Covid 19 Part XXVI- 50,993 ROI (1,852 deaths) 28,040 NI (621 deaths) (19/10) Read OP

frank8211

podgeandrodge wrote: »

I'd prefer to see a strategy of Close Schools for 3 weeks, keep pubs etc. open - and then the opposite. At least see where the transmission is occuring most. Doing both leaves no conclusion.

But we done want to make the obvious too transparent. Better to cloud it and blame the pubs! The schools are the last to be outed at all costs!

Gods Gift

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Well if someone knows.... are betting shops open and is horse racing still going ahead. Just wondered.

Gyms? Not that I ever crossed their sweaty smelly doors anyway lol.

Gamblers are WFH now.

Goldengirl

Gael23 wrote: »

How are ICUs operating with Covid patients and the ordinary heart attacks/people recovering from serious surgery that goes on day to day?

Covid patients are nursed in separate ICU areas or in isolation rooms depending on numbers .
Separate staff, equipment everything .
Very dangerous if the other already very sick patients get cross infected .

Eod100

Gael23 wrote: »

How are ICUs operating with Covid patients and the ordinary heart attacks/people recovering from serious surgery that goes on day to day?

Apparently if an ICU has more than 2 covid patients, other patients in ICU need to be moved to operating theatres. I'm not sure is that due to staffing issues or infection control or both. https://twitter.com/Antcon7062/status/1313817222905724937?s=19

vafankillar

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Well if someone knows.... are betting shops open and is horse racing still going ahead. Just wondered.

Gyms? Not that I ever crossed their sweaty smelly doors anyway lol.

GYMS are open, but would close any higher than level 3.

I joined back a few weeks ago and it's the only thing keeping me sane right now.
very well done I have to say too, have to book a slot to use with limited capacity, lots of sanitizer stands which you have to wipe down everything you use after, and there's a temperature check machine on the way in.


If we go to level 4 I can still do outside pints, but i'd have to stop going to the gym, my discipline levels with go down so badly

mountgomery burns

frank8211 wrote: »

so why are sports practitioners from all types so frequently in the news about positive tests

Because it's not news when Thomas Ryan from Banagher tests positive but it is when Cristiano Ronaldo does

frank8211

billybonkers wrote: »

Haha yeah you're passport won't be in anyone's house. They can do the work from home no problem

There is no reason why most civil servants work cannot be done from home. Some presence in the office may be needed to meet customers and occasional visits by others to collect post/ post stuff/ but rare and brief. That way the spacing issue in the office is sorted

Eod100

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Is this for real? And if there is a dramatic surge to three Covid patients? What an incompetent shower.

He's a consultant gastroenterologist so would think he would be in the know. Think patients already in ICU have to be moved. ICU capacity is a bit of a false figure if that's the case.

Cluedo Monopoly

mountgomery burns wrote: »

Because it's not news when Thomas Ryan from Banagher tests positive but it is when Cristiano Ronaldo does

Did Tommy get it in Lyons bar after the county final? He is a hoor for the pints.

Gods Gift

Which county final was Chris ronaldo at?

Non solum non ambulabit

political analyst wrote: »

Wimbledon usually takes place in late June and early July - the lockdowns in the UK and Ireland commenced in late March. The UK government couldn't predict what the situation would be in 2 or 3 months - even having only players and staff go to Wimbledon may have been too risky - and it may have been spooked by the opprobrium in the aftermath of Cheltenham and a Six-Nations match.

Wimbledon and the Open golf had pandemic insurance. They cashed in the policy and made millions. If they went ahead without crowds they would have made way less money.

Strumms

Cluedo Monopoly wrote: »

Did Tommy get it in Lyons bar after the county final? He is a hoor for the pints.

No but Ronaldo did.

Goldengirl

Eod100 wrote: »

Apparently if an ICU has more than 2 covid patients, other patients in ICU need to be moved to operating theatres. I'm not sure is that due to staffing issues or infection control or both. https://twitter.com/Antcon7062/status/1313817222905724937?s=19

Primarily infection control.
That is if a suspected case has not been isolated already and the entire unit is deemed contaminated.
Some hospitals have separate isolation areas, or even a second I CU , others convert theatre recovery or part of it to a functioning ICU .
Obviously this has implications for theatre capacity and staffing in the latter .

MelbourneMan

frank8211 wrote: »

But we done want to make the obvious too transparent. Better to cloud it and blame the pubs! The schools are the last to be outed at all costs!

It might be helpful here also perhaps to take a slightly different view of this. There is a general tendency to over simply virus spread into having an impact/not having an impact, or safe/unsafe, or this is safer than that therefore we should not be be prevented from doing this. etc.
But it cannot be looked at in this black and white manner.

The chain of transmission has many many links, and all contribute to the overall spread and R0. Individual factors have greater or lesser contributions, and also have different levels of importance to society in general. It is never true to say schools or pubs are or are not having an impact. Whereever people interface, there is an impact.

The task of the politicians is to weigh up the sum of all factors contributing to spread, and weigh up the the impact on society, health, and the economy of curtailing these activities to varying degrees, and balancing those two elements with the capability of the health service to handle the caseload. The data and advice on the virus element is provided to them by NPHET.

It is not easy I can assure you.

Nobody is 'blaming' pubs as you state it. They are simply a very strong case of the benefits of limiting/closing them, overwhelmingly outweighing the cost.

I hope this clarifies.

igCorcaigh

Goldengirl wrote: »

Primarily infection control.
That is if a suspected case has not been isolated already and the entire unit is deemed contaminated.
Some hospitals have separate isolation areas, or even a second I CU , others convert theatre recovery or part of it to a functioning ICU .
Obviously this has implications for theatre capacity and staffing in the latter .

If ICU unit is not deemed contaminated, are existing patients removed?

Goldengirl

UrbanFret wrote: »

I take your point but on the other hand they weren't new admissions because of Covid.

What difference does it make whether they did or not ?
Apart from the obvious disappointment and distress to both the patients, their families and the hospital staff involved .
These are people infected who are already vulnerable and now are 4 times more at risk of complications than they were now they have Covid .
These people still have to counted whether they got it in hospital or not!
They are doubly sick , and are taking up hospital beds .
There is too much concentration on numbers here.
It has always been stressed that if numbers in the community are rising it is more difficult to prevent those vulnerable in nursing homes from getting it .
Hospitals are the same risk as a very high percentage of those in hospital are elderly or vulnerable.

Wolf359f

Dublin hospital patients still increasing at a really low rate, but the rest of the country, it's a scary looking trend.

Renjit

Wolf359f wrote: »

Dublin hospital patients still increasing at a really low rate, but the rest of the country, it's a scary looking trend.

It's the "we are low on numbers, what could go wrong in having a bit of fun?" outlook

giveitholly

Wolf359f wrote: »

Dublin hospital patients still increasing at a really low rate, but the rest of the country, it's a scary looking trend.

Would the outbreaks in Cavan and Cork hospitals be a reason for such high figures outside dublin?

rob316

There will be no level 5, it ain't in the budget announced today. Level 3 with some tweaks and we'll have to make do.

Goldengirl

igCorcaigh wrote: »

If ICU unit is not deemed contaminated, are existing patients removed?

Unless those patients have been treated as infectious from the start and isolated , all staff going in to that room kept away from any other non Covid area, the unit is contaminated.
Infection control in the hospital would have strict guidelines about this and would not be taking chances with any patients .
Anybody requiring ICU is already vulnerable, even if just post surgery .

Wolf359f

giveitholly wrote: »

Would the outbreaks in Cavan and Cork hospitals be a reason for such high figures outside dublin?

Cavan hospital alone accounts for 20% of all hospital cases outside of Dublin (31/150)

caveat emptor

If it get's in it causes a myriad of problems. We do remember

• the PPE issues,
• the health care workers health care workers getting sick even dying

It's a systematic risk which has cascading failures. (I use the word in a system sense not a personal one)

I don't know why there wasn't one hospital designated as an infectious disease hospital going into this second wave. Strict test and entry to other hospitals with clear infection control measures. Maybe not practical from an operational perspective but this thing saps hospitals until they are only treating covid patients. Happened in every country in the world.

Other countries had tents outside hospitals to ensure, infection was kept out and then people transferred to other hospitals where everyone in PPE etc.

People saying it is stabilising based on one data point. While encouraging does not nullify the overall trend. It's not a good one.

vafankillar

do we actually know what the cause of the rise in cases is? everyone seems to say there's no evidence for this and no evidence for that.


two biggest jumps seems to be ever schools opened and every everywhere outside of dublin was allowed open wet pubs. tho i imagine it was more the relaxed attitude the wet pubs opening brought allowed than them necessarily themserlves

Widdensushi

Goldengirl wrote: »

What difference does it make whether they did or not ?
Apart from the obvious disappointment and distress to both the patients, their families and the hospital staff involved .
These are people infected who are already vulnerable and now are 4 times more at risk of complications than they were now they have Covid .
These people still have to counted whether they got it in hospital or not!
They are doubly sick , and are taking up hospital beds .
There is too much concentration on numbers here.
It has always been stressed that if numbers in the community are rising it is more difficult to prevent those vulnerable in nursing homes from getting it .
Hospitals are the same risk as a very high percentage of those in hospital are elderly or vulnerable.

It makes a difference on how many people this is making so ill that they have to be hospitalised, if the numbers in hospital with covid increases by 100 in a week it is very bleak with rising numbers, if 50 of those were already in hospital with other issues but caught covid it is also very serious but is a very different situation.

Billy Ocean

frank8211 wrote: »

so why are sports practitioners from all types so frequently in the news about positive tests

well there travelling all over Europe for a start, the GAA bashing is a bit narrow minded and suits alot of agendas, the mentality of tearing the backside out of it after your finished championship needs to change in short to medium term, little or no issue from matches themselves, any health expert ive noticed has said outdoor exercise is a good thing currently.

Maybe avoid a scrum in rugby alright...

igCorcaigh

Goldengirl wrote: »

Unless those patients have been treated as infectious from the start and isolated , all staff going in to that room kept away from any other non Covid area, the unit is contaminated.
Infection control in the hospital would have strict guidelines about this and would not be taking chances with any patients .
Anybody requiring ICU is already vulnerable, even if just post surgery .

Thanks, so the existing virus -ve patients are removed and the ICU now treated as a covid area?
Will there be room for the existing patients to be moved?

Goldengirl

igCorcaigh wrote: »

Thanks, so the existing virus -ve patients are removed and the ICU now treated as a covid area?
Will there be room for the existing patients to be moved?

Depends on the hospital . A few posts back .

vafankillar

vafankillar wrote: »

do we actually know what the cause of the rise in cases is? everyone seems to say there's no evidence for this and no evidence for that.


two biggest jumps seems to be ever schools opened and every everywhere outside of dublin was allowed open wet pubs. tho i imagine it was more the relaxed attitude the wet pubs opening brought allowed than them necessarily themserlves

There was no big jumps, just steady growth from June as data posted by Caveat kindly showed earlier. As the growth increased the frequency and severity of large clusters increased giving the impression of large jumps, but it has remained at a steady 4% daily growth on average

The non Dublin pubs were only open two weeks so barely had a chance to have any impact

bb1234567

Deaths down to a trickle in Brazil, less than 300 on a weekday, lowest daily death toll since late April