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Why no coherent legal challenge to restrictions?

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    #92
    CalamariFritti
    Registered Users Posts: 5,605 ✭✭✭CalamariFritti


    Insidious wrote: »
    If people want to protest the restrictions.. they don't need to meet up in person in a pandemic. They can use the likes of zoom etc to peacefully gather online instead of creating environments where the virus can thrive. It's also simple enough to create and sign online petitions to express their feelings and email them in to government. The article 40 doesn't say it has to be in person....

    Protest is to raise awareness of an issue and discontent with it. Therefore it needs to be very visible. I thought that would be fairly obvious.


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    #93
    Gael23
    Registered Users Posts: 12,110 ✭✭✭✭Gael23


    Surprised and disappointed that the Irish council for civil liberties have not gone to the courts


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    #94
    Dubl07
    Registered Users Posts: 1,801 ✭✭✭Dubl07


    Gael23 wrote: »
    Surprised and disappointed that the Irish council for civil liberties have not gone to the courts

    Why on earth would they? These measures are to facilitate the functional operation of society in a pandemic. Yes, there are restrictions to prevent illness, there are measures to ensure distancing, but now we have masks available in pharmacies and in the likes of Dunnes, masking and santising are simple. So the pubs are closed, but they and restaurants are doing takeouts. Clothes are available online. So are books.

    It is a pandemic. Some people's longterm health is being affected. Other people are dying. If we stop whinging and support each others' mental wellbeing by phone or from 2 metres away wearing a mask, that'd be a big help.

    Challenging these restrictions measures to keep the population safe is like challenging seat-belts or airbags, or parachutes for sky-divers.

    I'd rather be bored, broke and alive than the alternative.


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    #95
    Risteard81
    Registered Users Posts: 2,567 ✭✭✭Risteard81


    Dubl07 wrote: »
    Challenging these restrictions measures to keep the population safe is like challenging seat-belts or airbags, or parachutes for sky-divers.
    Absolute nonsense.

    I challenge these illegal and unlawful restrictions at every opportunity. However I have deployed a canopy - or parachute if you will - on every jump I have made skydiving and fully intend to do so for all future skydives too.


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    #96
    Dubl07
    Registered Users Posts: 1,801 ✭✭✭Dubl07


    Risteard81 wrote: »
    Absolute nonsense.

    I challenge these illegal and unlawful restrictions at every opportunity. However I have deployed a canopy - or parachute if you will - on every jump I have made skydiving and fully intend to do so for all future skydives too.

    Just make sure it covers your nose...

    Long Covid


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    #97
    political analyst
    Registered Users Posts: 4,546 ✭✭✭political analyst


    Dubl07 wrote: »
    Why on earth would they? These measures are to facilitate the functional operation of society in a pandemic. Yes, there are restrictions to prevent illness, there are measures to ensure distancing, but now we have masks available in pharmacies and in the likes of Dunnes, masking and santising are simple. So the pubs are closed, but they and restaurants are doing takeouts. Clothes are available online. So are books.

    It is a pandemic. Some people's longterm health is being affected. Other people are dying. If we stop whinging and support each others' mental wellbeing by phone or from 2 metres away wearing a mask, that'd be a big help.

    Challenging these restrictions measures to keep the population safe is like challenging seat-belts or airbags, or parachutes for sky-divers.

    I'd rather be bored, broke and alive than the alternative.

    Many people were dying or had long-term health problems because of explosions in Belfast during the Troubles but most businesses didn't have lockdowns that went on for months back then. For most people who get the virus, it's not as bad as being in the blast radius of an explosion.


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    #98
    Dubl07
    Registered Users Posts: 1,801 ✭✭✭Dubl07


    political analyst wrote: »
    Many people were dying or had long-term health problems because of explosions in Belfast during the Troubles but most businesses didn't have lockdowns that went on for months back then. For most people who get the virus, it's not as bad as being in the blast radius of an explosion.

    The troubles went on for years and everyone going into the cities was frisked, bags searched, cars kept out.

    Besides, you can't catch an explosion or PTSD. You can catch a virus. Apples and watermelons.


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    #99
    political analyst
    Registered Users Posts: 4,546 ✭✭✭political analyst


    Dubl07 wrote: »
    The troubles went on for years and everyone going into the cities was frisked, bags searched, cars kept out.

    Besides, you can't catch an explosion or PTSD. You can catch a virus. Apples and watermelons.

    In fairness, the blast radius of an explosion is a good analogy for the distance travelled by droplets coming out of people's mouths and noses when they speak or cough.


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    #100
    odyssey06
    Registered Users Posts: 29,529 ✭✭✭✭odyssey06


    I think this is the right thread for this news item...

    BUSINESSMAN DECLAN GANLEY has initiated a High Court challenge against certain regulations aimed at preventing the spread of Covid-19 which he claims breach his constitutional right to religious freedom.

    https://www.thejournal.ie/declan-ganley-high-court-5257784-Nov2020/

    "To follow knowledge like a sinking star..." (Tennyson's Ulysses)



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    #101
    political analyst
    Registered Users Posts: 4,546 ✭✭✭political analyst


    There is still no further development on Press Up Ltd's case against the restrictions.


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    #102
    trixi001
    Registered Users Posts: 200 ✭✭trixi001


    Dubl07 wrote: »
    Why on earth would they? These measures are to facilitate the functional operation of society in a pandemic. Yes, there are restrictions to prevent illness, there are measures to ensure distancing, but now we have masks available in pharmacies and in the likes of Dunnes, masking and santising are simple. So the pubs are closed, but they and restaurants are doing takeouts. Clothes are available online. So are books.

    It is a pandemic. Some people's longterm health is being affected. Other people are dying. If we stop whinging and support each others' mental wellbeing by phone or from 2 metres away wearing a mask, that'd be a big help.

    Challenging these restrictions measures to keep the population safe is like challenging seat-belts or airbags, or parachutes for sky-divers.

    I'd rather be bored, broke and alive than the alternative.

    Some peoples long term health is affected by Chicken pox but we don't stop the world for it - and its very contagious...

    Viruses can cause death and long term conditions in many people, doesn't mean people have to lose their jobs and livelihood. Doesn't mean cancer screening stops, doesn't mean we all hide and stop living!

    Chicken pox can cause septicaemia, Pneuomina and even Meningitis.

    In the US 3 -4 milllion cases of chicken pox were recorded per year with 10,000 hospitalisations. (Can't find stats for Ireland) - and every country in the world is basically following a herd immunity strategy for it - we don't self isolate anyone who has been in contact with Chicken pox!

    It leads to shingles which can lead to PHN, or even death for people who are immuno-compromised.

    It took me about 6 months to recover from fatigue after shingles (And i had a very mild case), and almost 2 years later still suffering from PHN.

    For reference - About 224,000 people in the UK get shingles every year. About 60,000 people of these are affected by post herpetic neuralgia


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    #103
    nofools
    Closed Accounts Posts: 608 ✭✭✭nofools


    trixi001 wrote: »
    Some peoples long term health is affected by Chicken pox but we don't stop the world for it - and its very contagious...

    Viruses can cause death and long term conditions in many people, doesn't mean people have to lose their jobs and livelihood. Doesn't mean cancer screening stops, doesn't mean we all hide and stop living!

    Chicken pox can cause septicaemia, Pneuomina and even Meningitis.

    In the US 3 -4 milllion cases of chicken pox were recorded per year with 10,000 hospitalisations. (Can't find stats for Ireland) - and every country in the world is basically following a herd immunity strategy for it - we don't self isolate anyone who has been in contact with Chicken pox!

    It leads to shingles which can lead to PHN, or even death for people who are immuno-compromised.

    It took me about 6 months to recover from fatigue after shingles (And i had a very mild case), and almost 2 years later still suffering from PHN.

    For reference - About 224,000 people in the UK get shingles every year. About 60,000 people of these are affected by post herpetic neuralgia

    Those ailments all have treatments and haven't killed 1.2 million people so far this year.


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    #104
    speckle
    Registered Users Posts: 2,251 ✭✭✭speckle


    nofools wrote: »
    Those ailments all have treatments and haven't killed 1.2 million people so far this year.

    How many disease even with treatments infectious or not kill more than that in a year?

    https://www.who.int/news-room/fact-sheets/detail/the-top-10-causes-of-death

    Or who due from lack of proper food

    https://www.theworldcounts.com/challenges/people-and-poverty/hunger-and-obesity/how-many-people-die-from-hunger-each-year/story

    Of that 7 and a half million... 3 and a half million are children.


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    #105
    nofools
    Closed Accounts Posts: 608 ✭✭✭nofools


    speckle wrote: »
    How many disease even with treatments infectious or not kill more than that in a year?

    https://www.who.int/news-room/fact-sheets/detail/the-top-10-causes-of-death

    Or who due from lack of proper food

    https://www.theworldcounts.com/challenges/people-and-poverty/hunger-and-obesity/how-many-people-die-from-hunger-each-year/story

    Of that 7 and a half million... 3 and a half million are children.

    I don't think it is a competition. All bad.

    What do you reckon should be done?


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    #106
    speckle
    Registered Users Posts: 2,251 ✭✭✭speckle


    nofools wrote: »
    I don't think it is a competition. All bad.

    What do you reckon should be done?

    Not what is happening at present and I am high risk and have 8 high riskers in the family over 80 and 2 under. And most of them agree.I also have a lot of high risk neighbours of the same view most of them are under 65.
    The government/NEPHET may deludely think that you are protecting us, but you are not for many reasons.
    For starters If they gave us and familys with a high risk kid the extra 350 that goes to a low risk healthy person we could protect ourselves.
    We know like during the last recession we where the worst hit and it will be the same again.
    What do you suggest we do ...put our trust in a system that has been cutting left right and center services for the disabled?


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    #107
    nofools
    Closed Accounts Posts: 608 ✭✭✭nofools


    speckle wrote: »
    Not what is happening at present and I am high risk and have 8 high riskers in the family over 80 and 2 under. And most of them agree.I also have a lot of high risk neighbours of the same view most of them are under 65.
    The government/NEPHET may deludely think that you are protecting us, but you are not for many reasons.
    For starters If they gave us and familys with a high risk kid the extra 350 that goes to a low risk healthy person we could protect ourselves.
    We know like during the last recession we where the worst hit and it will be the same again.
    What do you suggest we do ...put our trust in a system that has been cutting left right and center services for the disabled?

    My consolidations for the situation. I think smart and holistic supports should be in place.

    Lots of shoulds and coulds, i can only control my own actions.


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    #108
    trixi001
    Registered Users Posts: 200 ✭✭trixi001


    nofools wrote: »
    Those ailments all have treatments and haven't killed 1.2 million people so far this year.

    But it might have if we didn't have herd immunity...., thats the point - Covid is no more deadly than the flu or chicken pox/shingles - its just that we have no immunity.

    If Chicken pox first appeared as virus today, we would probably shut down for it as well...but in the long term it wouldn't have been the right thing to do - people need to get viruses when then are young and able to fight them, so that immuntiy develops over time..


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    #109
    nofools
    Closed Accounts Posts: 608 ✭✭✭nofools


    trixi001 wrote: »
    But it might have if we didn't have herd immunity...., thats the point - Covid is no more deadly than the flu or chicken pox/shingles - its just that we have no immunity.

    If Chicken pox first appeared as virus today, we would probably shut down for it as well...but in the long term it wouldn't have been the right thing to do - people need to get viruses when then are young and able to fight them, so that immuntiy develops over time..

    If you say so Dr.


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