Changing Covid situation- how do you plan for 2021 races

Kurt Godelfish

The Event Guidelines have just been published... and I'd imagine every RD looked at the wave guidelines, noticed Version 1.0, and calmly waits for Version 2.0 to be published.

Wave starts can include 80 athletes- rolling start with 15s between each athlete, and then 30mins between last athlete in Wave 1, and first athlete in Wave 2. That's 50mins before 81 athletes have even started... and the faster guys start at the front.

Good luck getting any road closures, safety kayaks, or marshals for those sort of timeframes.

BTH

Ironman obviously finally doing the right thing. Received an email at 4am, they have refunded my entry fee.

tunney

BTH wrote: »

Ironman obviously finally doing the right thing. Received an email at 4am, they have refunded my entry fee.

For which Ironman?

BTH

tunney wrote: »

For which Ironman?

Aix en Provence 70.3 2020 originally.

Then transferred to the 2021 race.

Then changed to a voucher against any future French IM race.

Refund out of the blue last night.

tunney

BTH wrote: »

Aix en Provence 70.3 2020 originally.

Then transferred to the 2021 race.

Then changed to a voucher against any future French IM race.

Refund out of the blue last night.

I did the same for IM Austria. No refund for me.

woody1

Kurt Godelfish wrote: »

The Event Guidelines have just been published... and I'd imagine every RD looked at the wave guidelines, noticed Version 1.0, and calmly waits for Version 2.0 to be published.

Wave starts can include 80 athletes- rolling start with 15s between each athlete, and then 30mins between last athlete in Wave 1, and first athlete in Wave 2. That's 50mins before 81 athletes have even started... and the faster guys start at the front.

Good luck getting any road closures, safety kayaks, or marshals for those sort of timeframes.

i see 2 provinces anounced today they wont be running their race this year, i expect a lot of other clubs not to do anything this year either ,

woody1

Kurt Godelfish wrote: »

The Event Guidelines have just been published... and I'd imagine every RD looked at the wave guidelines, noticed Version 1.0, and calmly waits for Version 2.0 to be published.

Wave starts can include 80 athletes- rolling start with 15s between each athlete, and then 30mins between last athlete in Wave 1, and first athlete in Wave 2. That's 50mins before 81 athletes have even started... and the faster guys start at the front.

Good luck getting any road closures, safety kayaks, or marshals for those sort of timeframes.

where did you see these kurt,was there a more detailed version sent out other than the one thats online

Kurt Godelfish

woody1 wrote: »

i see 2 provinces anounced today they wont be running their race this year, i expect a lot of other clubs not to do anything this year either ,

Thats a shame, its a great race.

Pikeman in Wexford just announced they are moved to Sept 19th. Don't know if its connected, but no-one will want to host a race under those guidelines as they stand.

Kurt Godelfish

woody1 wrote: »

where did you see these kurt,was there a more detailed version sent out other than the one thats online

Its in the guidelines document linked on their homepage

"In order to facilitate a maximum of more than 100 participants:
→ Maximum of 80 participants per wave.
→ Wave starts must be rolling starts with a minimum
of 15 seconds between participants.
→ Each wave must be separated by at least 30 mins between
the last participant starting in a given wave and the
first participant starting in the following wave. (This will greatly reduce the distribution of athletes on the course and in and around the finish / transition / recovery area).
→ EOC should segregate participants by estimated average speed and set the fastest wave off first."

woody1

thanks i see it now, we have a zoom club meeting later, be good to have the right info

peter kern

Kurt Godelfish wrote: »

The Event Guidelines have just been published... and I'd imagine every RD looked at the wave guidelines, noticed Version 1.0, and calmly waits for Version 2.0 to be published.

Wave starts can include 80 athletes- rolling start with 15s between each athlete, and then 30mins between last athlete in Wave 1, and first athlete in Wave 2. That's 50mins before 81 athletes have even started... and the faster guys start at the front.

Good luck getting any road closures, safety kayaks, or marshals for those sort of timeframes.

kurt are you going to argue with yourself on boards

StaggerLee

Any update from Sheephaven?

Kurt Godelfish

peter kern wrote: »

kurt are you going to argue with yourself on boards

Now now Peter, we never argue with anyone who has an AG shirt!:D

What do you think of the wave proposals? I was hoping for something more pragmatic myself, thought the wave system could be utilised to keep everyone apart but effectively the 30mins break between waves means several staggered races on the day. Fine for athletes; not so good for Marshalls I would have thought.

EDit

BTH wrote: »

Aix en Provence 70.3 2020 originally.

Then transferred to the 2021 race.

Then changed to a voucher against any future French IM race.

Refund out of the blue last night.

Was the refund for the race to your CC?

I got 2 emails this morning, one is related to a small refund of the medal engraving fees that it says is going to my CC, the other (also described as a refund) says it is refunded to “Credit Balance”, which i am assuming is the voucher. That said, there is nothing on my Active account about having any credit.

peter kern

Kurt Godelfish wrote: »

Now now Peter, we never argue with anyone who has an AG shirt!:D

What do you think of the wave proposals? I was hoping for something more pragmatic myself, thought the wave system could be utilised to keep everyone apart but effectively the 30mins break between waves means several staggered races on the day. Fine for athletes; not so good for Marshalls I would have thought.

but better than no racing

so whats out there at the moement
austria running a race with i thin 1700 people you can only race with a corona test withn 72 hours before the race

germany had a race cancelled with 1000 people just after they thought they had gotten their permit. rule seems to be races can be hold if 7 day incidence rate is bellow 50 . the county with the biggest part of rate 3 weeks ahead of races had 46 and the other county that had some bike course had 55 both coming down permision was not granted
italy has races and there seems to be starts of 4 people with 5 sec gaps now i think thats the best way to do.

but again i dont see the irish way the worst way and i think we will be soon where we were last year and then i think at least in august we will be 500 people .

to me it seems a bit the current rule is a bit like when the teenager goes the first time to night club and is suppoesd to be back by 9 pm everybody knows this is not going to really happen but everybody feels good aobut it henceforth clear version 1 note .
i looked a bit around gaa clubs and the rules where definitely stretched ...
so i think things will be better than last year.

the thing is for instance in poland a lot of races go over 2.5 days
friday aquathon sat sprint and oly sunday half etc and that works ...
and i like this as long races dont overlap. same in france they do this a lot too and it works and of course ireland cant do it ... right ...

rodriquez

StaggerLee wrote: »

Any update from Sheephaven?

updated on their facebook yesterday ... decision will be made early next week

Kurt Godelfish

peter kern wrote: »

to me it seems a bit the current rule is a bit like when the teenager goes the first time to night club and is suppoesd to be back by 9 pm everybody knows this is not going to really happen but everybody feels good aobut it henceforth clear version 1 note .
i looked a bit around gaa clubs and the rules where definitely stretched ...
so i think things will be better than last year.

Good reply Peter, unfortunately I tend to have an AngloSaxon view when it comes to rules but I like your way of thinking better. Fingers crossed.

peter kern

Kurt Godelfish wrote: »

Good reply Peter, unfortunately I tend to have an AngloSaxon view when it comes to rules but I like your way of thinking better. Fingers crossed.

do trump and johnson represent anglo saxon view of rules ...
you have to explain to me what you mean by that.

tunney

peter kern wrote: »

do trump and johnson represent anglo saxon view of rules ...
you have to explain to me what you mean by that.

Yeah me too.
No clue what you mean kurt

Kurt Godelfish

tunney wrote: »

Yeah me too.
No clue what you mean kurt

AngloSaxon view on rules are more defined and rigid, and typically Irish views are that rules are there to be bend/broken/ignored.

I could have been clearer, was just back from a long early run.

peter kern

i do not think Ti will bend rules but i do think version 1 will be changed rather quickly into a version 2 by july or mid july .
in a way version 1 is already more flexible than version 1 in the uk which was a limit of 100 before going to 500 . if i see this correctly you can already do a 500 people race in ireland if you have the 30 min gap intrestingly france also seems to a a gap between waves their waves at least for one departmern are 400 people and then 30 mim break.
so looks like ireland is not the only country to so so .

Kurt Godelfish

So if there's 4 waves that means Wave 4 starters have to wait around an extra 90mins before they start, also Wave 1 finishers have to wait around an extra 90mins before they can enter trans to pick up their bike.

Where are they all going to congregate in the meantime?

peter kern

Kurt Godelfish wrote: »

So if there's 4 waves that means Wave 4 starters have to wait around an extra 90mins before they start, also Wave 1 finishers have to wait around an extra 90mins before they can enter trans to pick up their bike.

Where are they all going to congregate in the meantime?

you sound like as if you have forgoten that you have done lough cutra ...
i if you did you really have not to look further than lough cutra where they have a divided transition zone thats quite transient .
or i could bring up many tri festivals in europe that have up to 8 races over a weekend. its not really something i like but its nothing new.
did 70.3 ireland 2019 not have a 30 min gap due to fog, it worked as well.

Kurt Godelfish

Well at least I'm not arguing with myself!:D

Lough Cutra Trans is the best I've ever seen, and if it helps square this circle then all is well and good. I'd still wonder how it would operate with active bikes in at the same time as active bikes out.

There is no need though- the guidelines as they stand won't stop Covid spread any better than just letting 400 athletes off rolling start with 2s gap. Three of the early races have already postponed after these guidelines were announced- TI will need to change to something more practical before other races go ahead. No point saying we can race from June 7th and then releasing guidelines that make events impractical.

peter kern

Kurt Godelfish wrote: »

Well at least I'm not arguing with myself!:D

Lough Cutra Trans is the best I've ever seen, and if it helps square this circle then all is well and good. I'd still wonder how it would operate with active bikes in at the same time as active bikes out.

There is no need though- the guidelines as they stand won't stop Covid spread any better than just letting 400 athletes off rolling start with 2s gap. Three of the early races have already postponed after these guidelines were announced- TI will need to change to something more practical before other races go ahead. No point saying we can race from June 7th and then releasing guidelines that make events impractical.

did you speak with the race organicers why they cancelled or postponed or are you assuming what their reason is?

Kurt Godelfish

I'd imagine there are many reasons why a race might be cancelled/postponed. It's my assumption the current guidelines add to those reasons.

StaggerLee

I’m spoke to 1 organiser who is trying to decide whether to go ahead or not in August. He cited following as limitations ...

1 limit on number of entrants due to restrictions - waves etc
2 Hard to get sponsors on board in current climate
3 profitability due to above
4 Safety of participants, marshals, general public
5 general uncertainty around variants and vaccines
6 If public / local council will support the race taking up space on the day - roads, footpaths etc.

It’s much easier to cancel than go ahead for a club race.

Kurt Godelfish

Lack of staff/marshals will be an issue too. To give an example, there's a hill race I RD most years, they just announced a new calendar after the sports guidelines announced and I got a phone call asking was I available to RD? No can do as I'm meant to do a (rescheduled) Tri that weekend. My mate who alternates RD with me is also racing that weekend... it'll be very hard to shoehorn so many events into a few weeks. In a volunteer-heavy sport like Triathlon it'll be especially harder to get sufficient support this summer.

Bertje14

Sheephaven has been cancelled. Possibly rescheduled till September. That really has put a spanner in my woodworks. My next race is Tyrone (up North so I reckon it will go ahead). I was luckily enough to get my hands (not fully yet but good chance) on at Lost Sheep entry. End of August so they won't be able to move an awful lot further down the calendar.

RacoonQueen

Wonder what will happen with September races now too, no point in everyone rescheduling to that time of year. Then races that are on will have issues get volunteers if it is the only time their members can race themselves.