesses will be severely impacted if they close them, which they shouldn't if shops do what they did back in March and only allow a one in one out system and mandatory masks. I'm talking DIY and the likes. Not sure about nail bars, hairdressers and barbers, gyms etc. Very close contacts there. But then again who knows what the transmission is?

Get it over with. Sharp shock, CLEAR rules, good roadmap and financial supports and I think people will buy in for now anyway. It's the chopping and changing from 5 distinct levels to bits of the last, bits of the present and bits of the next one that is driving people mad.

Curfew should definitely be brought in for two weeks even. 9pm. That'll put manners on some of the pups congregating till all hours. And close the off licenses at 4pm.

Yes I know I will get a hammering for posting this, but am totally fed up now like lots of people, and it's better to just get on with it and try to cope.

What will it achieve?

What is the quantifiable point that the curfew will be lifted?

I’m just curious, the WHO have taken a different stance it seems towards the value or at least the point of lockdowns it seems.