Mother and babies homes information sealed for 30 years

saabsaab

Anger at the latest development, saying they were not informed their testimony would be destroyed.


https://www.thejournal.ie/mother-and-baby-home-testimonies-destroyed-5340837-Jan2021/

Cluedo Monopoly

https://twitter.com/maeveorourke/status/1355860621523353600

stockshares

Cluedo Monopoly wrote: »

The government are really starting to look as bad as the religious orders now in terms of hiding information.

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40217090.html



"It adds fuel to a widely held view that this report was at best a whitewash and at worse a cover-up. I would see this as a corruption of a really important witness testimony."

You need to follow Simon McGarr on Twitter. He warned of this 1-2 weeks ago and created a template for a letter which enabled people affected to write in and get their transcripts before they were destroyed.

John Hutton wrote: »

People need to be really careful as to what they say about the report and its authors, lest they leave themselves open to defamation claims. Criticism of the terms of reference and the actions and choices of the people involved are one thing, but people need to be careful not to go to far.

If you start accusing report authors of corruption and the like it mightn't end well... (at least if you are not a TD making these claims under privilege in the Dáil)

What's your opinion of the tapes being destroyed?

Cluedo Monopoly

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40217777.html

The daughter of a mother and baby home survivor has asked Taoiseach Micheál Martin to retract part of the apology he gave to all survivors in January.

The section she wants retracted is where Mr Martin said that what happened was a result of how “society” had acted at the time.

Laura Murphy, a marketing executive whose mother Mary gave birth at St Patrick’s on Navan Rd, Dublin, says this is wrong.

The retraction she is asking for is, she says, being made “on behalf of Mná na hÉireann”, the women of Ireland.

Her mother, now aged 63, was told by her family’s parish priest when she fell pregnant at 17 that she had to leave home before she “contaminates the morals of other girls”.

The family’s GP also told her parents that the teenager would bring shame on her entire family if anybody was to find out she was going to give birth outside marriage.

As a result, her parents — much to their lifelong regret — felt they had no choice but to send her away to St Patrick’s.

“An expounding of truth became a distortion of history. An unequivocal assumption of responsibility descended into a dispersal of blame.

“The society you speak of was the remnants of one invasion after another from the beginning of our history.”

She writes that while women played a key role in both the Easter Rising and the War of Independence, they ended up “largely excluded from political, economic and societal life”.


Church and State were merged, she writes, and “a terrible beauty was born”.

“Our ‘representative’ government was dominated by the male-led Catholic Church. The Church and State colluded to write the constitution.

“Therefore responsibility for the ‘perversion of society’ lies with the Church and State regime, and not the Irish people.

Cluedo Monopoly

https://twitter.com/HollyCairnsTD/status/1356289551803805696

smurgen

saabsaab wrote: »

Anger at the latest development, saying they were not informed their testimony would be destroyed.


https://www.thejournal.ie/mother-and-baby-home-testimonies-destroyed-5340837-Jan2021/

I thought the big argument back in October was the government storing records so files wouldn't be destroyed? Are they just pretending that excuse was never used now?

stockshares

smurgen wrote: »

I thought the big argument back in October was the government storing records so files wouldn't be destroyed? Are they just pretending that excuse was never used now?

That wasn't the argument then. It was about the sealing of an archive and access to testimony.

Cluedo Monopoly

Cluedo Monopoly wrote: »

https://twitter.com/HollyCairnsTD/status/1356289551803805696

What’s your opinion on that tweet? She “believes” babies are buried in unmarked graves. Doesn’t know for sure.

Cluedo Monopoly

Deleted User wrote: »

What’s your opinion on that tweet? She “believes” babies are buried in unmarked graves. Doesn’t know for sure.

More than 900 children died in Bessborough or in hospital after being transferred from the home in question.

Despite “very extensive inquiries and searches”, the Commission has been able to establish the burial place of only 64 children.

The burial places of more than 800 babies and children who died while they were residents of Bessborough are therefore unknown, with the Commission concluding that it is likely some of them were buried in unmarked graves.

The Commission considers it “highly likely” that some of these children were buried on the campus, which at one stage extended over 200 acres.

“The Congregation of the Sacred Hearts of Jesus and Mary who owned and ran Bessborough do not know where the other children are buried.

“The burials of children who died in the three Sacred Heart Homes (Bessborough, Castlepollard and Sean Ross) are not recorded at all. More importantly, there is no certainty about where they are buried,” the Commission previously noted.

In the final report, the Commission says it “remains perplexed and concerned at the inability of any member of the Congregation of the Sacred Hearts of Jesus and Mary to identify the burial place of the children who died in Bessborough”.

Cluedo Monopoly

Cluedo Monopoly wrote: »

More than 900 children died in Bessborough or in hospital after being transferred from the home in question.

Despite “very extensive inquiries and searches”, the Commission has been able to establish the burial place of only 64 children.

The burial places of more than 800 babies and children who died while they were residents of Bessborough are therefore unknown, with the Commission concluding that it is likely some of them were buried in unmarked graves.

The Commission considers it “highly likely” that some of these children were buried on the campus, which at one stage extended over 200 acres.

“The Congregation of the Sacred Hearts of Jesus and Mary who owned and ran Bessborough do not know where the other children are buried.

“The burials of children who died in the three Sacred Heart Homes (Bessborough, Castlepollard and Sean Ross) are not recorded at all. More importantly, there is no certainty about where they are buried,” the Commission previously noted.

In the final report, the Commission says it “remains perplexed and concerned at the inability of any member of the Congregation of the Sacred Hearts of Jesus and Mary to identify the burial place of the children who died in Bessborough”.

Thanks. I prefer reading posters own opinions than just copying a post from other social media with no comment on it.
It is highly unlikely that the final resting places will ever be found. We can only hope that they are Resting In Peace.

Cluedo Monopoly

Deleted User wrote: »

Thanks. I prefer reading posters own opinions than just copying a post from other social media with no comment on it.
It is highly unlikely that the final resting places will ever be found. We can only hope that they are Resting In Peace.

They already found a mass grave in Tuam. I am fairly certain there are mass graves in other Mother and Baby homes including Bessborough. The 900 babies missing from Bessborough did not disappear into thin air.

The government are drafting a 'Certain Institutional Burials (Authorised Interventions) Bill' now. The purpose of the Bill is to provide ‘the statutory basis and framework under which Government may decide to authorise interventions at certain sites where manifestly inappropriate burials have taken place associated with institutions operated by or on behalf of the State or in respect of which the State had clear regulatory or supervisory responsibilities’, and for the establishment of an Agency to carry out such interventions.

The hope for many is that these children can be found, identified if possible, and buried with dignity.

smurgen

stockshares wrote: »

That wasn't the argument then. It was about the sealing of an archive and access to testimony.

You sure?

Minister O'Gorman continued: "The 2004 Act also requires that such records are sealed for a period of 30 years pending their transfer to the National Archives.

"This provision was already in place ahead of the establishment of the Commission.

"The Commission is due to submit its final report and stand dissolved in law on 30 October. This Bill needs to be passed and signed into law prior to its dissolution.

"Failure to act will result in an incomplete archive transferring and in the database being effectively destroyed and unavailable for information and tracing

https://amp.rte.ie/amp/1171375/

stockshares

smurgen wrote: »

You sure?

Minister O'Gorman continued: "The 2004 Act also requires that such records are sealed for a period of 30 years pending their transfer to the National Archives.

"This provision was already in place ahead of the establishment of the Commission.

"The Commission is due to submit its final report and stand dissolved in law on 30 October. This Bill needs to be passed and signed into law prior to its dissolution.

"Failure to act will result in an incomplete archive transferring and in the database being effectively destroyed and unavailable for information and tracing

https://amp.rte.ie/amp/1171375/

The Gov tried to portray the sealing of the archive as necessary in order that the Arvhive wouldn't be destroyed.

The real reason they wanted to seal it was to smother this story

They had planned to destroy the testimony anyway and have used the spurious argument that it's necessary to ensure privacy .

We all know that's not the reason they did this

It was neither necessary to seal the archive or destroy testimony.

I suggest you read Simon McGarr and Maeve O Rourke's articles on this.

Cluedo Monopoly

Some good news

https://www.independent.ie/news/plans-for-apartment-block-at-site-of-mother-and-baby-home-are-rejected-40041719.html

Plans for apartment block at site of mother and baby home are rejected.

A CONTROVERSIAL plan to build an eight-storey apartment block on lands at the former Bessborough mother and baby home estate in Cork has been rejected.

The rejection was welcomed by campaigners who opposed development on the Blackrock estate site of what was once Ireland's largest mother and baby home.
Campaigners now want the site to be assessed for any remaining undiscovered infant graves – and for those areas to be properly preserved as cemeteries.

Graces7

Cluedo Monopoly wrote: »

More than 900 children died in Bessborough or in hospital after being transferred from the home in question.

Despite “very extensive inquiries and searches”, the Commission has been able to establish the burial place of only 64 children.



There was a report way back of a mother seeking the grace of her baby to be told there was "one under her and 18 atop of her"

I think it was Sean Ross where at least one local man knows where the burials are and I am sure there were ground-penetrating radar confirmations of that online
Oh and the gardeners at Bessborough left coded keys when they buried a baby; a pattern of nails in the wall.
People did care but were helpless.
(Sorry'; abed and very unwell; I did a huge amount of research into all this a few years ago when working on a book. It seems there was more info available than or maybe I just knew the right people tp o ask as it was as the first scandals were breaking; the extent was not even guessed at and folk were more open. If someone could follow through? Thank you.

I have not read all the thread but Catherine Corless was rightly urging that the funding be urgently made available for the exhumation DNA ID ing and proper burial of the Tuam babies and this needs extending to all .

The abuses cannot be undone but this is one thing we can do as a caring nation. in respect for the dead little ones and it will heal some of the wounds to do this.

please scuse typos.

crossman47

TheChizler wrote: »

I haven't seen it mentioned yet so I thought I'd point out that it's extremely common to delete audio recordings once they've been transcribed when doing this kind of research. It's quite often a condition of ethics approval before starting.

I'm not saying that was the case here, or it's right or wrong, and I can definitely see how it's problematic when there are questions surrounding accuracy. Just saying their deletion isn't a smoking gun for cover up by itself in case people are thinking it's proof. It may well be some evidence in favour of it.

According to an article by Patsy McGarry (no friend of the churches) this morning, witnesses were explicitly told their testimony would be recorded as an aide memoire and then destroyed. This is a very good article that criticises the responses of some politicians who have not read the whole report because it did not give them the slant they wanted.

saabsaab

crossman47 wrote: »

According to an article by Patsy McGarry (no friend of the churches) this morning, witnesses were explicitly told their testimony would be recorded as an aide memoire and then destroyed. This is a very good article that criticises the responses of some politicians who have not read the whole report because it did not give them the slant they wanted.

Why are some of them saying that they were never told this?

Cluedo Monopoly

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/arid-40218473.html

The Data Protection Commissioner (DPC) has written to the Mother and Baby Homes Commission over the destruction of recordings of witness testimony.

It is understood the DPC has raised concerns with the commission and has asked it to provide the justification and legal basis for the deletion of the records.

A total of 550 people provided personal accounts to the confidential committee as part of a five-year investigation into mother and baby homes, however, these recordings have been destroyed and no verbatim transcripts were made of the testimony.

Survivors have strongly criticised the final report of the commission, which they say does not reflect their experiences. They say the wiping of these recordings has created a "verbatim void" and means they have again been forced to argue the truth of their own life experiences.

The commission said those who came forward were "orally asked for permission to record and told the recordings would be destroyed".

However, many survivors say they were not informed that the audio of their statements would be deleted.

The 550 survivors that found the courage to come forward and speak about the horrors are being treated appallingly.

saabsaab

Extract taken from the underlying principles of the DPC,,


'6 .Ensuring that people’s rights are maintained Personal data shall be processed in accordance with rights of the person. For example, a person has the right to: request access to the information; prevent the processing of information if it is likely to cause damage or distress; correct mistakes in the information; claim compensation if the information is inaccurate of if the Data Protection Act has been breached….
7. Information Security
Appropriate technical and organisational measures shall be taken against unauthorised or unlawful processing of personal data and against accidental loss or destruction of, or damage to, personal data

crossman47

saabsaab wrote: »

Why are some of them saying that they were never told this?

They may not have felt it important at the time.

James Brown

crossman47 wrote: »

According to an article by Patsy McGarry (no friend of the churches) this morning, witnesses were explicitly told their testimony would be recorded as an aide memoire and then destroyed. This is a very good article that criticises the responses of some politicians who have not read the whole report because it did not give them the slant they wanted.

That's the despicable line the apologists have been trotting out, 'people don't like the report because it doesn't suit their agenda' or whatever. It's designed to dismiss criticism.
The survivors have come out numerous times to complain that their published testimonies were 'glaringly inaccurate'. They also claim that elements raised were not covered in the report.
Why on earth would they destroy evidence given when this was a report not a full-stop/case closed scenario?

crossman47

James Brown wrote: »

That's the despicable line the apologists have been trotting out, 'people don't like the report because it doesn't suit their agenda' or whatever. It's designed to dismiss criticism.
The survivors have come out numerous times to complain that their published testimonies were 'glaringly inaccurate'. They also claim that elements raised were not covered in the report.
Why on earth would they destroy evidence given when this was a report not a full-stop/case closed scenario?

I'm criticising politicians who have criticised the report without having read it all and without recognising it was a legal body that had to assess evidence. They have called it cold - what did they want? An emotional tear jerker?

stockshares

crossman47 wrote: »

According to an article by Patsy McGarry (no friend of the churches) this morning, witnesses were explicitly told their testimony would be recorded as an aide memoire and then destroyed. This is a very good article that criticises the responses of some politicians who have not read the whole report because it did not give them the slant they wanted.

Patsy McGarry is not a reliable Journalist on this matter and has frequently posted inaccurately .

The Clann Project took this up with his Editor recently.

saabsaab

Is there evidence that they were told? quote below.



'person was provided with a copy of one of those information leaflets. As you can see, while it does say that the testimony will be recorded and that the witnesses can't take a copy out of the office, it doesn't say that the recordings will be destroyed.'

Cluedo Monopoly

https://twitter.com/maeveorourke/status/1357038486176624643

Cluedo Monopoly

Cluedo Monopoly wrote: »

https://twitter.com/maeveorourke/status/1357038486176624643

And your opinion on the above is??? Other than Twitter drops?

Cluedo Monopoly

Deleted User wrote: »

And your opinion on the above is??? Other than Twitter drops?

I completely agree. Dr Maeve O'Rourke says it very clearly. O'Gorman was duplicitous.

Cluedo Monopoly

Open letter to Michael Martin from Laura Murphy the daughter of a courageous Mother and Baby Home survivor.

Dear Taoiseach,

I am the daughter of a Mother and Baby home survivor and I wish to share this open letter on behalf of Mná na hÉireann concerning the recent State apology, and in particular the following alarming element:

“This treatment of women and children is something which was the direct result of how the State, and how we as a society acted. We embraced a perverse religious morality and control, judgementalism and moral certainty, but shunned our daughters.

We honoured piety, but failed to show even basic kindness to those who needed it most.

We had a completely warped attitude to sexuality and intimacy, and young mothers and their sons and daughters were forced to pay a terrible price for that dysfunction.”

These are the words that turned what should have been a watershed moment of healing into a whitewashing of trauma. An expounding of truth became a distortion of history. An unequivocal assumption of responsibility descended into a dispersal of blame.

The society you speak of was the remnants of one invasion after another from the beginning of our history, the vestiges of a perpetual battle for the reclamation of sovereignty and the preservation of the spirit of our people and land. It was a miracle that we – a small, pillaged, broken nation – had any remaining energy or means to fight for and win our freedom. But we did.

The key word here is ‘we’. There was no need for gender quotas in the fight for Irish freedom. Mná na hÉireann showed up in their droves. They were outstanding. Constance Markievicz, Maud Gonne, Hanna Sheehy-Skeffington, Grace Gifford, Ella Young to name but a few. Women’s organisations such as Inghinidhe na hÉireann and Cumann na mBan played a pivotal part in the military, political, cultural and humanitarian aspects of our fight for independence and the subsequent birth of the state.

When Pádraic Pearse declared Irish independence, he addressed ‘Irishmen and Irishwomen’. The promise of our proclamation was ‘equality, happiness and prosperity for all men, women and children’.

Yet, when we emerged from the ashes of the Civil War, the collective trauma had hit new lows. We were a war-weary, exhausted, divided and vulnerable society. Ripe for the deception and manipulation that was about to transpire. Despite resistance from the few who were in a position to see what was going on, Church and State were merged.

‘A terrible beauty was born’.

When it came to drawing up the constitution, it was authored in no small part by Archbishop John Charles McQuaid, a close ally of Taoiseach Éamon de Valera. Article 41.2 made sure that the place for women in society was in the home and nowhere else.

Women and children were written out and the Roman Catholic Church was written in.

Under the constitution, women had little access to the sovereignty they fought for, no autonomy over their own bodies. Marital rape was not a crime, contraception was. Women were prevented from working after marriage, banned from divorce, access to information was censored and there was little support from the State.

De Valera and his contemporaries rode on the coat-tails of women to win Irish independence and when he assumed power, women were largely excluded from political, economic and societal life.

Mná na hÉireann fought for democracy, they got a theocracy. They fought for equality and got oppression. Religion replaced empire. One form of control, replaced by another.

Our ‘representative’ government was not organised to be malleable to the general will of society because it was dominated by the holders of unaccountable religious and moral power in the form of the male-led Catholic Church.

Safe Ireland defines coercive control as “persistent and deliberate pattern of behaviour by an abuser over a prolonged period of time designed to achieve obedience and create fear.

It may include coercion… isolation, degradation and control. It is all about making a woman’s world smaller – trapping her, restricting her independence and freedom.”

The State sanctioned a regime of coercive control in which it and the men of Ireland were given unchecked authority and dominion over women and children, the devastating inter-generational effects of which are still being felt today across both genders.

This was not the society that Mná na hÉireann fought for. They were not privy to the finer details of what Church and State collusion meant. They were not present at the clandestine meetings, the corrupt conclaves or the dens of inequality that shaped our society.

Mná na hÉireann did not give informed consent.

The likes of W.B. Yeats and George William Russell gave warnings but with limited access to education, censorship, state-controlled media and Church-State propaganda, the Irish people were easily manipulated, deceived and controlled.

Muintir na hÉireann did not give informed consent.

Church and State colluded to write the constitution, the contract by which every citizen in society is bound. Therefore responsibility for the ‘perversion of society’ lies with the Church and State regime, and not the Irish people.

The Church held the power. Society suffered the consequences.

We, as a society, were coercively controlled by Church and State to behave in ways that were contrary to our nature.

Muintir na hÉireann, the people of Ireland, did not give informed consent.

Since then, many have tried to fight against what was the Church’s all too unchristian grip on society. Noel Browne, former Minister for Health, fought to bring in the Mother and Child Scheme in 1950, which proposed free healthcare to all women and children. It was opposed by the Church because it could have paved the way for birth control and abortion. It was then dutifully opposed by the Government.

Muintir na hÉireann did not give informed consent.

When Taoiseach John A. Costello sent a telegram to the Pope expressing his wish to ‘repose at the feet of your Holiness’, affirming his commitment to ‘social order in Ireland based on Christian principles’, cabinet secretary Maurice Moynihan responded by asserting ‘No civil power should declare that it reposed at the feet of the Pope’. The response was to exclude him from further cabinet meetings.

This ‘perverse religious morality’ of the Church meant that the men who impregnated women out of wedlock got off scot free, escaping all religious and social censure whilst the women were isolated, shunned and shamed – all in the name of Christ. It meant that even the women who were married were deemed unclean and unholy after giving birth because it resulted from sexual activity.

Mná na hÉireann did not give informed consent.

So, it falls upon us, Mná na hÉireann and citizens of Ireland in the 21st century to refute and reject claims that we, as a ‘society’ were responsible for the ‘perversion, religious morality, warped attitudes and dysfunction’ that caused this ‘dark period’ in our history.

We call upon you, as a representative of the State who colluded with the Church to perpetrate coercive control (now a crime) on the women and children of Ireland to wholly and unequivocally assume responsibility for the ‘perversion’ in ‘society’ that emerged as a result.

We call on you, as Taoiseach, as a human, father, husband, son and an upholder of equality to retract these sentences from the State apology and see to it that the Government addresses the glaring discrepancies and inadequacies of the report in a way that respects truth, brings justice and fully honours the survivors and their stories.

We call on the Government of Ireland to recognise Brigid, our matron saint, in the same way that St. Patrick is honoured. Originally an indigenous Goddess of Ireland, she was appropriated by the Catholic Church who made her a Saint.

In the spirit of unity, let Brigid’s Day, February 1st 2022 and all other years thereafter, be a national holiday where we honour Brigid as Goddess, Saint and symbol of feminine power and strength.

Let this gesture symbolise how our society values women and men equally. Ireland, Éire, a wounded land named after the Goddess Ériu. In our healing, we can rediscover our true selves and find that real sovereignty is possible when men and women can truly empower each other through shared strength and unity.

Let this be our commitment to shaping Ireland’s future, a new era guided by Brigid’s principles of light, inspiration, imagination, healing, truth, justice and love.

It is not too late to turn the whitewashing of trauma that the State apology amounted to into the watershed of healing that it was intended to be.

Is mise le meas,

Laura Murphy

I think this is a powerful well written letter.

Ted_YNWA

Cluedo Monopoly wrote: »

I completely agree. Dr Maeve O'Rourke says it very clearly. O'Gorman was duplicitous.

Do you ever respond to the actual message/substance?

Mod
If you are using twitter to back up your views.

Add a message or substance of your own.

I had deleted the post as this is called link dumping. Seeing as you have since added some comments of your own, I have reinstated.

If you (or anyone) just drops in a link/tweet with no context of your own, it is liable to be deleted with no warning or notice given.

saabsaab

Does anyone know when the recordings were destroyed? Who approved it? Why the urgemcy?

stockshares

saabsaab wrote: »

Does anyone know when the recordings were destroyed? Who approved it? Why the urgemcy?

Simon McGarr went into detail about it. I'll see if I can find the article tomorrow.
.
Plus some Survivors spoke on the Joe Duffy show about this. There were a lot of interviews on that show but I'll try and find the specific ones.

It was sprung on some Survivors at the last minute that their testimony would be destroyed and others were not hold at all.

This whole saga is an exercise in cover up and deceit . It was obvious from the terms of reference at the outset and how this Commission got off the ground in the first place is sickening.

PatrickSmithUS

When are we expecting a compensation offer to be made or redress scheme to be revealed?

Will it be post COVID?

Cluedo Monopoly

Fair play to many of the councils around Ireland making an effort e.g. printing commission reports for libraries, refusing planning on potential mass graves (Bessborough), issuing apologies and opening up archived records.

The Mayo council in particular is being very proactive.

https://westernpeople.ie/2021/02/04/council-accepts-sad-and-painful-truth-of-its-role-in-tuam-home/

Mayo County Council has apologised for its role in the Tuam Mother and Baby Home.
Up to 200 babies who died in the Bon Secours Mother and Baby Home in Tuam are documented as being born to mothers from Mayo.

Acting CEO of Mayo County Council, Peter Duggan apologised for its role in the Mother and Baby Home in Tuam, at a special meeting of the local authority convened last Monday.
“I would like to express sorrow and apologise for Mayo County Council’s role in the practices employed in dealing with these women and children,” said Mr Duggan.

“I would like to offer our sincere and humble apology to all the victims of this sad time in our history,” Cllr Finn added.
Breeda Murphy of the Tuam Mother and Baby Home Alliance addressed the meeting. She urged Mayo County Council to open up its administrative records on the Home.
“Without those records, we get a skewed narrative. What tells the story, the true story, is the administrative records,” said Ms Murphy.
Mr Duggan said the majority of Mayo County Council’s records relating to the Tuam home were handed over to the Western Health Board but stated that the council’s archives are open.

Cluedo Monopoly

Meath is another council to issue a strong apology and offer to propose a proper memorial. They also committed to supporting the government action plan.

https://www.meathchronicle.ie/2021/02/03/mother-and-baby-home-memorial-garden-proposal-for-dunboyne/

A SPECIAL garden in memory of the mothers and babies who were former residents of the Ard Mhuire home in Dunboyne is to be erected in the village as part of Meath County Council’s apology for its historical role in the home.

The move came as the council issued an “unreserved apology” to the former residents of the Dunboyne and Castlepollard mother and baby homes and their families. The unprecedented apology was made on behalf of the 40 councillors by the cathaoirleach of the council Cllr David Gilroy at its monthly meeting on Monday.

Independent Cllr Nick Killian proposed, and the councillors agreed, to write to Catherine Corless, the campaigner on the Tuam mother and baby scandal, congratulating her on her work on the issue. He said that but for her tenacity he did not think the matter would have come to light. “We should acknowledge all those who have been hurt and all the babies who were buried in such horrible circumstances”.

stockshares

Ear to the ground now on Rte 1 are covering a story about a person who was in Tuam.

Cluedo Monopoly

stockshares wrote: »

Ear to the ground now on Rte 1 are covering a story about a person who was in Tuam.

They covered that story extremely well. Very sad that his mother called to the home every week for 5 years asking for her son until they fostered him out. Wanton cruelty. He plans to travel to her grave in the UK to tell her the nuns apologised.

Cluedo Monopoly

The Ear to the Ground story above is covered here:

https://www.rte.ie/lifestyle/living/2021/0204/1195039-the-farmer-who-started-his-life-in-the-tuam-mother-and-baby-home/

Catherine had an interest in local history, but she also had a strong sense of right and wrong. "I was always a bit like that," is her typically understated way of explaining where she got the courage and strength to take on such a weighty issue.

"I got lots of correspondence from people disgusted with what I was claiming, and telling me that I should be ashamed of myself," she recalls. "But as more and more came out and after the official State apology, some of those same critics have got back to me to apologise."

The long struggle for the survivors of the Mother and Baby Homes to get the recognition that they deserve is not over yet, but huge progress has been made. And PJ knows that it could have been a lot worse. "It could be me down there," he says as we finish up our interview at the impromptu shrine at the site of Tuam’s Mother and Baby Home.

"And the apologies by the State, the County Council, the Archbishop of Tuam, and the Bon Secours nuns mean a lot to me, especially the one from the nuns," he concludes, his voice full of emotion. "When we’re allowed travel again, I’ll take that to my mother’s grave to read it out to her."

stockshares

Cluedo Monopoly wrote: »

They covered that story extremely well. Very sad that his mother called to the home every week for 5 years asking for her son until they fostered him out. Wanton cruelty. He plans to travel to her grave in the UK to tell her the nuns apologised.

It would make your blood boil.

There was another programme last night on TV3 11pm called Adoption stories . This seems to be a new series, following on from previous series over the last couple of years.

Two people stories were covered, the 2nd one dealt with an unusual trafficking case in that the child's foster parents took him from Ireland to South Africa when the father moved to take up a new job.

The parents were not the right age to adopt so left with the child. He had fond memories of his parents but at the same time says it was wrong what they did saying they trafficked him and that the GOV knew.

It's worth viewing and its far too complicated for me to explain here.

Btw his Mother was still paying the order in Castlepollard for his upkeep 5yrs after he had been taken to South Africa. She was never told .

They also provided his original birth cert to the foster parents enabling them to traffick him.

The Irish Gov got involved in this case . Brian Lenihan was the Minister who tried to sort out the legal situation the child (now adult) found himself in because he was never legally adopted .

It's very hard to find info on TV3 but it looks like this week's show is repeated next week 08/02/21 at midnight from the schedule below
https://www.virginmediatelevision.ie/subtitles

stockshares

Holly Cairns very good on TV3 tonight with Fergus O Dowd.

Brought up the subject of the destroyed transcripts towards the end of the argument over how the cervical check women are being treated.

Said that it was very easy for this to get lost while the Covid pandemic us being dealt with.

Gov are simply a disgrace.

Cluedo Monopoly

stockshares wrote: »

Holly Cairns very good on TV3 tonight with Fergus O Dowd.

Brought up the subject of the destroyed transcripts towards the end of the argument over how the cervical check women are being treated.

Said that it was very easy for this to get lost while the Covid pandemic us being dealt with.

Gov are simply a disgrace.

She is an excellent TD. I caught part of the interaction. O'Dowd is a spoofer.

mrslancaster

Why were those testimonies destroyed & why have successive governments been so determined to keep this story and information buried for so long? Is it simply because they are afraid of the financial cost of setting up some redress for survivors? Is there some other reason they are still keeping information buried?

We know that the homes in the report were run by different religious orders but paid by the state (from what I can gather) & they have a lot to answer for. It is unbelievable the cruel way they treated women & children. The church deserves all the outrage & loathing it gets & hopefully will be made to "atone" for their sins in some way.

But the report only covered a tiny number of institutions. Who ran the rest?

And what about other state agencies, e.g. the dept of health, or the GRO who issued false birth certs or the adoption authority who were directly involved in every adoption since 1952. Or the department that issued fake passports?
The list goes on.

Is all the focus being skewed to the church when it was various governments allowed this to continue? From what I've read, survivors have been trying to get information from many government departments for years & were blocked at every stage. why the on-going cover up?

stockshares

Joe Duffy has just said the Judge Yvonne Murphy has declined an invitation to appear before the Oireachtas .

The IT did a profile of her in 2011
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/profile-yvonne-murphy-1.599255

Formerly of Rte and the Irish Times.

This is Patsy McGarrys article on the commission members
https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/religion-and-beliefs/commission-dealt-with-1-3m-documents-and-held-195-hearings-1.4458658

She also chaired the report on the symphysiotimy survivors which was another cover up.

Cluedo Monopoly

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/politics/arid-40221251.html

Mother & Baby Home Commission chair refuses to appear before Oireachtas committee.

It is understood the head of the Commission declined the request, with Judge Murphy claiming she is not available on the suggested date of February 16.

However, Committee chair Kathleen Funchion has now responded by asking the judge to provide a suitable date. Ms Funchion has suggested that other members of the Commission appear instead of the judge if she cannot appear before the end of the month when the Commission is due to be wound up.

Ms Funchion said she was “very disappointed” by the response.

Funchion is doing her best for the survivors since the report came out.

stockshares

Kathleen Function and Patsy Mcgarry on drive time now

If anyone wants to know just what Patsy McGarry is like listen to the interview.

He said Yvonne Murphy should not have to appear because simply she is a Judge and there might be constitutional issues.

They hide behind that legal jargon any chance they get. He is nothing more than a Church and Gov shill.

is_that_so

Cluedo Monopoly wrote: »

https://www.irishexaminer.com/news/politics/arid-40221251.html

Mother & Baby Home Commission chair refuses to appear before Oireachtas committee.



Funchion is doing her best for the survivors since the report came out.

This looks a whole lot more like a committee with notions of grandeur. As the article points out it's not in the terms of the commission. It is a regular feature of Dail committees demanding people appear before them. They do good work but sometimes overreach. PAC, under McGuiness in particular, thought they could dig under any rock in the country.

Cluedo Monopoly

stockshares wrote: »

Kathleen Function and Patsy Mcgarry on drive time now

If anyone wants to know just what Patsy McGarry is like listen to the interview.

He said Yvonne Murphy should not have to appear because simply she is a Judge and there might be constitutional issues.

They hide behind that legal jargon any chance they get. He is nothing more than a Church and Gov shill.

I have never trusted McGarry. I find him quite two faced.

stockshares

Cluedo Monopoly wrote: »

I have never trusted McGarry. I find him quite two faced.

He is a piss ant

stockshares

Here's the Drivtetime coverage with Kathleen Funchion, Regina Doherty and Patsy McGarry from 39m 55s
https://www.rte.ie/radio/radioplayer/html5/#/radio1/11278799

Cluedo Monopoly

Michelle O'Neill not holding back.

https://www.thejournal.ie/readme/mother-and-baby-homes-3-5345116-Feb2021/

Mother and baby homes were the product of systemic misogyny

These institutions were detention centres which housed grave human rights abuses. The regime of forced labour inflicted on women and girls while heavily pregnant was appalling and would certainly constitute cruel, inhuman and degrading treatment as is prohibited under the European Convention on Human Rights. This is to name just one right, of many, that have been violated.

This is the ideology that women had fewer rights than men, and in order to be ‘respectable’, they must stay home and only have children once married.

Ultimately, this was about a societal attitude that women and girls needed to be controlled. These women and girls were utterly let down by society and this never should have happened.

Those children who never knew their mothers, who for too long have been kept in the dark and were wrongly made to feel ashamed of their start in life. They too were failed on every level and we cannot allow them to be failed any longer.

Interesting to see if the NI executive move faster than our shameful government who have heaped abuse upon abuse with their actions and especially their inaction.

saabsaab

It will be interesting. We know attitudes were different back then but the key point is that much of what happened was not acceptable by the standards of the time in many cases and even illegal.