Covid 19 Part XXVII- 62,002 ROI (1,915 deaths) 39,609 NI (724 deaths) (02/11) Read OP

forumdedum

The HorsesMouth wrote: »

Jim o Callaghan one of the first politicians coming out to say that we need to accept people are going to die in a trade off for the economy not collapsing. On Claire Byrne now

Thanks for this. He will never get my vote in future.

Loafing Oaf

ThunbergsAreGo wrote: »

Actually the biggest problem is its asymptomatic nature, which means that lad could have affected many many more by just sitting on a plane unawares.

That makes it almost impossible to trace

I was thinking about this yesterday. I was eating outside at McDonalds and there were four lads chatting near my table with no masks. If I picked up the virus off one of them, how would that ever be traced? Presumably if I got a positive diagnosis I would tell the contact tracers I was was in McDonalds Castlebar between 1.15 and 1.30 on Wednesday, but what could McDonalds do with that info, beyond informing staff on duty at the time?

Supercell

wadacrack wrote: »

https://twitter.com/segal_eran/status/1318614894657286146

That is super promising news, very interesting twitter discussion as to the reasoning around Israel's second lockdown success this time round. Hopefully we will start to see the same in a couple of weeks time or less.
Only real difference with Ireland is they closed the schools the second time as well but we haven't, i guess we will find out soon enough whether they really are an important factor.

Longing

seamus wrote: »

The residents do sleep.

It is possible, they would sleep when the residents sleep.

You'd be utterly shagged though.

What dream world you living in. Go back to sleep

polesheep

seamus wrote: »

The residents do sleep.

It is possible, they would sleep when the residents sleep.

You'd be utterly shagged though.

No, it's not possible Seamus and wouldn't happen. Residents don't all sleep at the same time plus the tweet stated that almost all of them are Covid positive. There is more to the story.

is_that_so

Kivaro wrote: »

And this is one example why the HSE is such a disaster in Ireland. Even with the thousands of middle-management folder-holders in the well-funded organisation, they cannot even figure out how to carry out basic healthcare processes in this country.

Quoting the full tweet from the doctor this morning:
This is an absolute disgrace, and those on the top should hang their heads in shame. Donnelly should resign, as he has shown that he is not capable to do the job.

Well that'll be a shock to him that a care home he's probably never even heard of should make him resign. Some care homes have not been good on infection control and some are just not fit for purpose anyway and should be closed.

Paddygreen

is_that_so wrote: »

He is a very self-motivated individual who writes his own press releases!

Stephen is great in all fairness guys but he is no Simon C who had the late great Peter Suds as his mentor, I think Stephen got Barry Cowan. He’s got the look I suppose, FF created a very good replica of Simon but the software was cobbled together in a hurry and just stuffed in there any old way I’d say.

stephenjmcd

manniot2 wrote: »

The story on RTE today about the uselessness of these vaccines needs to printed and posted to everyone in this country. We need to wake up quickly, we can ruin the economy/society now for no reason or we can realise that this aint going anywhere and actually live with it!

You actually need to read proper research not a 4 page opinion piece with no review.

Richard Hillman

The HorsesMouth wrote: »

Jim o Callaghan one of the first politicians coming out to say that we need to accept people are going to die in a trade off for the economy not collapsing. On Claire Byrne now

The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few. We are facing economic oblivion that will ruin many many lives for decades.

Plumbthedepths

forumdedum wrote: »

Thanks for this. He will never get my vote in future.

Out of curiosity what do you think would be the health outcome for people in a collapsed economy, healthier?

Allinall

Allinall wrote: »

What's misleading?

This lockdown is nothing like the first one.

Schools open.
Construction open.
Hardware and DIY shops open.
Inter-county GAA going ahead.
Various health services which were stopped in March
5k exercise limit instead of 2k.

But the golf courses are closed, which seems like a strange decision to me.

Qiaonasen

Loafing Oaf wrote: »

I was thinking about this yesterday. I was eating outside at McDonalds and there were four lads chatting near my table with no masks. If I picked up the virus off one of them, how would that ever be traced? Presumably if I got a positive diagnosis I would tell the contact tracers I was was in McDonalds Castlebar between 1.15 and 1.30 on Wednesday, but what could McDonalds do with that info, beyond informing staff on duty at the time?

In Germany they take the phone and contact details of everyone in the restaurant. They will contact them also. Additionally if you both have the covid app installed you would both get notified.

Fuascailteoir

[Deleted User] wrote: »

Signs of stability - green shoots but not an established trend.

Why did they leave cavan out?

Away With The Fairies

[Deleted User] wrote: »

But the golf courses are closed, which seems like a strange decision to me.

It is odd that golf courses are closed. A golfer has a huge open space and I never see golfers gathering in groups to hit the ball. Very strange.

Paddygreen

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

Out of curiosity what do you think would be the health outcome for people in a collapsed economy, healthier?

Prince Charles said it would be grand. The WEF “Great Reset” he heavily promotes will fix everything including racism and climate change. Nothing to worry about guys.

eagle eye

is_that_so wrote:

He's a GP, who got a call from someone. This may not be untrue but it does make you wonder where he's going with it, apart from outrage.

Well I know the man personally. An absolute gentleman and very popular as he works with the Roscommon county football team. If you ever see a match on tv you'll see him on the field dealing with injured players. He's based in Ballygar which is in Galway on the Roscommon border sinus guess this care home is near there, I could be totally wrong about that though.
It's not like him to do something like this so I'd imagine he's been trying to prevent it from happening and is at his wit's end and gotten no help from the HSE.

OwenM

stephenjmcd wrote: »

You actually need to read proper research not a 4 page opinion piece with no review.

Asking people in general to wade through tortuous academic linguistics and ignore the media isn't realistic.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/oct/21/covid-vaccine-immunisation-protection

A vaccine isn't going to fix nearly as much as we think it will, there are a lot of 'if's' and the principle one is efficacy, approval will be granted if, among other things, it displays >=50% efficacy. That's not going to solve much.

Away With The Fairies

Qiaonasen wrote: »

In Germany they take the phone and contact details of everyone in the restaurant. They will contact them also. Additionally if you both have the covid app installed you would both get notified.

Doesn't some countries trace the bank card records as well?

weldoninhio

weldoninhio wrote: »

I can see Dr Daly being "resigned" fairly soon for letting that cat out of the bag.

How can you "resign" an GP working in a private capacity? Need to lay off the deep state conspiracy theories, dude.

polesheep

polesheep wrote: »

I don't advocate at all. I will decide for myself whether or not I should take it. Everyone else can decide for themselves.

So if vaccine got HPRA, MHRA and EMA approval? Would you take it?

is_that_so

eagle eye wrote: »

Well I know the man personally. An absolute gentleman and very popular as he works with the Roscommon county football team. If you ever see a match on tv you'll see him on the field dealing with injured players. He's based in Ballygar which is in Galway on the Roscommon border sinus guess this care home is near there, I could be totally wrong about that though.
It's not like him to do something like this so I'd imagine he's been trying to prevent it from happening and is at his wit's end and gotten no help from the HSE.

As I said elsewhere there are others you can call apart from HSELive. My questions are about the care home itself.

Funsterdelux

Fuascailteoir wrote: »

Why did they leave cavan out?

Because if you keep adding counties youd end up with this

I posted something similar on this thread the last day.

Best case scenario:

The number of infections drop rapidly and the country can open up in 6 weeks, except for the pubs which may have to wait until next year. Many retailers are saved from going under.

The UK avoids a no deal Brexit which will mean Ireland avoids the major impact this will have on its economy.

Trump does not get re-elected, so the plan to 'Make America Great Again' doesn't involve US tech companies relocating to the US from Ireland.

Away With The Fairies

Away With The Fairies wrote: »

It is odd that golf courses are closed. A golfer has a huge open space and I never see golfers gathering in groups to hit the ball. Very strange.

Maybe there are not enough golfers in the Dail.

They are more into the GAA and horse racing?

stephenjmcd

OwenM wrote: »

Asking people in general to wade through tortuous academic linguistics and ignore the media isn't realistic.

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2020/oct/21/covid-vaccine-immunisation-protection

A vaccine isn't going to fix nearly as much as we think it will, there are a lot of 'if's' and the principle one is efficacy, approval will be granted if, among other things, it displays >=50% efficacy. That's not going to solve much.

I've read the guardian yesterday, another opinion piece, lots of ifs and created situations. A vaccine doesn't stop virus circulation in this case, so I'm not sure why people think this finishes it off, the virus is there, its the impact that gets limited.

Well if people want actual good vaccine and data they'll have to go look for it as it doesn't get any coverage through RTE for example.

There's a full vaccine thread on all of this where there's informed posts.

A vaccine is a way to get back to normal by reducing illness. Efficiency data is due in the next few weeks.
Not sure why people keep throwing out 50% efficiency as that's not been mentioned in any data yet.

The more people vaccinated the less restictions required as there's less pressure on health services.

Anyway I digress like I said full thread on vaccine development and data.

weldoninhio

Deleted User wrote: »

How can you "resign" an GP working in a private capacity? Need to lay off the deep state conspiracy theories, dude.

Ask my GP. Or is he a deep state "actor"?

The HorsesMouth

Deleted User wrote: »

I posted something similar on this thread the last day.

Best case scenario:

The number of infections drop rapidly and the country can open up in 6 weeks, except for the pubs which may have to wait until next year. Many retailers are saved from going under.

The UK avoids a no deal Brexit which will mean Ireland avoids the major impact this will have on its economy.

Trump does not get re-elected, so the plan to 'Make America Great Again' doesn't involve US tech companies relocating to the US from Ireland.

I would think this is probable case scenario...only media are so doom and gloom they would lead us to believe this is all hugely optimistic.
With the exception of Brexit however because that is in the hands of Boris while the rest is in the hands of the public.

OwenM

stephenjmcd wrote: »

I've read the guardian yesterday, another opinion piece. Well if people want actual good vaccine and data they'll have to go look for it as it doesn't get any coverage through RTE for example.

There's a full vaccine thread on all of this where there's informed posts.

A vaccine is a way to get back to normal by reducing illness. Efficiency data is due in the next few weeks.
Not sure why people keep throwing out 50% efficiency as that's not been mentioned in any data yet.

The more people vaccinated the less restictions required as there's less pressure on health services.

Anyway I digress like I said full thread on vaccine development and data.

That's the one threshold parameter set by the FDA and EMA

weldoninhio

weldoninhio wrote: »

Ask my GP. Or is he a deep state "actor"?

So your GP has been fired by the HSE? Link to new story would be great as that would certainly be newsworthy.

Curious_Case

Vizza Vee Stephen Donnelly's use of the phrase --

I'm feeling hungry so I'm going to make a sandwich, as a "pre-emptive strike"

How very modern !!!

eagle eye

Plumbthedepths wrote:

Out of curiosity what do you think would be the health outcome for people in a collapsed economy, healthier?

Economic problems are happening whether this lockdown happened or not. I think we need to look at the long term as regards national healrh and the economy.
The longer you let this thing go the worse things are going to get and the longer you'll end up.in a lockdown. If we went into lockdown a month ago it would only have taken four weeks, now it's going to take six weeks at least. Longer you go unchecked with rising numbers the worse it's going to be both for the economy and the national health .

stephenjmcd

OwenM wrote: »

That's the one threshold parameter set by the FDA and EMA

Yes but said opinion piece suggests that's the best that can be achieved by a vaccine.

My point is that is unproven, we await efficiency data.

eagle eye

is_that_so wrote:

As I said elsewhere there are others you can call apart from HSELive. My questions are about the care home itself.

I'd be pretty confident he has exhausted all avenues before putting that on Twitter.

Curious_Case

eagle eye wrote: »

Economic problems are happening whether this lockdown happened or not. I think we need to look at the long term as regards national healrh and the economy.
The longer you let this thing go the worse things are going to get and the longer you'll end up.in a lockdown. If we went into lockdown a month ago it would only have taken four weeks, now it's going to take six weeks at least. Longer you go unchecked with rising numbers the worse it's going to be both for the economy and the national health .

I suspect the almost global, intermittent lockdowns may be having a teensy weensy effect too !!!

weldoninhio

Deleted User wrote: »

So your GP has been fired by the HSE? Link to new story would be great as that would certainly be newsworthy.

No he was "retired" from practice for 1) calling out the initial nursing home fiasco and 2) having an opinion.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/gp-to-close-practice-after-threat-of-suspension-over-anti-mask-views-1.4375726

mr zulu

I see hospital rate has dropped to 305,no surprise that rte havnt reported that, they are very quick to report when they go up.

TonyMaloney

TonyMaloney wrote: »

Thanks Raind.

Are you basing the first on notified cases?

On the 14 day epidemiological report.

BringBackMick

mr zulu wrote: »

I see hospital rate has dropped to 305,no surprise that rte havnt reported that, they are very quick to report when they go up.

That would not suit the agenda

Boggles

HSE chief apologises over contact tracing issues

Mr Reid said they will get 70% of decisions right and 30% wrong

#standards

stephenjmcd

Boggles wrote: »

HSE chief apologises over contact tracing issues



#standards

Ah yes because in my work if I was wrong 30% of the time and caused a major issue I'd probably be shown the door.
Clown

BringBackMick

Boggles wrote: »

HSE chief apologises over contact tracing issues



#standards

Hah is that the level of service they expect!

Most SLA are 95%, perhaps 90% in some places but our HSE has a SLA hit rate expectation of 70%!!!!!!!!! God help us

c montgomery

[Deleted User] wrote: »

So if vaccine got HPRA, MHRA and EMA approval? Would you take it?

After 5 years of it being in use I would consider it

seamus

Deleted User wrote: »

But the golf courses are closed, which seems like a strange decision to me.

It's a PR decision.

If golf courses were allowed to stay open, the Shinners would be immediately on the attack that sports were being closed for everyone but "the elite".

There's this popular fallacy that only wealthy upper class people play golf. But I can tell you that high-cost, "classy" clubs are enormously popular with drug dealers, and there are plenty of lads in Jobstown who enjoy hitting a few balls on public courses during the week.

weldoninhio

weldoninhio wrote: »

No he was "retired" from practice for 1) calling out the initial nursing home fiasco and 2) having an opinion.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/gp-to-close-practice-after-threat-of-suspension-over-anti-mask-views-1.4375726

That is a fitness to practice issue. If I said the same things without evidence, my regulator (the PSI) would be questioning my fitness to practice. He took the coward's step of resigning rather than standing up for his convictions. If I held so steadfast views, I'd welcome my day in the tribunal.

Also, the medical council is not the HSE.

polesheep

Deleted User wrote: »

So if vaccine got HPRA, MHRA and EMA approval? Would you take it?

That would be one of the criteria I would use. Another would be the fact that I am not in an at-risk group. I also would be reluctant to take a rushed vaccine until it had been in general use for a period of time and demonstrated to be safe. Nothing unreasonable there. If, on the other hand, I was very vulnerable, I would be first in the queue.

Supercell

weldoninhio wrote: »

No he was "retired" from practice for 1) calling out the initial nursing home fiasco and 2) having an opinion.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/health/gp-to-close-practice-after-threat-of-suspension-over-anti-mask-views-1.4375726

That's quite sad, this is supposed to be a free country, he has a different opinion which should be countered with facts not threats to stop him practising medicine which he is qualified to do. It undermines the HSE/NPHET when they lash out like a petulant child in this way.

SeaBreezes

Richard Hillman wrote: »

The needs of the many outweigh the needs of the few. We are facing economic oblivion that will ruin many many lives for decades.

Its happening globally. Really, you think Governments ALL OVER THE WORLD havent weighed up the balance and lockdown is the option that will ruin LESS lives?

Or have they just not googled enough?
Not as informed as you obviously are

Boggles

stephenjmcd wrote: »

Ah yes because in my work if I was wrong 30% of the time and caused a major issue I'd probably be shown the door.
Clown

According to Public Health, Glynn when he was acting CMO wrote to Reid 3 times to relay the concerns about contact tracing.

According to Reid himself he didn't notify the Health Minister.

But he is sorry and will aim for 60%-70%.

He should be fired out of a fúcking cannon.

prunudo

Allinall wrote: »

What's misleading?

This lockdown is nothing like the first one.

Schools open.
Construction open.
Hardware and DIY shops open.
Inter-county GAA going ahead.
Various health services which were stopped in March
5k exercise limit instead of 2k.

Exactly, its not level 5 lockdown at all, its a level 4 with a 5km travel restriction tagged on.

Richard Hillman

SeaBreezes wrote: »

Its happening globally. Really, you think Governments ALL OVER THE WORLD havent weighed up the balance and lockdown is the option that will ruin LESS lives?

Or have they just not googled enough?
Not as informed as you obviously are

Well it looked like we were doing that when NPHET first whipped out their dicks and slapping it around the media. But when they did it the second time Micheal Martin cowed to their pressure. In January they are going to have to lockdown again or admit they messed up. And we all know how reluctant politicians are to admit they were wrong.